Do you want Ben back for a fourth year?

[Johnnyboy18]

So using that logic, Ben would be a worse coach if he had won a few more games in years one and two and then had the same year 3?

If he won 8 games his 1st year and then 6 the next 2 years he'd probably be fired by now.

For example Gates won a lot last year, went 0-20 this year and if is freshman struggle next year he'll either be fired or on the hot seat the following season.

 

[Spaulding!No!]

Coyle is sly and he might surprise some people here.

 

[TwistingMyMelon]

Herein lies the problem with the hire in the first place.

No shit? Do you think that anyone in the entire Gopher fan universe fails to understand that? It's amazing how many people will continue to argue about something that isn't controversial and can't be retroactively undone.

 

[Some guy]

Going from two conference wins to nine increased the fan base.

True, if you can drive down attendance enough it goes up even though it’s still tiny

 

[MNVCGUY]

No shit? Do you think that anyone in the entire Gopher fan universe fails to understand that? It's amazing how many people will continue to argue about something that isn't controversial and can't be retroactively undone.

Well said. The negative crowd loves to pretend like there is a group that is blindly supporting Ben no matter what which is not the case and never has been. There is the group that has hated the hire from day one and won't stop complaining until the coach is fired because they have decided there is no possible way it can work out.

And there is a second group that will fully admit that the first two years were awful but is also willing to have some patience and see how things play out. This year was a step in the right direction. As long as the trajectory continues in the right direction we will be willing to ride with Johnson.

If/When things take a downturn you will be hard pressed to find anyone here that will not be on board with a coaching change.

 

[leib0039]

So let's recap.

Those who are happy with CBJ : Argument generally goes IF everyone returns and IF we add a few good transfers, and IF Asuma is good and IF the coach figures some things out we MIGHT be a solid team

So you are willing to beat on all of those scenarios happening but you are terrified at the prospect of starting over with a different coach. Do I have that right?

Keeping him seems just as risky if not more than hiring someone new. But I guess familiarity breeds contempt.

 

[Gopher Ally]

Coyle is sly and he might surprise some people here.

He always has a shortlist ready to go

 

[MNVCGUY]

So let's recap.

Those who are happy with CBJ : Argument generally goes IF everyone returns and IF we add a few good transfers, and IF Asuma is good and IF the coach figures some things out we MIGHT be a solid team

So you are willing to beat on all of those scenarios happening but you are terrified at the prospect of starting over with a different coach. Do I have that right?

Keeping him seems just as risky if not more than hiring someone new. But I guess familiarity breeds contempt.

The argument goes: First two years sucked, year 3 was a step in the right direction. There are some good pieces on the team so let's see if he can keep building on this year in year 4 when the hope is he will have the vast majority of the current team back.

This group is also willing to accept that it appears he is not going to be fired so the options are to look at the positives from this season (and there were a number of them) or dwell on the negatives (some of those as well). There is one group here that has clearly chosen option 2, the rest of us prefer to look at the good and hope for the best in a situation we have zero control over.

If the team struggles next season and doesn't seem to be on an upward trajectory you will be hard pressed to find anyone that wants to see a year 5.

 

[Gopherbbdude]

Compete for conference titles? No. Be an NCAA tournament contending team? Yes. Not be one of the worst coaches in the power 6? Certainly. The bar is not exactly high here.

I think you referring to a top 5% of College coaches that could accomplish that in Minnesota ...maybe higher.

Regardless... Ben deserves and will get another year.

 

[Gopherbbdude]

If what johnson has produced is the best we can hope for, the fanbase will continue to shrink

Hope is a funny thing.... we can hope for a top 10 coach in the country.... will we get one here.... not a chance. U OF MN will never, in my lifetime, pay a top 10 bball coach the kind of money the want.

 

[leib0039]

The argument goes: First two years sucked, year 3 was a step in the right direction. There are some good pieces on the team so let's see if he can keep building on this year in year 4 when the hope is he will have the vast majority of the current team back.

This group is also willing to accept that it appears he is not going to be fired so the options are to look at the positives from this season (and there were a number of them) or dwell on the negatives (some of those as well). There is one group here that has clearly chosen option 2, the rest of us prefer to look at the good and hope for the best in a situation we have zero control over.

