All Things Grayson Grove Recruitment Thread (Class of 2024, Alexandria, MN; 6-8, 190lb; Gophers Commit!

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Johnnyboy18 said:
Football lost one to NDSU when PJ first got hired and he's in the NFL now IIRC.
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PJs 1st year he offered ndsu commit a week before signing day. Kid decided to stick with his commitment

Too my knowledge that is only player that mn offered and they went to ndsu. Ndsu fans will tell you they steal recruits from us though
 


formerlybis said:
Maybe. You’re right about not hitting up against scholarship limits, but it doesn’t mean they won’t.

I’m about to write some things people will hate. It’s a red flag that he committed so quickly. Maybe the U was his dream school. But, it also looks like he jumped at the only P6 offer he believed he might get. I also think it’s suspect to commit to a coach that has a good chance of not being there.
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He's a 2024 recruit and it's May. That's not exactly a rushed commitment. Obviously Ben may not be here, but it's his home school and he would be let out of the commitment if he wants. Asuma committed earlier and has better alternatives.
 

Grove is in an interesting position - and a challenging position for schools like MN.

Grove looks like a good player with potential, but he's not some can't miss 4* or 5* prospect.
and that means a catch-22 for the Gophers.

You land a player like Grove and some people will say he's not a game-changer.
But if Grove goes to another school - like maybe Wisconsin - people will complain that the Gophers let an in-state prospect "get away."

in the end, you can't get every player in the state. the coaches have to make choices. we'll see if this choice works out for Johnson (assuming he gets to coach Grove in '24......).
 




Payne didn't have a long offer list and I think everyone thinks he's going to be great. Johnson seems to know which recruits he wants in-state. I trust his evaluations. And I have to say, he is getting Minnesota recruits every single year.
 

I watched a few minutes of the highlight video of his game against Kapke and I was pretty impressed. Kapke is a year older and a lot more physically developed. However, Grove matched up quite well with him. He will be better than TT and several other big man recruits over the last 15-20 years.
 

I have watched him play a lot. I really like his overall game. No glaringly deficiencies. Obviously can always improve but he rebounds well, shoots well, and his leadership skills are really good. He will be the first guy to lay out in a dive for a loose ball. Seen it many times. Uses both hands well and is crafty around the rim.
 



howeda7 said:
Nah. In state kid and we have yet to ever have a scholarship issue. No downside in taking him, even if he's Treyton Thompson level.
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There are few if any comparisons between Grove and Thompson. Go watch their film and how they play the game.

I'm still surprised that RP and then Ben took TT. Must have been that one HS or AAU game where he shot the lights out from 3!! :ROFLMAO: I think Grove has the talent and skills to earn PT but will probably be more of a depth player. He has another year to develop.
 

CoMn said:
Payne didn't have a long offer list and I think everyone thinks he's going to be great. Johnson seems to know which recruits he wants in-state. I trust his evaluations. And I have to say, he is getting Minnesota recruits every single year.
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Which MN recruit is coming this year?
 

CoMn said:
And I have to say, he is getting Minnesota recruits every single year.
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Why does this matter so much to people? We had 9 players from Minnesota on the team last year and finished 2-17. Would it have been better if we had 10/11/12 players from Minnesota?

I have no idea if Grayson Grove can play or not so this isn't intended to be a slight on him. But in general, if we are taking lesser players just because they are from Minnesota, isn't that a recipe for mediocrity? Would we recruit the same player X if he grew up in Arkansas?
 
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golfing18now said:
Why does this matter so much to people? We had 9 players from Minnesota on the team last year and finished 2-17. Would it have been better if we had 10/11/12 players from Minnesota?

I have no idea if Grayson Grove can play or not so this isn't intended to be a slight on him. But in general, if we are taking lesser players just because they are from Minnesota, isn't that a recipe for mediocrity? Would we recruit the same player X if he grew up in Arkansas?
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Highly doubt he was offered because he was from Minnesota. The recruiting from Minnesota thing is far more an observer reality than a coaching one.

As has been noted, this staff has identified guys early and worked on them. Talent evaluation doesn’t seem to the problem. Closing the deal has been.
 

Bayfieldgopher said:
There are few if any comparisons between Grove and Thompson. Go watch their film and how they play the game.

I'm still surprised that RP and then Ben took TT. Must have been that one HS or AAU game where he shot the lights out from 3!! :ROFLMAO: I think Grove has the talent and skills to earn PT but will probably be more of a depth player. He has another year to develop.
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That’s great, but at some point we need to bring in more than just depth players. From what I’ve seen for years, a guy who can drop in over 40% from three will be a welcome addition and seems like more than a depth player to me.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Grove is in an interesting position - and a challenging position for schools like MN.

Grove looks like a good player with potential, but he's not some can't miss 4* or 5* prospect.
and that means a catch-22 for the Gophers.

