Rivals Class of 2008 Centers:Ralph Sampson III rated #12, #2 statistically=outperform

[NCAAGophers]

Due to Sampson's injury the vast majority of these guys are averaging MORE minutes than Ralph this season. So are you taking that in account on his behalf? Of course you aren't. None of that changes the overall stats, however, which clearly show who's on top.

I didn't ask who would you rather have. That was not part of my analysis. I clearly showed that based on his ranking coming out of HS, which was 12th, Ralph overperformed. What is inaccurate is to take a player who is barely playing and multiply his stats to assume a 40 min rate. That never produces accurate results

FINALLY, I am not interested in extrapolating results. I said that Ralph has had the most productive college career and he has. He never played 30 min a game like these guys have. Look, I'm done. The facts are on the web, at the athletic department. You guys keep trying to bend numbers to discredit him and even with the most ridiculous method, he is still solidly in the top ten. Ralph was a good player and one the best centers to ever wear a Gophers uniform. Argue with the history books, you delusional, sad, poor excuse for Gopher fans. Wish we had nankivil, berggren? please. Berggren was scoring 1 and 2pts a game when RSIII was playing in the tourney.

Pure, unadulterated lies and bias against one of our own. He deserves better and has performed better. Worst fans ever.

 

[GophersInIowa]

Alright because I don't want to study for my 2 tests this week I put this together quickly. I chose Jeff Withey just because he was one of the players that RSIII was being compared to. I honestly didn't look at any other players' stats. On a per minute basis (With Freshman year on top and only 3 years for Withey who is a RS Junior):

Points/min
Withey:
.4333
.371
.387

RSIII:
.303
.320
.351
.338

Reb/min
Withey:
.46667
.2903
.2647

RSIII:
.2019
.2266
.1862
.1966

Blks/min
Withey:
.1333
.1167
.1345

RSIII:
.07212
.0625
.06897
.05556

So statistically, RSIII never reached, in his best year, the efficiency in any of the 3 major categories of Withey in his WORST year. So this can easily boil down to what constitutes a "better career". Is it pure numbers or efficiency in their role? I believe a more successful career, at least in terms of being beneficial to the team, would be about efficiency. Maybe others disagree, and that's fine.

I'm not going to get in a pissing match with you because there really isn't a right or wrong answer with all of this. But Withey's "efficiency" numbers for the first two years (especially his freshmen year) have no business being compared to Sampson's. He played a total of 45 minutes his first year, and just 162 his second. I'm fine with comparing numbers per minute played when both players actually are part of the regular rotation, but counting numbers from a year when Withey only played in mop up duties doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. It's like saying Engen Nurumbi was one of the most efficient scorers for the Gophers in 06-07.

It's fine if you or anyone thinks Withey is better than Sampson, but I don't think you can use Withey's first two years can be used to help that argument.

 

[BMEnGopher]

I would rather have a player who is solid for all four years than a guy that gives me nothing for three years.

I think there is a big difference between a player who gave the team nothing for 2 years and someone who was behind a player who RSIII likely would have been behind in the depth chart as well. If I can put a backup in for 3 minutes and he'll get one basket while the even better player rests vs a person who you have in for 28 and gets 5, which one has a more positive impact on the game for his team? I would say the former contributed better value to the team than the latter. Being an efficient backup is hardly giving the team "nothing".

 

[BMEnGopher]

I'm not going to get in a pissing match with you because there really isn't a right or wrong answer with all of this. But Withey's "efficiency" numbers for the first two years (especially his freshmen year) have no business being compared to Sampson's. He played a total of 45 minutes his first year, and just 162 his second. I'm fine with comparing numbers per minute played when both players actually are part of the regular rotation, but counting numbers from a year when Withey only played in mop up duties doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. It's like saying Engen Nurumbi was one of the most efficient scorers for the Gophers in 06-07.

It's fine if you or anyone thinks Withey is better than Sampson, but I don't think you can use Withey's first two years can be used to help that argument.

I've already openly stated that the number are skewed from low minutes, although I don't think that the sophmore year minutes are too terrible, with 6 min/g. You can tell there is a skewing with the freshmen year numbers with the really high averages, as I've already admitted. I'm not even saying Withey is better than RSIII, and quite frankly I don't care who is better. I'm merely saying it's not nearly as conclusive as NCAAGophers seems to believe and you can find stats that support other players being better than RSIII. I am fully willing to admit these don't tell the whole story, but neither does just stating RSIII's career #s and saying he is the 2nd best producing center from the class. He probably has more minutes than every other center from the class as well, due to necessity. But even if you are considering only this year, his numbers are better than Ralph's at any point, and he contributed when needed to before.

