Coyle: Considering Rollback of Donation Levels

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caliGopher said:
I have a feeling Mr. Coyle will be handing out free candy for a while. Shiny objects keep the masses from paying attention to what he's actually done to the U.
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What has he done to the U? He's been here less than a year and hired the biggest names coach since Tubby.
 

Johnnyboy18 said:
What has he done to the U? He's been here less than a year and hired the biggest names coach since Tubby.
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  1. Failed to act when he recieved the police report to head off the mess that we're in before it became a fire.
  2. Activley fanned the fire form the 9/2 incident into an inferno due to a lack of leadership and his inability to communicate effectively as more details - that he was aware of - became public
  3. Failed to communicate with the coach and team effectively
  4. Repeatedly lied to the public about details relating to the situation
  5. Publicly named and shamed 10 players who have not been found guilty in any way shape or form at this point (the EOAA report is damning, but recommendations have been made and there is a process to appeal).
  6. Did so without having his facts straight, which may lead to two of said players actually not having been involved
  7. These last two things providing ample ammunition for the expense legal battles the U will face in the coming months over this situation, particularly if players on the list are found to have not been involved.
  8. Appears to have a double standard when it comes to student athletes who are white (wrestling team debacle being kept quiet) and those who are black (football team debacle)
  9. Put on an embarrassing press conference when announcing the firing of Tracy Claeys
  10. indicted Claeys for the team's academic performance which has been better than the past 20 years and, umm, we went to a bowl game last year because our academics have been so strong.
  11. Indicted Claeys for the attendance issues which were driven primarily by the pricing increase that his predecessor launched while failing to actually do anything about it publicly to quickly to improve the situation
  12. The last two which now give Tracy Claeys ammunition for a wrongful termination suit.

Quite a list for a guy who has been here for six months.......and no, making a good hire doesn't absolve him of the list above, if he truly wants to improve the culture an example he could set would be to resign. He's in over his head, he's costing the U.

I won't tell you to shut up, but you may want to wake up.
 

caliGopher said:
  1. Failed to act when he recieved the police report to head off the mess that we're in before it became a fire.
  2. Activley fanned the fire form the 9/2 incident into an inferno due to a lack of leadership and his inability to communicate effectively as more details - that he was aware of - became public
  3. Failed to communicate with the coach and team effectively
  4. Repeatedly lied to the public about details relating to the situation
  5. Publicly named and shamed 10 players who have not been found guilty in any way shape or form at this point (the EOAA report is damning, but recommendations have been made and there is a process to appeal).
  6. Did so without having his facts straight, which may lead to two of said players actually not having been involved
  7. These last two things providing ample ammunition for the expense legal battles the U will face in the coming months over this situation, particularly if players on the list are found to have not been involved.
  8. Appears to have a double standard when it comes to student athletes who are white (wrestling team debacle being kept quiet) and those who are black (football team debacle)
  9. Put on an embarrassing press conference when announcing the firing of Tracy Claeys
  10. indicted Claeys for the team's academic performance which has been better than the past 20 years and, umm, we went to a bowl game last year because our academics have been so strong.
  11. Indicted Claeys for the attendance issues which were driven primarily by the pricing increase that his predecessor launched while failing to actually do anything about it publicly to quickly to improve the situation
  12. The last two which now give Tracy Claeys ammunition for a wrongful termination suit.

Quite a list for a guy who has been here for six months.......and no, making a good hire doesn't absolve him of the list above, if he truly wants to improve the culture an example he could set would be to resign. He's in over his head, he's costing the U.

