Gabe to Iowa State

If history is any predictor, most players from low/mid majors that transfer to Power 6 have a drop (in some cases significant) in their numbers. In some cases obviously because of minutes, but others because of difference in talent. We'll see how they do soon enough though.

I'm not expecting them to average 17 a game in the B1G.

You can win a lot of games with 6-7 guys who each average 7-12 ppg and play defense. They need to add at least 2 more who can do that.
 

It is reported that Gabe spent many days watching reruns of "Green Acres" and felt mysteriously drawn to Ames, Iowa...
He has already adopted a stray pig and purchased a bushel of corn. 😗
 


We literally have no STARTERS right now. Maybe Gach pre injury.

That remains to be seen. It's not like we're the only P6 school picking up mid-major players. Most are right now and quite a few of those more highly ranked players are moving down.
 

It is reported that Gabe spent many days watching reruns of "Green Acres" and felt mysteriously drawn to Ames, Iowa...
He has already adopted a stray pig and purchased a bushel of corn. 😗
Recruited there by Arnold Ziffel....
 



We need more depth? We need STARTERS.

We literally have no STARTERS right now. Maybe Gach pre injury.
People are way over valuing the transfers we have coming in. I guess they are just placing what they want on them since there is no real evidence to reign that in. The odds that a bunch of mid major players are going to come into the B1G and tear it up is nil. I was hoping we could keep a couple of the main players and have the others come in and contribute, that I could see as having some possible success (I was really banking on Robbins in this regard), and then Gabe locking down the other teams best scoring option and thus hopefully holding teams scoring down always gives you a chance to win. Admittedly I was really squinting to see some possible roadmap for a respectable team, but now I can't see it, Gabe and Robbins were really key pieces to any possible roadmap.
 

Somebody explain this to me.
Really wanted out for whatever reasons. This clearly isn't about winning. It could be about playing time, but Iowa State is in about the same rebuilding process we are in. He wanted different scenery. God bless him. He gave us his all for three years. He left without poking us in the eye by going to a conference foe. He's always welcome home.

I've said this before, but I think many of us (me at the top of the list) severely underestimated the toll of abject isolation on college athletes for the last year. Think about how hard it is for us at our stage of life and compare it to them at the time of highest and most active socializing in their lives and it gets really magnified. It's not surprising that a lot of players are seeking something new, and for many of them it may not be about basketball as much as we think. They just see a need for something new.
 

I have an open question for the litany of posters praising GK's defense. Asking very honestly too -why is he considered such a great defender? I've seen and heard it endlessly repeated here and on tv but have never seen evidence its more than a misguided echo chamber opinion.

What can we concretely point to in order to demonstrate his defensive skills? All of his advanced statistics point to him being one of the worst defenders not only on the team, but in the entire conference. There are no traditional stats (ie steals) to point to. A poster above made the comment that Gabe made a habit of shutting down the opponent's top guard but I look back at some game logs and see the top two guards in the conference (by offensive rating - Ayo and DJ Washington) combining for one below average game, one average game, and two pretty good games against us.

I don't know who Gabe guarded every game of course and I guess thats kind of my question - can someone demonstrate something concrete here with respect to him routinely shutting down opposing stars? And if he did shut down opposing stars, what could be so flawed about how they calculate these defensive stats that they show him allowing so many points?
 



I have an open question for the litany of posters praising GK's defense. Asking very honestly too -why is he considered such a great defender? I've seen and heard it endlessly repeated here and on tv but have never seen evidence its more than a misguided echo chamber opinion.

What can we concretely point to in order to demonstrate his defensive skills? All of his advanced statistics point to him being one of the worst defenders not only on the team, but in the entire conference. There are no traditional stats (ie steals) to point to. A poster above made the comment that Gabe made a habit of shutting down the opponent's top guard but I look back at some game logs and see the top two guards in the conference (by offensive rating - Ayo and DJ Washington) combining for one below average game, one average game, and two pretty good games against us.

I don't know who Gabe guarded every game of course and I guess thats kind of my question - can someone demonstrate something concrete here with respect to him routinely shutting down opposing stars? And if he did shut down opposing stars, what could be so flawed about how they calculate these defensive stats that they show him allowing so many points?
I guess you never watched a Gopher basketball game and watched Gabe play defense. He always guarded the best offensive player and that player always scored less points than their average. I am shocked you are so clueless.
 

