Shama: U to priortize diversity in search

[MrGopher]

Just no Asians please.

Oh, come on.... Asians are just fine. I'll be fine as long as it's not a Ginger.

 

[Stargenes]

I can only talk about diversity from my experience. So

Yes, being preferred before doing or saying anything can be burdensome I suppose.

 

[monk10]

It ain't easy always being told I can't understand an issue, but I do my best to keep taking it.

 

[Stargenes]

Agreed. My only concern here, and I think it should be Dungy's concern, is that there is "consideration" and then there's "consideration." Bring in the best coaches from all heritages and seriously consider the best ones regardless of race, creed, and religion. I worry that so much of the "diversity in search and hire" is simply window-dressing and parading diverse candidates with no chance of getting the job simply reinforces that perception. Dungy was "Mr. Rooney Rule" for about half a decade and he should understand this better than anyone.

Yes but the unfortunate reality, most of the football clubs would never even interview black coaches but for the rule. The power structure thinks and builds from within its circle of resources to which most black coaches had little to no access. Rules and policies make people get outside their box. DIVERSITY IS GOOD; AND IT HELPS YOU WIN TOO!

 

[Rosemountian]

Jesus H Christ

Why don't we just bring in norm Chow now?

 

[Stargenes]

It ain't easy always being told I can't understand an issue, but I do my best to keep taking it.

Not sure if you are opposed to continuing education, but you may consider taking a debate class; you learn to discount or discard such claims very quickly. Perspectives can vary greatly, and which one wins may depend on the crowd or judge.

 

[Iceland12]

Well, you may think so but let me point out a couple of issues that need to be addressed as well.

While The U should be commended for its diversity of the staff, note that none of the African Americans were granted true leadership positions. Folks on this board made sure to emphasize which coordinator of the co offensive and defensive coordinators were truely calling the shots; and we only need to look as far as which was being paid the most to confirm same. While Coach Cross was the Associate Head Coach, he was passed over for the interim position when Brewster was fired. Thus, opportunity to assend is really denied. Note that Coach Hammock only got a true opportunity to be an Offensive Coordinator with play-calling responsibility when Horton was given the Interim Head Coach position. Out of all of these experienced coaches on Brewster's staff, none of them were capable of serving as a true coordinator? I think not. Even the special teams coordinator position was given to Butler.

The truth sometimes is a bitter pill.

Particularly when you choose to ignore it:

McKinley Boston, the Gophers athletic director during the early 1990s, is one of the few African-Americans ever to hold the position of athletic director at a Big Ten school. And two of Minnesota’s last three men’s basketball coaches have been African-Americans, Clem Haskins and Tubby Smith.


Those aren't leadership positions? Or better yet "ignore those guys, I'm strictly talking football".

 

[monk10]

Not sure if you are opposed to continuing education, but you may consider taking a debate class; you learn to discount or discard such claims very quickly. Perspectives can vary greatly, and which on wins may depend on the crowd or judge.

As being a former debater I entered this thread already with a losing hand. I'm white. I acknowledge that. Now you are trying to imply I'm stupid too? That maybe the case because I happen to believe in diversity despite always getting slapped in the face instead of a hand shake for reaching out.

I have another cheek. Go for it. I can't change my skin color, sorry about that.

 

[Silvio]

Sometimes making a hire with diversity can be a double edge sword. Look at Ron Prince @ KSU, he was a coach on the fast track but was promoted to head coach at a BCS AQ school too quickly and it didn't work out for him. Will he get another shot to be a head coach? The point is that you need to hire the right fit for each specific opening, not necessarily pound a square peg in a round hole.

This is my main concern about having Tony Dungy to heavily involved in the process. I feel he might be more concerned with advancing opportunities for minority coaches ( a noble cause well worth his effort) than finding the right hire for the University.

 

[Great Plains Gopher]

Including candidates of color and varying ethnicity is one thing, hiring them for that reason is another. The search should be colorblind - if there's a black Rockne out there, hire him; if there's a white Rockne, hire him. Minnesota (u, state and businesses) has a national reputation for affirmative action hiring, the benefit of which has gone mostly to white Minnesota women who were already married to successful men - the rich got richer. It's a feel good thing that should have nothing to do with this hire, unless they go for the first woman DI coach!

 

[monk10]

Including candidates of color and varying ethnicity is one thing, hiring them for that reason is another. The search should be colorblind - if there's a black Rockne out there, hire him; if there's a white Rockne, hire him. Minnesota (u, state and businesses) has a national reputation for affirmative action hiring, the benefit of which has gone mostly to white Minnesota women who were already married to successful men - the rich got richer. It's a feel good thing that should have nothing to do with this hire, unless they go for the first woman DI coach!

I totally disagree about this colorblind concept. Color is important. Diversity is difficult, but trying to dismiss someones color, background, heritage is insulting to what that person brings to the table.

