whats to blame for fan apathy

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I wasn't there because I had a wedding to attend out of town, otherwise I would have been there. However, I personally don't take much stock in the number of people who show up for a glorified practice. I don't quite understand why 90,000 people show up at Alambama to watch their Spring Game. Just like I don't understand the allure to head down to Mankato to watch the Vikes training camp. I love my Gopher football, but at the end of the day the Spring Game is just a practice.
 

marketing

marketing Gopher football has been a tough sell since the Vikes arrived. I know a lot of you are big Vike fans and I have been and love watching Favre play but if the Vikes left, the Gopher football crowds would grow exponentially.
 


josh087 said:
Making it an "event" would not help one bit for spring attendance. They could have a 3-ring circus out there and it wouldn't matter. The game is already free. There is a new stadium. They offered parking and tailgating right next to the stadium for $10. They had a victory walk and the marching band. An autograph session right after the game. Do we really expect that adding some small activities outside the stadium will bring people in droves?

The U has gone leaps and bounds with the help of brewster over the last couple years to improve the gameday experience and the excitement for the team, and there is no less fan apathy than in the last 40 years.

There are a million things to do in the Twin Cities - and Gopher football is a blip on the radar. Unless they start winning 10+ games each year nothing will change. It's just the way it is going to be. If the Vikings leave it will start to help the wheels of change in the form of media attention - but even still there are so many things competing for our entertainment dollar and entertainment time it will be very hard to make progress without winning big consistently.
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I just don't agree with that statement. Yes, they build a new stadium, which is a huge investment and demonstration of commitment. And that by itself will help the game day experience. But that's all they did. They did nothing to promote tailgating -- in fact, discouraged it by making it too expensive for most people to park in the lots around the stadium. They're relying on Sally's and Stub & Herb's to create all the atmosphere, when all they have to do is make their own money and enhance the experience by charging $30-40 to let people tailgate in their lots.

Winning football is the most important thing we need. But college football is about the full experience, not just the game. Most Minnesotans know very little about that because we were stuck in the Dome for so long, and because the long-term inteptitude of the program has encouraged fans to watch the NFL instead. The U can do a lot to bring fans in by improving AND promoting the game day experience. But they don't.
 

I see where you're coming from Hates, but since there wasn't a good tailgating atmosphere before TCF, and when you consider all of the other improvements, I would still call it "leaps and bounds." It doesn't mean that it is perfect, or that there isn't a long way to go. There is, no doubt.

I think it is a bit naive to think that if the U simply dropped tailgating prices that it would bring out fans in droves. Remember, TCF was very well attended last year except for the students, who, ironically were the ones not paying for tailgating or parking. Could dropping prices bring a few more closer to the stadium? Sure - but if people really want to tailgate or be on campus before the game there are plenty of spots to do so.

The major problem is that the Gophers get squeezed out in the fall landscape of sports and time. This will be even more of a factor this year when the Twins are playing at TGT field late in the year.

How many casual MN fans will pick the Gophers over going to see a Vikings or Twins game? How many casual fans will watch a Gopher game over a Twins game? Not very many. Inherently, that is the main problem with the apathy. The only way it will change is if the Gophers start winning BIG each year (10+ games). People will care at that point because they love to cheer for a winner, but unless we are doing so people in the Twin Cities simply don't have the time and/or money to care about a non-pro team that isn't competing for a title every year.
 


MN fans are bandwagon at best. No better example than for those of us who were at the Michigan game in 2003 AND the Mich St game the next week. Half to 2/3 crowd for a game against two top 25 teams.
 

SMU GOPHS FAN said:
I wasn't there because I had a wedding to attend out of town, otherwise I would have been there. However, I personally don't take much stock in the number of people who show up for a glorified practice. I don't quite understand why 90,000 people show up at Alambama to watch their Spring Game. Just like I don't understand the allure to head down to Mankato to watch the Vikes training camp. I love my Gopher football, but at the end of the day the Spring Game is just a practice.
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Replace "wedding" with "my daughter's first communion" and you just gave the exact response I was going to give.