 

[coolhandgopher]

Look, I'm done.

I really hope so. A few years ago, there was a poster on the board from Duluth who was so opposed to any criticism of Rick Rickert and became so obnoxious and condescending towards anyone with a different viewpoint that he seemingly invited more criticism towards Rickert. You remind me so much of this poster.

As RSIII's career was winding down, the board was generally in a respectful mood of his contributions to the program. Go read From the Barn's blog and also read the thread where Chip Scoggins came under much criticism for his column on RSIII.

Time and again, people have agreed with you on this board that RSIII's numbers are second only to Zeller's among class of '08 centers; time and again, posters have recognized the positive citizen he was for the Gophers while here his entire four years.

Yet, when anyone tries to introduce a more nuanced conversation beyond the pure numbers, you explode and engage in personal attacks against their intelligence and allegiance to the Gophers. When it gets pointed out that RSIII's numbers declined across the board during his senior year, you veer away from your beloved facts to engage in speculation about how severe his ankle sprain was and how it kept him from putting up bigger numbers. You certainly ignore logic altogether when you trump RSIII's career numbers but insist that Withey or Sims or others superior seasons do not matter because you're talking about entire careers, yet at no point do you acknowledge that based off of Sampson's freshman season it was reasonable to expect steady progress and better stats as he became more seasoned rather than a regression?

On the flip side of all this, I increasingly get the feeling that I am arguing with one of the legends of college basketball; or if not him, the woman that he conceived RSIII with.

 

[zambam]

Due to Sampson's injury the vast majority of these guys are averaging MORE minutes than Ralph this season. So are you taking that in account on his behalf? Of course you aren't. None of that changes the overall stats, however, which clearly show who's on top.

I didn't ask who would you rather have. That was not part of my analysis. I clearly showed that based on his ranking coming out of HS, which was 12th, Ralph overperformed. What is inaccurate is to take a player who is barely playing and multiply his stats to assume a 40 min rate. That never produces accurate results

FINALLY, I am not interested in extrapolating results. I said that Ralph has had the most productive college career and he has. He never played 30 min a game like these guys have. Look, I'm done. The facts are on the web, at the athletic department. You guys keep trying to bend numbers to discredit him and even with the most ridiculous method, he is still solidly in the top ten. Ralph was a good player and one the best centers to ever wear a Gophers uniform. Argue with the history books, you delusional, sad, poor excuse for Gopher fans. Wish we had nankivil, berggren? please. Berggren was scoring 1 and 2pts a game when RSIII was playing in the tourney.

Pure, unadulterated lies and bias against one of our own. He deserves better and has performed better. Worst fans ever.

You don't understand statistics do you? The stats point that per minute played, Ralph was not as productive. Of course a stat that is per minute takes into account players that play less, that's why it is per minute. And none of this changes the fact that overall stats will never tel the entire picture.

My "would you rather have" argument was trying to explain why looking at more than just the overall stats. A player that needs 100,000 shots to score 1,000 points is not nearly as effective of a player as someone who needs 1,000 shots to score 1,000 points (these numbers are exaggerations to help explain my point, no real stats). And I wasn't using Stat per 40 minutes, BME used stat per minute which gauges how effective a player was per minute played. Maybe later this week I'll figure out the PER of each player so we can compare that as well.

I'm not extrapolating any results and I have never said Ralph wasn't productive. Sure, he never played 30 minutes a game, but he still played more total minutes. The facts are also out there that the argument could be made that a more effective player would have had better stats in the same scenario. That is what is going on here. Nobody is denying that Ralph had a solid career, in fact most posters on here have actually said Ralph has been one of the best Centers in Gopher history. A small number of posters actually say they wanted Berggren or anyone like that.

Seriously, you have a problem with people being objective and comparing the numbers of two players saying that the more efficient player would have had better stats playing more minutes? Really, objectivity is "lies and bias" against one of our own. Nobody is saying Ralph sucked or anything like that. You are the one that straight up started attacking the opinions of people that disagreed with you while you were looking at the scenario from a limited view. YOU CAN'T EFFECTIVELY GAUGE A PLAYER'S CAREER WITHOUT INCLUDING EFFICIENCY! I'm sorry but I'd rather have a player score 1,000 points in 1,000 shots than 2,000 in 100,000. THAT is what you are ignoring. I love Ralph as a Gopher but viewing the scenario objectively it is easy to argue against what you are saying because you are being downright fallacious in ignoring a large part of the scenario.

