Zagzebski ???

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FiveStarFan said:
Congrats on getting your FIRST commit and good luck trusting him.
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Just like we trust David Gilreath going across the middle and returning kicks. Love that guy.

You guys are taking all of this waaaaay too personally.
 

BoOwnsIzzo said:
ROTFLMAO!

Says a fan of a team that has won 2 of the last 14 contests......If anything is irritating to you, it should be losing your home stadium to North Dakota State! LOL!

EDIT: Nice try on the edit, too.
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This coming from a team that if it wasn't because of 3 missed PAT would have lost at home to Cal Poly. Get over yourself. You're just mad cuz you realize BB is drunkenly running your program into the ground and we are improving as you are drinking. So keep drinking the juice and we will whooping your arse soon enough. As fun as the two basketball games were this year I can't wait to time BB and see how fast he runs off the field after losing!
 

BoOwnsIzzo said:
Just like we trust David Gilreath going across the middle and returning kicks. Love that guy.

You guys are taking all of this waaaaay too personally.
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He is a nice player yes. I can't wait for Micheal Carter to lay him out! Even better...Royston would be sweet.:clap:
 

Royston? Speaking of castoffs! LOL.

But I wish no ill will toward Kim Royston. He wanted to play football. He was beat out by better players. That's when you transfer to a lesser talented team.
 

We will see about that...He saw BB running the Alvarez legacy into the ground and said peace out! I don't blame him either
 


BoOwnsIzzo said:
Just like we trust David Gilreath going across the middle and returning kicks. Love that guy.
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Not sure I'd trust a return man who ranked 13th in the conference in kick return average and couldn't even manage 20 yards a return. We've got the Big Ten leader in kick returns and the second best in the conference in punt returns coming back, you can keep him. <img src="http://www.clipartof.com/images/emoticons/xsmall2/2216_sleeping.gif">
 


FiveStarFan said:
We will see about that...He saw BB running the Alvarez legacy into the ground and said peace out! I don't blame him either
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Actually, his name appearing third on the depth chart helped him see the door. But believe what you wish.
 

mckerney said:
Not sure I'd trust a return man who ranked 13th in the conference in kick return average and couldn't even manage 20 yards a return. We've got the Big Ten leader in kick returns and the second best in the conference in punt returns coming back, you can keep him. <img src="http://www.clipartof.com/images/emoticons/xsmall2/2216_sleeping.gif">
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How cute. You actually think that Gilreath doesn't have to rely on 10 blockers. UW Special Teams sucked in 2008. But he was on top just one year before. I'm sure he didn't forget how to run back kicks from one year to the next.
 



BoOwnsIzzo said:
How cute. You actually think that Gilreath doesn't have to rely on 10 blockers. UW Special Teams sucked in 2008. But he was on top just one year before. I'm sure he didn't forget how to run back kicks from one year to the next.
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Hey Little Buddy,

Is this how you vent your frustration for getting swept by Tubby and the boys this winter? Get use to taking is hard and often from MN. I'd be kind of pissed too if I lived in that state.........

You may have gotten this average player to decommit back to WI, but you do realize that WI can no longer have success recruiting in MN????? You do realize this right???? So at least the Gophs are showing we have a shot with kids from MN, unlike WI's case with MN kids. I'm guessing not being able to recruit MN will be the reason for Becky's slow decent to the bottom of the Big 10. Will you come on here and visit us in a couple years when that process is complete???? Thanks little buddy!!!
 

You realize of course that in 2010 there have been no players offered by both schools who have crossed the border?

And in 2009 there was one player offered by both schools who chose to go out of state, and that player (Casey Dehn), went to UW.

And in 2008 there was one player (Joe Schafer) offered by both schools who left his home state and that player went to UW?

And that Zagzebski marks the 2nd player in 3 years to commit to the Gophers and then decommit when UW started recruiting him in earnest?

Minnesota has improved. I will not dismiss them as a non-factor, and Badger fans that do so are silly. But you hurt your case when you make statements that have no basis in fact.


sonnygarcia said:
Hey Little Buddy,

Is this how you vent your frustration for getting swept by Tubby and the boys this winter? Get use to taking is hard and often from MN. I'd be kind of pissed too if I lived in that state.........

