Wisconsin Badgers are idiots

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Arminius said:
Me thinks there is quite a bit at stake here, which is why Wisconsin has dug in on this. The Badgers might be doing the Gophers and DTA...every D1 school and their NIL org for that matter...a favor.

It is starting to get the feel that we may hear for several years, "In Lucas vs. Wisconsin, we have precedent that clearly shows our position is correct."
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I think you are right. Media reports are that the WI collective signed Lucas to a $500K NIL deal. If the collective paid him, say, 40% up front (or more), and the day after he got the money he tried to put his name in the transfer portal, then WI is taking the bullet for a lot of teams. How would Gopherholers feel if Koi pocketed say $500,000 for 2025 NIL and then immediately put in transfer portal papers? I suspect we'd understand the WI situation better.

I don't know what is in the standard NIL contract but I believe that the contract must contain a provision that forbids the player from entering into another NIL deal while the WI NIL deal is in place. What is called an "exclusivity" provision. Certainly would not violate any NCAA rule on NIL; not a pay for play thing; just insures basic honesty on the player's part. So, Lucas's choices are probably play for the Badgers or sit out the season, in either case living with the WI NIL contract. But if Lucas wants to sign a "competing" NIL contract, I think he is toast. Even if he transfers but doesn't sign a new NIL deal, I think there is a good argument that he has repudiated and/or destroyed the value of the WI NIL contract. Whether the University can intercede and abet the legal position of the WI NIL collective is somewhat open, I suspect.

Bottom Line: The kid should repay the money he took from the Wisconsin collective or the University of Miami collective should pay it for him. Just like Miami is paying a $600,000 contract termination fee to the U of Minn because it snatched away our DC during the term of a contract. It looks like this kid wants to keep the WI collective money yet immediately sign a new, competing NIL deal with Miami. If this is the case, it is a piggish and fundamentally dishonest move. I'll bet the WI collective thinks it has a good case. And the fact that Lucas's lawyer is simply fulminating on social media but hasn't brought a lawsuit (likely to be venued in Wisconsin) speaks volumes.

Anyway, on historical principle, the Badgers are dinks ... but I think in this case the Badgers are doing the whole B1G a huge favor by digging in their heels and insisting that there must be some minimum level of honesty and fair dealing by players in NIL deals.
 
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Gophergrandpa said:
I think you are right. Media reports are that the WI collective signed Lucas to a $500K NIL deal. If the collective paid him, say, 40% up front (or more), and the day after he got the money he tried to put his name in the transfer portal, then WI is taking the bullet for a lot of teams. How would Gopherholers feel if Koi pocketed say $500,000 for 2025 NIL and then immediately put in transfer portal papers? I suspect we'd understand the WI situation better.
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I can't speak for others, but I'd be frustrated that the collective and coaching staff were unable to retain him either due to finances, playing time, or the competitiveness of the team. But I wouldn't want the school to force him to stay if he didn't want to be at the University of Minnesota.

There is likely to be yet another change to how all of this is structured. But in the meantime, schools and collectives should probably view losing student-athletes as a cost of doing business. Since this isn't my (literal) business, I don't really care if the U of M has a few kids leave who may not have conducted themselves with the utmost integrity as in your example.
 

Scottsdale Gopher said:
I can't speak for others, but I'd be frustrated that the collective and coaching staff were unable to retain him either due to finances, playing time, or the competitiveness of the team. But I wouldn't want the school to force him to stay if he didn't want to be at the University of Minnesota.

There is likely to be yet another change to how all of this is structured. But in the meantime, schools and collectives should probably view losing student-athletes as a cost of doing business. Since this isn't my (literal) business, I don't really care if the U of M has a few kids leave who may not have conducted themselves with the utmost integrity as in your example.
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If a player wants to transfer, fine.

If a player signed a deal, and THEN requested a transfer?

Nope.
 



USAF said:
If a player wants to transfer, fine.

If a player signed a deal, and THEN requested a transfer?

Nope.
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Agreed in the principle and this is why I wish they’d just change the rules and the players sign with the school, they’re the ones paying the players, etc and we stop this facade that is NIL. Lucas isn’t making anyone money from his NIL. He’s making the badgers better and thus generating them revenue by people going to and watching games. The money involved comes from tv revenue for schools. A random db isn’t making people buy new season tickets or things of that nature.
 

Gophergrandpa said:
I think you are right. Media reports are that the WI collective signed Lucas to a $500K NIL deal. If the collective paid him, say, 40% up front (or more), and the day after he got the money he tried to put his name in the transfer portal, then WI is taking the bullet for a lot of teams. How would Gopherholers feel if Koi pocketed say $500,000 for 2025 NIL and then immediately put in transfer portal papers? I suspect we'd understand the WI situation better.