I guess you never watched a Gopher basketball game and watched Gabe play defense. He always guarded the best offensive player and that player always scored less points than their average. I am shocked you are so clueless.
Maybe we try with a less confrontational approach? Ayo scored 32 the last time out and Dj had 21 on 12 shots, so "always" seems like a stretch.

I'll ask again if you or perhaps someone less abrasive can hypothesize the reason for the massive disconnect in his advanced stats and the public perception of his defense?
 

Ridiculous. Gabe was a guy who could take the other team's best player and shut him down and it wasn't like he was shutting down only other 2's he was shutting down 1-3's and occasionally a 4. You guys who downplay this really are missing an understanding of the game. So what if he wasn't scoring enough, you've got 4 other positions to get your points from. This is a huge loss, especially if you are trying to build your program off of a defensive toughness foundation.
Not downplaying it, just saying that if he demands to be a starter to stay here this isn't the place for him. You have get efficient scoring from your guards or they are a bench players. This is the exact same scenario as Okogie, these are world-class defenders who belong as bench players because of their offensive inabilities.
 

I guess you never watched a Gopher basketball game and watched Gabe play defense. He always guarded the best offensive player and that player always scored less points than their average. I am shocked you are so clueless.

He has a point. Yes, we've all watched the games and have seen good defensive performances by Gabe but I doubt there is a single person posting here who has ever done a systematic game-by-game tracking of his performances. Unless you're doing that, you're falling back on selective memory of games here and there and the reinforcement you get from other posters and TV announcers.

It must be said that Gabe has never made an all conference defensive team in his three years here. I know that's far from a definitive barometer of performance but he was certainly hyped enough to receive consideration.
 



Not downplaying it, just saying that if he demands to be a starter to stay here this isn't the place for him. You have get efficient scoring from your guards or they are a bench players. This is the exact same scenario as Okogie, these are world-class defenders who belong as bench players because of their offensive inabilities.
In an ideal world Gabe is a bench player, in the real world of what Minnesota has and most likely will have, based on what has been brought in to this point, he is a starter. Losing him does not make this team better, it makes it worse. I am looking at this from the standpoint of who is going to be on the court next year. If suddenly we start seeing 4 and 5 star types signing up for next year then I would agree, but this is not happening.
 
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Who cares? He hasn't hit a shot since they moved back the 3 point line.

Have you seen his Win Shares and BPM numbers?

He was a bench player starting out of necessity. This loss isn't a problem.
He was one of if not the top perimeter defender in the entire conference last year....
 

Really wanted out for whatever reasons. This clearly isn't about winning. It could be about playing time, but Iowa State is in about the same rebuilding process we are in. He wanted different scenery. God bless him. He gave us his all for three years. He left without poking us in the eye by going to a conference foe. He's always welcome home.

I've said this before, but I think many of us (me at the top of the list) severely underestimated the toll of abject isolation on college athletes for the last year. Think about how hard it is for us at our stage of life and compare it to them at the time of highest and most active socializing in their lives and it gets really magnified. It's not surprising that a lot of players are seeking something new, and for many of them it may not be about basketball as much as we think. They just see a need for something new.
As it is with many things, there were probably a number of factors and a process that led him to this decision. Hey, maybe he doesn't like the U as a college, and we both would agree that it's not for everyone. Iowa State is the closest high-major, it's a nice campus, a heck of a good school, a manageable-sized town, and there's a medium-sized city close by. Those things are why a lot of Twin Cities kids choose to study there.

Also, maybe he had a bad experience here for reasons beyond GopherHole speculation.
 

According to these metrics rank 1-5 the Gopher guards? Carr Gabe Tre Mash and Gach... please rank per what these metrics say. Toss in Mccaffrey from Iowa as well if you can. Thank you
 

In an ideal world Gabe is a bench player, in the real world of what Minnesota has and most likely will have, based on what is been brought in to this point, he is a starter. Losing him does not make this team better, it makes it worse. I am looking at this from the standpoint of who is going to be in the court next year. If suddenly we start seeing 4 and 5 star types signing up for next year then I would agree, but this is not happening.
It's a good point but do we think he and Ben no longer get along or is it more likely they had an honest discussion about Gabe's fit here? I honestly have no idea, this whole situation is odd considering the prior recruiting connection and the DeLaSalle connection.
 