 

[BMEnGopher]

Due to Sampson's injury the vast majority of these guys are averaging MORE minutes than Ralph this season. So are you taking that in account on his behalf? Of course you aren't. None of that changes the overall stats, however, which clearly show who's on top.

I didn't ask who would you rather have. That was not part of my analysis. I clearly showed that based on his ranking coming out of HS, which was 12th, Ralph overperformed. What is inaccurate is to take a player who is barely playing and multiply his stats to assume a 40 min rate. That never produces accurate results

FINALLY, I am not interested in extrapolating results. I said that Ralph has had the most productive college career and he has. He never played 30 min a game like these guys have. Look, I'm done. The facts are on the web, at the athletic department. You guys keep trying to bend numbers to discredit him and even with the most ridiculous method, he is still solidly in the top ten. Ralph was a good player and one the best centers to ever wear a Gophers uniform. Argue with the history books, you delusional, sad, poor excuse for Gopher fans. Wish we had nankivil, berggren? please. Berggren was scoring 1 and 2pts a game when RSIII was playing in the tourney.

Pure, unadulterated lies and bias against one of our own. He deserves better and has performed better. Worst fans ever.

So much of this is just laughable hyperbole. Do you take into account that some of the other players actually had competition for playing time? No. 6 games won't skew season averages per game that much (and obviously not at all when he doesn't play).

I didn't multiply stats to assume 40 minute rates, I multiplied to assume RSIII's playing rates. I'm not trying to "discredit him" I'm merely showing that there are many things that can be proven by statistics and totals don't tell the whole story.

"He never played 30 min a game like these guys have." Well he did play 29min/g as a junior. Which is more than Zeller's career high (28.1 as a junior) or Withey (23.8 this year). In fact I'd be interested if you can find me one player who played more than Ralph's 29 in any of their seasons.

"Due to Sampson's injury the vast majority of these guys are averaging MORE minutes than Ralph this season." No, they aren't, not significantly anyway. Withey is averaging a whopping .4 more minutes per game. Hardly enough to have a huge effect on per game averages, Zeller averaging 3.3 more, Berggren averaging 3 more. None of those should really create the separating from Ralph that they have.

And it pains me to have you not thing I am a good fan. I'll be cheering for them to succeed every game, as I cheered for RSIII every game, although from my living room as I don't get student tickets (don't feel like paying that much when half the games are against UMD and the like). Whether you think I am a good fan because I like to look at things through the big picture and not just an elementary total number really affect my life....well, not at all. I've been a fan since I was little, when my dad's main punishment after getting in trouble was not letting me watch gopher basketball games on TV because he knew it would keep me in line. I've been a fan as a student, and will be a fan as an alumni. But I'll always be honest in how I see things.

 

[NCAAGophers]

When it gets pointed out that RSIII's numbers declined across the board during his senior year, you veer away from your beloved facts to engage in speculation about how severe his ankle sprain was and how it kept him from putting up bigger numbers.

From the 02/27/12 edition of the Star Tribune: http://www.startribune.com/sports/twins/140519833.html

He (Tubby) added: "We knew it was going to be tough because we had two kids that hadn't practiced in a couple days. Ralph [Sampson] hadn't practiced before the Michigan State game, so he's hobbling around with a bad ankle.

Sampson missed or played reduced minutes after he hurt his ankle in the following games and, as shown above, it has continually bothered him:

Mount St Mary's, DNP
Depaul, 15 min
ISU, 10 min
Dayton, 10 min
VT, DNP
USC, DNP
ASU, 19 min

and he still isn't fully recovered. That's the truth. Not my opinion. Read the above until it sinks in. All public information no spin.

I never said the he was unquestionably better. I said that his career numbers are better. You can't counter that by saying someone is playing better right now. it's apples and oranges.

Jeremy Lin is playing better than Jason Kidd right now. Does that mean that he had a better career? Of course not. Two separate arguments.

