Ted Stieber leaving tea

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John Galt said:
And knowing all that, and that Terry desperately wanted to be here, they still passed.
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Well, now you're heading down towards the same logic Highwayman has on every thread. You can't debate a move by the staff because they know they best.

You're starting at the conclusion.

That said, I was just making a point that "just a body" can be a good thing.
 

die hard gopher said:
Sure, I do expect guys to step up in their absence but I'd rather they step up in addition to still having those guys.
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Yeah, I get that...good programs figure it out. Gophs have become a good program, and PJ's going to adjust this year to get the most out of the team. He's put together a good staff and this team is full of talented, tough playing guys. Plus with all that has happened recently, they definitely have a chip (or CRACK) on their shoulders and will want to prove something.

Seriously, call me crazy but I have this feeling that PJ might find himself going into that last game with a chance at winning the B1G West. If that's the case...Gameday, BABY!
 

btowngopher said:
What do you mean? He is capable of playing football to some degree, thus contributing?
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Oh well then every single person can contribute. It's strange you would just pick his name out. Noah Kuehn can contribute. Anyone can contribute. They are capable of playing football to some degree.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Oh well then every single person can contribute. It's strange you would just pick his name out. Noah Kuehn can contribute. Anyone can contribute. They are capable of playing football to some degree.
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Well Schmitz plays the same position as Terry, why are we assuming Terry would've been more of a contributor?
 

btowngopher said:
Well Schmitz plays the same position as Terry, why are we assuming Terry would've been more of a contributor?
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Umm well because he is a juco and has at least 45 pounds on Schmitz. Juco's are brought in to contribute right away, freshman offensive lineman aren't.
 


John Galt said:
Fleck wanted good players. He was happy to take guys the previous staff recruited when he thought they were good. See Handy Holly, Douglas, and Paulson as examples.

Gopher fans seriously have to be the most insecure group of people on the planet and feel like we should take any player with a pulse that wants to be here.
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Do you really think that Tracy Claeys and Bart Miller would have wanted him if he was nothing more than a player with a pulse?
 

btowngopher said:
Well Schmitz plays the same position as Terry, why are we assuming Terry would've been more of a contributor?
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Are you aware that Strieber was just as highly ranked as Schmitz when he was in high school?
 


die hard gopher said:
Umm well because he is a juco and has at least 45 pounds on Schmitz. Juco's are brought in to contribute right away, freshman offensive lineman aren't.
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I'm pretty sure their have been freshman contributor olineman before. Yes Terry had more weight, doesn't really mean anything. And yeah JUCOs are normally brought in to contribute right away, but he wasn't brought in.
 




btowngopher said:
Well Schmitz plays the same position as Terry, why are we assuming Terry would've been more of a contributor?
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It's not just an assumption out of the blue. He's older and more filled out than Schmitz. Miller and Claeys had quite a bit of success with three JuCo OL that were able to contribute right away last year. There aren't that many true freshman OL that are able to contribute right away.

So I'm not saying I know Terry would have been more ready, but statistically, the Terry "types" are more ready than the Schmitz "types" year 1. We are talking about a body for "year 1".

I also wouldn't want to waste a year of Schmitz just to be a body. This class is already huge, so we're going to have to play quite a few FR to even it out anyways, but I would like as many lineman to RS as possible. I guarantee you Schmitz would be better at 22/23 than at 18/19.
 

btowngopher said:
I'm pretty sure their have been freshman contributor olineman before. Yes Terry had more weight, doesn't really mean anything. And yeah JUCOs are normally brought in to contribute right away, but he wasn't brought in.
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Can we please not make these kinds of arguments? They are pointless. They are essentially saying "it was the right move because PJ made it". PJ can make mistakes. I guarantee you that he'll make quite a few of them (he's human). I think he's a good coach, so I think he'll make more excellent decisions than bad ones, but he is capable of making mistakes. Your argument is implying that Fleck can't and doesn't make mistakes. I hated it when people made similar arguments with Claeys and Kill too (if someone second guessed pulling Conner Mayes RS or Croft's RS, someone would chime in with an almost identical argument). It's nothing but hero worship.
 

mkAz said:
Umm, because you are counting on a similarly rated OL to come in and make an immediate contribution.
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I'm not counting on it on him providing depth, just saying there is no reason Fleck can't use him. Steiber is out of the picture, we are talking about who will fill his role. No one is arguing who is better between the three. Everyone is saying we needed Terry to provide depth, and I'm saying Schmitz can provide depth, not out of the blue, it's based on the fact that he was the only interior o-lineman that we signed, and nobody mentioned him as an option. I don't like the idea of burning a scholarship on a juco who projects to be a backup.
 