I won't tell you to shut up, but you may want to wake up.
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1. You don't know what he did and didn't do
2. That is your opinion, you are just assuming.
3. It has been stated publicly that he sat down with the head coach first, head coach agreed with the suspensions, and then sat down with each player individually and explained why they were being suspended. But yes, I guess he "failed to communicate"
4. No he didn't. He couldn't comment due to federal law.
5. No he didn't. That was their lawyer that released that players were going to be suspended or kicked out of school. The U released a statement that 10 players were suspended. Which they should have been as it was an active situation where removal from the school or suspension from the school was a very real outcome. You can't have those players playing in that situation.
6. Could possibly be true, but he has to allow the University process to play itself out.
7. Possibly, but again, not his fault.
8. Really? Any wrestling fan knows which players were involved due to suspensions and being kicked off the team. Not to mention the coach was fired. You just don't hear about it because nobody gives a sheet about wrestling.
9. The players and lawyers had been telling lies to the press trying to discredit the AD for weeks and weeks with him remaining silent. This caused idiots like you to put complete blame on the AD and Prez and somehow has made the players completely innocent. This was his chance to set the record strait.
10. I still don't remember him shaming the academic record of the team at all. Stated over and over again that they need to excel in all 3 phases. Clearly haven't in the social aspect. That was the point he was making.
11. True, this is one aspect of why ticket sales were down. But also because less and less people were excited about the program. In college football, you have a head coach who is the face of the program. If the program and that coach do not have a history of winning, more and more of the appeal is on the head coach.
12. He wasn't wrongfully terminated. He was let go and paid his buyout just like his contract states. Are you really that stupid? Alabama could fire Saban tonight after they win, and not give any explanation. As long as they pay the buyout, it is not grounds for a wrongful termination suit. What world do you live in?

So, nice list.
 

It would be a nice gesture for those of us who took the hit of the increases and ... not so great years.

I do worry if they drop them for the next season, they might get more crap for increasing them if it makes sense later ... don't want to yo yo everyone too much.

But hell I'll take it.
 

DLguy said:
1. You don't know what he did and didn't do
2. That is your opinion, you are just assuming.
3. It has been stated publicly that he sat down with the head coach first, head coach agreed with the suspensions, and then sat down with each player individually and explained why they were being suspended. But yes, I guess he "failed to communicate"
4. No he didn't. He couldn't comment due to federal law.
5. No he didn't. That was their lawyer that released that players were going to be suspended or kicked out of school. The U released a statement that 10 players were suspended. Which they should have been as it was an active situation where removal from the school or suspension from the school was a very real outcome. You can't have those players playing in that situation.
6. Could possibly be true, but he has to allow the University process to play itself out.
7. Possibly, but again, not his fault.
8. Really? Any wrestling fan knows which players were involved due to suspensions and being kicked off the team. Not to mention the coach was fired. You just don't hear about it because nobody gives a sheet about wrestling.
9. The players and lawyers had been telling lies to the press trying to discredit the AD for weeks and weeks with him remaining silent. This caused idiots like you to put complete blame on the AD and Prez and somehow has made the players completely innocent. This was his chance to set the record strait.
10. I still don't remember him shaming the academic record of the team at all. Stated over and over again that they need to excel in all 3 phases. Clearly haven't in the social aspect. That was the point he was making.
11. True, this is one aspect of why ticket sales were down. But also because less and less people were excited about the program. In college football, you have a head coach who is the face of the program. If the program and that coach do not have a history of winning, more and more of the appeal is on the head coach.
12. He wasn't wrongfully terminated. He was let go and paid his buyout just like his contract states. Are you really that stupid? Alabama could fire Saban tonight after they win, and not give any explanation. As long as they pay the buyout, it is not grounds for a wrongful termination suit. What world do you live in?

