Terms Presented by Notre Dame and Texas to the Big Ten

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Northwestern Message Board Rumor

Earlier this evening, Notre Dame and Texas jointly presented the Big Ten Conference with their proposed terms of entry into the conference. These terms resulted from lengthy discussions among both schools and the Big Ten over the past several months.

The major items include:
1. The preservation of an eight game (plus championship) conference football schedule. Both ND and Texas wish to preserve rivalries with non-Big Ten universities on a regular basis. This would require the Big Ten to abandon its current plans of a 9 game conference schedule.
2. The staggering of the schedule to allow for mid-season scheduling with non-conference football opponents.
3. The preservation of the status quo conference makeup until approximately 2014, unless the Big XII fails to retain key (NOT including A&M) conference members. This will provide the member schools, acting in unison, with the greatest leverage negotiating ongoing television contracts, particularly with ESPN.
4. Should Texas depart the conference for the Big Ten before ND due to the further disintegration of the Big XII, ND will remain independent until approximately 2014
5. The Longhorn Network would remain independent until approximately 2014, at which point the network would become a part of an expanded Big Ten Network (specifically referred to as "BTN2"), likely either in partnership with Fox, NBC, or less likely ABC

The Big Ten just wrapped up a meeting to initially consider all of the terms presented by the schools, including the aforementioned.

Notably, there is a general discontent with the reporting of the situation by ESPN with specific regard to Texas. ESPN has, for self-serving purposes, drastically exaggerated the lean of Texas to the Pac12 conference in nearly all commentary. ESPN has essentially waged a propaganda campaign to drive support among the Texas stakeholders to the Pac12 conference. ESPN has gone so far as to attempt to accelerate the disintegration of the Big XII to pressure Texas into making an immediate conference change decision. Texas has steadfastly resisted change, and will do so until the appropriate time occurs for Texas to stand in a strong position to renegotiate television contracts, including with ESPN.

In reality, the preference expressed by Texas' relevant leadership is to depart the Big XII for the Big Ten at the time that gives Texas the greatest leverage in negotiating a new television rights deal. The Big Ten and Texas agreed that Texas should do what is best for Texas, which they also both agree is a move by Texas to join the Big Ten Conference. Delaney's top priority has been to create an environment for Texas and Notre Dame to join the conference on mutually benefical terms.

Notre Dame has an interest in preserving its traditional rivalries, three of which occur already in the Big Ten, and creating a new national rivalry with a traditional powerhouse. The Big Ten believes that ND prefers independence, but realizes that it will soon have no choice but to join a conference. The Big Ten also believes that ND is trying to position itself so that if it must join a conference, it does so on the most favorable terms possible. Hence the return to the 8 game schedule and a protected game with national power Texas. The Big Ten will attempt to create a mutually beneficial environment for ND that allows it to preserve a great deal of independence to retain all its traditional rivalries within the conference context.

The initial mood at the Big Ten to the terms provided by the two schools is "receptive."
This post was edited on 9/8 2:20 AM by PURPLE Book Cat
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As of midnight there have been a fair amount of people viewing this post on Northwestern Rivals. Views: 61566, Replies: 255
 

Wow.

Two of the powerhouse schools I would NOT want to see in the B1G. I hope it's not true.
 

It is going to be hard enough just adding Nebraska but if both schools join it will be really tough for everyone.
 

Wow...I read the entire thread on the NW board...this thing with TX and ND could really go off...we do live in interesting times in college football.
 



I read this from a link on another board. The only place, as far as I know, that this has been posted was on the NW Rivals site. I need to see another source before I believe any of it.

Keep in mind that Nebraska is now one of us, with the ability to vote on things like this. They joined the Big Ten in part because they wanted to get away from the bullying of Texas. I have a hard time believing that they would want to allow the Longhorns into the Big Ten.
 

If this is legitimate...

T_O_-Popcorn.jpg

Get ya popcorn ready.

Seriously. What would they do for an encore to get to 16 teams? The Yankees and Manchester United? I know it's probably it has no basis in sanity, but I did notice that the WCHA extended invites to everyone from the CCHA but Notre Dame...is that because they know the Domers are NCHC or Hockey East bound...or that there could be a third destination.

