All Things Class of 2020 Recruiting Thread

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alchemy2u said:
You also forget Pitino's first year at FIU where he built a very competitive team out of the mess that Isiah Thomas left. FIU had it's first winning season in 13 years, the defense ranked eighth in the country, only had six returning players, only five scholarship players, set school records and got them within one win of an NCAA berth on a team.

https://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2013/3/11/4090004/richard-pitino-fiu-coaching-record-sub-belt-championship

Pitino himself admits that he was giving a B1G job very early in his career. That also means that he has had to learn on the job against the some of the very best coaches in the country. Would it have been nice if he could have spent a few more years in the "minor leagues"? Of course, but we took the chance and it is beginning to payoff. It will take more consistent success on the court before more of the local kids believe that the grass is just as green at the U.
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I don't completely disagree with this as I like Pitino want him to do well, probably one of his bigger apologise, but at some point there needs to be a payoff for the longevity. I would say his tenure was better than Monson's, Tubby's up for debate, see how the next two years ago. Pitino needs to compete for a tourney bid, recruit reasonably well this year and put a top four team in the league on the floor next year, if he wants to be here long term. If he can land Garcia, I think they can win the league in 2021. But if those things don't happen at that point eight years is enough to pull the plug and start over

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mkAz said:
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I still think if we offer Mason, we can land both. Dad's a high school coach, be easier to get to the games. Question is how confident are we in landing Walton, could be a job defining decision

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vic0404 said:
Built Im right with you on much of what you write. People keep wanting to give someone more and more time to see results, yet you cant just keep hoping that positive results will come about because Pitino is young, or because there have been rays of sunshine here and there. If recruiting would be going better I would be more positive about the direction, but at this point, it is less than ideal (especially on the MN scene).
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I completely understand holding on to hope. I still have hope as well, continue to write checks, cheer for the team, watch prospects all offseason and take a very close objective view of the total body of work. What i will not do is pretend that he is one of the best young coaches in the game. No one in the game thinks that because the results are no where near that. Too often i see fans support what they hope will happen instead of seeing what has happened and is happening. I have seen young coaches that started out in tough jobs and do far better at their first job and absolutely annihilate what he has done here. I have read thoughts on here about how other coaches would not have done better here and that is simply not being truthful. Some of those coaches won ACC titles and Big East titles with classes ranked very similar. And they won big early under very early on. Of course he could still do it but in the first 6 years he has come nowhere near winning a conference title, 30 games or a deep advancement in the tourney. I expect a lot. I see things like people referring to a run to the conference semifinals, or a potential run to the sweet 16. Damn, those things are winning two games, hardly a run to me. Then i see could have, should have, maybe.... All of those things are did not do it in my eyes. Losing conference records do not impress recruits or their parents. This is just my take. I get that each fan can decide for themselves what is bad, good, great, dynamic, funny, good looking and on and on. Everyone has their own opinion. I am cheering just as hard as anyone else for the Gophers to win big but i can aknowledge when it has been atrocious in the conference. I can accept it if it was surrounded by conference titles, conference tourney titles, elite 8's etc.. But nothing.
 

Any recruitment news, or just pitino talk
 


Builtbadgers’s, it is very very clear you do not think rp is a good coach.
You state it over and over and over while at the same time reminding gopherhole
Of your generosity to Mn bb.

I have challenged you many times to list those badgerbuilt approved young coaches that
Are really going to be home run hires.

No list to this point.
 

builtbadgers said:
Wooden won 6 straight conference titles to start his career ! Jay Wright had a far better start in his first 6 years at Hofstra and again at Nova. You listed those years at Nova . TWO 3RDS AND a Conference title in the first 6 dwarfs the historical losing we have seen here.
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Yes, Wooden did. Nice, but then it got bumpy for 12 years....with double figure loss seasons and several 7, 8, 9 loss seasons. Fine, but not any indicator he's about to string National title win seasons together.

Wright started 10-18, 9-18, 12-15 in a lesser conference at Hofstra, after 10 years as an assistant coach. You would have fired him hands down at that point!!!!

The overall point...it took Jay Wright 29 years to become the icon you highlight.

Wooden went went to 3 NCAA tournaments in his first 15 years. Pitino has been to two in his first 7 years. Less than half the time. Wooden was the NAIA runner up at Indiana St. Pitino won the NIT Championship in his first year at Minnesota. Looks like Pitino wins!

You wanna argue stupid and ignore stuff...I can too!
 

bemidjigopher said:
I still think if we offer Mason, we can land both. Dad's a high school coach, be easier to get to the games. Question is how confident are we in landing Walton, could be a job defining decision

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It'd be a nice change to recruit and land too many shooters.
 

BarnBurner said:
Builtbadgers’s, it is very very clear you do not think rp is a good coach.
You state it over and over and over while at the same time reminding gopherhole
Of your generosity to Mn bb.

I have challenged you many times to list those badgerbuilt approved young coaches that
Are really going to be home run hires.

