Current Scholarship Numbers

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Bob_Loblaw said:
My math says we have to move 6 people. Keep in mind that my math assumes WOs who are awarded scholarships do not have them guaranteed. They often get them re-awarded if one opens up in the spring/summer.

QB: 4 (Kramer, Clark, Morgan, Annexstad)
RB: 5 (Wiley, Potts, Williamson, B. Williams, Ibrahim)
WR: 9 (S. Green, CAB, D.Douglas, R. Bateman, J. Brooks, E. Gibson, NAM, M. Brown-Stephens, Udoibok)
TE: 4 (Witham, Kieft, Paulson, BSF)
OT: 5 (Schlueter, Dickson, Sassack, Faalele, Guedet)
OG: 4 (Andries, Dunlap, Cooper, Beier)
C: 3 (Olson, Schmitz, Boe)
DE: 6 (Otomewo, Mafe, N-Okonji, Ahanatu, Anderson, Harris)
DT: 8 (MDT, K. Schad, Robinson, Hickox, Teague, Cheney, Richter, Charter)
LB: 7 (Guthrie, Rush, Oliver, Aune, Willis, Sori-Marin, Gordon)
CB: 7 (Durr, Howard, Harris, K. Thomas, St. Juste, T. Smith, S. Brown)
S: 4 (Antoine Winfield, Sapp, Howden, Nubin)
Specialist: 3 (Ryerse, Lantz, Weeks)

2019 Class: 21
PJ Said we have one more spot: 1

That total is 91.

So 6 people from that list.


I wasnt 100% sure on the position for some of the guys, so I picked one for the sake of counting.
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You are for sure missing Crawford from the specialists.
 


swelna said:
Brock doesn't show up on the grid, so I think his was just one year in 2018. And you're right that Geary was a walk on, so his was probably only for the year...

Back down to 9 spots needed assuming Geary's scholarship was only a year
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IIRC Brock was granted a Scholarship to offset the hardship to the family for having two walk-ons. Now that Zach is on scholarship, I think that Brock is back to walk-on status. I could be wrong (far from the first time), but I recall hearing something like that.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
My math says we have to move 6 people. Keep in mind that my math assumes WOs who are awarded scholarships do not have them guaranteed. They often get them re-awarded if one opens up in the spring/summer.

QB: 4 (Kramer, Clark, Morgan, Annexstad)
RB: 5 (Wiley, Potts, Williamson, B. Williams, Ibrahim)
WR: 9 (S. Green, CAB, D.Douglas, R. Bateman, J. Brooks, E. Gibson, NAM, M. Brown-Stephens, Udoibok)
TE: 4 (Witham, Kieft, Paulson, BSF)
OT: 5 (Schlueter, Dickson, Sassack, Faalele, Guedet)
OG: 4 (Andries, Dunlap, Cooper, Beier)
C: 3 (Olson, Schmitz, Boe)
DE: 6 (Otomewo, Mafe, N-Okonji, Ahanatu, Anderson, Harris)
DT: 8 (MDT, K. Schad, Robinson, Hickox, Teague, Cheney, Richter, Charter)
LB: 7 (Guthrie, Rush, Oliver, Aune, Willis, Sori-Marin, Gordon)
CB: 7 (Durr, Howard, Harris, K. Thomas, St. Juste, T. Smith, S. Brown)
S: 4 (Antoine Winfield, Sapp, Howden, Nubin)
Specialist: 3 (Ryerse, Lantz, Weeks)

2019 Class: 21
PJ Said we have one more spot: 1

That total is 91.

So 6 people from that list.


I wasnt 100% sure on the position for some of the guys, so I picked one for the sake of counting.
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Thanks! I totally forgot that Durr got another year due to injury. Having him back will be great!
 

swelna said:
Ben Davis was non-scholarship, so he doesn't affect the numbers
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I'm surprised, if this is correct.

Came to Minnesota from a JUCO in California. And it was when Fleck first became coach and needed bodies to fill the class. That's quite a distance and change in climate, just to be a PWO.
 


MplsGopher said:
I'm surprised, if this is correct.