As amazing a post as this is, and as much as it does touch on some details...it's as good as the paper it's printed on at this point, as far as I'm concerned. Good read, nice to think about, but hardly concrete. Definitely enough to get text messages flying around the midwest and message boards buzzing.
 

I actually like the idea of adding these two teams. I love being able to play these top notch programs and i'll especially like it if it's something our rivals have to do as well. Playing USC was cool last weekend and it'd been cooler if we knew Iowa and Wisconsin had to play them as well.

I like the idea of an Austin and South Bend trip to watch my Gophers. I realize that it might make our schedule a notch tougher but that really doesn't bother me.

Furthermore, the idea of adding Notre Dame and Texas to the BTN will bring a ton of money to the U. These two school support networks on their own, if you essentially add that money to the BTN, it'd be pretty significant.

My only concern is recruiting...Notre Dame would become further entrentched in our recruiting. They already recruit MN pretty well (when they are interested) but I think this might help them when a MN recruit gets on their radar. I could see Texas looking at the occasional MN kid (ala tOSU).
 



I don't want to go as far south as Texas. I'd actually rather grab Notre Dame and Mizzou, then maybe Maryland and BC or Rutgers and BC.
 

GopherInWI said:
If this is legitimate...

View attachment 1119

Get ya popcorn ready.

Seriously. What would they do for an encore to get to 16 teams? The Yankees and Manchester United? I know it's probably it has no basis in sanity, but I did notice that the CCHA extended invites to everyone but Notre Dame...is that because they know the Domers are NCHC or Hockey East bound...or that there could be a third destination.

As amazing a post as this is, and as much as it does touch on some details...it's as good as the paper it's printed on at this point, as far as I'm concerned. Good read, nice to think about, but hardly concrete. Definitely enough to get text messages flying around the midwest and message boards buzzing.
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I thought the Domers were already part of the forming of the NCHC.
 

There are 6 teams that will start the new conference. CC, Denver, Miami of Ohio, Duluth, Neb.-Omaha, and North Dakota Flickertails. Talks continue at this time about adding Notre Dame and Western Michigan. If Notre Dame did not have something in the works they would have already accepted the invitation to this new conference. (IMHO). Now they could end up in Hockey East, but it is looking more and more like Notre Dame will be in the Big 10 by 2014.
 

"The Big Ten and Texas agreed that Texas should do what is best for Texas."

I smell BS. Since when would the Big Ten take this position? I think this was written by a Texas supporter with an agenda until I hear otherwise.

Also, why would Notre Dame & Texas be doing anything together?

And since when would ND be interested in a protected rivalry with Texas?

It would have been more credible if it said that ND wanted to play Michigan, MSU & Purdue every year.
 



badgergopher said:
"The Big Ten and Texas agreed that Texas should do what is best for Texas."

I smell BS. Since when would the Big Ten take this position? I think this was written by a Texas supporter with an agenda until I hear otherwise.

Also, why would Notre Dame & Texas be doing anything together?

And since when would ND be interested in a protected rivalry with Texas?

It would have been more credible if it said that ND wanted to play Michigan, MSU & Purdue every year.
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THIS. i just don't see the big ten and its member schools being willing to bend over and take it up the poop shoot (like the big 12 members did for a long time) for texas (or even notre dame for that matter) just to add them to the conference.

THE OLDEST and most traditional conference in America is NOT going to let a bragadocious school like texas come in and dictate terms to everyone else in the big ten conference the way they were able to in the big 12. i don't see them doing it for notre dame either. the big ten is far more about parity in distribution of conference contract rights/fees, etc. amongst member schools and has been for a while. i don't see the big ten being willing to change everything around to let texas (or notre dame) dictate how they will interact with the rest of the conference when it comes to tv contracts, fee negotiations, scheduling, etc, etc.

not sure how much validity i would put in this supposed "story" until it is further confirmed/verified.
 

Why this makes sense:

-BTN is in Chicago and has a lot of NW ties/workers/interns etc, so it could be valid.
-It seems to be very detailed and logical.
-It would be THE home run the B1G (and Delaney) is looking for (Texas market and broad ND reach accross country,Marquee programs).
-Benefits all sports beyond Football (does TX have a hockey team?)
-A B1G champion should almost certainly get a nod for a national championship.