You land a player like Grove and some people will say he's not a game-changer.
But if Grove goes to another school - like maybe Wisconsin - people will complain that the Gophers let an in-state prospect "get away."

in the end, you can't get every player in the state. the coaches have to make choices. we'll see if this choice works out for Johnson (assuming he gets to coach Grove in '24......).
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I understand some don't like it, but for me it's tougher in 2023 to take a project kid like Grove. The issue now with projects is that they never stick around. You either end up with TT who isn't good enough, or you end up with a player who out performs his recruiting profile and goes to greener pastures. For me, I'd have to be sure the kid could play as a fr (Payne, Christie come to mind) and if I didn't think they could then just stay in the portal with that spot. Essentially this is what Muss does at Arkansas, you are either a productive freshman or you come from the portal.
 


GopherBlood666 said:
Literally said I liked the signing. I was a replying to a post declaring this was a sign of future conference titles. I'm not willing to go that far. Players like this should be the floor of recruiting if we hope to win conference titles. Is that okay?
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Yes you did say you liked the signing. I was just trying to point out that most people on this board just cant help but try and be negative about everything. Yes it was a good signing, BUT its not like any blue bloods were after him. It was a good signing, BUT his offer list was terrible. It was a good signing, BUT.......there's always something to be negative about. I get that we havent been great lately. Hopefully it turns around soon. People need something to get excited about.
 

leib0039 said:
I understand some don't like it, but for me it's tougher in 2023 to take a project kid like Grove. The issue now with projects is that they never stick around. You either end up with TT who isn't good enough, or you end up with a player who out performs his recruiting profile and goes to greener pastures. For me, I'd have to be sure the kid could play as a fr (Payne, Christie come to mind) and if I didn't think they could then just stay in the portal with that spot. Essentially this is what Muss does at Arkansas, you are either a productive freshman or you come from the portal.
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Going to greener pastures has rarely been a thing for P6 programs G5 programs have to worry about that, not any school in the P6 (at least not in any way it should impact who you recruit).
 

leib0039 said:
I understand some don't like it, but for me it's tougher in 2023 to take a project kid like Grove. The issue now with projects is that they never stick around. You either end up with TT who isn't good enough, or you end up with a player who out performs his recruiting profile and goes to greener pastures. For me, I'd have to be sure the kid could play as a fr (Payne, Christie come to mind) and if I didn't think they could then just stay in the portal with that spot. Essentially this is what Muss does at Arkansas, you are either a productive freshman or you come from the portal.
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When has a developmental recruit of Ben’s left got greener pastures?

Obviously, I’m not counting portal players.

It flummoxes me why some feel the need to dwell in future angst.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
When has a developmental recruit of Ben’s left got greener pastures?

Obviously, I’m not counting portal players.

It flummoxes me why some feel the need to dwell in future angst.
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Ben hasn't recruited anyone that good. Carr did it twice, Pitt to MN to TX. Ryan Young and Pete Nance both did it at NW. Yes it's not as prevalent but when you are consistently finishing last in your conference its going to happen. But clearly CBJ is totally fine with 4-5 guys on the roster each year who have no business in a B1G roster. I guess it's working out so far....wait..
 

leib0039 said:
I understand some don't like it, but for me it's tougher in 2023 to take a project kid like Grove. The issue now with projects is that they never stick around. You either end up with TT who isn't good enough, or you end up with a player who out performs his recruiting profile and goes to greener pastures. For me, I'd have to be sure the kid could play as a fr (Payne, Christie come to mind) and if I didn't think they could then just stay in the portal with that spot. Essentially this is what Muss does at Arkansas, you are either a productive freshman or you come from the portal.
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I would make a distinction between a project and a developmental player. A project in my mind is someone who might have athletic ability, size, etc. but is not yet a skilled basketball player, and one hopes that with effort and the natural attributes already there, they might make it. Tall guys are frequently in this category.

A developmental player is someone who perhaps has skills, but doesn't have the size, speed, etc. to compete at the level he needs to be competitive.

I think they are different, and your point is strong for real projects, and maybe not as much for a developmental player. Groves is much closer to developmental than project from what I read on this board.

The project is much more high risk than a developmental, but the risks of investing time and effort into getting a player ready and having him bolt is high.

I said it before, but any player at 6-8 who can hit threes over 40% has to find a place on the Gophers roster. We just don't see them often. From a distance, Groves seems more than a project or a developmental player even if not the star that we need to upgrade the program in a hurry.
 

leib0039 said:
Ben hasn't recruited anyone that good. Carr did it twice, Pitt to MN to TX. Ryan Young and Pete Nance both did it at NW. Yes it's not as prevalent but when you are consistently finishing last in your conference its going to happen. But clearly CBJ is totally fine with 4-5 guys on the roster each year who have no business in a B1G roster. I guess it's working out so far....wait..
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it’s May / go enjoy the sun 🌞 and have some fun, you’ll have plenty of time to grumble this winter ❄️

Or keep moving the goalposts of your suppositions to prove you’re right 🥸
 

Holy Man said:
I would make a distinction between a project and a developmental player. A project in my mind is someone who might have athletic ability, size, etc. but is not yet a skilled basketball player, and one hopes that with effort and the natural attributes already there, they might make it. Tall guys are frequently in this category.