You may have gotten this average player to decommit back to WI, but you do realize that WI can no longer have success recruiting in MN????? You do realize this right???? So at least the Gophs are showing we have a shot with kids from MN, unlike WI's case with MN kids. I'm guessing not being able to recruit MN will be the reason for Becky's slow decent to the bottom of the Big 10. Will you come on here and visit us in a couple years when that process is complete???? Thanks little buddy!!!
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BoOwnsIzzo said:
I fully understand that there is a lot of pressure that goes on with recruiting. But each kid is different. I'm sure not all will respond well to high pressure. So I'm trying to illustrate, that the posters agenda isn't necessarily supported here. Is there a lot of pressure on these kids? Of course. But it's a different topic than making things up with how they went with Konrad Zagzebski's recruiting. Do we know Brewster pressured him? Do we know Bielema pressured him? No on both.
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I guess what I was thinking was more on a national level. Obviously, some kids respond differently to pressure than others. Do we know what was said by either Brewster or Bielema in this case? Obviously no and we probably never will.

From a more wide-spread point of view, this is how things can get out of hand in terms of recruiting however. And I think its why we see as many decommits as we do on a national level as well. Too much bidding rather than selling. I don't have a problem with selling what your university and program have to offer. But I get the feeling that most coaches look at it as a bidding war rather than actually offering what their school and university can provide. Therefore, they often make promises to kids order to get them in (and in some cases, offer more than that. USC is starting to become an example of this imo.
 

I think it would be interesting to hear what this kid has been thinking. He commits to the U of M and comes out with such a strong statement then 2 months later switches his commitment to a team that he said was never really in it. Can't be mad him he has to go where he feels the most comfortable. Just an interesting situation but it happens all over the country. The team needs players that want to be here and help the gophers win.
 



breadtree said:
Minnesota has improved. I will not dismiss them as a non-factor, and Badger fans that do so are silly. But you hurt your case when you make statements that have no basis in fact.
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All I was saying is that WI has recruited here a ton in the past (when Mason was here) and got a lot of players that helped them win a lot of games. I just don't see them getting many impact players from MN going forward (Brewster is too good of a recruiter, and MN football is on an upswing). Thats it, I think that statement has a ton of basis.
 

BoOwnsIzzo said:
I fully understand that there is a lot of pressure that goes on with recruiting. But each kid is different. I'm sure not all will respond well to high pressure. So I'm trying to illustrate, that the posters agenda isn't necessarily supported here. Is there a lot of pressure on these kids? Of course. But it's a different topic than making things up with how they went with Konrad Zagzebski's recruiting. Do we know Brewster pressured him? Do we know Bielema pressured him? No on both.
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Thanks for agreeing with my point wisky person. When you say: "...I fully understand that there is a lot of pressure that goes on with recruiting...Is there a lot of pressure on these kids? Of course..." That is certainly the way it would look. Now the recruiting addicts from Minnesota that were formerly spinning this case as proof that Brewster is the greatest recruiter ever areack peddling and are pulling a stunt that they always accuse wisky recruiting addicts of pulling. And, the wisky recruiting addicts have totally reversed course on their spin of this whole soap opera-like recruiting turn of events. Some of the recruiting addicts from both schools are just too far over the top with this stuff.

These coaches, in a number of ways, are like used car salesmen...especially the younger ones. Brewster came into wisky and thought he kicked the tail of the wisky coach with a name that sounds like an eating disorder. At least that's the way the recruiting addicts here tried to paint the picture. The recruiting addicts from wisky all said that kid wasn't anybody they really cared much about any way. These two really do both need to be a little more professional in their post game posturing and bad-acting. They were a bit too much like pro-wresslers plugging their "rematch" event for my tastes. Especially after their first meeting a couple of years ago.

Now this coach who has the name that sounds like an eating disorder appears to have successfully reversed the tail kicking and now the recruiting addicts here in Minnesota appear to be spinning things differently and this recruit who formerly was a big coup for Brewster is no big deal. Conversely, the recruiting addicts from wisky now see the merits of keeping this recruit in state. It is the recruiting addicts from Minnesota and wisky who look pretty bad here, the way I see it.

There is NO question that everything about the recriting process in the year 2009 is high pressure business. The recruits crank up the pressure on the coaches with all their "press-releases" and interviews with the "for money" publications that cover recruiting.

At Minnesota, there are some that think recruiting is supposed to be Brewster's strong point and that it is great that he never gives up on a recruit and never backs off and just keeps coming hard after any and every recruit even after that recruit has verbally committed elsewhere. Now, those same people think it is bad form for any other coach to keep coming after a kid who has verballed to Minnesota. I just get tired of all the hype and all the soap opera-like drama football recruiting brings about.

Personally, I like to wait a couple of years to see how it all turns out with recruits. You win some. You lose some. Actually for each one you win, it means there is some other recruit with potential that must be going somewhere else. There is a limited number of scholarships that each school can give each year. You can't get 'em all.

