Dasher's status still uncertain

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hyaluronic said:
With regard to Rodent Rampage's comment about it being a huge scandal here... you have to understand our media. The Twin Cities (Mpls/St. Paul metro) media would investigate this and leave no stone unturned. Not only would no stone be unturned, but all of the op ed pieces would be tearing into the Gopher program, the individual player, and whoever else they could demonize. I don't know if we would handle the situation any differently, but understand the public pressure would be much more intense.

And again, with Ogee, you are trying to justify a shady situation. Let it play out, Dasher should not be defended nor prosecuted at this point.

<edit>And Howeda's comments - realize we had two players suspended indefinitely from our basketball program this season, one incident involving theft, which is comparable to this case.

The point being, people have justification for the points they are making. Right now, there have been no charges, and the U would be handling this exactly the way it appears MTSU is handling it.
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Holy crap, I've been branded a "hater". First time for everything I guess...

One last note on this (exercise in futility); I have nothing against Dasher, don't know the kid, don't know his day to day actions, he could be a very charitable guy. I hope so. I hope he plays in the game because regardless, it's a game the Gophers should win.

My only issue all along here has actually been with the idiotic responses of a select few Raider fans who refuse to acknowledge that it APPEARS that Dasher has involved himself in a NUMBER of different activities that have a strong chance of bringing embarassment to his university.

>> Playing in high stakes poker games, for a D-1 NCAA athlete (you fail to understand just how much the severity of activity like this is HAMMERED into these kids' heads every year; they get lectured, they get pamphlets, they are educated on it, etc.)

>> Stealing checks from a teammate (regardless of whether or not you now think it's "been all cleared up between the two of them", you still condone this activity? Clearly Boss filing a police report indicates he had no knowledge of this happening)

>> Even being ASSOCIATED with a guy like Donnell. You seem to think the old man is the primary criminal here. What in the hell is somebody like Dasher doing spending time around somebody like that if you think Donnell is the real dirtbag? The more you incriminate the old man, the more you have to question why Dasher is in so tight with him.

Again, just stating that I have much less problem with what Dasher did or may have done than the UNBELIEVABLE stance some of you Raider fans are attempting to take on this. Forgive me if I just shake my head in disbelief...

For better or worse, this guy is the face of your university right now. I just can't believe that this makes you all beaming with pride, that's all. If you all can truly stand here and say that you couldn't be more proud of Dwight Dasher as the face of my university, then I take my hat off to you, I really do.

Wait, I know, I know.... I'll save you the time... "But there's no 'proof' that he ever did anything..."
 

Ogee Oglethorpe said:
Holy crap, I've been branded a "hater". First time for everything I guess...

One last note on this (exercise in futility); I have nothing against Dasher, don't know the kid, don't know his day to day actions, he could be a very charitable guy. I hope so. I hope he plays in the game because regardless, it's a game the Gophers should win.

My only issue all along here has actually been with the idiotic responses of a select few Raider fans who refuse to acknowledge that it APPEARS that Dasher has involved himself in a NUMBER of different activities that have a strong chance of bringing embarassment to his university.

>> Playing in high stakes poker games, for a D-1 NCAA athlete (you fail to understand just how much the severity of activity like this is HAMMERED into these kids' heads every year; they get lectured, they get pamphlets, they are educated on it, etc.)

>> Stealing checks from a teammate (regardless of whether or not you now think it's "been all cleared up between the two of them", you still condone this activity? Clearly Boss filing a police report indicates he had no knowledge of this happening)

>> Even being ASSOCIATED with a guy like Donnell. You seem to think the old man is the primary criminal here. What in the hell is somebody like Dasher doing spending time around somebody like that if you think Donnell is the real dirtbag? The more you incriminate the old man, the more you have to question why Dasher is in so tight with him.

Again, just stating that I have much less problem with what Dasher did or may have done than the UNBELIEVABLE stance some of you Raider fans are attempting to take on this. Forgive me if I just shake my head in disbelief...

For better or worse, this guy is the face of your university right now. I just can't believe that this makes you all beaming with pride, that's all. If you all can truly stand here and say that you couldn't be more proud of Dwight Dasher as the face of my university, then I take my hat off to you, I really do.

