Doogie

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Doogie Quote: "I hope this person isn't serious...It would go against everything I was taught in J-school at the "U"...I am supposed to hold back, so I can find a plum job somewhere? I could do a whole entry on that message...I still can't believe that I'm reading that."

Doogie, here is some additional advice for you. "SPORTS JOURNALISM" is not the same as "NEWS JOURNALISM". When writing or talking about sports you have to consider who your audience is, and then give them what they want. If you don't have an audience, you don't have a job. That is true whether you are talking about radio, TV, or newspapers.
 

But, I am not writing objective pieces...the Strib blog is called "Your Voices"...they want opinion, I am not one of their beat reporters...and here on GH, Rob & Nadine want opinion, not hard reporting...may provide the hard stuff on occasion though...
As for your example, how do we know that Brewster has the team on the right track? I talked to a former player just the other day, and he is far from the 1st former player who feels the complete opposite, and I respect his opinion...I think the jury is still out, need to see more...so, in turn, why would I write in this most recent entry that coach Brewster certainly seems to have the team on the right track??
 

UpnorthGo4 said:
Doogie Quote: "I hope this person isn't serious...It would go against everything I was taught in J-school at the "U"...I am supposed to hold back, so I can find a plum job somewhere? I could do a whole entry on that message...I still can't believe that I'm reading that."

Doogie, here is some additional advice for you. "SPORTS JOURNALISM" is not the same as "NEWS JOURNALISM". When writing or talking about sports you have to consider who your audience is, and then give them what they want. If you don't have an audience, you don't have a job. That is true whether you are talking about radio, TV, or newspapers.
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The audience take holds true across all journalism, not just sports...and I think there happens to be an audience for all types of shows/stories
 

It is quite possible that I saw too much similarity between Ruesse's obvious gambit and what you wrote. I may have jumped to a conclusion that you were in cahoots with the big turd. I should give you the benefit of the doubt. And I will, so for that I will apologize.

But be clear you work amongst jackals who will use you before they would better you.
 

Doogie said:
But, I am not writing objective pieces...the Strib blog is called "Your Voices"...they want opinion, I am not one of their beat reporters...and here on GH, Rob & Nadine want opinion, not hard reporting...may provide the hard stuff on occasion though...
As for your example, how do we know that Brewster has the team on the right track? I talked to a former player just the other day, and he is far from the 1st former player who feels the complete opposite, and I respect his opinion...I think the jury is still out, need to see more...so, in turn, why would I write in this most recent entry that coach Brewster certainly seems to have the team on the right track??
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Ok, well be hard-headed all you want, you can also provide opinion with a positive tone. You don't do that. If that's your goal so be it. My example was based on the assumption that you feel he has the team on the right track, which since you think they have a great defense and will go 3-0 in this next stretch would seem obvious, but apparently I am wrong. Seems to prove my point that you are subtly (or not so) attempting to set Brew up for failure. Enjoy the vitriol!
Also, since you think Pat Fitzgerald is a MUCH better coach than Brew, why on earth would you say that even though NW is a favorite (at home), to not be fooled, and that they really shouldn't be? Based on what? It's OBVIOUS what you are doing.
 


One Does Not Beget The Other

Doogie said:
But, I am not writing objective pieces...the Strib blog is called "Your Voices"...they want opinion, I am not one of their beat reporters...and here on GH, Rob & Nadine want opinion, not hard reporting...may provide the hard stuff on occasion though...
As for your example, how do we know that Brewster has the team on the right track? I talked to a former player just the other day, and he is far from the 1st former player who feels the complete opposite, and I respect his opinion...I think the jury is still out, need to see more...so, in turn, why would I write in this most recent entry that coach Brewster certainly seems to have the team on the right track??
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I'm not one of posters here who doesn't like you, Doogie. I think you're doing the job you were asked to do, as you understand it. I do disagree, though, with the supporting material you used for a conclusion you seem to have come to.

"...how do we know that Brewster has the team on the right track? I talked to a former player just the other day, and he is far from the 1st former player who feels the complete opposite, and I respect his opinion...I think the jury is still out, need to see more...so, in turn, why would I write in this most recent entry that coach Brewster certainly seems to have the team on the right track?"

