All Things Gopher Players Appeals Process

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rugger14 said:
I have absolutely read everything I can on the subject. STUPID to boycott. In the court of public opinion the players look awful. All these rules and EOAA guidelines are irrelevant. A girl maybe agreed to have sex with a player and a recruit. The player then texted all his buddies to come and join the fun. Meanwhile they used all kinds of derogatory language towards women in their texts. Game, set, match to the girl in the court of public opinion.
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I believe you are confusing what was known, when and by whom. You're assuming that all of what you note above was transparent to the entire team. It certainly should have been. But was not due to their incompetent AD that repeatedly, and from the very beginnng, just let the situation play out without trying to actively manage it. Again, read the piece in the PiPress. If after doing so you have the same opinion, we're going to have to agree to disagree.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
So you think Coyle could just pass out the report to whoever he wants? Do you even know how much of the report Coyle even had access to?

Someday you'll figure out I'm not just blindly defending Coyle because I want to. People continue to say stuff that isn't true, and I just call them out on it.
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Ummm, I never said anything about him passing or not passing out the report. I said saying something negative about MC on here is like saying beatlejuice 3 times --- you instantly appear to defend him. That much cannot be debated.


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GopherWeatherGuy said:
So you think Coyle could just pass out the report to whoever he wants? Do you even know how much of the report Coyle even had access to?

Someday you'll figure out I'm not just blindly defending Coyle because I want to. People continue to say stuff that isn't true, and I just call them out on it.
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You are defending Coyle at every turn. And being called out when you do so.

You won't admit his leadership and management of the entire situation has been severely lacking.

Blind.
 

Spoofin said:
Someone should have warned you that saying something negative about Mark Coyle on here is like saying Beatlejuice 3-times. Only in this case GopherWeatherGuy instantly appears.


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So true. When GWG is preoccupied and posting on this forum do you also sometimes wonder if Mark Coyle is aimlessly wandering the hallways shouting for Smithers?
 


BarnBurner said:
You are defending Coyle at every turn. And being called out when you do so.

You won't admit his leadership and management of the entire situation has been severely lacking.

Blind.
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I call out anyone who posts misinformation on any subject. No one has a problem with that unless I'm defending the made up stuff that's posted on here about Coyle. Then the same handful of Claeys apologists come calling.

Coyle had very little say over the situation.

Blind.
 


1385md said:
Yeah, that sounds terrible cuz Bob frames it that way. The 10 players will be evaluated according to their individual roles, not lumped together. There will only be one hearing, but each accused player can and most likely will present whatever evidence they feel best served their case.

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How did I frame it in anyway but the way it is?

Yeah, they are going to have that hodge podge of an investigation, I NEVER said that people couldn't bring things up individually. I just said that having 1 mass hearing is a horrible idea. I am shocked anyone would defend that process (regardless of where you stand on the substance of the issue).

Do you see the lynch mob mentality that you have? The process is horrible. Ask yourself, why don't real court rooms and real cases lump them together. The answer is really easy and anyone on EITHER side of court room would tell you, 1 big trial is much less likely to find the truth. Prosecutors and police LOVE when defendants have varying degrees of culpability. You don't believe me, ask anyone who has ever been a cop or prosecutor. It's how you get people to talk.

It's ok, you can say that I am spinning this to make a case. It's just me, every police station, every prosecutor and every court in the country that feels this way. But you're right, we're just spinning.
 

GopherRock said:
Just remember that if the team doesn't walk out, the report doesn't get leaked.
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Ha. Yeah, they're fault.

This isn't too far from a lot of people's point of view on this, "hey, even if it was consensual, if you didn't have consensual sex with that girl, you never would have been accused of rape."
 



A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
I wouldn't call anything anyone has done here investigated.

I'm not a fan of the process, I've got serious concerns about universities acting as justice systems... but I don't think anyone has done much in the way of investigated. Not in any original way.
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I agree. Bad joke, but I think there has been more serious thought on this situation on this board than by the admin of the U and we haven't actually talked to anyone.


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caliGopher said:
I agree. Bad joke, but I think there has been more serious thought on this situation on this board than by the admin of the U and we haven't actually talked to anyone.
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Why do you keep saying that Kaler is going to be fired in May?
 





I think people (on both sides) are missing a big reason for the boycott. The EOAA publicly (or perhaps Kill made it public) went after football players and a culture of harassment in the summer of 2015. After all their investigation, they found very little (reports of one player being verbally abusive I believe). Apparently Kill warned the players that this office was out to get them. Then this happens and the team feels like they were unfairly targeted (and they probably were. Lynch spent a weekend in jail and never missed a basketball game while members of the 10 were not directly involved and face expulsion/suspension).

When all this broke Derrick Wells tweeted:

https://twitter.com/DerrickWells_3/status/810246312734195712

Pretty sure that he is referring to the team being targeted. It would also explain why recent alumni (Gray, Wilson, Cobb) immediately took the players side.
 


Winnipegopher said:
I think people (on both sides) are missing a big reason for the boycott. The EOAA publicly (or perhaps Kill made it public) went after football players and a culture of harassment in the summer of 2015. After all their investigation, they found very little (reports of one player being verbally abusive I believe). Apparently Kill warned the players that this office was out to get them. Then this happens and the team feels like they were unfairly targeted (and they probably were. Lynch spent a weekend in jail and never missed a basketball game while members of the 10 were not directly involved and face expulsion/suspension).