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As it is with many things, there were probably a number of factors and a process that led him to this decision. Hey, maybe he doesn't like the U as a college, and we both would agree that it's not for everyone. Iowa State is the closest high-major, it's a nice campus, a heck of a good school, a manageable-sized town, and there's a medium-sized city close by. Those things are why a lot of Twin Cities kids choose to study there.

Also, maybe he had a bad experience here for reasons beyond GopherHole speculation.
Nothing is beyond Gopherhole speculation, I have seen speculation that would melt your mind here, but some are immune to this effect for obvious reasons.
 

According to these metrics rank 1-5 the Gopher guards? Carr Gabe Tre Mash and Gach... please rank per what these metrics say. Toss in Mccaffrey from Iowa as well if you can. Thank you

You seem to have forgotten to identify "these metrics" or include them with your post.
 

Sorry was not clear. I was hoping Minnesota Jay could rank the guards per the advanced stats he had.
 

Maybe we try with a less confrontational approach? Ayo scored 32 the last time out and Dj had 21 on 12 shots, so "always" seems like a stretch.

I'll ask again if you or perhaps someone less abrasive can hypothesize the reason for the massive disconnect in his advanced stats and the public perception of his defense?
All those players would score even more if Kalscheur was not guarding them.
Of those points scored, how many came when Gabe was actually guarding them?
It seems to me, you are a hater. That's your peragative. I won't join you.
 

Sorry was not clear. I was hoping Minnesota Jay could rank the guards per the advanced stats he had.
Ahh...


Gach, Williams, Carr, Kalscheur, Mash by defensive rating. Mccaffrey on par with gach apparently.

To be clear, I'm not trying to argue that gabe is an awful defender. I was just hoping for an argument better than "just watch" to explain the hype
 

All those players would score even more if Kalscheur was not guarding them.
Of those points scored, how many came when Gabe was actually guarding them?
It seems to me, you are a hater. That's your peragative. I won't join you.
Yes you've caught me, I simply hate Gabe. Thanks for the chat...
 

My total guess: He just didn't enjoy playing for Thorson that much...so the thought of re-uniting wasn't appealing to him. (When Ben was hired, he knew he was coming.)
 



To be clear, I'm not trying to argue that gabe is an awful defender. I was just hoping for an argument better than "just watch" to explain the hype

That would take effort and few people who post here are willing to make much effort to back their claims empirically. I think better than advanced stats would be a systematic game-by-game tracking of his guarding assignments but I'm virtually 100% confident that no one around here has done that and almost as confident that no one would even if challenged.
 

This. How is this going to play now through the AAU circles? I assume Gabe was liked in the AAU circles, and they watched somebody who they care for get ripped and under appreciated despite being "one of us". You think these AAU types are going to encourage their guys to stick around, nah, they are going to say, "yeah I remember what they did to Gabe, they won't treat you like a hero, they will throw you away just like anyone from anywhere, don't buy that line."
Battle coming back, so it's one local in and one out. And I'm not sure that fans "did" anything more to Gabe than they would have done if he wasn't local. His offensive stats declined by a bunch as his career went on, and that doesn't get you treated like a hero no matter where you are from.
 
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It's a good point but do we think he and Ben no longer get along or is it more likely they had an honest discussion about Gabe's fit here? I honestly have no idea, this whole situation is odd considering the prior recruiting connection and the DeLaSalle connection.
Not sure anyone on GH has a real idea. Most assumed of all the guys in the portal, he was the most likely to come back. I agree with Holy Man that we overlook how tough last season must have been for all college kids, let alone athletes. The perception isn't great but there have been a lot of valid reasons speculating why Gabe is doing this. We just don't know. I wish him luck and thank him for representing the U of M well.

As for me, I'd like to see the 3d assistant officially confirmed and a few transfers coming in announced. When in your 70's you've gone through enough rebuilds and want to see this one move faster.
 




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