Plus, when I went to the spring game once a couple of years ago, I was bored and slightly confused on who/what to cheer for. Is an interception a good thing? Does a touchdown mean your defense sucks? Cue Allen Iverson, "We're talking about practice".

However, come September, I will be one of the first to arrive in my tailgating lot, one of the loudest cheerers in my section and one of the last to leave for every Gopher home game. So am I considered an apathetic fan?
 

Let's not confuse BT football with SEC football. I have been to 4 other BT stadiums on game day and there wasn't much going on for tailgating. Tailgating in the BT is usually just packing into a bar for 2 hours before the game. You want tailgating you go down to Auburn and the like.
 





MN fans are bandwagon at best
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They're bandwagon because they can afford to be. There are many sports options, so since they really don't have any loyalty other than to root for the hometown team (which all of them are anyway), they pick the team that is either the most popular, or the best performing.

I'll use the following as an example of the point I'm trying to make:

Let's say there are four stores that are all at about the same location in town that people can shop in town for the holiday season. All of them carry a variation of a popular giftable teddy bear. Since the stores are all in the same location in town (think all Mpls sports teams), location is no object.

Now, suppose three of the stores are more trendy in general, and more popular. Thus, they are able to carry the version of the teddy bear that gets featured on Oprah. EVERYONE wants this teddy bear. Why would anyone go the other store to get their knockoff teddy bear? Maybe there are a small few that prefer the other teddy bear to the more popular one. Maybe there are also a small few that know the owners of the other store personally, and thus have a vested interest in spending money in that store. Another small amount of others prefer to stay away from the more popular store and believe the "other store" has better products

Those of us on this board are in the vast minority. We would go to the "other store" to shop. Now, there are a couple of ways that we can get the other store to compete against the trendier stores
- Develop their own popular items to draw people away from the trendier more popular stores (championship or very good seasons)
- Hope the other stores leave

The problem with the "other store" developing their own trendy items is that as soon as that trend (wins) wears off, people will just go back to the other stores because they are more popular.

This is what we're facing competing with pro sports in the Twin Cities. In Iowa City and Madison, there is only one store. Everyone goes there.
 

wait!what? said:
Let's not confuse BT football with SEC football. I have been to 4 other BT stadiums on game day and there wasn't much going on for tailgating. Tailgating in the BT is usually just packing into a bar for 2 hours before the game. You want tailgating you go down to Auburn and the like.
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Just out of curiosity, which four did you visit where all they did was got to a bar for two hours?
 

RodentRampage said:
Some info on Spring Game attendance around the country from previous years:

http://bigrednetwork.com/archives/2007/04/analyzing_2007_spring_game_att.html

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_VfGU3Ao9Z...0-h/SNT_SpringFootballAttendance_20090518.PNG

The Spring Game has never been an "event" in its own right here at Minnesota. We have had years, such as when Holtz first came here, that it was well-attended, but that didn't translate into general interest in the Spring Game.
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Just in case you didn't want to click on the links, MN attendance was:

2007: 15,000
2008: 7,200
2009: 7,700
2010: 4,500 (what Maturi announced - but I think most would say closer to 2000-3000)

Yes, it's a Spring Game, yes, the weather was bad that morning...but the trend is certainly not good. I would certainly think that at the very least, more would come out just to see the new stadium. For our performance level, I would be very happy with a 10-15,000 range, like we had right when Brew was hired. We had that just 3 years ago, I don't think that's too much to expect - and there were still other options in the cities that year...we had the Vikings, Twins, Wild, Wolves, etc. way back then too ;).
 



ruralgopher said:
MN fans are bandwagon at best. No better example than for those of us who were at the Michigan game in 2003 AND the Mich St game the next week. Half to 2/3 crowd for a game against two top 25 teams.
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Reported attendance for that michigan game was 62300. Only about half full the next week. But what do you expect when the fattened on cream puff diet bubble burst against the Wolverines?

