CBS: As black hires decline, college football needs, but can't adopt, a Rooney Rule

[Sportsfan24]

This is kind of an aggressive "us against them" mentality isn't it? Doesn't that kind of message breed divisiveness?

In regards to Tony Dungy- didn't he already have an NFL HC job before the Rooney Rule? His teams were known for great defense, but lack luster offenses. He brought the Bucs back to respectability, but kind of hit a plateau of making the playoffs, but not being able to get further than first round or so. Is it a coincidence that he was picked up by a team that already had a good offense, but needed shoring up on D? Was he fired because he was black, and then hired by the Colts because he was black(Rooney Rule)? Or was he fired from the Bucs because his offenses were bad and had reached a plateau, and hired by the Colts because they already had an offense and needed some Defense?

Rooney did not need a rule to do the right thing, his fellow owners did. Dungy was great coach who took a perennial horrible team to the playoffs. He was fired and Gruden was the beneficiary one year later.

Because he was a great coach, Dungy built perennial loser Indy into a Super Bowl winner.

Us against them mentality? Is that what you call being self sufficient and resolving ones own issues. What's your take on black coaches not being hired? What is your solution?

 

[minibeaver]

Rooney did not need a rule to do the right thing, his fellow owners did. Dungy was great coach who took a perennial horrible team to the playoffs. He was fired and Gruden was the beneficiary one year later.

Because he was a great coach, Dungy built perennial loser Indy into a Super Bowl winner.

Us against them mentality? Is that what you call being self sufficient and resolving ones own issues. What's your take on black coaches not being hired? What is your solution?

What tato and Golden Rodents said most closely resembles my thoughts. A family situation where kids get a good start at home (white and black) is where it begins. This is the only REAL permanent fix. The socioeconomic issues I think are the bigger problem. Same fix though. Success breeds success. You seem like you have been successful in life. I'd imagine your children have followed in their dad's footsteps. They had parents who cared about them, their future.



Tony Dungy is a great coach. I'd be dicrediting him to say he was hired because of the Rooney rule, and I don't believe he was. I believe he was hired because he's a good coach. In the same token, I don't believe he was fired (or fired sooner) from Tampa because he was black.

 

[Sportsfan24]

What tato and Golden Rodents said most closely resembles my thoughts. A family situation where kids get a good start at home (white and black) is where it begins. This is the only REAL permanent fix. The socioeconomic issues I think are the bigger problem. Same fix though. Success breeds success. You seem like you have been successful in life. I'd imagine your children have followed in their dad's footsteps. They had parents who cared about them, their future.



Tony Dungy is a great coach. I'd be dicrediting him to say he was hired because of the Rooney rule, and I don't believe he was. I believe he was hired because he's a good coach. In the same token, I don't believe he was fired (or fired sooner) from Tampa because he was black.

Thanks for the kind words.

Socioeconomics, better family situations? I have no idea what any of that has to do with black coaches being grossly under represented in college football. Unless you are saying if white decisions makers were given better values in their up bringing?

No? Of course not, it's far to easy to assume blacks are broken and need to be fixed.

Because neither of us know the upbringing of all involved let's just toss that aside and deal with issue. Why are black coaches not getting hired? I say it all boils down to racism.

You?

PS
We really have to stop thinking all black folks grew up with JJ, Thelma and Michael.


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[CWCWCW]

PS
We really have to stop thinking all black folks grew up with JJ, Thelma and Michael.


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That's funny. I've got a black friend who once said "They think they grew up with J.R., but were really friends with Archie."

 

[Sportsfan24]

That's funny. I've got a black friend who once said "They think they grew up with J.R., but were really friends with Archie."

That's funny. Dude, I loved All in the Family!

Meathead thought he was on point....all the while the "bigot" Archie was supporting his ass.


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[Pompous Elitist]

Give it more thought than this. People are hiring who they BELIEVE to be the best; that's the problem.

Personally I would love for Louis Farrakhan to be in charge of a hiring search in my profession. My white counter parts might not particularly care for it.

I'm not sure he is serious here, although by the tone of his posts I would guess yes. Or, if he is comparing white people or leaders to be like him. Equally disturbing.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/louis-farrakhan

Debating with people like this is and endless and fruitless endeavor. When the base assumption is "whites are the cause of all my problems" that is a really deep hole to dig out of.

Merry Christmas

 

[Sportsfan24]

I'm not sure he is serious here, although by the tone of his posts I would guess yes. Or, if he is comparing white people or leaders to be like him. Equally disturbing.

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/louis-farrakhan

Debating with people like this is and endless and fruitless endeavor. When the base assumption is "whites are the cause of all my problems" that is a really deep hole to dig out of.

Merry Christmas

Who are you talking too and about?


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[Sportsfan24]

My bad.

That was a bad attempt to show an example of what it feels like to apply for a job with a person you know would not hire you. You are correct Louis is an incredible racist and I will add murder.

My point is if Louis was in charge of hiring we would never be questioning the qualifications of the white folks he would not hire. The blame would correctly rest with him.

The lack of black coaches in college football is simple. They are not being given the same opportunities as their white counterparts. No justification is needed.

This is what you missed.


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[Pompous Elitist]

I'm talking about you. How do you feel about Farrakhan?

 

[Pompous Elitist]

I didnt read that far ahead. My apology.

However, it almost sounds like you are saying college ADs are like Farrakhan?

 

[MrC]

Nm

 

[Pompous Elitist]

Overtly? Signs saying blacks need not apply stop appearing years ago. What was overt 30 years ago no longer exists today, it's illegal. The lack of black coaches in college football is today's overt racism.

