Chip: Looking at Gophers football stats: They rank 7th nationally in time of possession and 108th in scoring. That seems darn near impossible to do.

[BleedGopher]

 

[gopherbadgerman]

Early in the year pure crap in the red zone has a lot to do with it I’d guess.

 

[bleedsmaroonandgold]

We try to avoid scoring, because if you score, you have to kick off, and then time of possession starts to shift the other way.

 

[BilldGopher]

It obviously takes poise to pull that off.

 

[Stuff]

Punting from the opponents 43 yard line and playing for FGs will do that.

 

[Roland Brooks]

Won the time of possession battle against the Wolverines!

 

[upnorthkid]

Early in the year pure crap in the red zone has a lot to do with it I’d guess.

yep we’ve made almost as many FGs as TDs and that scoring average looks way different if we finish half of those drives

 

[Replacement Gopher]

Highlights the absolute meaninglessness of Time of Possesion.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

How have we compared in conference play? Our redzone offense was attrocious the first couple games.

 

[Panthadad2]

How have we compared in conference play? Our redzone offense was attrocious the first couple games.

#3

Time of Possession​

Time of Possession

Index	Team	G	TIME	AVG/G
1	Penn State	5	170:28	34:05
2	Michigan	5	170:15	34:03
3	Minnesota	5	163:43	32:44
4	Ohio State	5	162:26	32:29
5	Rutgers	5	156:20	31:16
6	Nebraska	5	150:42	30:08
7	Wisconsin	5	149:32	29:54
8	Purdue	5	147:53	29:34
9	Michigan State	5	144:51	28:58
10	Northwestern	5	141:25	28:17
11	Illinois	5	141:09	28:13
12	Maryland	5	140:25	28:05
13	Indiana	5	140:19	28:03
14	Iowa	5	120:25	24:05

https://bigten.org/stats.aspx?path=football&year=2023&conf=true

 

[Dakota2]

TOP is garbage stat. It is something you look at with casual interest after the game. As a pre-game strategy and objective it is worthless.

 

[RememberMurray]

With Scoggins, I'm beginning to get the feeling that like I've seen this movie once before, years ago...

Is this The Glen Mason Story, Part Two? Is Chip Scoggins playing the same role Dan Barrerio played way back in the Mason days? Is Chip going to be constantly sniping at Fleck the way Barreiro was constantly going after Mason, back in the day?

It worked back then, maybe it'll work again.

 

[Dakota2]

With Scoggins, I'm beginning to get the feeling that like I've seen this movie once before, years ago...

Is this The Glen Mason Story, Part Two? Is Chip Scoggins playing the same role Dan Barrerio played way back in the Mason days? Is Chip going to be constantly sniping at Fleck the way Barreiro was constantly going after Mason, back in the day?

It worked back then, maybe it'll work again.

Are you disputing the factual stats Chip is citing? Did he get it wrong?

 

[RememberMurray]

Are you disputing the factual stats Chip is citing? Did he get it wrong?

No, and no. They are facts, and he got it right.

My point: you can take facts about this team and write a negative column (or "tweet", if that's what they're still called), or a positive one. You, as the columnist (or tweeter or X-er or whatever), get to decide which story you want to tell.

For example, the Gophers just beat Iowa, one of their two main rivals, in Iowa City for the first time in a very long time. As your lede, you as a columnist could choose to point out that the Gophers didn't score any TDs in that game (which is a fact). Alternatively, you could choose to point out that the victory puts the Gophers firmly back in contention in the B1G West after two disheartening losses (also a fact).

There are lots of ways to tell the story of this Gopher football season. Lately, to my thinking, Chip seems to be pointing in one direction, and one only.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

#3

Time of Possession​

Time of Possession

Index	Team	G	TIME	AVG/G
1	Penn State	5	170:28	34:05
2	Michigan	5	170:15	34:03
3	Minnesota	5	163:43	32:44
4	Ohio State	5	162:26	32:29
5	Rutgers	5	156:20	31:16
6	Nebraska	5	150:42	30:08
7	Wisconsin	5	149:32	29:54
8	Purdue	5	147:53	29:34
9	Michigan State	5	144:51	28:58
10	Northwestern	5	141:25	28:17
11	Illinois	5	141:09	28:13
12	Maryland	5	140:25	28:05
13	Indiana	5	140:19	28:03
14	Iowa	5	120:25	24:05

https://bigten.org/stats.aspx?path=football&year=2023&conf=true

79th percentile in TOP in the big 10. 43rd percentile in scoring.

95th percentile in NCAA in TOP. 17th percentile in scoring.

Much improved in conference.

 

[Gophergrandpa]

#3

Time of Possession​

Time of Possession

Index	Team	G	TIME	AVG/G
1	Penn State	5	170:28	34:05
2	Michigan	5	170:15	34:03
3	Minnesota	5	163:43	32:44
4	Ohio State	5	162:26	32:29
5	Rutgers	5	156:20	31:16
6	Nebraska	5	150:42	30:08
7	Wisconsin	5	149:32	29:54
8	Purdue	5	147:53	29:34
9	Michigan State	5	144:51	28:58
10	Northwestern	5	141:25	28:17
11	Illinois	5	141:09	28:13
12	Maryland	5	140:25	28:05
13	Indiana	5	140:19	28:03
14	Iowa	5	120:25	24:05

https://bigten.org/stats.aspx?path=football&year=2023&conf=true

Of the top 5 in B1G TOP, 4 are in the top 5 in scoring in the B1G … one is not.

 

[RememberMurray]

Of the top 5 in B1G TOP, 4 are in the top 5 in scoring in the B1G … one is not.

Which would indicate that time of possession is, perhaps, not so insignificant after all.

