Visit with Howard transfer G Elijah Hawkins

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Holy Man said:
I think he improves on ball defense immediately.
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Let's hope he can be an upgrade on on ball defense, and that he can get the ball up the court with some speed and create some things. This is a big signing, not because this guy is an all-world point guard, but because he adds depth to a backcourt that sorely needed it.

And I like the idea of a 46% 3 pt shooter from last year added to Mitchell (over 40%), along with Carrington and Christie, whom I believe are both solid shooters (yet to be proven.) When you have a post guy who will demand double teams and who can pass it (Payne), you've got a much better offense when you have multiple shooters. Things are looking a bit better now..
 

WriterGoph said:
It's coming together, but I know they're not done yet. Ask me when they're done in a couple weeks. Can't comment on non-con wins without knowing the schedule.
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So the last potential add will make a major difference? OK.

Noncon looking very weak at this point.
 

Big get for the squad. Now time to keep the momentum going, do we have any current leads/visits for wings? Sounds like that is the general consensus for biggest need with our remaining scholly
 

Crappie said:
So the last potential add will make a major difference? OK.

Noncon looking very weak at this point.
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How would either of us know that if we don't know who the visitor is this week??

Everyone thought we were totally screwed when Brown chose Utah State, but it appears we found a comparable option the next week. Maybe the coaches actually have an idea of what they're doing?

I'll choose to let this next couple weeks play out.
 

I watched the Kansas game to see how Hawkins looked against Harris, the B12 Defensive POY. My biggest takeaway was his quickness and aggression. He took lots of chances on offense and defense, which led to points but also turnovers and allowing his man to get penetration. Thought he was a little bit lazy on perimeter D both challenging 3's and fighting through screens.

Payne will be his best friend if they develop chemistry like Hawkins had with Shy Odom, there were tons of lobs. Also we need to work on our backdoor cuts because I counted half of dozen of those where Hawkins delivered a beautiful pass.

I am really curious to see how Ben uses him because we've been a painfully slow team and the announcers specifically mentioned Howard is 3rd in turnovers because of their pace pushing the ball. Can Ben integrate Hawkins into his offense? I really hope he doesn't stifle him but can help limit the turnovers a bit. Overall I was impressed with him and think this was a very good get.

Hawkins scored 12 points on 5/11 shooting (3/5 FT, 2/6 3PT) with 8 assists, 2 steals, 2 rebounds, and 7 (!) turnovers.

Opening possession, he has a nice looking drive that doesn't go in. Announcers go on to talk about his reputation for driving to the basket. They also note he is in a matchup with Dajuan Harris, the reigning B12 Defensive POY. Who is also a small PG at 6'1" 160.

Nice assist on a backdoor cut for the first points of the game:

Right after that last basket, he ties up the inbound pass for a jump ball (which Kansas retains)

Next time down the floor, another assist:

1st near-turnover, he starts a fast break off of a miss. Pushes the ball and makes a risky pass that gets knocked out of bounds. Definitely shows he is aggressive:

continued...
 


continued because I can only post 5 YT links at a time:

Knocks down a 3 on a kickout after an offensive board:

He sat for a while. Came back in the game and made a nice floating pass off the drive that led to a shooting foul:
Made a high degree of difficulty drive in traffic, also looked like a prayer ball but it went in:

Finds teammate in transition for a 3:

First turnover, gets the ball poked away by Harris as he dribbles around trying to use a screen:
 

An example of his aggression leading to a defensive lapse, he lunges for the ball which leads to easy penetration for Harris who kicks it out for a 3:
Another alley-oop pass that lead to a shooting foul. I think this is the 4th pass like this that has led to a basket or FT opportunity, really hope he develops some chemistry with Payne and Garcia and Ola-Joseph on these shots:
Turnover #2: Harris deflected a pass on a screen and roll:

Turnover #3: 2 on 1 fast break, he makes the pass and it is intercepted

Drives and forces a foul by Harris to get to the line, I like his confidence:
 