So, nice list.
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1) Are you sure?
2) Really? So he did do his job when he received the police report and suspended the players named in the investigation pending the outcome of the EOAA report, knowing what was in the police report, knowing that it was a violation of the student conduct code, and knowing that the EOAA report would have to be done? I feel really dumb for not knowing he did that.
3) So 110 football players unanimously voted to boycott after he communicated so well with them then. wow.
4) You're right, he couldn't, and yet he did, which is why I was so shocked he commented in the ways he did. We must have seen and heard different media reports.
5) It wasn't just their lawyer, and yes, they should have been suspended - at least the ones that were originally investigated. See point #2
6) You're right. They did need to let it play out. Because they did not, this is a real issue.
7) Again, we must have seen different news accounts
8) Really? It may be that everyone knew the wrestlers involved were doing, but it was remarkable how different the two situations played out. This became an issue to me, again based on Coyle's effective communication with the team, when the players had this feeling. That shouldn't have been the case. And I get that he was pissed he had to deal with this anyway, but dealing with it effectively is what Leaders (with a capital "L") do. Given that the coaching staff had abdicated responsibility to manage the situation, again a real Leader would have been pissed about it, but would have stepped in and solved the problem.
9) I completely disagree that there is any justification on how he conducted himself in that press conference. The players are not completely innocent. Coach Claeys was not completely innocent. And neither are Mark Coyle and Eric Kaler, and so far, they are the only two how have escaped any responsibility for what has transpired. And that is why I have the mindset that I do. Nothing of substance is changing in the culture for the better, the Admin is failing more spectacularly than ever, but are getting better at covering their butts. That isn't what should be changing.
10) Perhaps it was just my take on this, but when he went into the "reasons" why Claeys was fired, he mentioned academics as being an issue and needing to improve. While the team does not sport a GPA of 4.0, so there is room for improvement, as a whole, academic issues were cleaned up over the past six years, and our APR which was abysmal when Kill took over is now, not abysmal, in fact, we went to a bowl game because of it. This inability to handle himself is a huge issue as there are sure to be more issues that the AD will need to address going forward, and in his first big chance, he failed miserably.
11) I agree this is a multi-faceted issue -- the pricing increases, the 9/2 incident, the schedule of who came to play us, and Claeys' style all worked to create a problem. The way presented, it served as a "reason" to fire Claeys
12) I used "reasons" vs. reason above because, you are correct, he didn't need to have a reason to fire Claeys, other than he wanted to fire Claeys. And anyone that thinks the firing was unjustified wasn't paying attention.

The problem is when you give "reasons" in a firing that can be disputed with facts, you create an HR nightmare. an example. A company I worked for fired a guy who hadn't really done his job in about a year. For a variety of real reasons, the company tried to work with him to get him back into being productive (at one point he was a rising star). When they finally fired him, and he contested it, they had given several "reasons" about why they fired him to the staff (and shouldn't have) in an effort to both protect him (sadly that's what they were trying to do), but also for the Dept Manager to avoid looking like the bad guy. The fired employee's award in the lawsuit was in the 7 figures because he could document that the "reasons" weren't true. So, by standing up and creating a litany of excuses Mark Coyle created an opportunity for this to happen. Not that I think it will, but it could because of how poorly he handled this. And all Mark Coyle needed to do was say - "we reviewed the situation and felt we needed to make this change". Instead he gave people like me even more reason to question everything else he's done and to not give him the benefit of the doubt.

So, no, not a nice list. A sad, depressing list. But if we're going to stand up in front of the Staff, Student, Alumni and public and say we're going to hold ourselves accountable in a higher manner - which I don't disagree with, I think that should go for all parties involved. Period. We can debate further some of the points on my list, but #2, #9, #10, #11, and #12 are all extremely concerning and fire-able offenses for an AD.

Wanting to hold Coyle and Kaler accountable for their failures does not equate hating Minnesota, being mad about firing Claeys, or just being a lunatic (that I may be) it is about wanting to finally move away from the problems the University has had and continues to have based on failed and inadequate leadership. Unfortunately, Mark Coyle is very much a part of this culture of failed leadership, and has made that clear in a very short period of time.
 


DLguy said:
12. He wasn't wrongfully terminated. He was let go and paid his buyout just like his contract states. Are you really that stupid? Alabama could fire Saban tonight after they win, and not give any explanation. As long as they pay the buyout, it is not grounds for a wrongful termination suit.
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So here is your problem (not that Claeys is going to fight his termination) but when you fire someone under contract and don't give a reason you are fine. But if you give reasons and they turn out to be wrong, untruthful or otherwise determined to be slander or libel, then you can lose in court.

That is why smart ADs, even when there is loads of reasons to fire someone, don't give press conferences where they list the reasons...they just say, "going in a new direction" and move on. But Coyle didn't do that. He gave a list. A list that was absurd to anyone that is actually a fan and follows the program. A list that painted a picture that may well keep Claeys and several asst coaches from getting a new job. And that equates to real damages and the basis for a suit, regardless of the contract and buy out.
 

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