When all this broke Derrick Wells tweeted:

https://twitter.com/DerrickWells_3/status/810246312734195712

Pretty sure that he is referring to the team being targeted. It would also explain why recent alumni (Gray, Wilson, Cobb) immediately took the players side.
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Lynch went through the same EOAA process and a punishment was recommended for him. But the committee who heard his appeal decided no punishment was warranted. I say let it play out before passing judgement on the players or the process.
 

dpodoll68 said:
If they're that upset about his performance, why would they wait until May? Why wouldn't they just do it now?
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Pretty sure they don't need to, but that is why that keeps being used as a date. I would think the BoR would want all this to play out and be completed before deciding to take any action. I assume they would then have an investigation conducted. He surely has a severance package as part of his contract. To void it, they surely would want to have strong defensible evidence and a good paper trail.

In any case, based on the public comments from three regents, he's likely to get a less than stellar review.
 

bizzle22 said:
Lynch went through the same EOAA process and a punishment was recommended for him. But the committee who heard his appeal decided no punishment was warranted. I say let it play out before passing judgement on the players or the process.
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Per my recent post on the Upset Family thread, not sure Doogie's a great source to be using as proof...
 


PMWinSTP said:
Per my recent post on the Upset Family thread, not sure Doogie's a great source to be using as proof...
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You can choose to believe it or not, but I don't know why he would just make it up. It's very different than saying "the Timberwolves have had talks about trading so and so with many teams"
 

PMWinSTP said:
Pretty sure they don't need to, but that is why that keeps being used as a date. I would think the BoR would want all this to play out and be completed before deciding to take any action. I assume they would then have an investigation conducted. He surely has a severance package as part of his contract. To void it, they surely would want to have strong defensible evidence and a good paper trail.

In any case, based on the public comments from three regents, he's likely to get a less than stellar review.
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Less than a stellar review is still a long was from being fired.
 

bizzle22 said:
You can choose to believe it or not, but I don't know why he would just make it up. It's very different than saying "the Timberwolves have had talks about trading so and so with many teams"
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Did you view the attachment? By definition the panel has to be at least five people. He said repeatedly that it is three people. This is basic reporting 101 stuff. Took me about a minute to find the document. Hard for me to believe that the U would not follow the written process.

It's a running joke on this board that whatever Doogie reports, believe the opposite. He's wrong that often.
 

scools12 said:
Less than a stellar review is still a long was from being fired.
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For Kaler, I think people need to understand athletics are a very visible but likely small part of his job. Dpodoll posted university fundraising totals a while back and the totals were huge and going up. If Kaler is indeed seen as a great fundraiser (for the university not just athletics) he will be at Minnesota as long as he wants to be.
 

scools12 said:
If caving after 2 days and having none of your demands met then yes it was a complete success.
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They knew their "demands" wouldn't be met. It was a negotiation. They couldn't set their sites low or they would have no negotiating power. They succeeded in their goals. National attention was brought to their side of the debate.
 

PMWinSTP said:
Did you view the attachment? By definition the panel has to be at least five people. He said repeatedly that it is three people. This is basic reporting 101 stuff. Took me about a minute to find the document. Hard for me to believe that the U would not follow the written process.

It's a running joke on this board that whatever Doogie reports, believe the opposite. He's wrong that often.
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Pretty sure you found the wrong document. Close, but...did you see this one? Only took me a minute to find. http://usenate.umn.edu/ssms/ssmsprocedures.pdf
 

Oregon Gopher said:
Ridiculous- you don't the press wasn't going to pursue the issue otherwise?


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I think the U was content to have everything buried and gag-ordered until tomorrow's hearings, and didn't take the walkout threat seriously. It wasn't until the walkout started that the external pressure went through the roof to find out why the additional players have been dragged in, as well as why now.

Recall that the walkout started Thursday afternoon/evening the 15th. The report hit the KSTP website shortly after lunch on Friday the 16th, while it was reported that the players were in a meeting with one or more members of the Regents.
 

scools12 said:
Less than a stellar review is still a long was from being fired.
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Thinking that is the minimum that will happen, if an investigation does not provide enough evidence to terminate for just cause.

His contract, which was extended in 2014 to 2020, states his severance would be equal to his annual salary. If terminated for just cause, he can file a grievance but the only remedy would be monetary, not to exceed one year's salary.
 


http://kstp.com/news/appeal-hearing...layers-university-of-minnesota/4381305/?cat=1

This line from the article should very much frighten everyone.

In university documents, the Student Sexual Misconduct Subcommittee stated the evidence will not be allowed because whether the student had consensual sexual contact with certain individuals “is irrelevant to whether there was consent with other accused students.”

I'm pretty sure that's a pretty big deal for the 5 that did have sexual contact with the accuser.

Seems like this would have had an easy solution IF THEY HAD INDIVIDUAL HEARINGS like was requested.

464f1fc8e40b41968d8c41c15755f0d6659bed35050c5a9d577a64ab1f2c4cca.jpg
 

CurveballJesus said:
http://kstp.com/news/appeal-hearing...layers-university-of-minnesota/4381305/?cat=1

This line from the article should very much frighten everyone.

In university documents, the Student Sexual Misconduct Subcommittee stated the evidence will not be allowed because whether the student had consensual sexual contact with certain individuals “is irrelevant to whether there was consent with other accused students.”

I'm pretty sure that's a pretty big deal for the 5 that did have sexual contact with the accuser.

Seems like this would have had an easy solution IF THEY HAD INDIVIDUAL HEARINGS like was requested.

View attachment 4721
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Just saw the link myself.

Attorney Ryan Pacyga, whose client, Antoine Winfield Jr., is one of the players facing a one-year suspension, says the university declined a request to conduct individual, six-hour hearings for each player.

“My concern is I don't want Antoine Winfield Jr. being judged for any of the alleged conduct of any of the other nine accused students, nor should any of them be judged for anything somebody else is accused of,” Pacyga said, adding that all 10 players must now make their arguments in a third of the time.
 

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