Why this does NOT make sense:

-Why would TX and ND approach jointly? (if so are they briging this offer to other conf?)
-None of the other 'new school' roumers (UCONN, KS, Mizzu) paned out.
-Would a 1 or possibly 2 loss FB team still get a shot at a title--it would be VERY tuff to run the table.
-No way that BTN $comes close to NBC$ or Longhorn$
 

I don't think the Big Ten is going to add just anybody, that is why I feel ND and Texas are viable candidates for expansion if expansion happens at all.
 

badgergopher said:
"The Big Ten and Texas agreed that Texas should do what is best for Texas."

I smell BS. Since when would the Big Ten take this position? I think this was written by a Texas supporter with an agenda until I hear otherwise.

Also, why would Notre Dame & Texas be doing anything together?

And since when would ND be interested in a protected rivalry with Texas?

It would have been more credible if it said that ND wanted to play Michigan, MSU & Purdue every year.
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I thought the same thing, BS. There would have to be some sort of strange re-alignment of the divisions and re-jiggering of the "protected games" to pull this off as well.

Though it would be natural "geographically" to put Texas in Legends (to play Nebraska) and ND in Leaders (state rivals Indiana and Purdue). In order to have an 8 game conference schedule, there would be six division games and only 2 non-divisional games, one which is protected. What happens with Michigan and MSU for ND? Michigan is already protected with OSU.

Put ND in Legends (with Michigan and MSU), and their protected game becomes Purdue. They play in-state rival Indiana only twice every 12 years.

That begs the question--do we then want to even have a protected game with a 14 team conference and only 8 conference games? Even if we reshuffle the divisions, every team will only play out of division teams only once at home every 12 years with the protected game format. That's ridiculous.

This ain't the NFL. I think it's clear that a 14 team conference will not work with football and a 8 game conference schedule.

That just adds to the BS factor for me.
 

Enough already. Just say no to Texas and N.D.
 

THE Chitown Gopher said:
Why this makes sense:

-BTN is in Chicago and has a lot of NW ties/workers/interns etc, so it could be valid.
-It seems to be very detailed and logical.
-It would be THE home run the B1G (and Delaney) is looking for (Texas market and broad ND reach accross country,Marquee programs).
-Benefits all sports beyond Football (does TX have a hockey team?)
-A B1G champion should almost certainly get a nod for a national championship.

Why this does NOT make sense:

-Why would TX and ND approach jointly? (if so are they briging this offer to other conf?)
-None of the other 'new school' roumers (UCONN, KS, Mizzu) paned out.
-Would a 1 or possibly 2 loss FB team still get a shot at a title--it would be VERY tuff to run the table.
-No way that BTN $comes close to NBC$ or Longhorn$
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Keep in mind the poster on the NW board was also the poster who first revealed the NE deal and was exactly right on it being NE and ONLY NE. Nobody in the media had it...this guys credibility about B1G stuff is spot on...at least according to the top posters on their board.

And why would ND select TX to be their bidding partner? The Domers have wanted to be in the B1G but not on our terms for years...now they try and stack the deck with TX so they can have some leverage...and TX doesn't want to be int he PAC 27 or the ESECPN...the best conference in the country is the B1G and if ND comes along...it is only better. TX wants the academic ups as much as the athletic history...plus and 8 game conf schedule allows them to keep playing whomever they want.

Interestingly...a 2 loss team can win a national championship if we have a 16 team playoff...so the idea of a tough schedule being the death sentence changes when a playoff comes into focus.

Regarding the Longhorn Network...it isn't profitable yet...so how much $$$$ is Texas going to make...especially when they are playing Oregon instead of TA&M and Baylor.

This makes perfect sense to me...and I prefer the 8 game schedule for us to survive...let TX play OSU and TA&M out of conference every year...we can play New mexico State and Holy Trinity Bible College...it helps us...and we still get to host alternating years, MI, TX, NE, IA, WI...we can sell 80,000 seats for those games.

With TX and ND on the BTN...our TV payouts will increast 50% easily...not just from football but also because all the other sports that get televised will create eyeballs and ad sales. I know that since the BTN went on air I have watched everything from volleyball to gymnastics to track and wrestling...and I live in Philly. No way I see a single event before the BTN...and they got to sell ads in Philly because I was watching those shows...along with PSU fans of course.