No list to this point.
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I’ve been wondering this as well. Who are these plethora of young coaches who dwarf RPs achievements and have won ACC/Big East titles at a young age? The only ones I can think of are Tony Bennett and maybe Kevin Ollie (that worked out well lol)


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60's Guy said:
It'd be a nice change to recruit and land too many shooters.
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I like both twins, Mason is just three inches shorter, but still 6'3" with a decent handle. His film looked better than Greenlee's did

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60's Guy said:
Yes, Wooden did. Nice, but then it got bumpy for 12 years....with double figure loss seasons and several 7, 8, 9 loss seasons. Fine, but not any indicator he's about to string National title win seasons together.

Wright started 10-18, 9-18, 12-15 in a lesser conference at Hofstra, after 10 years as an assistant coach. You would have fired him hands down at that point!!!!

The overall point...it took Jay Wright 29 years to become the icon you highlight.

Wooden went went to 3 NCAA tournaments in his first 15 years. Pitino has been to two in his first 7 years. Less than half the time. Wooden was the NAIA runner up at Indiana St. Pitino won the NIT Championship in his first year at Minnesota. Looks like Pitino wins!

You wanna argue stupid and ignore stuff...I can too!
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Wooden had to win the conference to get in the tourney, not have some hack sub .500 conference record and still get in. Your ignoring how they won the conference by year 6 in Wrights case and Wooden won it year after year quickly. I was not expecting icon status in 6 years but to think Pitino is even in the same universe at 6 years, by any measure is a joke. Bo Ryan won the conference right away. As it pertains to recruiting he has done a pretty good job, building a championship team that has been terrible inefficient and weak defensively falls very short of being a big winner. I did nor say fire him now, i support him this year but expect to win big if i am going to consider him a great coach. There is not any argument for me with a historically bad conference record that not a single highly regarded , high achieving coach has ever done that poorly.
 

BarnBurner said:
Builtbadgers’s, it is very very clear you do not think rp is a good coach.
You state it over and over and over while at the same time reminding gopherhole
Of your generosity to Mn bb.

I have challenged you many times to list those badgerbuilt approved young coaches that
Are really going to be home run hires.

No list to this point.
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Never said there was a list of those to hire. You actually have to be smart enough to hire them before someone else does.This was about the ability of coaches to win big and early that is a indicator for great things to come.
 

A nonymous said:
I’ve been wondering this as well. Who are these plethora of young coaches who dwarf RPs achievements and have won ACC/Big East titles at a young age? The only ones I can think of are Tony Bennett and maybe Kevin Ollie (that worked out well lol)


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Valvano, Coach K, Bennett was not that young in years but in experience he was and it is far more difficult in the ACC than the Big 10 as you have had to get through UNC and Duke and the Big 10 has nothing to match that. Thompson did it in the BE at 37, Boeheim at 35, Gary Williams 37. Of course Knight by this age had 4 conference titles and a National title, Brad Stevens had 2 final 4's before this age, Check out what Matta did early, Donovan and on and on. All apologies to the board for putting these posts under recruiting.
 



builtbadgers said:
Never said there was a list of those to hire. You actually have to be smart enough to hire them before someone else does.This was about the ability of coaches to win big and early that is a indicator for great things to come.
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Ok, no list.

Who are those coaches that have the ability to win big in the future? Name them.
 

builtbadgers said:
Valvano, Coach K, Bennett was not that young in years but in experience he was and it is far more difficult in the ACC than the Big 10 as you have had to get through UNC and Duke and the Big 10 has nothing to match that. Thompson did it in the BE at 37, Boeheim at 35, Gary Williams 37. Of course Knight by this age had 4 conference titles and a National title, Brad Stevens had 2 final 4's before this age, Check out what Matta did early, Donovan and on and on. All apologies to the board for putting these posts under recruiting.
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Who is the next Thompson Boeheim Williams Knight??

You are the one with all the knowledge so name them.
 

BarnBurner said:
Who is the next Thompson Boeheim Williams Knight??

You are the one with all the knowledge so name them.
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Yeah not really sure how naming the all time greats is really that beneficial. We are trying to hire one of those guys, I understand, but doesn't having those glasses on impact how you gauge a current coach? I think it does for a ton.
 

bemidjigopher said:
I still think if we offer Mason, we can land both. Dad's a high school coach, be easier to get to the games. Question is how confident are we in landing Walton, could be a job defining decision

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I know Greenlee and Mason are different kids and players, but I struggle to offer Mason when we took Greenlee. Now who knows what the offer really was. Maybe it was truly a one year deal to prove you belong thing, maybe he truly is a diamond in rough. I do know that Mason is a great shooter and would've been a take before Greenlee imo. Smart kid will good size for a lead/combo guard. Obviously schools must be worried a little about his athleticism or he'd have more high level D1 offers. Definitely an interesting scenario to play out. Obviously the staff doesn't feel comfortable with Mason, or they'd offer. Also how does it work for team dynamics if you take both brothers, but Mason never plays and wants to leave? Do you lose both?
 

Brother teams never seem to work out for us.

Jones brothers
Hurt brothers
Ellenson brothers

If we offer to both we'd most likely only get one and it would be the underperforming one.

The Hollins brothers are the only ones who worked, but they weren't brothers!
 