Another FT opportunity, I originally thought this was a turnover: Howard gets the ball back with 7 seconds, he is trying to get a last second shot up and steps out of bounds after some forcing contact with the defender, but they call the foul
Hero ball long missed 3PT early in possession:
Turnover #4: Drives under the hoop, looks for an escape, passes it to Odom but he fumbles the ball.
Finds Odom for the easy basket underneath, nice delivery:
Beautiful backdoor pass doesn't get finished:
 

Another nice assist on a backdoor cut:
Turnover #5?: Gets penetration on the drive, but then just tosses the ball without much of a chance, this one is his fault, but he immediately steals the ball and gets it to Odom for a layup:
Turnover #6, slipped and fell:
Turnover #7? No idea how they count this one, he technically grabs the rebound and tries to bounce it off the nearest Jayhawk, but steps out of bounds. This is a hustle play, not a TO IMO.
Converts an impressive drive when Udeh gets switched onto him:
 



eker0016 said:
Another nice assist on a backdoor cut:
Turnover #5?: Gets penetration on the drive, but then just tosses the ball without much of a chance, this one is his fault, but he immediately steals the ball and gets it to Odom for a layup:
Turnover #6, slipped and fell:
Turnover #7? No idea how they count this one, he technically grabs the rebound and tries to bounce it off the nearest Jayhawk, but steps out of bounds. This is a hustle play, not a TO IMO.
Converts an impressive drive when Udeh gets switched onto him:
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Nice thread (y)(y)(y)(y)
 


I think he looks like a solid addition, fully capable of playing in the B1G. Certainly an upgrade over Samuels and Thiam. This team needs speed, shooting and defense. Check, check and check.
 




WriterGoph said:
How would either of us know that if we don't know who the visitor is this week??

Everyone thought we were totally screwed when Brown chose Utah State, but it appears we found a comparable option the next week. Maybe the coaches actually have an idea of what they're doing?

I'll choose to let this next couple weeks play out.
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Guess well see when the games begin.
 

CoMn said:
So glad we have two point guards. When a team only has one and he gets injured the team is screwed. It's just too important of a position to only have one guy. Now let's hope Ben fills the last position and doesn't decide he has enough guys.
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They both shoot enough to get run off the ball as well. He is a nice fit to this roster.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
They both shoot enough to get run off the ball as well. He is a nice fit to this roster.
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Yep agree…Work inside out! Pound the ball down low to Payne and space the floor… Payne goes to work or find the open shooter..
 

WriterGoph said:
If you want clarity on GWG's agenda, all you need to read is the fact he mentions that Mitchell came from a "last place team" as opposed to him being rated as a 4-star transfer (as if the record of the team a player transfers from has shown to dictate success at their next stop). Or you can see that he mentions Hawkins' size as opposed to him shooting 47% from 3 and a good (and high volume FT shooter) or the fact that he had a ton of assists. Finally, he completely fails to mention one of our best recruits since Amir Coffey in Cam Christie ("Izzo had cooled on him," he will say).

It's been a while since any poster was so transparently a joke as GWG has become.
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Right a 4* transfer...what was Battle's rating? But we're better off without him right? Didn't we have 2 of the best transfers in the conference last season? How'd that play out?

Comparing Christie to Coffey is pure comedy. You're doing a great job of joke writing Writer.
 

eker0016 said:
I am really curious to see how Ben uses him because we've been a painfully slow team and the announcers specifically mentioned Howard is 3rd in turnovers because of their pace pushing the ball.
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Actually, Howard was #356 of 363 in turnover percentage, so not related to pace. Their tempo was #82, which is just sorta fast, and slower than Illinois and Iowa. When you take into account that a possession ends on a turnover and that neither of those B1G teams turned it over very much, their pace was probably artificially high based on turning it over so much.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Right a 4* transfer...what was Battle's rating? But we're better off without him right? Didn't we have 2 of the best transfers in the conference last season? How'd that play out?

Comparing Christie to Coffey is pure comedy. You're doing a great job of joke writing Writer.
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And Battle was All-Big Ten his first season. To say that he wasn't a quality recruit and didn't win us some games is further alteration of the truth by you. Yes, Battle wasn't the same player last season due to injuries and the position he played/our roster makeup. But to act like Battle was a "bad" recruit is so far beyond laughable.