The former player you spoke with recently --- did he play under Brewster? Was he recruited by Mason and either left the team or graduated? Is he a player from further in the Gopher past? What, besides being a former player, are his credentials to speak knowledgeably about what it takes to have a program "on the right track"? What, specifically, does he feel that Brewster is doing wrong?

I would contend that there is clear evidence that the team is "on the right track", meaning that we've got better overall talent and are a more competitive team than when Brew took over. Even the relatively limited national exposure the program gets seems to agree that the team is improved. Are we where we want to be? No, and Brewster would say the same thing. We need even more talent to build more competition and more depth.

Is there room to grow and get even better? Obviously, yes. But, you seem to take the approach that there's more you need to see before you'll admit that the program is "on the right track". I think it would be best if you define specifically what "on the right track" means to you? I know it would help me understand WHY you're saying what you're saying, and give us a better understanding of what Brew & Co need to do to be "on the right track" in your mind.
 

When you run a business, you always want to provide the customer with what they want to be successful. The media is a business. I find it funny, that KFAN crew, Doogie, and Fat Pat tend to right stuff that is fairly negative and sets up the Gopher fb program for failure, but now some of the audience (customers) are not happy about the product. Doogie, KFAN and etc. are now in "defensive" mode trying to justify their own writing when people are critical of their product.

I think this is a great sign that the times are changing regarding the Gopher football program. I for one, would really like some fair and balanced reporting. Pat is classic for setting up articles for future negative stuff to make it like he is so right on things. I never did see a follow-up on how Gray and Reeves worked hard to get back into school the following year..........only heard the negative stuff.
 

Section2 said:
It's not rocket science. To the people who say "well EVERYONE can't be homers." I say, other than Sid and the beat writer, name one? Shouldn't national writers be more negative than hometown writers? Our local media is filled with negativity, so I say AGAIN to you doogie, your brand of 'objectivity' is not wanted. There is an easy way to write an objective article and still make it sound positive. Do you really need any help figuring it out after the umpteenth 5 page thread of venom directed at you? It cannot be fun, right? So figure it out, and find something positive to write your next piece about, and leave 100% of the negativity out. 100%. Here's a helpful sample piece, "coach Brew certainly seems to have the team on the right track, but it would really go a long way to proving that if they could go 3-0 in their next three, and I firmly believe they can and should accomplish that." See? Something like that. Not so hard.
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You actually make a strong point here. It is not that hard to convey a negative, positive, or neutral tone in anything that is written. Doogie's piece had some negative undertones to it even though the overall message was relatively positive. The negative undertones could have been left out, but Doogie chose to include them. Those undertones do remind me a lot of KFAN. Hard to believe, isn't it? That's where Doogie came from. It's hard to stray from what you know.

All that being said, I think the piling on is getting a little out of hand. It appears to me that Doogie is taking much more heat than he should here. For some of you, Doogie has no chance, and you've made up your minds already. I think some of you are still so PO'd at him for somewhat sticking up for KFAN for "Banngate 2009", that you're picking apart everything with his fingerprints on it. While I do agree that maybe some of the snide remarks could have been excluded, I thought Doogie wrote a pretty good article there.

One other thing, if you want the program to rise, than you should demand a 3-0 record for the next 3 games. If the Gophers have improved this year, these are all games they should win. I've seen all 3 teams play and there's no reason not to expect victories against these teams. The only road game is against the weekest one, and this Gopher team should be expected to beat the other 2 at home. This portion of the schedule should be 3-0, period. I applaud Doogie for stating that even if he was a little harsh about it.
 

dbaldrich1 said:
I would contend that there is clear evidence that the team is "on the right track", meaning that we've got better overall talent and are a more competitive team than when Brew took over.
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But by this logic, aren't you then agreeing with Doogie that anything other than 3 wins in the next 3 games would be disappointing? To me seeing 3 wins in the next 3 games would indeed be "evidence" that the program is going in the right direction - while going 2-1 or holy crap I can't imagine 1-2 would be seen as the "same old Gophers". Is that fair? And isn't that all Doogie was saying in his original article?