That is why the ability to coach up a recruit and to develope a recruit is every bit as important as actually getting a recruit to make a verbal and actually make a committment.

But, make no mistake there is lot of high pressured selling that college coaches do. I don't like that part of college football very much. I think it tends to bring out the worst in the coaches and in some cases plays to the egos of the recruits or their parents.

I equate the high pressure recruiting tactics to a slight sleeze factor that creeps into college football, unfortunately. That's just the way it is and it happens to be an annoyance for me. Other people think it's great. I'm just stating my personal opinion. No one else has to agree with me. But, I don't like high pressure tactics coming from used car salesmen, politicians or football coaches.
 

Oh well...

Let's go get a better LB from a real football state like Texas.
 

BoOwnsIzzo said:
Royston? Speaking of castoffs! LOL.

But I wish no ill will toward Kim Royston. He wanted to play football. He was beat out by better players. That's when you transfer to a lesser talented team.
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That isn't what his position coach or defensive coordinator said.
 

grunkiejr said:
That isn't what his position coach or defensive coordinator said.
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Kim didn't like staring up at two names in front of him in the Spring depth chart last Spring. When he approached the coaches and asked that it be an open competition going into Spring, they told him that he was firmly the third saftey, and that he'd have to earn it. When they didn't agree to letting him be at the top of the chart, he quit. Anything else said would have been to help him save face.
 

BoOwnsIzzo said:
Kim didn't like staring up at two names in front of him in the Spring depth chart last Spring. When he approached the coaches and asked that it be an open competition going into Spring, they told him that he was firmly the third saftey, and that he'd have to earn it. When they didn't agree to letting him be at the top of the chart, he quit. Anything else said would have been to help him save face.
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TubbyOwnsBo, sorry!!! I meant, BoOwnsIzoo (man that must have slipped, I'm really sorry), I feel like your the guy whos girlfriend is cheating on him and he is just in denial. You seem so lost talking about your program as if it is above MN. What was your record last year? You barely came back to beat us at home? Should have lost to Cal Poly in the home finale? Got EMBARASSED by Florida St in your season finale? Have a coach that is leading a program down one notch on the todem pole each year?

To talk as if your above MN is just ignorant. If you want to start saying "well look at our Big 10 championships in the late 90's, therefore we are a better program", fine, we'll just pull out "look at our national championships and our 18 BT championships compared to your 11, BIATCH!!" Nuff said. I mean if anything other than the prior year matters then we should both be able to go back in history. So either way, I don't think you have much to lip off about. Your little man syndrome is getting annoying, but I guess if I lived next to the state voted as most intelligent and most healthy in the nation (as opposed to the drunkest) I'd be a little jealous too.

Hope this helps little buddy :D
 

sonnygarcia said:
TubbyOwnsBo, sorry!!! I meant, BoOwnsIzoo (man that must have slipped, I'm really sorry), I feel like your the guy whos girlfriend is cheating on him and he is just in denial. You seem so lost talking about your program as if it is above MN. What was your record last year? You barely came back to beat us at home? Should have lost to Cal Poly in the home finale? Got EMBARASSED by Florida St in your season finale? Have a coach that is leading a program down one notch on the todem pole each year?

To talk as if your above MN is just ignorant. If you want to start saying "well look at our Big 10 championships in the late 90's, therefore we are a better program", fine, we'll just pull out "look at our national championships and our 18 BT championships compared to your 11, BIATCH!!" Nuff said. I mean if anything other than the prior year matters then we should both be able to go back in history. So either way, I don't think you have much to lip off about. Your little man syndrome is getting annoying, but I guess if I lived next to the state voted as most intelligent and most healthy in the nation (as opposed to the drunkest) I'd be a little jealous too.

Hope this helps little buddy :D
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Neither Minnesota nor Wisconsin is in the position to be talking much trash as neither one is nor has been for many many years significant on a national scale. It is good to keep in perspective where we are at as a program realistically at this point and time and how far we have to go before we start patting ourselves on the back.
 

