Doogie: It's obvious now Gophers have long road to correct ineptitude

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Very interesting article. Although the loss against NMSU may come as a shock to most of us fans, it appears that the ineptitude of the prior regime has really created a situation where it is going to be some time yet before this program wins on a consistent basis. Thank God we have Kill as head coach. The man has a vision and knows how to turn programs around. He will do it to this program, it only takes a little time.
 

GO4INLALALAND said:
Very interesting article. Although the loss against NMSU may come as a shock to most of us fans, it appears that the ineptitude of the prior regime has really created a situation where it is going to be some time yet before this program wins on a consistent basis. Thank God we have Kill as head coach. The man has a vision and knows how to turn programs around. He will do it to this program, it only takes a little time.
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The same "inept" regime that did the Gophers normal 3-5 in the conference in '08 and '09? Let's see what Kill does as a head coach before you thank god for him.
 

Then, a few minutes later, Kill offered his commonly-used approach: the players are clueless when it comes to practicing at his pace.
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I realize it's a blog, but this kind of reporting can sometimes be frustrating. You use some strong language ("clueless") that goes unsupported by any quotation. In fact, you never really quote Kill at any point.

I guess what I'm saying is that either the coach actually called his players "clueless" and you should quote him...or you should be more careful.

Or am I being over-sensitive?
 

EG#9 said:
The same "inept" regime that did the Gophers normal 3-5 in the conference in '08 and '09? Let's see what Kill does as a head coach before you thank god for him.
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It was clear that this program was headed towards the gutter when Brewster was fired. I think it is pretty undisputed on this board that Brewster was inept. Although you are free to disagree. Regardless, Kill is not inept and I strongly believe he will turn this program around.
 


no one should be convinced after saturday that kill is a lock to turn our program around
 

and he isnt a sure thing to fail, he needs time, but saturdays loss was embarrassing, in my opinion it was worse than the ndsu loss
 

I believe that Jerry Kill will not be fired from his HC position at Minnesota.
 

The burden isn't on Coach Kill. He has proven himself as a coach. The next 4-5 years will be a litmus test for the university and Minnesota HS football. If he is fired for not winning, I will finally come to grips that this is a MAC football university. The modern era of ineptitude has featured some coaches, even Holtz, with some serious warts.

Coach Kill is the best fit we have had in the position because he fits the mentality of the region, is a proven coach, and can sell a program. Any dreams of Pasadena will just be crazy talk at that point. It is Coach Kill or bust for me.
 



Studwell55 said:
I guess what I'm saying is that either the coach actually called his players "clueless" and you should quote him...or you should be more careful.

Or am I being over-sensitive?
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No, I don't think that's asking too much. It's the old game of, "Well I'm blogging," and, "Of course I'm a journalist," depending on whatever suits you. The little bit about what Kill told some boosters also has an element of this. Kill, "suggested"? What the hell does that mean? He either said it or he didn't. Given the coaching fraternity and the fact that Kill seems a total class act, I really doubt he uttered anything close to stating that the previous regime set the program back years.

The other thing in this blog bordering on the absolute ridiculous is stating that over 50 practices couldn't overcome what Brewster did, and that wasn't enough practice time to be able to beat New Mexico State. 50 practices? What the hell were they doing? It's New Mexico State!!! That's more of an insult to Kill and his staff than it is a slam at Brewster.

Fully true that the talent level, fan support, dedication of the players, etc. has a long way to go before we can be a factor in the Big Ten and much of that is on Brewster. However, these players did win two Big Ten games at the end of their season last year so that presumes they should have had enough to beat New Mexico State yesterday.

Just going to chalk up yesterday to one of those days. Kill told us it's going to be a long process. The USC game made a lot of us forget that or think he was just blowing smoke. He seems like the type to eventually turn yesterday's game into a positive, although right now it's a bit hard to see that. He's honest about where we are; at the same time, he's not going to piss and moan about what his predecessor did. It's sort of a fine line he's walking, but to "suggest" that's one of his main themes, makes him look like a phony.
 

Throwing Brewster's regime under the bus makes Kill sound a little whiny, imo. We know we've sucked a long time, no need to keep reminding us that you weren't left with much to work with. We were 20+ favorites for a reason, and Kill obviously gave a poor coaching performance yesterday, regardless of how far we are from being a respectable program.
 