Came to Minnesota from a JUCO in California. And it was when Fleck first became coach and needed bodies to fill the class. That's quite a distance and change in climate, just to be a PWO.
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He was on scholarship. We needed bodies along the OL.
 

Sorry, I'm confused. (it happens a lot)

The guys Bob listed are the non-graduating, non-transferring out so far (that we know), who should be scholarship players who are back next year, and he included the players from the 2019 class. That list total is 69 players.

Then we're adding 25 new scholarship players for 2020. That's 94, meaning we need to trim 9 scholarships to get down to 85.

What did I do wrong?
 

MplsGopher said:
Sorry, I'm confused. (it happens a lot)

The guys Bob listed are the non-graduating, non-transferring out so far (that we know), who should be scholarship players who are back next year, and he included the players from the 2019 class. That list total is 69 players.

Then we're adding 25 new scholarship players for 2020. That's 94, meaning we need to trim 9 scholarships to get down to 85.

What did I do wrong?
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We have 24 players being added at the moment, so we only have to trim 8 at for now. When we likely add a 25th we will be up to 9 to trim.
 

OK, so it is 9 then. We need 9 guys to get off scholarship, one way or another.

Now I think I see what he was getting at. He must think there are three players that he didn't list who were on-scholarship in 2019 after originally being walk-ons, and he is assuming those players will voluntarily (or perhaps not) give up their scholarships for 2020.

Not saying he's wrong, I just don't know. Who are the three?


And let's say he's right, whoever the three are. Then who are the six players from that list who we still need to get off scholarship?

Got a lot of receivers. I know Udoibok was a "Maroon shirt", meaning he was promised a scholarship after being a PWO for the first year. I really hope we don't have to go back on our word there.

D. Douglas, I just don't know if I see him contributing much more than he did in 2019. He clearly couldn't handle the special teams responsibilities.

At DT, Hickox and Robinson haven't done much in three years.

I'm spitballing here. Pulling things out of my rear end.
 



MplsGopher said:
D. Douglas, I just don't know if I see him contributing much more than he did in 2019. He clearly couldn't handle the special teams responsibilities.
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Strong chance we lose to Georgia Southern without Douglas making 2 huge plays on final drive.
 

WinLoseOrTy said:
Strong chance we lose to Georgia Southern without Douglas making 2 huge plays on final drive.
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Yes I'm sure he had some nice plays this season. Also some bad plays (on special teams).

Realistically, he's a legacy (dad starred here), so probably not going anywhere unless he wants to. He will be #3 at best this year, assuming JDS or younger guys don't come in and pass him up.
 

MplsGopher said:
Sorry, I'm confused. (it happens a lot)

The guys Bob listed are the non-graduating, non-transferring out so far (that we know), who should be scholarship players who are back next year, and he included the players from the 2019 class. That list total is 69 players.

Then we're adding 25 new scholarship players for 2020. That's 94, meaning we need to trim 9 scholarships to get down to 85.

What did I do wrong?
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We signed 21 players and PJ said he has room for 1 more.

69 + 22 = 91
91 - 85 = 6

I try not to speculate too much on which players I think could be leaving because it is sort of a fool's errand. It is really difficult to predict who will be homesick, who might be struggling in school, where a couple RS FR stack up against each other on the depth chart. For example, I would not have guessed Harry Van Dyne this year. I had no idea about Nolan Edmonds health issues last year. It's really difficult to know.

It is clear that PJ knows right now. With confidence, he said "we have 1 spot". To me, that means he knows of 6 more people who will not be on the team next year. There is also the unknown - something could certainly happen in the next few months to open up additional scholarships.
 

I don’t understand why you’re counting the 2019 twice to get to 90. You have those guys in the players you listed.

Shouldn’t it be 69 + 25 for this year’s class??

Also (per post #39) are there three players who were on scholarship in 2019 who were originally walkons that you think will be back but will not have the scholly in 2020, and hence you didn’t list in the 69?
 



MplsGopher said:
I don’t understand why you’re counting the 2019 twice to get to 90. You have those guys in the players you listed.

Shouldn’t it be 69 + 25 for this year’s class??

Also (per post #39) are there three players who were on scholarship in 2019 who were originally walkons that you think will be back but will not have the scholly in 2020, and hence you didn’t list in the 69?
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I don't have them listed in that group. They are counted at the very end.