I have no horse in the "Is Doogie any good or isn't he" race, but it seems to me he said nothing unfair, inaccurate or even negative in his blog post. Evidence of being "on the right track" is going 3-0 in the next 3 IMO.
 



Well no Clyde. 2-1 is the expected outcome for where we are at. 2-1 is confirmation we are on the right track. 3-0 exceeds that and should leave us abuzz. 1-2 is disapointing and should leave us wondering. 0-3 ugh.
 

The problem with most media coverage of college football is that it assumes one of the following three win games:

1. Head Coaches
2. Conferences
3. Individual "Name" Players (i.e. Greg Paulus)

Any comments or articles that exacerbate this drives those of us who follow the sport insane. We want more. We don't care about Tim Brewster vs. Greg Paulus or however corporate media frames the story. These are games played by teams.

If you want to see what decent college football coverage looks like read Adam Rittenberg on ESPN. I have come to the conclusion that he is one of the few writers that actually watches the sport on occasion.
 

Schnoodler said:
Well no Clyde. 2-1 is the expected outcome for where we are at. 2-1 is confirmation we are on the right track. 3-0 exceeds that and should leave us abuzz. 1-2 is disapointing and should leave us wondering. 0-3 ugh.
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I get the stats/probability argument, but I'm just trying to say that going 2-1 would seem to be what we are used to - 3 beatable opponents and 2 wins. That shows no progress. To use your format:

3 wins - shows progress and reason to believe that this team has improved and is focused. I 100% guarantee that Brewster expects this result of himself and his team - so we as fans should realistically hope this happens.
2 wins - the "typical" result for the program - nothing to question Brew over but nothing to be excited about. An average result.
1 win - serious reason to doubt the direction of the program - Brewster on a spicy chili hot seat
0 wins - I refuse to consider this as an option. ;)
 

Doogie said:
But, I am not writing objective pieces...the Strib blog is called "Your Voices"...they want opinion, I am not one of their beat reporters...and here on GH, Rob & Nadine want opinion, not hard reporting...may provide the hard stuff on occasion though...
As for your example, how do we know that Brewster has the team on the right track? I talked to a former player just the other day, and he is far from the 1st former player who feels the complete opposite, and I respect his opinion...I think the jury is still out, need to see more...so, in turn, why would I write in this most recent entry that coach Brewster certainly seems to have the team on the right track??
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I have trouble believing Brew would have some of the coaches he has if he was not on the right track...Whoever the former player is, and for arguments sake I will concede it is probably not a benchwarmer, the quality of defense and the rising potential of the offense suggest the program is improving and the coaching staff is up and coming.

There may have been some unknown reasons why guys like Davis and Fisch responded to the opportunity to be on Brew's staff, but they seem to be guys who have to much going for them to give in to someone who is accused to come across as a snake oil salesman.
 



It's just amazing to me how much praise gets nationally and how little he gets locally. The national perception is very good of Brew and the program. It get's a little old listening to the local bashfest when the smarter guys say the opposite.
 

I think it is pretty safe to say 2 out of 3 is an absolute must (specifically the home games), and all 3 is needed to really truly establish that this program is on the rise. It's funny because when I hear things nationally, it's almost unanimous that this program is on the right track, but locally, it is not even close to the case. I just find that odd. But anyway, one thing I think needs to be done this year is establishing TCF as a true HOME field advantage. We've had a decent start, but I really think we need to go out and win the rest of our home games, start making teams worry about coming here. All of them are winnable, so take care of business in that regard. Then you only need one road game (NU would seem like the likely candidate). There's your 5-3 Big Ten record right there.
 

calminnfan said:
I have trouble believing Brew would have some of the coaches he has if he was not on the right track...Whoever the former player is, and for arguments sake I will concede it is probably not a benchwarmer, the quality of defense and the rising potential of the offense suggest the program is improving and the coaching staff is up and coming.

There may have been some unknown reasons why guys like Davis and Fisch responded to the opportunity to be on Brew's staff, but they seem to be guys who have to much going for them to give in to someone who is accused to come across as a snake oil salesman.
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I wouldn't necessarily say you can use his assistant coaches as a strong argument because this was a step up from their most recent position.

Fisch-unemployed after getting let go after Mike Shanahan was fired and this was a promotion to his first coordinator position.