Bring on ND and TX...can't wait!
 


If the B1G were to expand further, certainly those two schools fit the conference model (fine institutions and athletics). However, it should be the Big Ten setting the terms, not vice versa.
 

I am fine with them staggering their membership until 2014.

I am fine with an 8 game conference schedule, and the possibility for games midseason.

I don't like giving a school like Texas special privileges with its network.
 

First, let me say I'm not a fan of having a conference bigger than 12 teams. Far too many to retain a true sense of identity. However, some points if this WERE to happen:

- I agree not to let newcomers set terms like that, particularly in the # of conference games we play. With 12 or more teams a 9 game conference schedule only makes sense and particularly if we have 14 teams.
- ND fits the mold of a Big Ten team - location, academics, history, etc. Not to mention a tradition with a few Big Ten teams already it is a perfect fit. Sour taste in OUR mouth for them turning down the Big Ten so many times, so I feel like they can GFT but they at least are a good fit.
- TX is a good fit from a standpoint of academics and having football tradition. However, their tradition is not necessarily one that aligns with the Big Ten. They've always been part of southern conferences, played a different style ball, and haven't had a conference identity like the Big Ten has for years. I will concede that they at least do HAVE a tradition in football (and other sports) which is something to be said.
- If this does happen, it would clearly be all about the $$$. I'm not seeing any other reason, to be honest. Would it be fun to play Notre Dame, Texas, or some other teams under consideration? Sure! But there is no history to those games with us or any other team in the Big Ten (not counting Mich, MichSt, Purdue w/Notre Dame), so why would fans care? Moreover, why would fans give up a game we've loved to see every year for the past 80 years for a game against ND or TX?
- What would the conference alignments shake out to be? I would propose a straight East/West line at the Indiana/Illinois border.
East
Ohio State
Michigan
Michigan St
Purdue
Indiana
Notre Dame
Penn State
West
Minnesota
Iowa
Wisconsin
Nebraska
Illinois
Northwestern
Texas

- No protected crossover games, 9 conference game schedule (screw their demand, assuming this whole thing is true).
- Easy to understand names - please PLEASE abandon L&L
- All traditional rivalries are protected without the need for corssover - OSU-Mich, Mich-MichSt, Mich-ND, MichSt-ND, Purdue-ND, Purdue-Ind, MN-IA, MN-WI, IA-WI, Illinois-N'western
- More recent rivalries are protected, like PennSt-OSU, PennSt-MichSt, Iowa-Nebraska, Iowa-NW. Only historical game not played is MN-Mich (which sucked for me to put them in the east for that reason alone)
- Fairly even conference divisions
- 3 games against other division each year. This does mean that you play 3 teams for 2 years, 3 teams another 2 years, with the 7th foe going 4 years without playing, have to schedule to make that foe rotate.
- 3 non conference games allows Notre Dame to keep their USC, Navy, and BC games (for ND, this is a no brainer as a 1 loss year with that schedule is a guaranteed national championship bid) and Texas to play their choice of teams (I would hope they'd want to schedule A&M or Oklahoma each year but who knows).

Would this be the end of the world for the B1G or college football? No.... Not my ideal choice but it COULD work...
 

Playing it out, assuming a 14 team league with an 8 game schedule and no protected crossovers, I think the only way I think it works is to swap Michigan and MSU with Wisconsin and Illinois, then add ND in the East and Texas in the west. One big problem with this is that at least two teams each year could not finish with a divisional 'rival' (remember no crossover) and this would have to rotate among teams.

I can see how ND might find compelling an annual schedule that includes MI, MSU, Purdue, PSU, OSU, IN. Would this group see it as too tough?

Would Texas be excited about NE, IA, WI, MN, NW, IL? I don't see it.
 

Sounds like TX is positioning itself to sign with the best bidder and bid IMO. The one that serves its interest best...not necessarily blaming them, but the conference has to oversee and represent the best interest of all schools and the conference. Not sure TX could handle anything other then being an independent.
 

I apparently have been under the erroneous assumption that the university presidents of the B1G conference wanted to maintain the academic integrity of the group by admitting only AAU members. When Notre Dame was being bandied about and discussed on this board, I said I doubted they were actually, truly on the expansion list because they are not an AAU member.