A developmental player is someone who perhaps has skills, but doesn't have the size, speed, etc. to compete at the level he needs to be competitive.

I think they are different, and your point is strong for real projects, and maybe not as much for a developmental player. Groves is much closer to developmental than project from what I read on this board.

The project is much more high risk than a developmental, but the risks of investing time and effort into getting a player ready and having him bolt is high.

I said it before, but any player at 6-8 who can hit threes over 40% has to find a place on the Gophers roster. We just don't see them often. From a distance, Groves seems more than a project or a developmental player even if not the star that we need to upgrade the program in a hurry.
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Honestly Groves is much more of a low to mid major project than High major project. I do like his competitiveness and ability to contest shots at the rim. He is closer to 6'7 6'8 than a 6'9 6'10 player and he is far from wing. He is more of a stretch 4/5. His high school team plays majority zone and he struggles now when he has to guard bigs in man to man. I am surprised we pushed for Groves over Mckennonen who has more upside and is just as skilled.
 

60's Guy said:
The point was made that it was a nice signing....BUT, at some point we still do need to sign some players who may make an immediate impact in the Big Ten. Yes, we can sign guys and hope they develop from diamonds in the rough to ALL BIG TEN level but the percentages suggest it may not work. It also certainly will take more time to even know the answer. Does Ben still have 3 more years for us to wait to find out? I like the player okay, will Ben be here to coach him?

He said Kansas, he have could have said Duke, Kentucky, Purdue, St John's, USC, UCLA, on and on versus Indiana St and St Thomas.

Ben says, everybody says, you gotta get older...meaning everybody at the top is fortifying their rosters through the portal. We have added enough to get a l m o s t as good as last year. Reminder: we finished in last place two years running. We need another possible contributor from the portal to to give us a better chance to just get out of the last one, two to four slots in the standings.

Side note: I wanna know what happens when we lose the first recruit to St Thomas? Wooden could be our coach and it will still happen at some point...I think that thread is going to be one of the uglier ones.
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This IS the kind of guy you can build a competitive roster with...IF he's as good as his national ranking (which it looks to me like he is) and IF you can develop him and put him in a position to succeed. You saw my post a couple months ago about how Purdue's roster had these kinds of guys last season, including a freshman starter who was a 3-star recruit, and they were a top 5 team. Not changing my tune that you still need star power--guys that can do what other guys can't do and who change the game they're in--but this is a good signing for sure.
 

GopherPlaya said:
Honestly Groves is much more of a low to mid major project than High major project. I do like his competitiveness and ability to contest shots at the rim. He is closer to 6'7 6'8 than a 6'9 6'10 player and he is far from wing. He is more of a stretch 4/5. His high school team plays majority zone and he struggles now when he has to guard bigs in man to man. I am surprised we pushed for Groves over Mckennonen who has more upside and is just as skilled.
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I’ll take your assessment as you have seen him.
 

GopherPlaya said:
Honestly Groves is much more of a low to mid major project than High major project. I do like his competitiveness and ability to contest shots at the rim. He is closer to 6'7 6'8 than a 6'9 6'10 player and he is far from wing. He is more of a stretch 4/5. His high school team plays majority zone and he struggles now when he has to guard bigs in man to man. I am surprised we pushed for Groves over Mckennonen who has more upside and is just as skilled.
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We only have a spot for one and not both?
 

GopherPlaya said:
Honestly Groves is much more of a low to mid major project than High major project. I do like his competitiveness and ability to contest shots at the rim. He is closer to 6'7 6'8 than a 6'9 6'10 player and he is far from wing. He is more of a stretch 4/5. His high school team plays majority zone and he struggles now when he has to guard bigs in man to man. I am surprised we pushed for Groves over Mckennonen who has more upside and is just as skilled.
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Clearly coaches and scouts who have seen both play disagree with you because 1 is committed to a p5 school and ranked higher.
 


Johnnyboy18 said:
Clearly coaches and scouts who have seen both play disagree with you because 1 is committed to a p5 school and ranked higher.
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Where is Groves ranked higher? I don't think either one is ranked. Also, this is McKennonen's first year playing with a shoe team. His recruitment will be similar to Pharrell's. He has been the best player on D1MN 17s. I would even say Isaiah Johnson-Arigu has been better than Groves as well. I don't see how it is crazy to be surprised by this if you watch them play.
 

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