I don't know what is in the standard NIL contract but I believe that the contract must contain a provision that forbids the player from entering into another NIL deal while the WI NIL deal is in place. What is called an "exclusivity" provision. Certainly would not violate any NCAA rule on NIL; not a pay for play thing; just insures basic honesty on the player's part. So, Lucas's choices are probably play for the Badgers or sit out the season, in either case living with the WI NIL contract. But if Lucas wants to sign a "competing" NIL contract, I think he is toast. Even if he transfers but doesn't sign a new NIL deal, I think there is a good argument that he has repudiated and/or destroyed the value of the WI NIL contract. Whether the University can intercede and abet the legal position of the WI NIL collective is somewhat open, I suspect.

Bottom Line: The kid should repay the money he took from the Wisconsin collective or the University of Miami collective should pay it for him. Just like Miami is paying a $600,000 contract termination fee to the U of Minn because it snatched away our DC during the term of a contract. It looks like this kid wants to keep the WI collective money yet immediately sign a new, competing NIL deal with Miami. If this is the case, it is a piggish and fundamentally dishonest move. I'll bet the WI collective thinks it has a good case. And the fact that Lucas's lawyer is simply fulminating on social media but hasn't brought a lawsuit (likely to be venued in Wisconsin) speaks volumes.

Anyway, on historical principle, the Badgers are dinks ... but I think in this case the Badgers are doing the whole B1G a huge favor by digging in their heels and insisting that there must be some minimum level of honesty and fair dealing by players in NIL deals.
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The exclusivity concept is very interesting and don’t really know how that would work out in court. Pro players shooting commercials often are wearing generic jerseys, etc and it’s not like they are restricted from signing deals/shooting commercials with other organizations.

Agree with you that it’s a slimy move from Lucas and he should repay the money and move on, but that’s easier said than done for a guy who’s probably never seen money like this in his life.
 


dog mustard said:
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The plot thickens. This could be one heck of a ground-breaking lawsuit. Can a scholarship player transfer AND retain immediate playing eligibility without ever entering the portal? If yes, the portal might be a dead letter.
 




I mean the portal is not a big deal anyways...it just means the player is a free agents. I don't think they ever had to actually enter it to transfer.
 


How long til someone switches teams in the middle of a season?
 



Gophergrandpa said:
Looks like portal is a dead letter. Per NCAA all you have to do is unenroll?

www.on3.com

Miami lands transfer through NCAA loophole after Wisconsin refuses portal entry

.
www.on3.com www.on3.com
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Supreme Court rulings have essentially said just because they’re an athlete doesn’t mean they don’t have rights.
Other students don’t have to enter a portal to transfer

Will be interesting to see where this goes. For those who blame the portal…you might miss it when it’s gone
 

Word said:
How long til someone switches teams in the middle of a season?
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As soon as someone who wants to transfer is in a situation where transferring mid semester doesn’t make them academically ineligible and it is feasible to do because the school has classes to enroll in mid semester
 

Some guy said:
As soon as someone who wants to transfer is in a situation where transferring mid semester doesn’t make them academically ineligible and it is feasible to do because the school has classes to enroll in mid semester
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How long til academically ineligible isn't a thing anymore?
 

Word said:
How long til academically ineligible isn't a thing anymore?
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That’s a good question but kind of the one thing that hasn’t been chipped away at (yet)

So there are no new precedents I have read that make me think they already know which way a case on that would go.

The ncaa helped itself by not getting involved in the North Carolina issues and saying accreditation isn’t their purview
 

Word said:
How long til academically ineligible isn't a thing anymore?
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How long until the student part of student athlete isn't a thing anymore? We're pretty close
 

Word said:
How long til someone switches teams in the middle of a season?
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Scary thought. Could be Tuesday for many schools such as Minnesota and Wisconsin since Spring Semester starts then. Someone could enroll and play basketball or hockey immediately. I think there is a late fee to enroll once the semester starts but it is very small ($50?). Football would be tougher since the Fall semester and the season match.
 

mngg11 said:
How long until the student part of student athlete isn't a thing anymore? We're pretty close
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Yeah and when college sports officially becomes minor league sports I will be done as a fan. It's getting closer every year. I don't want to watch a minor league team that just happens to wear my school's colors.
 
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Word said:
Yeah and when college sports officially becomes minor league sports I will be done as a fan. It's getting closer every year. I don't want to watch a minor league team that just happens to wear my schools colors.
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Right there with you. As it is college sports is nearly unwatchable but when it jettisons any pretense of being part of the school I'm out.
 

Word said:
How long til someone switches teams in the middle of a season?
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Miami or Oregon would get an injury and just buy someone off another team to fill the hole in the middle of the week. I don't think this every happens because it's too crazy, but it's the worst case scenario which is why there do have to be at least SOME transfer rules.
 

Gophergrandpa said:
I think you are right. Media reports are that the WI collective signed Lucas to a $500K NIL deal. If the collective paid him, say, 40% up front (or more), and the day after he got the money he tried to put his name in the transfer portal, then WI is taking the bullet for a lot of teams. How would Gopherholers feel if Koi pocketed say $500,000 for 2025 NIL and then immediately put in transfer portal papers? I suspect we'd understand the WI situation better.