I also love how you guys conveniently say that you have to adjust Ralph's numbers down because he played more as a freshman, soph, and jr but while you admit he's playing less minutes this year, you have no interest in saying that might be a factor in his stats being down. Or that according to kenpom, the Big Ten is the slowest conference in the NCAA, which I don't know, might affect stats/poss. You compare his numbers this year to centers who are playing more minutes in mid major and downtrodden conferences like the Pac 12. How would these guys do against Leonard, Payne/Nix and Sullinger?. Then you lie and say Berggren was on the bench because there was "soo much talent in Wisco" like Nankivil or Krabbenhoft would have kept Ralph, Paul Carter or even Iverson on the bench. You do know that we routinely beat Wisco and this year was the first time that Wisco has beat us at home since before Ralph came.

Did any of you watch Kansas play over the last four years? Withey was not playing meaningful minutes in crunch time. It's a bogus argument.

Berggren averaging 3 more. None of those should really create the separating from Ralph that they have.

Prime example of randomly throwing sh$t at the wall and hoping you don't get called on it. Berg has separation on Ralph? Really?

Berg: 27.6 min, 10.4 pts, 0.6 asts, 4.9 rpg, 1.6 blks, 45% FG
RSIII: 23.5 min, 8.0pts, 1.9 asts, 4.7 rpgs, 1.3 blks, 47%FG (how is Berg more efficient smart guy?)

That is not what I would call separation. It's a dead heat. And whether or not you guys want to admit, all post players get a production boost from playing with a pro caliber PG like Jordan Taylor. Ralph put up over 10pts, 5 rebs, 1.5 ast and 2 blks in his junior which Berg is so what does that say?Ralph's numbers have been impacted by games where he barely played due to his ankle injury. Truth. And Ralph dominated him the last time that they played for all of you fans of recent production only. Berg does not pass the eye test for me. Weak post presence. Slow. Oh, and his career numbers are almost double what Berg's are. And yes, I think Ralph would have played over the great Nankivil and Krabbenhoft. Give me a break


I am not attacking everyone. Some posters are reasonable. You might prefer a style a play that I dont, that's fine. I am not going to let someone lie ab and try to trash Ralph just because of personal bias or what they perceive to be his character.

What upsets me is when people start extrapolating and lying to make their case. If you listened to some of the local media and some of the posters here, you would think Sampson is a "bust," but that is clearly not accurate. He definitely had a solid career and will go down as one of the best centers the Gophers have ever had.

Leave you with Tubby quote from Sun

On Ralph Sampson III and Trevor Mbakwe's senior day:
“We’re really excited and happy to be able to send Ralph and Trevor off with a win. These kids have been very good for our program. Ralph’s consistency and continuity, he’s been the guy that’s been here the whole way, all four years. We wish he could have seen more postseason play, but unfortunately things happen to the team that put you in these situations where you’re not at your best because of a loss of a player, an injury or a transfer. Through it all, Ralph has been very positive and very consistent and I appreciate that. That is my fault, when we have people who don’t surround guys with the right people. There’s nothing you can do about injuries but there are other things we can get better at. Through it all, I appreciate what Ralph has done. It’s always a treat when you coach guys who do the things you ask them to do on and off the court. I have always been able to sleep comfortably knowing that I wasn’t going to have any issues with Ralph Sampson and I knew he was going to come to work every day and do it the right way and the best way he knows.

"

Class act, RSIII. Hope you and the boys pull off a nice run in the BTT. Go Gophers!

 

[zambam]

I like how the only point where you actually coherently respond to something I said is the part about attacking people, but you were the initial one being unreasonable by calling people out on their knowledge of basketball, whether they watched the game, whether they've actually watched any basketball, and judged how good of fans they were.

 

[GophersInIowa]

I've already openly stated that the number are skewed from low minutes, although I don't think that the sophmore year minutes are too terrible, with 6 min/g.

That actually doesn't tell the whole story. He played 6 min/g in the games he played in. But there were 12 games in which he didn't even appear in. So if you take into account the additional games, his average was really about 4 min/g.

I'm not even saying Withey is better than RSIII, and quite frankly I don't care who is better. I'm merely saying it's not nearly as conclusive as NCAAGophers seems to believe and you can find stats that support other players being better than RSIII. I am fully willing to admit these don't tell the whole story, but neither does just stating RSIII's career #s and saying he is the 2nd best producing center from the class. He probably has more minutes than every other center from the class as well, due to necessity. But even if you are considering only this year, his numbers are better than Ralph's at any point, and he contributed when needed to before.

I agree.