Davis--Was in a non-coaching position last season.

Cosgrove--Unemployed and out of football last year
 

Section2 said:
Ok, well be hard-headed all you want, you can also provide opinion with a positive tone. You don't do that. If that's your goal so be it. My example was based on the assumption that you feel he has the team on the right track, which since you think they have a great defense and will go 3-0 in this next stretch would seem obvious, but apparently I am wrong. Seems to prove my point that you are subtly (or not so) attempting to set Brew up for failure. Enjoy the vitriol!
Also, since you think Pat Fitzgerald is a MUCH better coach than Brew, why on earth would you say that even though NW is a favorite (at home), to not be fooled, and that they really shouldn't be? Based on what? It's OBVIOUS what you are doing.
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If having expectations is setting up Brewster, as you say, for failure, then so be it...I don't understand the problem with having expectations...that spread was made not knowing 100% if Decker was healthy (he is, which I figured after he talked on Sat.) and Sherels being a question-mark (heard he was expected back, and that was confirmed today)...also, NW's best cover-corner, Sherrick McManis, hasn't played since week 1, and is expected to be out (although I suppose that could change)...him being out is a biggie...They also were without key reserves or starters MLB Nate Williams, and CB Justan Vaughn (int. in opener) vs. Syr...both guys up in air this week...the Gophers are MUCH healthier...NW also has 4 or 5 other reserves/special teamers banged up...
Fitzgerald is one hell of a coach...he's done a nice job so far. The Gophers have more starters back from last year...it's a game that in my mind they should win.
 

2608 hits and 106 replies...wow, Doogie, I think you have quite the following ;) Threads on Eric Decker don't even generate that much attention!
 

Doogie said:
Yes, I'll be the first person to say through three games my opinion on that has proven to be wrong...no different than any opinion writer in the country...Bob Ryan, Souhan, you name anyone, it happens where you state an opinion, and it turns out to be flat-out wrong.

As for defending KFAN at the expense of the "U", I've talked to enough people, and wrote what I wrote...the S.I.D. did not need to be thrown under the bus...I stick by that.
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Doogie, if you are going to throw this crap out there, back it up with information. How was he thrown under the bus? Who did it? The only ones I have seen throw anyone under any bus was KFAN when they read emails meant to be private.

You have thrown out an anti-Brewster nugget without a shred of evidence. Back it up with some facts or don't the readers deserve that? Foregt about your KFAN buddies for a minute.
 

This board is a reusse/doogie/kfan board more than anything.

For those who get all upset about some of the negative coverage - do you take the time to listen to the brewster show on wcco, or watch the brewster show on fsn/btn, or listen to brewster/weber/decker when they are on with Sid and Dave? These are all very positive and informative shows but I never see them discussed or referenced here. But if there is a reusse column or a kfan cheapshot it dominates the board. It actually seems like Gopher fans have a ravenous appetite for negative coverage. What is the thinking here?
 

We have to defend the gophers. They have an unfair advantage. Silence equals a lack of opposition or care for the gophers, which then signals agreement. Rebuttals provide tools and ammo against the regurgitation that comes from the KFAN/Ruesse faithful. we have a role in this.
 

You're preaching to the choir here though. Getting yourselves whipped up into a froth in what is the Gophers board with the most positive outlook on the program isn't really changing perceptions or providing a defense. If you're going with that line of thinking don't you need to seek ways to get your voice heard outside this medium?
 

I believe khaliq, that we all talk to folks outside of GH. They hear the other crap only. When we discuss this stuff it helps to make our arguments more cohesive as we encounter the Ruesse/KFAN regurgitations. So what we do here does reach beyond this site. It is important. I have many discussions about the gophers each week with people outside of this site. I'm a much more effective proponent of the Gophers because of what gets discussed here.

so choir yes, tho slightly out of tune. But much more than that.
 

Schnoodler said:
We have to defend the gophers. They have an unfair advantage. Silence equals a lack of opposition or care for the gophers, which then signals agreement. Rebuttals provide tools and ammo against the regurgitation that comes from the KFAN/Ruesse faithful. we have a role in this.
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They love the fact that you think this way and approach it this way. Support those who are providing coverage you enjoy. That way you might get more of it. Or call into those program and offer your positive opinions on the football program. Listening/reading so you can catch any little negative shot and then talking/posting about it for weeks is not productive given your aim. It rewards them though. However, if you get something out of "the battle" then knock yourself out and devour everything reuse/kfan puts out there.
 

