All Things 2022 Minnesota Vikings Off-Season Thread

Adam Thielen restructures his deal, everyone kinda expected that was going to happen.

Still waiting to see what happens with Hunter...
 

Just looking at Harrison's contract can tell you that you're exactly right.

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/minnesota-vikings/harrison-smith-9839/

2021 cap hit: 6.9M
22: 7.5M
23: 19.2M
24: 19.2M
25: 22M

And there's even less chance that we're going to win in 2022 than in 2021. Who can't see that??? It really boggles my mind.

But, that's what's going to happen. Then it's all going to go to hell in 23.
This times infinity. They could have set it up and had a bloodbath in '22 and just cleansed their system of (most of) Spielman's bad decisions in his attempt to "win now". I don't know if it's because if he's a new GM and doesn't want to suck (record wise) in his first year, or if it's the Wilfs not willing to admit they need a rebuild. But the prolonging of these bad contracts and kicking the can further down the road just means this club is farther from relevancy than it needs to be, and lessens the chance that they are in a position to draft a high quality QB in '23.
 

I feel bad for Theilen. They owe him all this money, and every year they come crawling to him on hands and knees asking if they can kick that can down the road one more year.

Probably because they know he'll do it, and are happy to use him.
 

This times infinity. They could have set it up and had a bloodbath in '22 and just cleansed their system of (most of) Spielman's bad decisions in his attempt to "win now". I don't know if it's because if he's a new GM and doesn't want to suck (record wise) in his first year, or if it's the Wilfs not willing to admit they need a rebuild. But the prolonging of these bad contracts and kicking the can further down the road just means this club is farther from relevancy than it needs to be.
100% it's the Wilfs and marketing Miller.

They don't care about winning, they care about sales.
 

I feel bad for Theilen. They owe him all this money, and every year they come crawling to him on hands and knees asking if they can kick that can down the road one more year.

Probably because they know he'll do it, and are happy to use him.

True, but just as likely Theilen realizes that if they cut him, on the open market he wouldn't get as much money as they offered him. His numbers the last 3 seasons have fallen off and last year he only played in 13 games.

Add in that he's a possession receiver and he probably made the right decision.

 


I feel bad for Theilen. They owe him all this money, and every year they come crawling to him on hands and knees asking if they can kick that can down the road one more year.

Probably because they know he'll do it, and are happy to use him.
theilen is willing to do it because he still gets his money, and he wants to be on a Viking Super Bowl winning team.

He can be the hometown boy on the first ever Super Bowl winning team. He knows that would be forever.
 

100% it's the Wilfs and marketing Miller.

They don't care about winning, they care about sales.
I don't think this assessment is necessarily fair--if there's been any ownership group whose efforts towards putting a winning product out there in the MN sports landscape, I believe it's the Wilfs.

The idea of bottoming out has its seductions, but what guarantee is there that the stars align? Take a look at just last year--did any of the quarterbacks chosen at picks #1, 2, 3, or 11 acquit themselves as franchise saviors? How many rebuilds and start overs have the likes of the Lions, Jets, Browns, Jaguars, etc., etc. went through with negligible returns?

I get the frustration of another year of Cousins and seemingly another year kicking the inevitable down the road. One potential offsetting factor is that the pissing match between Zimmer and Spielman last season resulted in a lot of young players from the last two drafts languishing on the bench. I recall after each of the last two drafts mostly positive grades and commentary on the selections--now, we all know that doesn't mean a thing, but we also know that Zimmer's proclivity towards veterans and disdain for Spielman may have found these youngsters in limbo. Perhaps there's some real talent that will burst forth this season from prior drafts and this year's draft.

It could be all for naught, but again, I think the approach that management is taking is understandable, even if fans find it off the mark.
 

I don't think this assessment is necessarily fair--if there's been any ownership group whose efforts towards putting a winning product out there in the MN sports landscape, I believe it's the Wilfs.