If the team struggles next season and doesn't seem to be on an upward trajectory you will be hard pressed to find anyone that wants to see a year 5.

Fair enough, I do not share your views but I think that is a logical way to view it. I would agree he's getting year 4.

Would be interested in this group if there are actual goals or is it simply "they look better to me so that counts ". That's where I could see people arguing for year 5 even if we weren't good again next year.

 

[Some guy]

Hope is a funny thing.... we can hope for a top 10 coach in the country.... will we get one here.... not a chance. U OF MN will never, in my lifetime, pay a top 10 bball coach the kind of money the want.

And that might be true. But that doesn’t make Johnson much more than bad

 

[MNVCGUY]

Fair enough, I do not share your views but I think that is a logical way to view it. I would agree he's getting year 4.

Would be interested in this group if there are actual goals or is it simply "they look better to me so that counts ". That's where I could see people arguing for year 5 even if we weren't good again next year.

At this point, falling short of the NCAA tournament next year would be a massive disappointment and unless there are some extreme circumstances that were out of Ben's control I think you would have a really hard time finding posters that want to keep him around for year 5.

 

[Gopherbbdude]

And that might be true. But that doesn’t make Johnson much more than bad

Well.... I say the jury is still out on that Decision

 

[golfing18now]

No shit? Do you think that anyone in the entire Gopher fan universe fails to understand that? It's amazing how many people will continue to argue about something that isn't controversial and can't be retroactively undone.

Almost as "amazing" as a grown man that spends day after day, week after week, month after month under this username and others.....occasionally providing thought provoking posts but far too often getting butthurt and arguing with anonymous posters over the viewpoints on Ben Johnson. If there is only one viewpoint that should be allowed, why bother? You might want to find other activities to enjoy Rockxxxx. It's good for the soul.

 

[howeda7]

I think you referring to a top 5% of College coaches that could accomplish that in Minnesota ...maybe higher.

Regardless... Ben deserves and will get another year.

Not at all. We'd take the level Clem was at less the cheating or even a notch below that. The bar is on the floor and Ben has still managed to trip over it to this point.

 

[howeda7]

Hope is a funny thing.... we can hope for a top 10 coach in the country.... will we get one here.... not a chance. U OF MN will never, in my lifetime, pay a top 10 bball coach the kind of money the want.

Tubby was one of the 20 highest paid coaches when he was here. Clearly we will not be in the top tier.

But this is still a B1G job in one of the two premier conferences in college sports. It is still the only power 6 program in a state of 5 million people in the middle of a large metro area that produces good talent. And despite 20 years of ineptitude, still has a fan base capable of drawing 10k plus when they give fans a reason to show up. The "woe is is us. We suck. We can't do any better than this" attitude from some here is very tiring.

 

[Johnnyboy18]

Almost as "amazing" as a grown man that spends day after day, week after week, month after month under this username and others.....occasionally providing thought provoking posts but far too often getting butthurt and arguing with anonymous posters over the viewpoints on Ben Johnson. If there is only one viewpoint that should be allowed, why bother? You might want to find other activities to enjoy Rockxxxx. It's good for the soul.

He doesn't post anything remotely like that poster.

Amazing how many posters get butt hurt for people disagreeing with them on a message board for Gopher fans while they attack Gopher coaches. Truly amazing that some people disagree.

 

[Spaulding!No!]

Gaardsy is in the know!

 

[bga1]

Super frustrating to watch basketball powerhouses like Iowa State, Penn State, and New Mexico turn programs around in short time frames with new coaches despite the NIL, portal, and administration boogeymen. Our chief rival buys up ad space downtown and makes a run to the conference final in our backyard. Our team's signature moment is the AD declaring "Hey, look at us. We will be a top 25 team next preseason" which sadly means nothing. But of course the declaration comes with the qualifiers "if" and "as long as".

Ben Johnson will get another year and probably the year after that. Maybe he should as firing coaches year after year isn't always the answer either. But this fanbase is so conditioned to losing. You need to look no further than many of the comments in this thread.