You say "bandwagon" I say informed and intelligent. You want fans to be interested, give them a reason to be. Don't just expect them to eat your garbage because it's the only thing in town, this isn't some other college cities...there's a bit more to do than watch a terrible team lose games.
 

The Spring game numbers actually speak fairly highly of Minnesota. Indiana, the only other Big Ten team not to finish at least 3rd in the conference during the Mason decade had the following spring game attendance marks in '07,08, and '09: 600, 1,500, 3,500. Minnesota's attendance was well ahead of Indiana. Minnesota also doubled Northwestern in spring game attendance in '08 and '09. Pittsburgh got less for their '09 spring game than Minnesota.

This idea that Minnesota has fair weather or bad fans just does not make sense to me. Why does Penn State pack them in for football and their basketball arena looks like the library on Friday night? Their hasn't been any winning at Minnesota for a long time and so attendance/interest has suffered greatly. Given the same scenario, most schools in the country would see a significant attendance drop. That doesn't make Minnesota fans any better/worse than most fans across the nation in terms of support.
 

EG#9 said:
This idea that Minnesota has fair weather or bad fans just does not make sense to me. Why does Penn State pack them in for football and their basketball arena looks like the library on Friday night? Their hasn't been any winning at Minnesota for a long time and so attendance/interest has suffered greatly. Given the same scenario, most schools in the country would see a significant attendance drop. That doesn't make Minnesota fans any better/worse than most fans across the nation in terms of support.
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Minnesota fans, with the possible exception of Viking fans in the Bud Grant days, are fair weather fans (literally and figuratively). It takes a winning team to get the support of all but a hardcore few. I attribute this to the lack of Game Day Tradition - if going to the game is an experience over and above watching the game, people will continue to come during less-than-stellar seasons. The choices the team-owners/town fathers have made to bring all sports indoors in relatively sterile downtown facilities - v. in the suburbs where there could be space to tailgate/socialize contributes to a different, more low-key game day experience.

After living in the Cities for a few years and watching some pretty good teams have mediocre attendance, my conclusion is that the spectator sports gene is not dominant in the average Minnesotan. I also think they have a much higher percentage of people who actually participate in sports (cross country skiing, hockey, etc.) and maybe that type of person would rather DO than WATCH.
 

Is it important to have a high attendance? I think its a fair question. I mean it would be nice to have ESPN say we had 50,000 people at TCF Bank, but I think that alot of work needs to be done in order to get that done.

First, it needs to be a priority for the U of M.
-How do you get students to attend this thing? Do you move the Spring Fest (or whatever its called) to the tailgating parking lots or to the end zone plaza?
-Get high school football involved. Have a coaching clinic somehow involved. Strongly encourage h.s. football players to get to the game.
-Give tours of the stadium.
-Give tours of campus. Use this day as not only a football recruiting tool, but to show off the U of M campus to parents and potential students.
-Advertise this darn thing. The date of the spring game should be out by signing day and should be included in our season ticket renewals.
-Don't schedule the same weekend as the NFL draft. I know some of you might not agree, but that is directly competing for attention with the NFL, and the gophs will always lose that battle.

I don't think beer should be a part of this game, but on the other hand do you think the Vikings would have attracted the number they have to their draft parties the past few years if beer wasn't involved? I wonder if it would be possible to sell $5 tickets to have the right to purchase beer up in the club level (once the legislature gives the power back to the U). It's a thought.

In the end this should be a campus wide event. Sort of an open house for all of campus.
 