I like Coach Kill and I am happy he is our head coach but what happened on saturday is on this current staff.

We are a vastly more talented footbal team than NMSU. NMSU is about as good as South Dakota. There is no excuse for this team to lose a game against NMSU.

Our players weren't ready to play, our play calling was bad and it resulted in a loss (in my mind) that is every bit as bad as NDSU and South Dakota.

Our past regime didn't leave a team that will be a good Big 10 football team and I could never blame Coach Kill for that. However, this team is considerably more talented than NMSU. We weren't simply outgunned, we were out coached, out prepared and out played.

(Again, I like Coach Kill and the entire staff but his entire motto is based on accountability. What happened yesterday isn't on Brew it's on this current staff.)
 

We are NOT a vastly more talented team than NMSU. Their QB doesn't have a big day and their RB doesn't run past our LBs because our play-calling is bad. While I'll agree that we were out played for many reasons, we are not a very talented football team. I'm not sure we have a single player that would start at any of our rivals (possible exception of 1 WR). Bigger school does not mean better team.
 



Doogie, LALALand, and Mulligan are the ones who are clueless. And Coach Kill should stop making excuses about why he might not win many games this year. It is beneath him and makes him sound like Glenn Mason. For the last five years the Gophers have been handicapped by their recruiting classes in 2004, 2005, 2006, and 2007. They add up to the worst four years of recruiting in Gopher football history which makes them pretty close to the worst four years of recruiting in Big 10 football history. And they were all on Mason who spent his last three years as coach blaming everyone but himself for losing football games.
 

LongTimeGopher said:
We are NOT a vastly more talented team than NMSU.
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Yes, we are. I can name several players on the Minnesota squad who will almost certainly be playing on Sundays. How many of the NMSU players do you think will even be invited to an NFL training camp, much less earn an NFL paycheck?

LongTimeGopher said:
Their QB doesn't have a big day and their RB doesn't run past our LBs because our play-calling is bad..
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It's not the lone reason, but play-calling/preparation was far more of a factor than lack of execution. The playcalling on offense and defense has been bizarre in both games.

LongTimeGopher said:
While I'll agree that we were out played for many reasons, we are not a very talented football team.
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Who said that we are?

LongTimeGopher said:
I'm not sure we have a single player that would start at any of our rivals (possible exception of 1 WR).
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What do Wisconsin, Iowa and Michigan have to do with this? We're talking about New Mexico St. If it were possible, do you think DeWayne Walker and his staff wouldn't trade rosters with Minnesota? If it were possible, and it were offered, it would take them about 1.5 seconds to scream "YES! YES! YES!"

LongTimeGopher said:
Bigger school does not mean better team.
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Who said that it does? I can think of plenty of schools smaller than Minnesota - dozens, in fact - that have better teams than Minnesota. New Mexico St. is not one of them.
 

Go4Broke said:
Doogie, LALALand, and Mulligan are the ones who are clueless. And Coach Kill should stop making excuses about why he might not win many games this year. It is beneath him and makes him sound like Glenn Mason. For the last five years the Gophers have been handicapped by their recruiting classes in 2004, 2005, 2006, and 2007. They add up to the worst four years of recruiting in Gopher football history which makes them pretty close to the worst four years of recruiting in Big 10 football history. And they were all on Mason who spent his last three years as coach blaming everyone but himself for losing football games.
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When has Kill made excuses?
 

dpodoll68 said:
Yes, we are. I can name several players on the Minnesota squad who will almost certainly be playing on Sundays. How many of the NMSU players do you think will even be invited to an NFL training camp, much less earn an NFL paycheck?.
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Completely and totally irrelevant statement.
Case in point. Gopher Hockey. Lots of guys who are going to the NHL, but the team has stunk it up the last few years. Meanwhile, teams like UMD and Bemidji are successful with guys who are less likely, or unlikely, to play in the NHL.

Teams win games. NMSU was the better team this week, as much as it sucks to says that.
 


discochris said:
Completely and totally irrelevant statement.
Case in point. Gopher Hockey. Lots of guys who are going to the NHL, but the team has stunk it up the last few years. Meanwhile, teams like UMD and Bemidji are successful with guys who are less likely, or unlikely, to play in the NHL.
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Not at all irrelevant. Perfectly relevant, actually. The initial statement was questioning the disparity of talent. I'd say getting drafted/signed to play professionally is a pretty good barometer of talent.