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builtbadgers said:
Never said there was a list of those to hire. You actually have to be smart enough to hire them before someone else does.This was about the ability of coaches to win big and early that is a indicator for great things to come.
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That is what we did! You have a bias against Pitino that makes you accentuate the negative and ignore any positive aspects. We all know that he made some early recruiting mistakes that killed the roster and made it very hard to win big early. That seems to be your only judge on what makes a coach, but it is not the only indicator! You tend to ignore the others and constantly bring it up.


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manderson1984 said:
I know Greenlee and Mason are different kids and players, but I struggle to offer Mason when we took Greenlee. Now who knows what the offer really was. Maybe it was truly a one year deal to prove you belong thing, maybe he truly is a diamond in rough. I do know that Mason is a great shooter and would've been a take before Greenlee imo. Smart kid will good size for a lead/combo guard. Obviously schools must be worried a little about his athleticism or he'd have more high level D1 offers. Definitely an interesting scenario to play out. Obviously the staff doesn't feel comfortable with Mason, or they'd offer. Also how does it work for team dynamics if you take both brothers, but Mason never plays and wants to leave? Do you lose both?
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What makes it even trickier is the recruitment of Walton. If you take Gabe and Mason, you are taking two and then you almost surely don't get Walton. If they think they can get Walton it makes it pretty tough to offer two schollys to accomplish what you could do with one.
 

Otis said:
Brother teams never seem to work out for us.

Jones brothers
Hurt brothers
Ellenson brothers

If we offer to both we'd most likely only get one and it would be the underperforming one.

The Hollins brothers are the only ones who worked, but they weren't brothers!
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I would add the Joseph brothers. I am not sure we signed Devoe to get an in with Cory but Devoe left and Cory never gave us a sniff.
 

bga1 said:
What makes it even trickier is the recruitment of Walton. If you take Gabe and Mason, you are taking two and then you almost surely don't get Walton. If they think they can get Walton it makes it pretty tough to offer two schollys to accomplish what you could do with one.
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Gabe and Walton are different guys and actually would play well together. Truthfully all three could play together as they are all willing ball handlers who can shoot it with Walton and Mason being the top shooters, while Gabe is a better slasher/vertical guy. All three CAN defend, Kerwin is the best/most willing of the three and could end up being a top tier Defender. Agree though that I highly doubt they all come together. I can appreciate that this staff doesn't seem to offer scholarships to someone to get another. They show enough respect for everyone involved and they obviously have not felt Mason is worth offering yet. Maybe it's a sign they feel they are in good with plenty of wings as well.
 


manderson1984 said:
Gabe and Walton are different guys and actually would play well together. Truthfully all three could play together as they are all willing ball handlers who can shoot it with Walton and Mason being the top shooters, while Gabe is a better slasher/vertical guy. All three CAN defend, Kerwin is the best/most willing of the three and could end up being a top tier Defender. Agree though that I highly doubt they all come together. I can appreciate that this staff doesn't seem to offer scholarships to someone to get another. They show enough respect for everyone involved and they obviously have not felt Mason is worth offering yet. Maybe it's a sign they feel they are in good with plenty of wings as well.
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Yep, that's my point, nor does it seem smart that the coaches would take all three together.
 

manderson1984 said:
Gabe and Walton are different guys and actually would play well together. Truthfully all three could play together as they are all willing ball handlers who can shoot it with Walton and Mason being the top shooters, while Gabe is a better slasher/vertical guy. All three CAN defend, Kerwin is the best/most willing of the three and could end up being a top tier Defender. Agree though that I highly doubt they all come together. I can appreciate that this staff doesn't seem to offer scholarships to someone to get another. They show enough respect for everyone involved and they obviously have not felt Mason is worth offering yet. Maybe it's a sign they feel they are in good with plenty of wings as well.
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Can not stand the idea of those together.
 

Take it for whatever it's worth, but I played golf today with a guy very tapped into athletics at Prior Lake -- Pitino has a very good chance to keep Dawson Garcia home. The rumors that had circulated he might go to prep school his senior year are false, he's staying at Prior Lake. His parents want him to stay home, though it's up to him, and they like Pitino.

He's had a few recent big-time offers has had conversations with Coach K, but no Duke offer as of yet. Based on what I was told today, I wouldn't be surprised if Garcia picks the Gophers.
 


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NWMetroGopherFan said:
Take it for whatever it's worth, but I played golf today with a guy very tapped into athletics at Prior Lake -- Pitino has a very good chance to keep Dawson Garcia home. The rumors that had circulated he might go to prep school his senior year are false, he's staying at Prior Lake. His parents want him to stay home, though it's up to him, and they like Pitino.

He's had a few recent big-time offers has had conversations with Coach K, but no Duke offer as of yet. Based on what I was told today, I wouldn't be surprised if Garcia picks the Gophers.
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I would not be surprised at all if Garcia picked Minnesota. What is he waiting for ? Have the parents met the other coaches yet ? Or is the family waiting to see the rest of the home visits ? He can commit right now if he knows that this is the coach he wants to play for. Do it, would love to see it.
 

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