Demi said:
You say "bandwagon" I say informed and intelligent. You want fans to be interested, give them a reason to be. Don't just expect them to eat your garbage because it's the only thing in town, this isn't some other college cities...there's a bit more to do than watch a terrible team lose games.
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A little stroll down memory lane for you... That year we had 3 future NFL running backs. Tapeh, Maroney, and Barber. Maroney and Barber both went over 1000 yds rushing. For the Mich St game, which is the game in question here, we were 6-1, 2-1 in conference and ranked 25th in the country. We already had a W over PSU. Our opponent was ranked 15th in the country. Ohio St wasn't even on the schedule that year so there was a lot of reasons to think that if we got past MSU (we ended up losing by 6) we could be BT champs. Hindsight we know that didn't happen, but we still had a ten win season and finished the year in the top 25. Come to think of it, with the knowledge at hand going into the MSU game, not attending would suggest the opposite of informed/ intelligent. And don't play the 'creampuff' card, have you seen the direction that major college football has gone?
 

GopherLady said:
Just in case you didn't want to click on the links, MN attendance was:

2007: 15,000
2008: 7,200
2009: 7,700
2010: 4,500 (what Maturi announced - but I think most would say closer to 2000-3000)

Yes, it's a Spring Game, yes, the weather was bad that morning...but the trend is certainly not good. I would certainly think that at the very least, more would come out just to see the new stadium. For our performance level, I would be very happy with a 10-15,000 range, like we had right when Brew was hired. We had that just 3 years ago, I don't think that's too much to expect - and there were still other options in the cities that year...we had the Vikings, Twins, Wild, Wolves, etc. way back then too ;).
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I don't agree that there is a tend there. The spring game got a bump in 2007 with people curious because of a new coach. This year, although the weather turned out to be good, many people had already made other plans based on the weather forcasts. 2008 and 2009 look more like a return to form than a drop in interest in the spring game itself.
 

ruralgopher said:
A little stroll down memory lane for you... That year we had 3 future NFL running backs. Tapeh, Maroney, and Barber. Maroney and Barber both went over 1000 yds rushing. For the Mich St game, which is the game in question here, we were 6-1, 2-1 in conference and ranked 25th in the country. We already had a W over PSU. Our opponent was ranked 15th in the country. Ohio St wasn't even on the schedule that year so there was a lot of reasons to think that if we got past MSU (we ended up losing by 6) we could be BT champs. Hindsight we know that didn't happen, but we still had a ten win season and finished the year in the top 25. Come to think of it, with the knowledge at hand going into the MSU game, not attending would suggest the opposite of informed/ intelligent. And don't play the 'creampuff' card, have you seen the direction that major college football has gone?
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You are trying to use attendance in the game after one of the most epic collapses in the history of all sports as a basis for your argument? I met a few people (friends of friends) who went to that Michigan game and didn't go back the rest of the season. I certainly can't blame them.

If I recall correctly, saying Minnesota lost to Michigan State by 6 is not telling the whole story as they got down big early and never had a lead. They finished that year as underachievers losing that MSU game and embarrassing themselves as favorites at Iowa.
 

It is pretty simple people, it's all about WINS. WIN BABY WIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

EG#9 said:
You are trying to use attendance in the game after one of the most epic collapses in the history of all sports as a basis for your argument? I met a few people (friends of friends) who went to that Michigan game and didn't go back the rest of the season. I certainly can't blame them.

If I recall correctly, saying Minnesota lost to Michigan State by 6 is not telling the whole story as they got down big early and never had a lead. They finished that year as underachievers losing that MSU game and embarrassing themselves as favorites at Iowa.
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Demi said that fans don't go because they are 'informed and intelligent'. I stated that was one of the most succesful seasons in the lives of many Minnesotans and to bail because of a loss is NOT informed and intelligent, but rather bandwagon, which he/she disputed. The result of the MSU game or any game after isn't relevent to the fact that Goph fans wouldn't show up for the 8th game of the year between 2 top 25 teams when the Gophs were very much alive for the conf title because they lost a game. If that ain't the definition of bandwagon I don't know what is.
 

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