Please try reading comprehension. Thanks in advance!
 

Well I don't know, but after 2 1/2 years, President Obama is still blaming all the failures of his administration on President Bush. I guess it's a sign of the times.
To Kill A Badger said:
Throwing Brewster's regime under the bus makes Kill sound a little whiny, imo. We know we've sucked a long time, no need to keep reminding us that you weren't left with much to work with. We were 20+ favorites for a reason, and Kill obviously gave a poor coaching performance yesterday, regardless of how far we are from being a respectable program.
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The kids that will be playing on Sundays are 2-3 yrs away from graduating!!!!!
 

dpodoll68 said:
Not at all irrelevant. Perfectly relevant, actually. The initial statement was questioning the disparity of talent. I'd say getting drafted/signed to play professionally is a pretty good barometer of talent.

Please try reading comprehension. Thanks in advance!
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I stand by my statement. If getting drafted and playing professionally is the barometer of talent, then the Gopher hockey team should be winning national titles every year, but they're pretty much terrible as of late. Remember the Gopher basketball team with Kris Humphries? He put up huge numbers, but the team was awful.

Yeah, the Gophers probably have more pro prospects than NMSU, but if they can't gel as a team, it doesn't make any difference. As a team, they were awful this week.
 

LongTimeGopher said:
We are NOT a vastly more talented team than NMSU. Their QB doesn't have a big day and their RB doesn't run past our LBs because our play-calling is bad. While I'll agree that we were out played for many reasons, we are not a very talented football team. I'm not sure we have a single player that would start at any of our rivals (possible exception of 1 WR). Bigger school does not mean better team.
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#1: We are a vastly more talented football team. Our roster has considerably more size, strength, athleticism and talent than NMSU. That isn't a very high standard as I said, they are a bad football team.

#2: I never said that we were a talented football team, I said we are much more talented than NMSU, again that is a LOW standard.

#3: You're right, Iowa and WI are more talented than us, however AGAIN, that has nothing to do with the fact that we are more talented than NMSU. I even pointed out how I wouldn't be making this argument if we were outgunned n Big 10 play, so I can't see how this point (that we have less talent than WI) is relevant at all.

#4: Our play calling was bad, however our play was bad on it's own (even if the calls were right). A portion of that has to be put on the coaching staff. Our coaches didn't have our team ready to play on saturday and on saturday, that had nothing to do with us being outgunned by a more talented team.
 

discochris said:
I stand by my statement. If getting drafted and playing professionally is the barometer of talent, then the Gopher hockey team should be winning national titles every year, but they're pretty much terrible as of late. Remember the Gopher basketball team with Kris Humphries? He put up huge numbers, but the team was awful.

Yeah, the Gophers probably have more pro prospects than NMSU, but if they can't gel as a team, it doesn't make any difference. As a team, they were awful this week.
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Yep, from the players to the coaches.

To the original point, I can't imagine that any person, NMSU fans, Gopher fans, completely objective observers could possibly make an argument that NMSU is more talented than the U. They were a better football team on saturday and that was despite them being the less talented team. The most talented teams don't always win football games, there are other factors involved.
 

Next Saturday will speak loudly. This team is very inexperienced, very young and learning a brand new system. They were high as a kite against USC and flat as a pancake against NMSU. Not much different than what we have seen in previous years.

It's now up to Kill & Co. to improve the game plan, have the team on a more level keel and keep teaching the new system. Most teams improve a little each week. The U has the potential to make huge strides throughout the season as the coaches teach a new system and as they expose these kids to a more thorough teaching of football fundamentals.

That said Miami is a worry. They've had a week off. Wanna bet they haven't been working on their running plays. On the other hand, we've had two games to their one and my expectations are that both the coaches and players have a better week.
 

New schemes on offense and defense have to be taking its toll, also an inexperienced quarterback. The thing is Horton ended the season at 2-2 in the Big Ten. How does that happen with complete ineptitude. Something isn't right. If they end up 0-12 or 1-11 I will have no hope whatsoever that any change is going to happen.
 

Three days after, I now have some rational thoughts, basically Doogie is correct in the fact that this will be a long process, which none of us believed when Coach Kill told us again and again.

I like our future at OL, I expect a shakeup there soon bringing in younger guys and opening up RT to competition, bottom line, the guys that are starting now aren't getting it done. Maybe time to throw T. Olson in.