The idea of bottoming out has its seductions, but what guarantee is there that the stars align? Take a look at just last year--did any of the quarterbacks chosen at picks #1, 2, 3, or 11 acquit themselves as franchise saviors? How many rebuilds and start overs have the likes of the Lions, Jets, Browns, Jaguars, etc., etc. went through with negligible returns?

I get the frustration of another year of Cousins and seemingly another year kicking the inevitable down the road. One potential offsetting factor is that the pissing match between Zimmer and Spielman last season resulted in a lot of young players from the last two drafts languishing on the bench. I recall after each of the last two drafts mostly positive grades and commentary on the selections--now, we all know that doesn't mean a thing, but we also know that Zimmer's proclivity towards veterans and disdain for Spielman may have found these youngsters in limbo. Perhaps there's some real talent that will burst forth this season from prior drafts and this year's draft.

It could be all for naught, but again, I think the approach that management is taking is understandable, even if fans find it off the mark.
Absolutely. Nailed it, cool. Losing guarantees you nothing, outside of irrelevance. Sometimes people forget all the little things that come with being a complete bottom-feeder. Losing a couple of prime time games each year? That would cost ownership millions. The Vikings played 4 prime time football games last year. How many do you think they're getting with Kellen Mond or Gardner Minshew playing QB?

There's also the fact that they think they can win and why not? Stranger things have happened.

A little early to pull the alarm bell when the roster is far, far from set. Maybe give the new regime more than 3 days into Free Agency before proclaiming the 2022 season a dumpster fire.
 




3 first rounders and that payday. Good lord, I'm sooo happy we aren't getting him.

Watson is good, but what as he done in his career to warrant the contract or the trade compensation?
 

I don't think this assessment is necessarily fair--if there's been any ownership group whose efforts towards putting a winning product out there in the MN sports landscape, I believe it's the Wilfs.

The idea of bottoming out has its seductions, but what guarantee is there that the stars align? Take a look at just last year--did any of the quarterbacks chosen at picks #1, 2, 3, or 11 acquit themselves as franchise saviors? How many rebuilds and start overs have the likes of the Lions, Jets, Browns, Jaguars, etc., etc. went through with negligible returns?

I get the frustration of another year of Cousins and seemingly another year kicking the inevitable down the road. One potential offsetting factor is that the pissing match between Zimmer and Spielman last season resulted in a lot of young players from the last two drafts languishing on the bench. I recall after each of the last two drafts mostly positive grades and commentary on the selections--now, we all know that doesn't mean a thing, but we also know that Zimmer's proclivity towards veterans and disdain for Spielman may have found these youngsters in limbo. Perhaps there's some real talent that will burst forth this season from prior drafts and this year's draft.

It could be all for naught, but again, I think the approach that management is taking is understandable, even if fans find it off the mark.
There is no need to “bottom out”. Keep Cousins at his original ‘22 cap number and take your lumps from a cap perspective in ‘22 to set yourself up for the future. That means you’d have to trade or cut a few guys to do that. The difference is probably 6 wins instead of 8 or 9. Extending guys now to win a couple more games this year will have ramifications for the future. It also means longer in mediocrity. There is not nearly enough talent on D, especially if they trade Hunter, and the OL cannot protect the statue that is Cousins. You can pretend otherwise, but the more you do that, the worse you make it for the future.

The Wild got a new GM, rid themselves of old players making too much money that hadn’t produced anything of note during their tenure, got younger and did a good job adding talent. They never “bottomed out”. But they realized doing the same thing over and over again wasn’t working, and now they’re in a better spot than they’ve been in a while. Getting rid of players and contracts that haven’t worked doesn’t mean you turn into the Browns or Lions overnight. Those organizations have literally decades of terrible decisions that put them in those positions.
 
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Watson is good, but what as he done in his career to warrant the contract or the trade compensation?
For sure. He will have the biggest QB guaranteed money contract by a large margin. His agent is a wizard.