80% of the teams with a high T.O.P. ranking also ranked high in scoring. 80% is a lot, I've been told.

 

[Dakota2]

No, and no. They are facts, and he got it right.

My point: you can take facts about this team and write a negative column (or "tweet", if that's what they're still called), or a positive one. You, as the columnist (or tweeter or X-er or whatever), get to decide which story you want to tell.

For example, the Gophers just beat Iowa, one of their two main rivals, in Iowa City for the first time in a very long time. As your lede, you as a columnist could choose to point out that the Gophers didn't score any TDs in that game (which is a fact). Alternatively, you could choose to point out that the victory puts the Gophers firmly back in contention in the B1G West after two disheartening losses (also a fact).

There are lots of ways to tell the story of this Gopher football season. Lately, to my thinking, Chip seems to be pointing in one direction, and one only.

If you base your writing on facts, it is neither negative nor positive. It's factual.

Before getting yourself in a tizzy, just step back and ask yourself how many decades has it been since any writer at the Star Tribune -- columnist, political writer, society page scribe, or anyone else -- written a piece that is not aimed at forming opinion? Seems to me that Scroggins has accidentally just written a factual piece. There may well be a reprimand already in the works.

 

[50PoundHead]

Punting from the opponents 43 yard line and playing for FGs will do that.

I think field goals over touchdowns contributes to the disparity.

 

[RememberMurray]

If you base your writing on facts, it is neither negative nor positive. It's factual.

Before getting yourself in a tizzy, just step back and ask yourself how many decades has it been since any writer at the Star Tribune -- columnist, political writer, society page scribe, or anyone else -- written a piece that is not aimed at forming opinion? Seems to me that Scroggins has accidentally just written a factual piece. There may well be a reprimand already in the works.

Uhhhhhh huh.

 

[Dakota2]

Which would indicate that time of possession is, perhaps, not so insignificant after all.

80% of the teams with a high T.O.P. ranking also ranked high in scoring. 80% is a lot, I've been told.

Or the best teams with the best athletes dominate on both sides of the ball.

 

[touchdownvikings]

We try to avoid scoring, because if you score, you have to kick off, and then time of possession starts to shift the other way.

I had to login, just to give this the "Ha-Ha" emoji. Well done, sir! Well done!

 

[jonnyganas]

I don't mind Chip and enjoy him and his quirkiness on the Pair and a Spare podcast. I like how he goes up 2 octaves when saying we should have a "MODERN OFFENSE"

Now whenever we throw the ball down field, I yell "MODERN OFFENSE"

 

[MplsGopher]

Fleckball!

 

[Word]

TOP is garbage stat. It is something you look at with casual interest after the game. As a pre-game strategy and objective it is worthless.

TOP only matters in the sense that it keeps your defense off the field, which can be valuable (Kill and PJ both believe in this). But it doesn't really mean much in terms of how good your offense is. A quick scoring, highly effective offense might have a really low TOP.

 

[jonnyganas]

TOP only matters in the sense that it keeps your defense off the field, which can be valuable (Kill and PJ both believe in this). But it doesn't really mean much in terms of how good your offense is. A quick scoring, highly effective offense might have a really low TOP.

I always thought it was more about keeping the ball out of your opponent's hands, making it harder for them to score on you. It also may mean that you are controlling the pace of the game. It's debatable whether that is a winning strategy or not. IMO it raises the floor for wins, but it certainly doesn't raise the ceiling.

 

[Word]

I always thought it was more about keeping the ball out of your opponent's hands, making it harder for them to score on you. It also may mean that you are controlling the pace of the game. It's debatable whether that is a winning strategy or not. IMO it raises the floor for wins, but it certainly doesn't raise the ceiling.

Keeping your defense off the field = keeping the ball out of your opponent's hands. So we agree.

We saw in the Wacker (maybe Brewster too) years what the potential draw backs of a high risk/high reward offense can mean for a team.

 

[FanSinceTheFifties]

TOP is garbage stat. It is something you look at with casual interest after the game. As a pre-game strategy and objective it is worthless.

Scroll back to the table above. Four of the top five B10 teams are also four of the top five in TOP. My guess is that the team with the greater TOP wins 80+% of the games. But I might be wrong. I've been called "insane" on this site before.

 

[RememberMurray]

If you base your writing on facts, it is neither negative nor positive. It's factual.

Before getting yourself in a tizzy, just step back and ask yourself how many decades has it been since any writer at the Star Tribune -- columnist, political writer, society page scribe, or anyone else -- written a piece that is not aimed at forming opinion? Seems to me that Scroggins has accidentally just written a factual piece. There may well be a reprimand already in the works.

There's a difference between a reporter and a columnist.

A reporter gathers and reports facts, and the good reporters deliberately leave their own opinions out of the story.

A columnist's job, on the other hand, is to put forth his or her opinion, selecting pertinent facts to bolster his or her case.

 

[TwistingMyMelon]

TOP only matters in the sense that it keeps your defense off the field, which can be valuable (Kill and PJ both believe in this). But it doesn't really mean much in terms of how good your offense is. A quick scoring, highly effective offense might have a really low TOP.

A quick look at the stats of the last two games illustrates your point:

vs. Iowa

IA TOP: 24:35
MN TOP: 35.25

Tackes by IA: 83
Tackles by MN: 48

vs. MSU

MSU TOP: 23:15
MN TOP: 36:15

Tackes by MSU: 73
Tackles by MN: 50

We could use Tackles as a proxy for how much the defense is having to work.

In both of these games, we heard TV announcers and/or words in the written recap describing how Minnesota seemed to be wearing the opponent down late in the game. There was a blogging game thread by a sports writer in one of the Michigan newspapers and he described how Minnesota was driving the ball in the MSU game with little or no resistance in the 4th quarter.