I for one, hate the losing. At this point it becomes an assessment of options and the likelihood for at least limited success in the near future:

1. Do we trust that the administration would go all in on a great coach? I don't. Their last hire was Ben and I did not want that hire.

2. If we get another coach not named Musselman, is there any likelihood that there will be enough NIL support to help the new guy score in the portal? If we fire Ben, it is going to be off to the portal for 6-8 players.

3. We are a couple players away and the current players need to get better. Despite the fact that I still don't think Ben is very good at in game coaching, I think he is our best shot for next year. No NCAAs - he gets fired. I think our best option is to get a few new assistants with experience and give Ben his year 4.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

The argument goes: First two years sucked, year 3 was a step in the right direction. There are some good pieces on the team so let's see if he can keep building on this year in year 4 when the hope is he will have the vast majority of the current team back.

If the team struggles next season and doesn't seem to be on an upward trajectory you will be hard pressed to find anyone that wants to see a year 5.

 

[TwistingMyMelon]

Almost as "amazing" as a grown man that spends day after day, week after week, month after month under this username and others.....occasionally providing thought provoking posts but far too often getting butthurt and arguing with anonymous posters over the viewpoints on Ben Johnson. If there is only one viewpoint that should be allowed, why bother? You might want to find other activities to enjoy Rockxxxx. It's good for the soul.

I am not Rockraven or any of the other variations of that name. If you think I've given you a hard time so far, just continue calling me that. You must of gotten that information from lying Weasel Howe who had no basis for spreading that misinformation (there is no similarity at all between my writing and Rockraven's) but did anyway.

If you insist on perpetuating stupidity and lies, I will continue to give you the disrespect that you deserve.

 

[Gopherbbdude]

Tubby was one of the 20 highest paid coaches when he was here. Clearly we will not be in the top tier.

But this is still a B1G job in one of the two premier conferences in college sports. It is still the only power 6 program in a state of 5 million people in the middle of a large metro area that produces good talent. And despite 20 years of ineptitude, still has a fan base capable of drawing 10k plus when they give fans a reason to show up. The "woe is is us. We suck. We can't do any better than this" attitude from some here is very tiring.

When do we stop starting over and wanting to start over? It's a Vicious circle with no end.

 

[Some guy]

Well.... I say the jury is still out on that Decision

Probably a hung jury if it needs to be unanimous either way

 

[Some guy]

When do we stop starting over and wanting to start over? It's a Vicious circle with no end.

Sports might not be your thing if this bothers you

 

[howeda7]

When do we stop starting over and wanting to start over? It's a Vicious circle with no end.

The Gophers have had five coaches in the last 36 years. Five. And you're acting like we just fire coaches left and right.

When we've determined the current guy isn't going to get it done we move on until we find that guy. If we can't do any better than 15-44, fold the program.

 

[MplsGopher]

Hell they care more about Wrestling than men's basketball.

I suspect if I look at attendance of MBB vs wrestling, it will be similar to ours at least.

 

[MplsGopher]

And there is a second group that will fully admit that the first two years were awful but is also willing to have some patience and see how things play out. This year was a step in the right direction. As long as the trajectory continues in the right direction we will be willing to ride with Johnson.

As a representative of that group, I'm curious your thoughts on how it has gone at Rutgers?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Pikiell#Head_coaching_record

Fire? Another year?

 

[leib0039]

When do we stop starting over and wanting to start over? It's a Vicious circle with no end.

I get it, it isn't ideal, but it's just like Vikings QB. Until you find a great college coach (in any sport) you need to keep trying new options. 1 college coach, like NFL QB, is the difference from irrelevant to quickly relevant for years.

 

[MplsGopher]

The argument goes: First two years sucked, year 3 was a step in the right direction. There are some good pieces on the team so let's see if he can keep building on this year in year 4 when the hope is he will have the vast majority of the current team back.

Another question I have for you and those in the same school of thought on this point:

even if we assume everyone comes back, they didn't get it done this year. is there really enough room for all these guys to improve, by working hard enough in the the weight room, practice court, etc. and make up that gap?

Players can only improve so much. At some point they get close to their talent ceiling.


I don't know, to me I feel skeptical sometimes that a guy by year 4 has much room left to hit a whole additional gear better.