Yeah, I don't know the exact nature of those walk-ons. It is extremely common for walk-ons to be offered available scholarships with the intent of them being year to year. Scholarships often become available late and WOs have them awarded in June or May. We don't want them to go to waste.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
I don't have them listed in that group. They are counted at the very end.

Yeah, I don't know the exact nature of those walk-ons. It is extremely common for walk-ons to be offered available scholarships with the intent of them being year to year. Scholarships often become available late and WOs have them awarded in June or May. We don't want them to go to waste.
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I think people are confused because you keep saying 2019 class when you presumably mean 2020 class.

Also, you keep referencing 21 commits, but we've had 24 signees to the 2020 class so far.
 


And that would be the difference of 3.

I consider the “2019 class” to be the players that were signed at some point after the 2018 regular season. I believe it’s a hold-over convention of when players all used to sign in early Feb.

If you go to 247 for example, you’ll see there were 21 such players (plus 3 grad transfers, 2 of which are coming back next year). You have those 21 in your list.

The 2020 class is then the players we just signed, plus one more presumably, which will be 25.

And so 69+25 = 94, meaning we need 9 guys who were on scholly this season, aren’t graduating, and so far haven’t declared transferring, to go off scholarship by next season.
 


Grant Ryerse should be on the list to transfer. Possible transfer.
 

I think the "ideal" is: you want guys to show promise early, start playing early, and be starters for a long time. That would mean you want to keep younger guys who haven't had a chance yet, and you want to keep older guys because it means they're either not on scholarship (and have decided to stay anyway) or they're starters/major contributors.

That leaves the main targets to be the guys who have been around for say 3 Fall season and haven't developed into starters/major contributors

- Justus Harris? Mainly a special teams player the last three years?
- Hickox - hasn't done much in three years
- Robinson - hasn't done much in three years
- Sassack - hasn't done much in three years, and lots of depth ahead of him. If Guedet is slated to pass him up, then he would seem to be buried
- Guthrie - hasn't done much in three years

You can also look at guys who have only been here for 2 Fall season, but may be unlikely to become starters/major contributors by next fall. You hate to cut ties with guys after only 2 Fall season, but sometimes it needs to be done.

Boe ?
Beier ?
Erik Gibson?
Jornell Brooks?

Also, are both Ryerse and Lantz on scholarship?? I don't think it's reasonable to have 2 scholarships going out to place kickers, one for kickoffs and one for FG/PATs. One guy has to win the job for both.

Finally, there is of course Winfield, who may decide to leave early. That would free up one spot.
 

MplsGopher said:
Yes I'm sure he had some nice plays this season. Also some bad plays (on special teams).

Realistically, he's a legacy (dad starred here), so probably not going anywhere unless he wants to. He will be #3 at best this year, assuming JDS or younger guys don't come in and pass him up.
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I would think Brooks and Gibson would be much more likely. Hasn’t Brooks had two knee surgeries?
 

MplsGopher said:
I think the "ideal" is: you want guys to show promise early, start playing early, and be starters for a long time. That would mean you want to keep younger guys who haven't had a chance yet, and you want to keep older guys because it means they're either not on scholarship (and have decided to stay anyway) or they're starters/major contributors.

That leaves the main targets to be the guys who have been around for say 3 Fall season and haven't developed into starters/major contributors

- Justus Harris? Mainly a special teams player the last three years?
- Hickox - hasn't done much in three years
- Robinson - hasn't done much in three years
- Sassack - hasn't done much in three years, and lots of depth ahead of him. If Guedet is slated to pass him up, then he would seem to be buried
- Guthrie - hasn't done much in three years

You can also look at guys who have only been here for 2 Fall season, but may be unlikely to become starters/major contributors by next fall. You hate to cut ties with guys after only 2 Fall season, but sometimes it needs to be done.

Boe ?
Beier ?
Erik Gibson?
Jornell Brooks?

Also, are both Ryerse and Lantz on scholarship?? I don't think it's reasonable to have 2 scholarships going out to place kickers, one for kickoffs and one for FG/PATs. One guy has to win the job for both.