4starrecruit said:
I really don't fault the kid. I fault the people, many of you supposedly adults who try to make an instant hero out of a kid who verbals or says he is committing to a high pressure sales job by a coach of our program need to back off and not take the kid, the coach or the high pressured sales jobs so seriously. Why would you be so nasty to the kid when a high pressure sales job causes him to cave in to a head coach from the flag-ship University in his home state after having caved in to the high pressure sales job from the high pressure coach of a border state? No, it is not shame on him. It is shame on the high pressure tactics that are turned on to these kids by these coaches. Any coach who high pressures and does a sales number on a 17 year old kid can't really expect that kid to not wake up with a bit of buyer's remorse. Beware the high-pressured sales coaches and this is just another reason I get so down on the whole recruiting thing. These kids want their butts kissed and these grown head coaches fancy themselves to be super recruiters and high pressured sales closers. Well, they don't always close the deal.

And, fans need to back off the highs and lows they get because some 17 year old recruit verbals. Wait until that kid shows up, enrolls in classes, puts on the pads and spends a couple of years in the program. Then we will know if a kid is really committed or is just suffering from wanting to "hear the love" and having some high-pressured sales coach telling him what that coach thinks he wants to hear. The scrupples of coaches and recruits and recruits parents actually kind of make a pretty good fit.

Quit high pressuring kids...it's not all it's hyped up to be. A high pressure sales job really is nothing to count on when all is said and done.
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This is complete and utter BS. You act as if a 17-year-old is some kind of naïve moron, and his feeble mind was swayed completely by the "salesmanship" of grown men. Kids are way smarter than we give them credit for, and this kid knew exactly what he was doing. No one held a gun to his head and forced him to say things like "my decision is over", "I want to be a Golden Gopher" and "I just want to be at Minnesota".

I give Bielema zero fault in this situation. Hell, I'd be tickled if Brewster pulled the same in reverse. This is 100% at the feet of Konrad Zagzebski. I already hate him because he is a Badger, but now I hate him even more because he is a two-faced liar whose word can't be trusted. I would enjoy nothing more than to see him rot at the end of Bucky's bench for the next five years.
 

Let's face it, the kid flat out lied, there's really no way to go around that. I mean, I understand the pressures of recruiting and it can be a lot for a kid that age, but you don't sit there and talk about how you "didn't see going to Wisconsin" and "I only really wanna be a Gopher" and all this other bs and then like not even more than a few months later switch it up and run to the place you said you "just couldn't see yourself going" unless you had thoughts of going there in the first place. He used us as leverage, oh well. I'm sure we'll get someone just as good to replace him. Brewster isn't sweatin this one, I'm sure, and neither am I. I would have welcomed him with open arms, but when you do shady stuff like that, it'll come back to you, I'm moving on.

What's funny is the first decommit came from the kid who acted like the strongest verbal in the first place of the five we had. On the surface, if you thought anyone would decommit first, it woulda been Antoine Lewis. Goes to show you, sometimes you just can't take people at their word, regardless as to how much they insist how they feel, cause they might just be lying through their teeth.
 

dpodoll68 said:
This is complete and utter BS. You act as if a 17-year-old is some kind of naïve moron, and his feeble mind was swayed completely by the "salesmanship" of grown men. Kids are way smarter than we give them credit for, and this kid knew exactly what he was doing. No one held a gun to his head and forced him to say things like "my decision is over", "I want to be a Golden Gopher" and "I just want to be at Minnesota".

I give Bielema zero fault in this situation. Hell, I'd be tickled if Brewster pulled the same in reverse. This is 100% at the feet of Konrad Zagzebski. I already hate him because he is a Badger, but now I hate him even more because he is a two-faced liar whose word can't be trusted. I would enjoy nothing more than to see him rot at the end of Bucky's bench for the next five years.
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I am sorry but the kid is not at fault he merely changed his mind to what he saw as a better fit. Who knows maybe he saw or heard about how Brewster pulled Fritz Rock's scholarship offer early when he did not commit right away and he didn't want that to happen to him and be left with no scholarship offers potentially especially coming off an injury like he is. Minnesota clearly set the precedent last season to commit early or else your scholarship offer may not be available after you take your officials. When you take that stance as a program and staff you have to be prepared for things like this to happen.
 

Thanks for making a good point. Fans are off the deep end. If you can hate over something like this it is no wonder that there is road rage, people going "postal" in the work place and horrible things happen to innocent people.

College football is only a game. It needs to be put in perspective.

17 years of age is not considered to be of legal age for virtually all legal maters with a few exceptions.

Your hate will not take you very far in life dpodoll68. It will enslave you and it will own you and make you miserable. If I hold anyone accountable here, I hold the fans who have seemed to lose all perspective. Certainly not all fans, thankfully. Only some fans. To "hate" a 17 year old kid over some kind of a recruiting fiasco is certainly way out of line in my opinion. But, I guess that's just me.
 