Wait, I know, I know.... I'll save you the time... "But there's no 'proof' that he ever did anything..."
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I'm not hating on you, nor am I trying to be ignorant, but the law does state that you are innocent until proven guilty. Yes, he's the face of our university right now, and we're beaming with pride because he's such a great football player. Probably the best MT has ever seen. People are standing up for Dasher because, like you said, things have not been proven. How do you know that Dasher went and played in a high stakes poker game? That's just what Donnell said, but nothing else has come forward about that. It's also not clear that the checks were stolen. Once again, pointing fingers at something you can't prove. And the whole thing with Dasher knowing Donnell...the MT Football Team volunteers there. Dasher could have met him through that or met him through his girlfriend (friend, whatever) when he was visiting her at work. Nothing is set in stone. MTSU fans aren't being ridiculous. We're just hoping for the best. And until I see solid proof of everything Dasher is being accused of, then I'm going to keep presuming he's innocent. I'm sure Minnesota fans would feel the same way about the ordeal if one of their players were in trouble.
 

Plus, most of the so called "facts" are being speculated by the media, which is never good. Bad news is what makes front pages, not good. And the media loves to just build on one story. You can't believe everything the TV tells you. And another thing...we have yet to see the other side of the story. All we've heard is Donnell's side. So you can't base the whole problem on what's he has told everyone.
 


dance4raiders said:
I'm not hating on you, nor am I trying to be ignorant, but the law does state that you are innocent until proven guilty. Yes, he's the face of our university right now, and we're beaming with pride because he's such a great football player. Probably the best MT has ever seen. People are standing up for Dasher because, like you said, things have not been proven. How do you know that Dasher went and played in a high stakes poker game? That's just what Donnell said, but nothing else has come forward about that. It's also not clear that the checks were stolen. Once again, pointing fingers at something you can't prove. And the whole thing with Dasher knowing Donnell...the MT Football Team volunteers there. Dasher could have met him through that or met him through his girlfriend (friend, whatever) when he was visiting her at work. Nothing is set in stone. MTSU fans aren't being ridiculous. We're just hoping for the best. And until I see solid proof of everything Dasher is being accused of, then I'm going to keep presuming he's innocent. I'm sure Minnesota fans would feel the same way about the ordeal if one of their players were in trouble.
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Ogee lives in Las Vegas. More the anybody on this board he's seen the problems between gamblers and NCCA players i.e. Northwestern, Arizona State, Boston College, Toledo, Tulane etc.

Cut him some slack.
 


If the school doesn't consider it a problem unless a player is convicted of a crime, that's about the lowest standard possible.
 

RodentRampage said:
If the school doesn't consider it a problem unless a player is convicted of a crime, that's about the lowest standard possible.
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Haha, it's funny because that's how the US Constitution works!
 

MrGopher said:
Haha, it's funny because that's how the US Constitution works!
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We aren't talking about a court of law. We aren't talking about convicting someone of something. If we held the position that you can't suspend someone without a criminal conviction, there would be no players suspended for violations of team rules. You can get in trouble with your employer without having done something that you could be convicted of.
 

MT is worried about NCAA violations, but once again, what proof is there that Dasher gambled? How can NCAA prove this? Also, what proof is there that Dasher actually took the money? There can't be a violation without proof. It's just a finger pointing game. And what confuses me the most is why the old man kept loaning Dasher $300 if he kept losing it. If he did gamble, after he lost the first $300, why would someone continuously give him $300 more each time he asked for it, up to 5 times? To me, that shows absolute ignorance and no common sense.
 



dance4raiders said:
MT is worried about NCAA violations, but once again, what proof is there that Dasher gambled? How can NCAA prove this? Also, what proof is there that Dasher actually took the money? There can't be a violation without proof. It's just a finger pointing game. And what confuses me the most is why the old man kept loaning Dasher $300 if he kept losing it. If he did gamble, after he lost the first $300, why would someone continuously give him $300 more each time he asked for it, up to 5 times? To me, that shows absolute ignorance and no common sense.
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Keep in mind that the NCAA is not a criminal court of law. I do not know off-hand what level of certainty they need to impose sanctions, but I would guess it is a "preponderance of evidence," which is much looser than "guilty beyond reasonable doubt."
 