Just imagine when it comes time for Herbert and Burrow to get paid. How the hell do you pay anyone else on the team?
 




For sure. He will have the biggest QB guaranteed money contract by a large margin. His agent is a wizard.

Just imagine when it comes time for Herbert and Burrow to get paid. How the hell do you pay anyone else on the team?
I wouldn’t be surprised if That was Burrows SB moment ala Dan marino
 





theilen is willing to do it because he still gets his money, and he wants to be on a Viking Super Bowl winning team.

He can be the hometown boy on the first ever Super Bowl winning team. He knows that would be forever.
Vikings Super Bowl (winning!) team???

Which decade is this happening??
 


I don't think this assessment is necessarily fair--if there's been any ownership group whose efforts towards putting a winning product out there in the MN sports landscape, I believe it's the Wilfs.

The idea of bottoming out has its seductions, but what guarantee is there that the stars align? Take a look at just last year--did any of the quarterbacks chosen at picks #1, 2, 3, or 11 acquit themselves as franchise saviors? How many rebuilds and start overs have the likes of the Lions, Jets, Browns, Jaguars, etc., etc. went through with negligible returns?

I get the frustration of another year of Cousins and seemingly another year kicking the inevitable down the road. One potential offsetting factor is that the pissing match between Zimmer and Spielman last season resulted in a lot of young players from the last two drafts languishing on the bench. I recall after each of the last two drafts mostly positive grades and commentary on the selections--now, we all know that doesn't mean a thing, but we also know that Zimmer's proclivity towards veterans and disdain for Spielman may have found these youngsters in limbo. Perhaps there's some real talent that will burst forth this season from prior drafts and this year's draft.

It could be all for naught, but again, I think the approach that management is taking is understandable, even if fans find it off the mark.
Most of your general sentiment is fine for me.

I'm not even necessarily advocating for a "tank" year. And yes I understand there is no guarantee of a high pick QB working out.


My major issue is with a proven loser like Cousins getting to continuing to milk this organization out of so much money.

There is no surprise to be had. We all know what we have with Cousins, and it won't be where we want to go.


I hate these damn restructuring years and deals of continuing to push big cap hits down the road.

2018 didn't work when we had 11 Pro Bowlers
2021 didn't work
2022 sure as hell isn't going to work.

And then in 2023 all the cap hits are just going to go to hell.
 
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3 first rounders and that payday. Good lord, I'm sooo happy we aren't getting him.

As someone in the thread already said, the Rams have everyone dreaming.

By the way, weren't the Browns "out of the running"? I guess the whole Baker fiasco made them force their way back in?
 

There is no need to “bottom out”. Keep Cousins at his original ‘22 cap number and take your lumps from a cap perspective in ‘22 to set yourself up for the future. That means you’d have to trade or cut a few guys to do that. The difference is probably 6 wins instead of 8 or 9. Extending guys now to win a couple more games this year will have ramifications for the future. It also means longer in mediocrity. There is not nearly enough talent on D, especially if they trade Hunter, and the OL cannot protect the statue that is Cousins. You can pretend otherwise, but the more you do that, the worse you make it for the future.

The Wild got a new GM, rid themselves of old players making too much money that hadn’t produced anything of note during their tenure, got younger and did a good job adding talent. They never “bottomed out”. But they realized doing the same thing over and over again wasn’t working, and now they’re in a better spot than they’ve been in a while. Getting rid of players and contracts that haven’t worked doesn’t mean you turn into the Browns or Lions overnight. Those organizations have literally decades of terrible decisions that put them in those positions.
This, times infinity.
 


Scoggins:

Vikings owners' 'super-competitive' edict creates tug-of-war between present and future

...

The Wilf ownership executed a dramatic shakeup in football leadership after years of continuity and stability in what amounted to an abrupt organizational reset. But Mark Wilf promptly dismissed any notion of a rebuild, saying he expects his team to be "super-competitive" this coming season.