GopherGod said:
I am sorry but the kid is not at fault he merely changed his mind to what he saw as a better fit. Who knows maybe he saw or heard about how Brewster pulled Fritz Rock's scholarship offer early when he did not commit right away and he didn't want that to happen to him and be left with no scholarship offers potentially especially coming off an injury like he is. Minnesota clearly set the precedent last season to commit early or else your scholarship offer may not be available after you take your officials. When you take that stance as a program and staff you have to be prepared for things like this to happen.
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You're not getting it. I don't think anyone here has a problem with him decommitting. That's not the issue. The way he talked about it as though he were swearing a blood oath is the problem.

He is at fault. Period. Unless you can prove to me that he was somehow coerced into saying what he said, he is a liar. He'll fit in well with the rest of the hillbillies over there.
 

4starrecruit said:
Your hate will not take you very far in life dpodoll68. It will enslave you and it will own you and make you miserable. If I hold anyone accountable here, I hold the fans who have seemed to lose all perspective. Certainly not all fans, thankfully. Only some fans. To "hate" a 17 year old kid over some kind of a recruiting fiasco is certainly way out of line in my opinion.
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Settle down, for Christ's sake. We're talking about college football. If you're getting down to the truth of it, of course I don't really "hate" people from WI, nor do I think anyone else here does. It's a joke. It's part of the rivalry.

Do you enjoy being a wet blanket?
 

dpodoll68 said:
You're not getting it. I don't think anyone here has a problem with him decommitting. That's not the issue. The way he talked about it as though he were swearing a blood oath is the problem.

He is at fault. Period. Unless you can prove to me that he was somehow coerced into saying what he said, he is a liar. He'll fit in well with the rest of the hillbillies over there.
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What do you expect him to say, I am marginally excited about the Minnesota offer and holding out for a Wisconsin offer. Here is an idea don't hang on every word a 17 year old kid says. He simply gave the media what they wanted which is what Brewster does all the time. Was Brewster a liar when he hired Dunbar or Meyer and declared them the right men for the job, no? Things change and the majority of people in the public eye are going to give you a good quote and what you want to hear.
 

GopherGod said:
What do you expect him to say, I am marginally excited about the Minnesota offer and holding out for a Wisconsin offer. Here is an idea don't hang on every word a 17 year old kid says. He simply gave the media what they wanted which is what Brewster does all the time. Was Brewster a liar when he hired Dunbar or Meyer and declared them the right men for the job, no? Things change and the majority of people in the public eye are going to give you a good quote and what you want to hear.
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You still continue to not get it. When did Brewster ever say "Mike Dunbar will be the offensive coordinator as long as I'm here" or "Phil Meyer will never be fired"? He didn't.

There is a huge difference between saying something like "I'm excited about joining Minnesota" and saying "My decision is over". He may have been truthful had he said the former. In saying the latter, he has proven himself to be a flat-out liar.

And don't keep throwing the "17 year old kid" thing out there as though it precludes him from culpability. It doesn't.
 

dpodoll68 said:
You still continue to not get it. When did Brewster ever say "Mike Dunbar will be the offensive coordinator as long as I'm here" or "Phil Meyer will never be fired"? He didn't.

There is a huge difference between saying something like "I'm excited about joining Minnesota" and saying "My decision is over". He may have been truthful had he said the former. In saying the latter, he has proven himself to be a flat-out liar.

And don't keep throwing the "17 year old kid" thing out there as though it precludes him from culpability. It doesn't.
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Please try and gain some perspective. It is one kid who has probably given few if any interviews prior to this and you want to jump on him. Perspective, he is not and was not going to bring a national title to Minnesota it is merely one player in the cog of 1000 things we need to do to be nationally relevant.
 

GopherGod said:
I am sorry but the kid is not at fault he merely changed his mind to what he saw as a better fit. Who knows maybe he saw or heard about how Brewster pulled Fritz Rock's scholarship offer early when he did not commit right away and he didn't want that to happen to him and be left with no scholarship offers potentially especially coming off an injury like he is. Minnesota clearly set the precedent last season to commit early or else your scholarship offer may not be available after you take your officials. When you take that stance as a program and staff you have to be prepared for things like this to happen.
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There are no parallels with Fritz Rock situation. Brew needed a WR, Rock didn't want to committ early, Brew had to pull it and go with Keise (who was ready to committ). KZ had already accepted. Brewster has no prior history of pulling scholarships of players who have given their verbal. You should at least acknowledge they are not similar situations at all.

You may hate Brew for whatever reason, fine, but don't manipulate cirsumstances to try to hate on Brew.
 

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