New coaching staff and system. They may have different standards or requirements for OL as far as body type, agility, etc. Size is not the only thing that matters. Under Mason, Gophers had very good o-lines - players were not huge, but followed system and played with great technique.

Sure, in a perfect world, you would want all 5 OL starters to be redshirt seniors - but it's not a perfect world, and the Gophers did not have a dominating OL last year - lots of running plays where RB was hit at the line. There is room for improvement.
 

We have to realize that PJ Fleck had to hire his coaches and staff, get into recruiting full throttle, make assessment of the current scholarship players, make decisions on Claey's recruits, their football program needs at each position, figure out where they are with the player appeals process all in the three and one-half weeks!

What I think happened is PJF underestimated the offensive line situation because he didn't know at that point in time how many linemen where healthy at the time he told Jimmie Terry his offer was being rescinded. Just speculating.
 


Bob_Loblaw said:
Well, now you're heading down towards the same logic Highwayman has on every thread. You can't debate a move by the staff because they know they best.

You're starting at the conclusion.

That said, I was just making a point that "just a body" can be a good thing.
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Please Bob, you can say anything derogatory about me, just don't compare me to highwayman...

I suppose that I could make the argument that we should have taken any JUCO lineman that would have come here so we could have a body. That's basically what the Jimmy Terry crowd is saying.
 

mkAz said:
Do you really think that Tracy Claeys and Bart Miller would have wanted him if he was nothing more than a player with a pulse?
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It's very possible, we were desperate due to the lack of upperclassman. No other P-5 team was interested. Remind me, how many NFL o-lineman have we had in the last 6 years?
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
Can we please not make these kinds of arguments? They are pointless. They are essentially saying "it was the right move because PJ made it". PJ can make mistakes. I guarantee you that he'll make quite a few of them (he's human). I think he's a good coach, so I think he'll make more excellent decisions than bad ones, but he is capable of making mistakes. Your argument is implying that Fleck can't and doesn't make mistakes. I hated it when people made similar arguments with Claeys and Kill too (if someone second guessed pulling Conner Mayes RS or Croft's RS, someone would chime in with an almost identical argument). It's nothing but hero worship.
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Terry would have been the easiest recruit to land in history for Fleck. But he wasn't interested. Why aren't you equally upset by letting Kittrell, Hawes, Holmes etc leaving? They also could have been mistakes by him.
 

hungan1 said:
We have to realize that PJ Fleck had to hire his coaches and staff, get into recruiting full throttle, make assessment of the current scholarship players, make decisions on Claey's recruits, their football program needs at each position, figure out where they are with the player appeals process all in the three and one-half weeks!

What I think happened is PJF underestimated the offensive line situation because he didn't know at that point in time how many linemen where healthy at the time he told Jimmie Terry his offer was being rescinded. Just speculating.
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What freshman o-lineman should we have passed on to bring in Jimmy Terry?
 

hungan1 said:
We have to realize that PJ Fleck had to hire his coaches and staff, get into recruiting full throttle, make assessment of the current scholarship players, make decisions on Claey's recruits, their football program needs at each position, figure out where they are with the player appeals process all in the three and one-half weeks!

What I think happened is PJF underestimated the offensive line situation because he didn't know at that point in time how many linemen where healthy at the time he told Jimmie Terry his offer was being rescinded. Just speculating.
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I think some of you are over estimating the lack of depth. There are players on the roster that no one has even mentioned that could contribute. Matt Leidner and Quinn Oselund for example.
 

John Galt said:
It's very possible, we were desperate due to the lack of upperclassman. No other P-5 team was interested. Remind me, how many NFL o-lineman have we had in the last 6 years?
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Fleck is about to have 3 in two years, so I'll trust his judgment. I don't see how taking a juco for back up depth is going to progress the program.
 

btowngopher said:
I think some of you are over estimating the lack of depth. There are players on the roster that no one has even mentioned that could contribute. Matt Leidner and Quinn Oselund for example.
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Matt Leidner graduated and is done playing football.
 



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