dance4raiders said:
MT is worried about NCAA violations, but once again, what proof is there that Dasher gambled? How can NCAA prove this? Also, what proof is there that Dasher actually took the money? There can't be a violation without proof. It's just a finger pointing game. And what confuses me the most is why the old man kept loaning Dasher $300 if he kept losing it. If he did gamble, after he lost the first $300, why would someone continuously give him $300 more each time he asked for it, up to 5 times? To me, that shows absolute ignorance and no common sense.
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I, like everybody else around here, have NO idea what happened but the part that you mentioned above is what the NCAA should be worried about. Heck, it's one of the things that got Pete Rose in trouble. When the gambler is an athlete it's in the bookie's interest to get them deeper and deeper in debt. It might lead to throwing games like Boston College or point shaving which the Northwestern and Arizona State teams did.

Let's just hope that isn't what happened here but it's certainly something that needs to be looked at.
 

dance4raiders said:
MT is worried about NCAA violations, but once again, what proof is there that Dasher gambled? How can NCAA prove this? Also, what proof is there that Dasher actually took the money? There can't be a violation without proof. It's just a finger pointing game. And what confuses me the most is why the old man kept loaning Dasher $300 if he kept losing it. If he did gamble, after he lost the first $300, why would someone continuously give him $300 more each time he asked for it, up to 5 times? To me, that shows absolute ignorance and no common sense.
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I can at least address this part. Again, realizing you have no comprehension of being around gambling addicts, an addict can talk you out of your last nickel and make you feel good about doing it. There could be many things in play here that we have no clue about.

With some experience here, my GUESS is that the old man gave Dasher money before and he WAS repaid with some profit. Donnell gives him $200, Dasher goes on a good run and brings Donnell back $300. You get that taste in your mouth and it's easy to run with it. For Donnell, particularly if he's also a gambler as you've stated, it's the allure of easy money.

And YES, 5 times would not be out of the question. Donnell gives him $300 to play, Dasher comes back shortly and says, "If you just give me $300 more, I'll bring you back $1000 tomorrow". The next time; "If you give me $500 today, I'll bring you back $2000 by Friday."

You see it as a guy handing somebody $300 over and over, and it looks just stupid. To the guy handing over the money, he sees giving Dasher the money as the only way he's going to get HIS money back. Dasher can't win the old man's money back for him unless Donnell gives him more money. Now they both have a vested interest in Dasher being successful.

Again, I'm probably wasting my time here. It's hard to explain if you haven't seen it. A gambling addict could talk an alcoholic into giving handing over his bottle in the middle of a bender.
 





dpodoll68 said:
Or talk the Murfreesboro weather into being below-average for once.
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Classy dpodoll...but you're about 2 weeks late.

Ogee...I see what you're saying now. No, I haven't seen it first hand so I wouldn't understand. And that's exactly why it's coming across as ignorant to me. Thanks for the information though. I'm still keeping my fingers crossed, hoping we find out something by Friday. If we don't hear anything by Tuesday, I'm guessing Stockstill will make it a game time decision or just not play him because the NCAA hasn't made a ruling yet.
 



RodentRampage said:
He was suspended for the Spring Game. Maybe you think that's not much, but at least it's something.
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Wasn't Tinsley, along with Whaley and Carter, also sat down for a game last year even though it wasn't an announced suspension? Carter may have ended-up playing on Special Teams but I'm pretty sure he didn't play in the backfield. I don't think Tinsley played at all.
 


Maturi says he's o.k. with Dasher playing or Dasher not playing, either way he's all right with it.
 

Iceland12 said:


I, like everybody else around here, have NO idea what happened but the part that you mentioned above is what the NCAA should be worried about. Heck, it's one of the things that got Pete Rose in trouble. When the gambler is an athlete it's in the bookie's interest to get them deeper and deeper in debt. It might lead to throwing games like Boston College or point shaving which the Northwestern and Arizona State teams did.