I don't know what is in the standard NIL contract but I believe that the contract must contain a provision that forbids the player from entering into another NIL deal while the WI NIL deal is in place. What is called an "exclusivity" provision. Certainly would not violate any NCAA rule on NIL; not a pay for play thing; just insures basic honesty on the player's part. So, Lucas's choices are probably play for the Badgers or sit out the season, in either case living with the WI NIL contract. But if Lucas wants to sign a "competing" NIL contract, I think he is toast. Even if he transfers but doesn't sign a new NIL deal, I think there is a good argument that he has repudiated and/or destroyed the value of the WI NIL contract. Whether the University can intercede and abet the legal position of the WI NIL collective is somewhat open, I suspect.

Bottom Line: The kid should repay the money he took from the Wisconsin collective or the University of Miami collective should pay it for him. Just like Miami is paying a $600,000 contract termination fee to the U of Minn because it snatched away our DC during the term of a contract. It looks like this kid wants to keep the WI collective money yet immediately sign a new, competing NIL deal with Miami. If this is the case, it is a piggish and fundamentally dishonest move. I'll bet the WI collective thinks it has a good case. And the fact that Lucas's lawyer is simply fulminating on social media but hasn't brought a lawsuit (likely to be venued in Wisconsin) speaks volumes.

Anyway, on historical principle, the Badgers are dinks ... but I think in this case the Badgers are doing the whole B1G a huge favor by digging in their heels and insisting that there must be some minimum level of honesty and fair dealing by players in NIL deals.
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Can we also start a thread that says the Badgers are dinks? Lol
 


upnorthkid said:
In the literal article

“There has been no public response from Wisconsin, nor any apparent resolution to Lucas’ desire to enter the portal. According to Heitner, litigation could soon follow”

There is speculation that Wisconsin feels he needs to honor a deal from a Badger insider. That is not directly from the school. I’m just answering his question.
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Wow. If Wisconsin is preventing a player from completing a clean entry (within 48 hrs) and transfer at the bequest of a butthurt donor (that doesn’t want to pursue normal legal action to enforce any NIL contract) this is doubly bad.

This is before any lawsuits arrive challenging the legality of the the portal window. I wonder if Heitner is biding his time to enforce maximum penalty dollars with the maximum number of defendants. McIntosh could make this story go away by making the donor whole out of the department entertainment and travel slush fund.
 

Gophergrandpa said:
I think you are right. Media reports are that the WI collective signed Lucas to a $500K NIL deal. If the collective paid him, say, 40% up front (or more), and the day after he got the money he tried to put his name in the transfer portal, then WI is taking the bullet for a lot of teams. How would Gopherholers feel if Koi pocketed say $500,000 for 2025 NIL and then immediately put in transfer portal papers? I suspect we'd understand the WI situation better.

I don't know what is in the standard NIL contract but I believe that the contract must contain a provision that forbids the player from entering into another NIL deal while the WI NIL deal is in place. What is called an "exclusivity" provision. Certainly would not violate any NCAA rule on NIL; not a pay for play thing; just insures basic honesty on the player's part. So, Lucas's choices are probably play for the Badgers or sit out the season, in either case living with the WI NIL contract. But if Lucas wants to sign a "competing" NIL contract, I think he is toast. Even if he transfers but doesn't sign a new NIL deal, I think there is a good argument that he has repudiated and/or destroyed the value of the WI NIL contract. Whether the University can intercede and abet the legal position of the WI NIL collective is somewhat open, I suspect.

Bottom Line: The kid should repay the money he took from the Wisconsin collective or the University of Miami collective should pay it for him. Just like Miami is paying a $600,000 contract termination fee to the U of Minn because it snatched away our DC during the term of a contract. It looks like this kid wants to keep the WI collective money yet immediately sign a new, competing NIL deal with Miami. If this is the case, it is a piggish and fundamentally dishonest move. I'll bet the WI collective thinks it has a good case. And the fact that Lucas's lawyer is simply fulminating on social media but hasn't brought a lawsuit (likely to be venued in Wisconsin) speaks volumes.

Anyway, on historical principle, the Badgers are dinks ... but I think in this case the Badgers are doing the whole B1G a huge favor by digging in their heels and insisting that there must be some minimum level of honesty and fair dealing by players in NIL deals.
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How would the NIL contract, even if stupidly agreed to by the player, allow Wisconsin to prevent a transfer. They don’t seem like they can be related? Or, are universities employing players now?
 


Word said:
How long til someone switches teams in the middle of a season?
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Someone would have to be willing to give up and/or pay any early termination penalties but I’d guess some team will need some player at some point.
 

The Big Ten apparently has revenue sharing contracts now that marry that player to the school. Except they are null and void pending House money. And the whole employee/employer legal test thing.

Interesting strategy, let’s see if it works out for them.




sports.yahoo.com

Former Wisconsin DB Xavier Lucas leaving school for Miami without entering transfer portal in a groundbreaking move

Wisconsin refused to enter Lucas into the portal after he requested a transfer, but he's off to Miami regardless in a groundbreaking move that may have ramifications across college football.
sports.yahoo.com sports.yahoo.com
 
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