Schnoodler said:
I believe khaliq, that we all talk to folks outside of GH. They hear the other crap only. When we discuss this stuff it helps to make our arguments more cohesive as we encounter the Ruesse/KFAN regurgitations. So what we do here does reach beyond this site. It is important. I have many discussions about the gophers each week with people outside of this site. I'm a much more effective proponent of the Gophers because of what gets discussed here.

so choir yes, tho slightly out of tune. But much more than that.
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This I agree with. Talking up the program to your friends/co-workers and telling them about all the fun that can be had at the games is worthwhile. Talking to them about kfan and reusse is not.
 

We're living what silence and ignoring these idiots brings. It didn't work. Now it's time to be proponents of the program, evangelical if you will. Through attrition one ear at a time we can make a difference. We can steal the audience from theses hacks. Nothing will be gained if we sit idly by and allow it without so much as a whisper.

People do pay attention, they're just sheeps. they need more options of shepherds.

Two religious references in one post. I'm good for another year. yesss
 

Doogie said:
If having expectations is setting up Brewster, as you say, for failure, then so be it...I don't understand the problem with having expectations...that spread was made not knowing 100% if Decker was healthy (he is, which I figured after he talked on Sat.) and Sherels being a question-mark (heard he was expected back, and that was confirmed today)...also, NW's best cover-corner, Sherrick McManis, hasn't played since week 1, and is expected to be out (although I suppose that could change)...him being out is a biggie...They also were without key reserves or starters MLB Nate Williams, and CB Justan Vaughn (int. in opener) vs. Syr...both guys up in air this week...the Gophers are MUCH healthier...NW also has 4 or 5 other reserves/special teamers banged up...
Fitzgerald is one hell of a coach...he's done a nice job so far. The Gophers have more starters back from last year...it's a game that in my mind they should win.
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Oh lord. Wow is that a lot of excuses for why NW will struggle. Our best cover corner has also been out. Decker is for sure playing, but he's certainly dinged. We are without key reserve Mike Rallis. Every team has players banged up. I would bet a LOT of money that you don't really think the gophers are going to win. A LOT. Your setting it up as we SHOULD win. Fine, I agree. But if we don't then....?
 

Section2 said:
Oh lord. Wow is that a lot of excuses for why NW will struggle. Our best cover corner has also been out. Decker is for sure playing, but he's certainly dinged. We are without key reserve Mike Rallis. Every team has players banged up. I would bet a LOT of money that you don't really think the gophers are going to win. A LOT. Your setting it up as we SHOULD win. Fine, I agree. But if we don't then....?
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I do think they will win...the penalties weren't as abundant vs. Cal, and I expect that to become a trend...Stommes may play at RT, which would be a good change...Admittedly, I've read a lot about NW, but haven't seen them in a full game so far this year...did last year, but they are a different team...1 example: they throw it a lot more this year...the Gopher LBs are the best trio they've had since Parc Williams, Sean Hoffman, and Ben Mezera...Triplett has gotten a ton better...the front four, with Kirksey and Edwards being mixed in (both much improved) should give the Gophers a great chance to contain Kafka, and there were some encouraging signs for the offense vs. Cal (Fisch's creativity and play-calling improved)...& Weber spreading it around a bit more...
I think they win by 10.
 

Doogie you're gonna end up with some gray hairs at this rate. :)
 

Schnoodler said:
We're living what silence and ignoring these idiots brings. It didn't work. Now it's time to be proponents of the program, evangelical if you will. Through attrition one ear at a time we can make a difference. We can steal the audience from theses hacks. Nothing will be gained if we sit idly by and allow it without so much as a whisper.

People do pay attention, they're just sheeps. they need more options of shepherds.

Two religious references in one post. I'm good for another year. yesss
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Evangelicals are annoying enough when they think they are trying to save my soul, I can only imagine how annoying one would be preaching to me the virtues of Gopher football.
 

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