So, is it now the case that since Nebraska was removed from AAU status that a school like ND can be courted, or have I been wrong this whole time? Or do dollars finally trump academics even in the B1G so that is why ND is so attractive?

When other schools such as Mizzou, Rutgers, Maryland or BC are mentioned, as they are here, I think that all but BC are worthy since they are AAU members. Unfortunately, if ND is being considered it can only be because of revenue and not academics and so these other schools simply don't bring the exposure and the concomitant increase in revenue for the BT Network so they become econonmically irrelevant.
 

Sumtimegophs said:
I apparently have been under the erroneous assumption that the university presidents of the B1G conference wanted to maintain the academic integrity of the group by admitting only AAU members. When Notre Dame was being bandied about and discussed on this board, I said I doubted they were actually, truly on the expansion list because they are not an AAU member.

So, is it now the case that since Nebraska was removed from AAU status that a school like ND can be courted, or have I been wrong this whole time? Or do dollars finally trump academics even in the B1G so that is why ND is so attractive?

When other schools such as Mizzou, Rutgers, Maryland or BC are mentioned, as they are here, I think that all but BC are worthy nice
they are AAU members. Unfortunately, if ND is being considered it can only be because of revenue and not academics and so these other schools simply don't bring the exposure and the concomitant increase in revenue for the BT Network so they become econonmically irrelevant.
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You cannot seriously be judging a schools academics strictly by their AAU membership or lack there of. Notre Dame, Dartmouth, and Syracuse are all schools that are better academically than many if not most of the big ten schools yet they are not AAU members.
 

Sumtimegophs said:
I apparently have been under the erroneous assumption that the university presidents of the B1G conference wanted to maintain the academic integrity of the group by admitting only AAU members. When Notre Dame was being bandied about and discussed on this board, I said I doubted they were actually, truly on the expansion list because they are not an AAU member.

So, is it now the case that since Nebraska was removed from AAU status that a school like ND can be courted, or have I been wrong this whole time? Or do dollars finally trump academics even in the B1G so that is why ND is so attractive?

When other schools such as Mizzou, Rutgers, Maryland or BC are mentioned, as they are here, I think that all but BC are worthy since they are AAU members. Unfortunately, if ND is being considered it can only be because of revenue and not academics and so these other schools simply don't bring the exposure and the concomitant increase in revenue for the BT Network so they become econonmically irrelevant.
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While it may be true that all AAU schools are good schools, it is not necessarily true that all good schools are in the AAU. ND is a great school. They compare favorably to most of the schools in the Big Ten in terms of academic rigor. Where they probably don't match up is in the degree of basic research, breadth of basic research, etc.

So while Big Ten schools may object to their admission because they bring less to the Committe on Institutional Cooperation (research Big Ten), they will not object because they have lower academic standards for undergraduates - as would be the case with Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, & others being bandied about.

Someone please jump in and correct me if I've misstated things.
 

GopherGod said:
You cannot seriously be judging a schools academics strictly by their AAU membership or lack there of. Notre Dame, Dartmouth, and Syracuse are all schools that are better academically than many if not most of the big ten schools yet they are not AAU members.
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AAU membership is largely about research (quantity and quality) and graduate education. http://www.aau.edu/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=10972

I don't know the numbers, but I'm guessing that Notre Dame, while an excellent school academically, doesn't have the breadth of research to be AAU...at least not yet. Same with BC.

One of the academic motivations for joining the B1G is also to become part of the CIC, a phenomenal collaborative organization consisting of the B1G schools plus the University of Chicago. Being part of CIC can actually help expand and enhance a university's research portfolio. http://www.cic.net/Home.aspx
 

Purple Book Cat said:
ESPN attorneys have already contacted the Big Ten regarding the content of this post. Again, I am in no way affiliated with the Big Ten conference nor should anything I write be considered credible in any context.

However, ESPN has unfairly used its bully pulpit to influence Texas stakeholders to prefer the PAC. The Big Ten feels that if the current trend of reporting that Texas only has interest in the PAC 12 continues, this would merit a major legal action against ESPN.
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Here is the original posters second post in this thread.
 

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