The one reason why I'm not as concerned about this issue as at other places is that I think* they are actively giving it its proper place.

*note: I can't really say because I don't sit in the room with these people.

 

[ruralgopher]

When I was in college a professor posed a question on diversity:

Which group of 3 is more diverse:

a black kid, a white kid, and an asian kid who grew up in the same suburban cul de sac; or the white kid from that cul de sac with a white kid from a rural community and a white kid from MPLS?

 

[Stargenes]

Particularly when you choose to ignore it:

McKinley Boston, the Gophers athletic director during the early 1990s, is one of the few African-Americans ever to hold the position of athletic director at a Big Ten school. And two of Minnesota’s last three men’s basketball coaches have been African-Americans, Clem Haskins and Tubby Smith.


Those aren't leadership positions? Or better yet "ignore those guys, I'm strictly talking football".

Wow, you took the words right out of my mouth. Really, you are mixing apples with oranges. I am not criticizing The U's overall diversity policy for hiring in all of their sports. I just point out a rather strange situation with regard to the distribution of responsibilities on the football staff over the past four years. The dearth of leadership position distribution to minority coaches, particularly given the number on the staff, is quite concerning. This is the type of title distribution without opportunity to manage the relevant responsibilities that prevent fair access to assend to true coordinator and HC positions. So when the opportunity to become an interim head coach presents, Leadership claims, you do not have the necessary experience. Coach MacDonald left because Brewster stepped over him and went out to hire a rookie coordinator, Fisch. Looks like what may be or have been a developing pattern with a clear disparate impact on the minority staff. But maybe not. Just pointing out reality.

 

[minngg]

Just hire the best person. The best person has many qualities. Who in their right mind would disagree with this?

 

[Stargenes]

When I was in college a professor posed a question on diversity:

Which group of 3 is more diverse:

a black kid, a white kid, and an asian kid who grew up in the same suburban cul de sac; or the white kid from that cul de sac with a white kid from a rural community and a white kid from MPLS?

It depends on what kind of diversity you are attempting to foster.

 

[Rosemountian]

When I was in college a professor posed a question on diversity:

Which group of 3 is more diverse:

a black kid, a white kid, and an asian kid who grew up in the same suburban cul de sac; or the white kid from that cul de sac with a white kid from a rural community and a white kid from MPLS?

That depends on if you are talking about racial diversity or economic diversity.

 

[Stargenes]

Just hire the best person. The best person has many qualities. Who in their right mind would disagree with this?

Yeah but didn't someone think that Brewster was the best person at one point?

 

[minngg]

Yeah but didn't someone think that Brewster was the best person at one point?

What does this have to do with the new coach?

 

[Mngoph79]

NO IRISH APPLY

To paraphrase Mel Brooks "…we'll take anyone with one exception – we won’t take the Irish - Ah horsemanure…everyone."

Seriously. People born after 1950 or so have about had it with all this group identity politics. The majority judges others by the content of their character. But it seems there are a whole lot of people who have a different agenda and will always interject race/ethnicity/gender/etc. into every issue. Might have something to do with keeping a political base agitated.

Something we all can agree on -- let's get the best coach possible!

 

[Stargenes]

Yeah but didn't someone think that Brewster was the best person at one point?

What does this have to do with the new coach?

Well, let me put it like this; if you are trying to figure out who is the best person for the job and the best person never got into the room for consideration, how can he get the job?

 

[Stargenes]

NO IRISH APPLY

To paraphrase Mel Brooks "…we'll take anyone with one exception – we won’t take the Irish - Ah horsemanure…everyone."

Seriously. People born after 1950 or so have about had it with all this group identity politics. The majority judges others by the content of their character. But it seems there are a whole lot of people who have a different agenda and will always interject race/ethnicity/gender/etc. into every issue. Might have something to do with keeping a political base agitated.

Something we all can agree on -- let's get the best coach possible!

A bit quixotic your comment may be, but I can agree that we should get the best coach possible.

 

[GopherFan75]

Oh, come on.... Asians are just fine. I'll be fine as long as it's not a Ginger.

Yeah enough people are laughing at us already we don't need a ginger coach.
________
Yamaha Dx5 History

 

[ruralgopher]

It depends on what kind of diversity you are attempting to foster.

That depends on if you are talking about racial diversity or economic diversity.

It seems to me that if you are trying to foster the concept that diverse life experiences bring different viewpoints, there is no question. If you are trying to 'foster diversity' so you can put an X in a box on some checksheet, than the answer may be diferent.

 

[Rosemountian]

Here is a situation:
Two kids are adopted by a family. They go to the same school, they are in the same grade, they have the same last name, they have the same family life. One of them is a black child and one is white.

Is anyone really going to argue that they probably had the same life experience? Skin color plays a larger role in society than a lot of people like to admit.