In words and actions since that day, the Wilfs have made clear that they believe two consecutive non-playoff seasons (and three out of the past four) can be blamed almost entirely on coaching, that it was a Mike Zimmer problem, not an indictment of Kirk Cousins or the roster.

Except, the salary cap quagmire left by General Manager Rick Spielman has created dueling agendas that make ownership's win-now objective a tug-of-war with reality.

The roster badly needs a massive infusion of young, less expensive talent. Jettisoning Zimmer and Spielman provided the perfect opening to give the new regime a blank canvas.

Ownership's demands to be super-competitive all but required another extension for Cousins, with the benefit of lowering his cap number, and run-it-back approach with the roster.

Turning the offense over to Kellen Mond, a drafted rookie or a veteran bridge quarterback would make the Vikings worse this season, potentially much worse, and the short term appears to be the Wilfs' priority.

On the flip side, the Vikings defense ranked among the NFL's worst, and the Star Tribune's Ben Goessling reports that the team is trying to trade Danielle Hunter, a premier pass rusher when healthy. A vulnerable defense unloading its best player at a marquee position doesn't sound like a recipe for being super-competitive.

The defense has major holes on the line and secondary, and new GM Kwesi Adofo-Mensah and cap guru Rob Brzezinski are working every angle possible, including checking under couch cushions, to find money to upgrade personnel.

Their salary-cap situation is a mess. Adofo-Mensah is trying to solve that problem while understanding his boss wants to win now and the quarterback continues to consume a sizable percentage of the cap and the defense requires an overhaul and Hunter presumably wants a mega deal and … oh yeah, by the way, Justin Jefferson is going to command a blockbuster contract soon.

Again, this feels like a tug-of-war between present and future.

The Vikings are stuck in limbo, a state of mediocrity, which is a predicament that screams for a rebuild or reboot or however you want to frame it. Major changes to the roster are necessary.

The Wilf brothers seem to think differently. They are fans at heart. They likely see a roster that features Jefferson, Cousins, Dalvin Cook, Adam Thielen, Harrison Smith and Eric Kendricks and blame Zimmer for not squeezing more out of it.

Everything revolves around the quarterback. Nothing is more important to the organization's long-term success than getting that decision right. The Cousins extension buys time, two seasons, for the new regime to identify who they hope will become their franchise quarterback.

The Wilfs were owners for the draft selections of Tarvaris Jackson and Christian Ponder. They witnessed Teddy Bridgewater suffer a career-altering knee injury that started a chain reaction that included squandering a first-round pick for 17 games of Sam Bradford. They endured Donovan McNabb's bounce passes, the Josh Freeman debacle and Joe Webb starting a playoff game at Lambeau Field.

The owners are probably gun-shy about starting over at that position. Teams can't become paralyzed by the fear of the unknown or past mistakes.

The Vikings are banking on new coach Kevin O'Connell being able to pull more out of Cousins and the offense than previous coaching staffs. The defense is still a problem, though. And money is tight.

This entire discussion about the Vikings' approach to roster management comes down to one overarching question: What exactly is ownership's definition of super-competitive?
 


Scoggins:

Vikings owners' 'super-competitive' edict creates tug-of-war between present and future

...

The Wilf ownership executed a dramatic shakeup in football leadership after years of continuity and stability in what amounted to an abrupt organizational reset. But Mark Wilf promptly dismissed any notion of a rebuild, saying he expects his team to be "super-competitive" this coming season.

In words and actions since that day, the Wilfs have made clear that they believe two consecutive non-playoff seasons (and three out of the past four) can be blamed almost entirely on coaching, that it was a Mike Zimmer problem, not an indictment of Kirk Cousins or the roster.

Except, the salary cap quagmire left by General Manager Rick Spielman has created dueling agendas that make ownership's win-now objective a tug-of-war with reality.