Our DB's haven't been coached very well, specifically our safeties, Royston was ok, but Salamon, Manuel, C. Lewis struggled, and our coverage was overall bad.

Our DE's are bad this year, I'm expecting Kill to play a handful of the new DL recruits next season, Amafuela looks ok, but he's small right now.

I actually thought Gray played ok to good besides the picks and a few bad passes. It's time to put the QB controversy to bed IMO, Max will be great in a few years, give him some reps, but Gray show some nice touch on a few passes and made some epic scrambles which is going to be very neccesery going into the meat of the schedule with this offensive line.

I actually felt that we would tie the game and squeek by in OT on that last drive, Gray was making some great plays with his feet and hit a few key passes. Nobody really mentions that Kill was going after the ref/reacting to the bad PI call on Mcknight when he went down. We get that call we're looking at 1st and goal on the 1 again, but maybe this time we'd be able to punch it in.

I'm really hoping the coaches will earn their keep training the young players on this team in the proper technigues and schemes to succeed, if they can do that, maybe late next season we'll see some improvement in the form of big wins.
This year we can only hope to beat our FCS opponent(we will) and try to play spoiler in BT season.
 

RodentRampage said:
When has Kill made excuses?
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Kill has been questioning the level of talent on his football team almost from the first day he arrived in Minnesota. He has been more subtle with his public comments than Mason but Kill never misses an opportunity to tell fans how it will take years to rebuild the team with players who can compete in the Big 10. I hear it in radio interviews constantly. The implication is that Tim Brewster was a terrible football coach and he left Kill very few players with the talent and ability to win football games.

What Kill is saying could very well be true but it is bad form for any football coach to say it for two reasons: 1) it sounds like he is making excuses in advance for the performance of his team: and 2) it has to sound to some members of his own team that he doesn't believe in them or their ability to play Division I football.

I don't recall Brewster publicly questioning the talent and ability of the pathetic recruiting classes that Glenn Mason left him. Brewster irritated most Gopher fans and almost all of the local sports media with his over-the-top enthusiasm but he never talked about his team's lack of talent and how difficult it is to recruit in Minnesota.
 

Go4Broke said:
Doogie, LALALand, and Mulligan are the ones who are clueless. And Coach Kill should stop making excuses about why he might not win many games this year. It is beneath him and makes him sound like Glenn Mason. For the last five years the Gophers have been handicapped by their recruiting classes in 2004, 2005, 2006, and 2007. They add up to the worst four years of recruiting in Gopher football history which makes them pretty close to the worst four years of recruiting in Big 10 football history. And they were all on Mason who spent his last three years as coach blaming everyone but himself for losing football games.
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MV nailed it with me in-studio last night on 1500: if the players are supposed to take on the personality of their coach, how should we expect them to be after they saw Brewster scream at Maturi on a few different occasions? How should we expect them to be after they constantly left the locker room a mess? There are many other examples, maybe borderline irrelevant on an individual basis, but add them all up, and it points to the problems of the Brew regime.
The USC game fooled many, me included. I should've realized after the assistant coach told me what he did last Wednesday and that not a lot can be fixed in two-months of conditioning, 15 spring practices, and 50-something practices/two games this summer. They will not go winless, but any sort of miracle isn't happening this year.
 

discochris said:
I stand by my statement. If getting drafted and playing professionally is the barometer of talent, then the Gopher hockey team should be winning national titles every year, but they're pretty much terrible as of late. Remember the Gopher basketball team with Kris Humphries? He put up huge numbers, but the team was awful.

Yeah, the Gophers probably have more pro prospects than NMSU, but if they can't gel as a team, it doesn't make any difference. As a team, they were awful this week.
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Urgh - I'll try again. Hopefully you'll pay attention this time.

The original poster tried to make the argument that NMSU is more talented than Minnesota. That is, 100%, categorically, undeniably, flat-out false. That is all I'm saying. Nothing more, nothing less.

Note that I said nary a single word about how talent translates into victories, nor how good of a team Minnesota has. Both of those are irrelevant to the singular point mentioned above. As blahblahblah has already stated so eloquently, it is not so simple as to say "more talented team always wins". However, the talent gap between NMSU and Minnesota is so vast that Minnesota should never, ever lose.

Now, do you understand?
 

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