As far as Christie and Coffey...

Coffey was rated #50 nationally. Coffey was 6-7 when he came in. Coffey had some NBA bloodlines in his family (his father, although briefly). 4-star. Highly productive in high scool.

Christie is rated #77 nationally. He is reported to be 6-6 now. His brother is on an NBA roster and both of his parents played collegiately. 4-star. Highly productive in high school.

Obviously Coffey developed well and has turned into a successful NBA player. But unless you can see the future for Christie, comparing the end product of Coffey and Christie as a recruit isn't reasonable. Comparing them recruit to recruit, I don't see the vast chasm you're portraying.
 

WriterGoph said:
And Battle was All-Big Ten his first season. To say that he wasn't a quality recruit and didn't win us some games is further alteration of the truth by you. Yes, Battle wasn't the same player last season due to injuries and the position he played/our roster makeup. But to act like Battle was a "bad" recruit is so far beyond laughable.

As far as Christie and Coffey...

Coffey was rated #50 nationally. Coffey was 6-7 when he came in. Coffey had some NBA bloodlines in his family (his father, although briefly). 4-star. Highly productive in high scool.

Christie is rated #77 nationally. He is reported to be 6-6 now. His brother is on an NBA roster and both of his parents played collegiately. 4-star. Highly productive in high school.

Obviously Coffey developed well and has turned into a successful NBA player. But unless you can see the future for Christie, comparing the end product of Coffey and Christie as a recruit isn't reasonable. Comparing them recruit to recruit, I don't see the vast chasm you're portraying.
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When did I say Battle was a bad recruit? You really like to make things up and say things I didn't say. I've been one of the few posters defending him as a big loss, which he is.

Coffey was a composite top 50 ranked .9747, Christie is a composite 129, ranked .9368. You continue to try and cherry pick to make a point, but I'll stick with composite. Amir was a better player coming out of HS. He even put up better numbers than McDonalds All American brother Max as a freshman. Cam is unlikely to come close to that because he's smaller and doesn't have the handles or ability to play D like Amir did.

Somehow you can't grasp that Ben can land a few players here and there but that doesn't make him a good recruiter. Any assistant who has been coaching as long as Ben has can do that.

The reality is Ben has recruited a last place team two years in a row, and this team will be picked to finish last in the B1G again this season. That's not bad recruiting, it's terrible recruiting.

But I guess everyone else around the country must have the same 'agenda' I apparently have.
 


GopherWeatherGuy said:
When did I say Battle was a bad recruit? You really like to make things up and say things I didn't say. I've been one of the few posters defending him as a big loss, which he is.

Coffey was a composite top 50 ranked .9747, Christie is a composite 129, ranked .9368. You continue to try and cherry pick to make a point, but I'll stick with composite. Amir was a better player coming out of HS. He even put up better numbers than McDonalds All American brother Max as a freshman. Cam is unlikely to come close to that because he's smaller and doesn't have the handles or ability to play D like Amir did.

Somehow you can't grasp that Ben can land a few players here and there but that doesn't make him a good recruiter. Any assistant who has been coaching as long as Ben has can do that.

The reality is Ben has recruited a last place team two years in a row, and this team will be picked to finish last in the B1G again this season. That's not bad recruiting, it's terrible recruiting.

But I guess everyone else around the country must have the same 'agenda' I apparently have.
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So you wanna use the composite rating from 7+ years ago when everyone who follows recruiting knows that ESPN and Rivals have taken serious dives as far as recruiting/rating legitimacy in that time period? 247 is widely considered the industry standard, so I used their ratings. The quality of the composite rating system is nowhere near the same thing as it was back in 2015/2016. ESPN literally laid off most of their employees who handled HS recruiting since then.

NOTE: Coffey was actually rated #81 nationally by 247, not #50. My mistake in my original post.
 