The roster badly needs a massive infusion of young, less expensive talent. Jettisoning Zimmer and Spielman provided the perfect opening to give the new regime a blank canvas.

Ownership's demands to be super-competitive all but required another extension for Cousins, with the benefit of lowering his cap number, and run-it-back approach with the roster.

Turning the offense over to Kellen Mond, a drafted rookie or a veteran bridge quarterback would make the Vikings worse this season, potentially much worse, and the short term appears to be the Wilfs' priority.

On the flip side, the Vikings defense ranked among the NFL's worst, and the Star Tribune's Ben Goessling reports that the team is trying to trade Danielle Hunter, a premier pass rusher when healthy. A vulnerable defense unloading its best player at a marquee position doesn't sound like a recipe for being super-competitive.

The defense has major holes on the line and secondary, and new GM Kwesi Adofo-Mensah and cap guru Rob Brzezinski are working every angle possible, including checking under couch cushions, to find money to upgrade personnel.

Their salary-cap situation is a mess. Adofo-Mensah is trying to solve that problem while understanding his boss wants to win now and the quarterback continues to consume a sizable percentage of the cap and the defense requires an overhaul and Hunter presumably wants a mega deal and … oh yeah, by the way, Justin Jefferson is going to command a blockbuster contract soon.

Again, this feels like a tug-of-war between present and future.

The Vikings are stuck in limbo, a state of mediocrity, which is a predicament that screams for a rebuild or reboot or however you want to frame it. Major changes to the roster are necessary.

The Wilf brothers seem to think differently. They are fans at heart. They likely see a roster that features Jefferson, Cousins, Dalvin Cook, Adam Thielen, Harrison Smith and Eric Kendricks and blame Zimmer for not squeezing more out of it.

Everything revolves around the quarterback. Nothing is more important to the organization's long-term success than getting that decision right. The Cousins extension buys time, two seasons, for the new regime to identify who they hope will become their franchise quarterback.

The Wilfs were owners for the draft selections of Tarvaris Jackson and Christian Ponder. They witnessed Teddy Bridgewater suffer a career-altering knee injury that started a chain reaction that included squandering a first-round pick for 17 games of Sam Bradford. They endured Donovan McNabb's bounce passes, the Josh Freeman debacle and Joe Webb starting a playoff game at Lambeau Field.

The owners are probably gun-shy about starting over at that position. Teams can't become paralyzed by the fear of the unknown or past mistakes.

The Vikings are banking on new coach Kevin O'Connell being able to pull more out of Cousins and the offense than previous coaching staffs. The defense is still a problem, though. And money is tight.

This entire discussion about the Vikings' approach to roster management comes down to one overarching question: What exactly is ownership's definition of super-competitive?
That’s a good article summing it up well. It is remarkable how much more balanced, sane, and competent Chip is than the majority of scribes in this town.

If his premise is correct, and the Wilfs think it was strictly a coaching issue, they’re insane. Zim had issues, but Cousins isn’t going to magically turn into a different player like magic out of nowhere. He has literally been almost the same guy his entire career, no matter who was his coach or coordinator.
 

On Hunter, his cap hit goes way down after this season, so they will have some more room to maneuver in '23.
Problem is the way his contract is structured it’s basically only through ‘22. He won’t play for his ‘23 contract amount. If they don’t extend or trade him, he’s almost guaranteed to hold out.
 

Problem is the way his contract is structured it’s basically only through ‘22. He won’t play for his ‘23 contract amount. If they don’t extend or trade him, he’s almost guaranteed to hold out.
Not likely. He still gets paid $30 million cash in 2023. He was supposed to make $35 this year. Instead he got $40 in 2022 and $30 in 2023.
 

Not likely. He still gets paid $30 million cash in 2023. He was supposed to make $35 this year. Instead he got $40 in 2022 and $30 in 2023.

Say what? He's already been paid 72 of his 77 million contract.

 




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