Let's just hope that isn't what happened here but it's certainly something that needs to be looked at.
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I'll stick with my "worry about a bookie" theme. Even though he says it was all about poker, the old man ran a sports book (bookie) for a few years in the past. He never mentioned that he use to be a bookie. Why would that even come up?:rolleyes:

Donnell says Dasher did not discuss sports gambling
Admits previous sports gambling, but not with Dasher
By ADAM SPARKS • [email protected] • August 26, 2010

The man that allegedly loaned $1,500 to MTSU quarterback Dwight Dasher for gambling said it was only for poker and not for sports gambling.




Donnell, an 80-year-old York VA Medical Center patient and alleged lender of the gambling money, said he loaned Dasher a total of $1,500 in five increments of $300 apiece for use in poker games. Donnell said he did not see Dasher play poker, but he said Dasher told him he lost the money in poker games.


Donnell said he “ran a sports book” from about 1978 to 1982, but he did not discuss sports gambling with Dasher.


“Never, ever, ever. It was never mentioned,” Donnell said of the subject of sports gambling. “It never came up. I didn’t bring it up, and he didn’t bring it up.
“You can’t win in sports gambling, even if they give you the juice. You still can’t win.”


In sports gambling, juice refers to the commission paid to bookmakers on losing bets for the privilege of betting. For example, a $110 bet could include a $100 collection to the winning bettor and an extra $10 to the bookmaker.


MTSU declined to make Dasher available for comment.


No formal charges of any kind have been filed against Dasher by any individual or law enforcement agency. Dasher is the subject of a university inquiry and MTSU police investigation, according to an incident report on file with campus police.
 

RodentRampage said:
He was suspended for the Spring Game. Maybe you think that's not much, but at least it's something.
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Yes, It's not much but something. Something should be done.. for a felon. I'd be fine with dasher missing a scrimmage. Maybe only half of one.. After all, he didn't fight any cops.
 

Iceland12 said:
I'll stick with my "worry about a bookie" theme. Even though he says it was all about poker, the old man ran a sports book (bookie) for a few years in the past. He never mentioned that he use to be a bookie. Why would that even come up?:rolleyes:

Donnell says Dasher did not discuss sports gambling
Admits previous sports gambling, but not with Dasher
By ADAM SPARKS • [email protected] • August 26, 2010

The man that allegedly loaned $1,500 to MTSU quarterback Dwight Dasher for gambling said it was only for poker and not for sports gambling.




Donnell, an 80-year-old York VA Medical Center patient and alleged lender of the gambling money, said he loaned Dasher a total of $1,500 in five increments of $300 apiece for use in poker games. Donnell said he did not see Dasher play poker, but he said Dasher told him he lost the money in poker games.


Donnell said he “ran a sports book” from about 1978 to 1982, but he did not discuss sports gambling with Dasher.


“Never, ever, ever. It was never mentioned,” Donnell said of the subject of sports gambling. “It never came up. I didn’t bring it up, and he didn’t bring it up.
“You can’t win in sports gambling, even if they give you the juice. You still can’t win.”


In sports gambling, juice refers to the commission paid to bookmakers on losing bets for the privilege of betting. For example, a $110 bet could include a $100 collection to the winning bettor and an extra $10 to the bookmaker.


MTSU declined to make Dasher available for comment.


No formal charges of any kind have been filed against Dasher by any individual or law enforcement agency. Dasher is the subject of a university inquiry and MTSU police investigation, according to an incident report on file with campus police.
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because he's 80 REMEMBER when that was a convenience for the other side of the debate. He's 80, if he is sow slow and inept, and i believe i heard "relegated to assisted" living. What's to worry about.. If that's the case, there's no way he could come up with a conspiracy like you are mentioning.
 

tds2n said:
because he's 80 REMEMBER when that was a convenience for the other side of the debate. He's 80, if he is sow slow and inept, and i believe i heard "relegated to assisted" living. What's to worry about.. If that's the case, there's no way he could come up with a conspiracy like you are mentioning.
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No, the point was the NCAA would have to look into it once they found out that he use to be a bookie, not that it was why it happened. I do find it odd though how taking the money from an 80 year old who is "((so) slow and inept" and "regulated to assisted living", how that makes this an innocent thing is way beyond me tds2n.

As a Minnesota fan I hope he doesn't play, but as an individual I hope like hell none of this is true.
 

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