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WriterGoph said:
If you want clarity on GWG's agenda, all you need to read is the fact he mentions that Mitchell came from a "last place team" as opposed to him being rated as a 4-star transfer (as if the record of the team a player transfers from has shown to dictate success at their next stop). Or you can see that he mentions Hawkins' size as opposed to him shooting 47% from 3 and a good (and high volume FT shooter) or the fact that he had a ton of assists. Finally, he completely fails to mention one of our best recruits since Amir Coffey in Cam Christie ("Izzo had cooled on him," he will say).

It's been a while since any poster was so transparently a joke as GWG has become.
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Has become? No, always has been.
 

Formerswish said:
Let's hope he can be an upgrade on on ball defense, and that he can get the ball up the court with some speed and create some things. This is a big signing, not because this guy is an all-world point guard, but because he adds depth to a backcourt that sorely needed it.

And I like the idea of a 46% 3 pt shooter from last year added to Mitchell (over 40%), along with Carrington and Christie, whom I believe are both solid shooters (yet to be proven.) When you have a post guy who will demand double teams and who can pass it (Payne), you've got a much better offense when you have multiple shooters. Things are looking a bit better now..
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It'll help the depth for sure, which I think is one of the more important things we lacked. We needed a quick point, outside shooting and defense and Hawkins seems to have all of that. Even though stepping up from the MEAC to the Big 10 will be a big jump up. We still have another scholarship available but this was pretty big
Formerswish said:
Let's hope he can be an upgrade on on ball defense, and that he can get the ball up the court with some speed and create some things. This is a big signing, not because this guy is an all-world point guard, but because he adds depth to a backcourt that sorely needed it.

And I like the idea of a 46% 3 pt shooter from last year added to Mitchell (over 40%), along with Carrington and Christie, whom I believe are both solid shooters (yet to be proven.) When you have a post guy who will demand double teams and who can pass it (Payne), you've got a much better offense when you have multiple shooters. Things are looking a bit better now..
Click to expand...
 




WriterGoph said:
So you wanna use the composite rating from 7+ years ago when everyone who follows recruiting knows that ESPN and Rivals have taken serious dives as far as recruiting/rating legitimacy in that time period? 247 is widely considered the industry standard, so I used their ratings. The quality of the composite rating system is nowhere near the same thing as it was back in 2015/2016. ESPN literally laid off most of their employees who handled HS recruiting since then.

NOTE: Coffey was actually rated #81 nationally by 247, not #50. My mistake in my original post.
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And 247 used to be Scout which was terrible. Either way people continue to overvalue the recruits Ben has brought in. The results speak for themselves.
 

skiumah1 said:
Who is the other potential visitor?
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Nobody outside the staff seems to know yet. As we saw with word on Hawkins not coming out til the day before his visit, they are doing everything they can to be extremely secretive lining up these transfer visits. So unless the transfer target posts on social media or gives an interview, there isn't much way to know. I'd venture to guess something more will leak out when said visitor is on campus (or close).
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
When did I say Battle was a bad recruit? You really like to make things up and say things I didn't say. I've been one of the few posters defending him as a big loss, which he is.

Coffey was a composite top 50 ranked .9747, Christie is a composite 129, ranked .9368. You continue to try and cherry pick to make a point, but I'll stick with composite. Amir was a better player coming out of HS. He even put up better numbers than McDonalds All American brother Max as a freshman. Cam is unlikely to come close to that because he's smaller and doesn't have the handles or ability to play D like Amir did.

Somehow you can't grasp that Ben can land a few players here and there but that doesn't make him a good recruiter. Any assistant who has been coaching as long as Ben has can do that.

The reality is Ben has recruited a last place team two years in a row, and this team will be picked to finish last in the B1G again this season. That's not bad recruiting, it's terrible recruiting.

But I guess everyone else around the country must have the same 'agenda' I apparently have.
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What exactly is your expectations for his recruiting? Your pessimistic attitude towards Ben is not reality. Yes he’s had 2 last place teams but it’s not recruiting it’s injuries and you know that Tucker Carlson. Depleted their bench in year one and forced them to play freshman in year 2, which doesn’t work in the portal/Covid year era… that’s not including the lack of NIL money. But that doesn’t matter to you… maybe when Ben gets fired we can hire someone else’s son
 

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