Now am I advocating hiring a black coach for the sake of having a minority coach? No
Am I saying the U of M should risk its football program for the sake of diminishing institutional racial inequality? No
But to make an argument that there is no actual diversity benefit other than putting an X in a box you are just being ignorant.

 

[60's Guy]

interim guy

Do you think it will help Horton's resume to have to say he was the interim head coach at Minnesota. Given the constraints of timing, practice availability, sensitivity to seniors, weighing the responsibility to the future, depression, and an avalanche of negative issues...I'm not too sure anybody raises their hand and says "Please, give me the opportunity to be the Gopher interim coach."

If the timing was two weeks before the season....now it is an opportunity to clamor for. But, I don't see the Gopher situation as one that would have helped someone's resume.

Could someone have done better than Horton? Likely so, but highly unlikely they become a serious candidate for the permanent job given the circumstances.

My point: maybe the minority guys were bright enough to turn it down or Maturi looked at Horton's losing streak and said, "We got the perfect man for the job."

 

[Klondike Gopher Fan]

Wow, you took the words right out of my mouth. Really, you are mixing apples with oranges. I am not criticizing The U's overall diversity policy for hiring in all of their sports. I just point out a rather strange situation with regard to the distribution of responsibilities on the football staff over the past four years. The dearth of leadership position distribution to minority coaches, particularly given the number on the staff, is quite concerning. This is the type of title distribution without opportunity to manage the relevant responsibilities that prevent fair access to assend to true coordinator and HC positions. So when the opportunity to become an interim head coach presents, Leadership claims, you do not have the necessary experience. Coach MacDonald left because Brewster stepped over him and went out to hire a rookie coordinator, Fisch. Looks like what may be or have been a developing pattern with a clear disparate impact on the minority staff. But maybe not. Just pointing out reality.

You are a fool. As it sets today; not counting trainers and video geeks, the FB staff is 35% minority. How does that compare to the faculty/employee base at the U, other sports and the population of the state?

 

[ruralgopher]

But to make an argument that there is no actual diversity benefit other than putting an X in a box you are just being ignorant.

I didn't say that there was not diversity benefit, what I said was that the concept of diverse life experiences is more than skin deep. I was unaware that having a different viewpoint made me ignorant.

 

[Stargenes]

As being a former debater I entered this thread already with a losing hand. I'm white. I acknowledge that. Now you are trying to imply I'm stupid too? That maybe the case because I happen to believe in diversity despite always getting slapped in the face instead of a hand shake for reaching out.

I have another cheek. Go for it. I can't change my skin color, sorry about that.

I frankly do not see why your being white has anything to do with the discussion on this thread. Why do you feel like a victim here? It almost seems like you cut and pasted your comments from another thread. Please know that I wish that you share your opinions here freely. And whether you are actually white or not really does not matter. Love, Peace and Happiness Bro.

 

[Rosemountian]

Do you think it will help Horton's resume to have to say he was the interim head coach at Minnesota. Given the constraints of timing, practice availability, sensitivity to seniors, weighing the responsibility to the future, depression, and an avalanche of negative issues...I'm not too sure anybody raises their hand and says "Please, give me the opportunity to be the Gopher interim coach."

If the timing was two weeks before the season....now it is an opportunity to clamor for. But, I don't see the Gopher situation as one that would have helped someone's resume.

Could someone have done better than Horton? Likely so, but highly unlikely they become a serious candidate for the permanent job given the circumstances.

My point: maybe the minority guys were bright enough to turn it down or Maturi looked at Horton's losing streak and said, "We got the perfect man for the job."

Definitely doesn't help or hurt his resume, he already has Head Coaching experience, so it doesn't add anything. He will never be a candidate for anything higher than a coordinator again, so it doesn't hurt his resume either.

If you are a guy looking to be a head coach somewhere, the experience of being the interm coach would help you regardless of record. If the team showed that you did not lose it, it would definitely help your resume.

I personally do not think anyone on the current staff could have been better than Horton is. It is an extremely difficult situation with an extremely difficult schedule. If Horton would have taken after the Purdue game and won 3 games, he still wouldn't have been a candidate.

 

[Iceland12]

Do you think it will help Horton's resume to have to say he was the interim head coach at Minnesota. Given the constraints of timing, practice availability, sensitivity to seniors, weighing the responsibility to the future, depression, and an avalanche of negative issues...I'm not too sure anybody raises their hand and says "Please, give me the opportunity to be the Gopher interim coach."

If the timing was two weeks before the season....now it is an opportunity to clamor for. But, I don't see the Gopher situation as one that would have helped someone's resume.

Could someone have done better than Horton? Likely so, but highly unlikely they become a serious candidate for the permanent job given the circumstances.

My point: maybe the minority guys were bright enough to turn it down or Maturi looked at Horton's losing streak and said, "We got the perfect man for the job."

An even simpler explanation? Horton had Head Coaching experience and you're right, Maturi was just looking for someone to finish the year.

Play Gray, throw the damn ball and don't finish 1-11.