Finally, there is of course Winfield, who may decide to leave early. That would free up one spot.
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I could see Bryce Williams leaving too. Yes Lantz and Ryerse are on scholarship, while unfortunate you can’t just straight up blatantly cut a guy.
 

btowngopher said:
I could see Bryce Williams leaving too. Yes Lantz and Ryerse are on scholarship, while unfortunate you can’t just straight up blatantly cut a guy.
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If the player got the scholarship as a freshman, you are correct, the scholarship can't be taken away purely for athletic reasons.

Thought about B Williams too. Depends how high on Wiley and Potts the coaches are and how "ready" they are for the game mentally. Lot of blitz pickups in pass-pro.
 

I'm questioning whether Dickson will go. Haven't really heard much from him (unless I missed it). As a JUCO transfer I would have expected him to at least be in the two deep, and I don't think he was.

Also, do you think Z Annexstad gets his scholarship renewed? Everyone is counting him, but he was a walk-on originally, so he is year to year.

kandj said:
Every year we go through this speculation, which is fine as it is a message board, but really it always works itself out. The coaches know more about whats happening then we do.
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I'm not sure why you feel the need to post this. It's not like anyone on this board is saying PJ is an idiot for signing so many guys. We all know the numbers will work out. That isn't a question to anyone. It's how they will work out. Who will transfer, retire, etc.
 

btowngopher said:
I could see Bryce Williams leaving too. Yes Lantz and Ryerse are on scholarship, while unfortunate you can’t just straight up blatantly cut a guy.
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Don’t see why it’s unfortunate except for cases where the kid’s just not putting in the work which I imagine is uncommon. You’re often uprooting a kid from 1000 miles away and promising him a great education in return for that. If each school could cut 10-15 kids a year the college landscape would be a sh!tshow and any claim that they were “student athletes” and not deserving of remuneration would be be laughable.
 

MplsGopher said:
Yes I'm sure he had some nice plays this season. Also some bad plays (on special teams).

Realistically, he's a legacy (dad starred here), so probably not going anywhere unless he wants to. He will be #3 at best this year, assuming JDS or younger guys don't come in and pass him up.
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Disagree- had many crucial catches and far from a signee because he’s a legacy. Was committed to the Ducks and only the opportunity to play WR swayed him to go to the U
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Don’t see why it’s unfortunate except for cases where the kid’s just not putting in the work which I imagine is uncommon. You’re often uprooting a kid from 1000 miles away and promising him a great education in return for that. If each school could cut 10-15 kids a year the college landscape would be a sh!tshow and any claim that they were “student athletes” and not deserving of remuneration would be be laughable.
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Oops I worded that wrong. I meant it’s unfortunate to be stuck with a young scholarship kicker that didn’t pan out.
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Disagree- had many crucial catches and far from a signee because he’s a legacy. Was committed to the Ducks and only the opportunity to play WR swayed him to go to the U
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Yeah, I think Douglas will have a key role on offense this year. I also don’t think he was a disaster on special teams. He had the one bad game. The lack of punt returns I think was a coaching choice.
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Don’t see why it’s unfortunate except for cases where the kid’s just not putting in the work which I imagine is uncommon. You’re often uprooting a kid from 1000 miles away and promising him a great education in return for that. If each school could cut 10-15 kids a year the college landscape would be a sh!tshow and any claim that they were “student athletes” and not deserving of remuneration would be be laughable.
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Well the math says that’s what they were doing many years, essentially ...

5 years * 25 signees is 125. You have “natural” attrition in every class, particularly when kids don’t redshirt. But one way or another you need a difference of 40 in order to keep signing 25 a year. The four classes ahead of the newly signed class have to each contribute 10 losses per class on average (more realistically it’s more heavily weighted towards the older classes).
 

Sophomores and Juniors that graduate before their eligibility runs out automatically become grad players-if they enroll in grad school.

Those scholarships don’t count.

Many of the suggestions of players who won’t get renewed-Ryerse and Annexstad especially-make me laugh. If a player practices hard, goes to class, and keeps his nose clean, he’s got his scholarship.

The coaches totally know what their doing, and no one here has a clue, including me.
 

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