The fact your organization has to look at demographic info (insert shaking my head) in an effort to come up with board members is telling. I was on a golf trip 3 months ago with 30 professional black men. Hell, my contact list in my phone contains several hundred black professionals. Your organization can't find one or two? Don't you have any professional black friends? I'm sure thats how the bulk of your board came to be hired. That's how I came to serve on the 2 non profit boards I serve on....a friend asked if I would be interested.

I digress. This ***t ain't difficult if the goal is to promote change (remember I think black folks can fix this one) then mandate change. Universities left to their own accord isn't getting the job done. The University of Minnesota hired a couple of serial sexual deviants. These folks were responsible for hiring coaches! Is it out of the realm of probability that universities are hiring racists as AD's? And guess what? The racist AD isn't going to say I don't hire black coaches. Instead he will say I hired the best person for the job.

This may be news to you, but you have a terrible attitude. If you are as confrontational in real life...

As you said, this **** ain't difficult.

 

[Sportsfan24]

CBS: As black hires decline, college football needs, but can't adopt, a Roone...

[emoji848]

 

[Sportsfan24]

I didnt read that far ahead. My apology.

However, it almost sounds like you are saying college ADs are like Farrakhan?

I agree, that's why I said it was a bad example.

When you talk as much as I do you are bound make a ass out of yourself on occasion.


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[Word]

I work in a field that is greatly underrepresented by blacks. Sadly though, in my many years at this job, we have had zero black applicants for a position in my department. To me, the only solution (and it's one that finally is being worked on) is a recruiting program to get more blacks into the profession. I have no idea if it will work but it seems like a start.

What I am getting at is, how does a person become a coach? I imagine (just a guess) is that certain individuals are asked/recruited to become coaches as they come out of college and work their way up from there (like Adam Weber or Mike Sherels). Perhaps the solution is not a Rooney rule, but an effort to get existing head coaches to recruit more black players to become coaches?

 

[short ornery norwegian]

It has to start somewhere. current black players have to be lobbying and calling for more black coaches. current black coaches have to be actively involved in mentoring young black coaches and would-be coaches. players need to be strongly encouraged by their peers to consider coaching as a career after their playing days.

the white coaches have had their own "old-boy" network for decades. black coaches need to create their own "old-boy" network, from scratch if necessary.

And, I would say, black NFL players, especially the superstars, need to be lending their voices to the campaign. I know an Adrian Peterson or a Larry Fitzgerald (jr) is probably not going to go into coaching - but they can speak up about the issue - talk to HS and college players about the need for more blacks who want to coach, and raise the overall profile of the topic.

and a question for 24: based on your experience with your son and his teammates - how many of the black players ever talked about/considered coaching as a career?

 

[Sportsfan24]

I work in a field that is greatly underrepresented by blacks. Sadly though, in my many years at this job, we have had zero black applicants for a position in my department. To me, the only solution (and it's one that finally is being worked on) is a recruiting program to get more blacks into the profession. I have no idea if it will work but it seems like a start.

What I am getting at is, how does a person become a coach? I imagine (just a guess) is that certain individuals are asked/recruited to become coaches as they come out of college and work their way up from there (like Adam Weber or Mike Sherels). Perhaps the solution is not a Rooney rule, but an effort to get existing head coaches to recruit more black players to become coaches?

I'm guessing the plethora of black position coaches already in college football might correctly state "we are here, give us a chance."

It's not that difficult; hire black head coaches. Graduate Asisstants (GA's) are what you are thinking of. As a department head and hiring leader I can tell you first hand that long-term solutions like training or mentoring programs are all B.S. It's all about opportunity. The folks that usually get the opportunity have never had to formally go through either of those type programs.

The "fix" should not belong to those wanting the opportunity; what needs fixing is those doing the hiring. But them in "programs."

For those who spoke about growing up or social economics. Really? The path to becoming a head coach usually starts with being a college player. Then GA (you graduated from college and now are in graduate school). Position coach (you have your graduate degree). Then a opportunity to become a head coach (maybe coordinator first). Two parent family, where you grew up ect. has nothing to do with any of it.

Now remember I said usually played college football, I made that distinction because there are white college football coaches who never played college football? It would seem to me the qualifications are dumbed down for some.

Now with all that said allow me to reiterate; I would not change one thing in the hiring process. If black folks continue to empower others to control our lively hoods we should reap what we sow. This is one of the few times when we have complete control of a situation.

Don't play football for schools who won't hire you to work there. Don't make billions for schools but not be allowed to join in on the wealth. If blacks do this watch how fast AD's figure out how to close the hiring gap.

 

[Sportsfan24]

CBS: As black hires decline, college football needs, but can't adopt, a Roone...

It has to start somewhere. current black players have to be lobbying and calling for more black coaches. current black coaches have to be actively involved in mentoring young black coaches and would-be coaches. players need to be strongly encouraged by their peers to consider coaching as a career after their playing days.

the white coaches have had their own "old-boy" network for decades. black coaches need to create their own "old-boy" network, from scratch if necessary.

And, I would say, black NFL players, especially the superstars, need to be lending their voices to the campaign. I know an Adrian Peterson or a Larry Fitzgerald (jr) is probably not going to go into coaching - but they can speak up about the issue - talk to HS and college players about the need for more blacks who want to coach, and raise the overall profile of the topic.

and a question for 24: based on your experience with your son and his teammates - how many of the black players ever talked about/considered coaching as a career.

?

Most, including my son.

Being a GA a is a coveted position most players would jump all over it. It's a fast track to a 6 figure job before you are 30.

 

[Ignatius L Hoops]

Now remember I said usually played college football, I made that distinction because there are white college football coaches who never played college football? It would seem to me the qualifications are dumbed down for some. And then when asked, simply reply "I chose the best school for me."

Tracy Claeys being one.