 

[EG#9]

I just want to post in this thread due to the very real possibility that it was started by one of the top college C's of all time. I agree with most of Coolhand's points on this matter. I'd also like to throw Henry Sims of Georgetown in to the conversation as he is averaging 11.1 points, 5.6 rebounds, 3.4 assists, and 1.4 blocks in 26.8 minutes a game.

 

[NCAAGophers]

Again we are discussing career, not just this year. Sims was considered a bust until this year. Ralph has outperformed Sims every year but this year and it's not even close. I would rather have Ralph for four years than one slightly more productive year from Sims. Sims is avg 4.5 pts and 3.0 rpg over his 4 years. Ralph's averages are almost double. Get real.

This isn't a thread about which center had the best year. You guys are discussing something completely different. one year does not make a career. Get it? Jeremy Lin is outplaying Jason Kidd, has Jeremy Lin had a better career? No. Deron Williams scored 57 points last night, and Lebron only had 23. Is Deron Williams better? I am sure that there are guys that are sitting on benches in college and the NBA that have better PER numbers than alot of star players. does that make them better? Not necessarily.

None of these arguments change the fact that RSIII has outperformed these guys over the course of his college career. Career=more than one year, game etc.. Yeesh. As Gophers fans, I would think that wouldn't be so upsetting to some of you.

 

[EG#9]

Again we are discussing career, not just this year. Sims was considered a bust until this year. Ralph has outperformed Sims every year but this year and it's not even close. I would rather have Ralph for four years than one slightly more productive year from Sims. Sims is avg 4.5 pts and 3.0 rpg over his 4 years. Ralph's averages are almost double. Get real.

This isn't a thread about which center had the best year. You guys are discussing something completely different. one year does not make a career. Get it? Jeremy Lin is outplaying Jason Kidd, has Jeremy Lin had a better career? No. Deron Williams scored 57 points last night, and Lebron only had 23. Is Deron Williams better? I am sure that there are guys that are sitting on benches in college and the NBA that have better PER numbers than alot of star players. does that make them better? Not necessarily.

None of these arguments change the fact that RSIII has outperformed these guys over the course of his college career. Career=more than one year, game etc.. Yeesh. As Gophers fans, I would think that wouldn't be so upsetting to some of you.

Sure Ralph has had a better 4 year career, but the Lin/Kidd comparison doesn't hold any water. Jason is nearly 40 years old and is a future hall of famer who just last year played a key role on the NBA champs. Lin is 15 years younger and has played well for a month or so. Sims and Sampson are the same age, and the arrow on one seems to be pointing up, while the arrow on the other seems to be pointing down.

Why do you believe Ralph did not improve statistically through his four years at Minnesota? http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/41568/ralph-sampson-iii

 

[Gopher10]

Can I ask you something, NCAAGophers? Stats aside, no matter if they are in the NBA, College, or where-ever they are. Where would you rank Ralph among those on this list, "Right Now"? Just out of curiosity..

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Due to Sampson's injury the vast majority of these guys are averaging MORE minutes than Ralph this season. So are you taking that in account on his behalf? Of course you aren't. None of that changes the overall stats, however, which clearly show who's on top.

So when we analyze who is having a better season we should take into account the marginal difference in MPG between Ralph and some of those players, but we shouldn't take that into account when looking at career stats? LOL.

Pure, unadulterated lies and bias against one of our own. He deserves better and has performed better. Worst fans ever.

Lies? huh? Who has lied about him?

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

This isn't a thread about which center had the best year. You guys are discussing something completely different. one year does not make a career. Get it? Jeremy Lin is outplaying Jason Kidd, has Jeremy Lin had a better career? No. Deron Williams scored 57 points last night, and Lebron only had 23. Is Deron Williams better? I am sure that there are guys that are sitting on benches in college and the NBA that have better PER numbers than alot of star players. does that make them better? Not necessarily.

.

How about you compare people who are the same age?

How about this one...who is better, Wes Johnson or Gordon Hayward, who has had the better career?
Wes Johnson career stats: 925 points, 341 rebs, 176 assists, 73 blks, 76 steals
Gordon Hayward carer stats: 726 points, 239 rebs, 191 assists, 43 blks, 58 steals

I'll tell you the answer, Gordon Hayward is a better basketball player than Wes Johnson and he has had a better career than Wes Johnson. There are a few other players from the 2010 draft who also have fewer career stats than Wes Johnson but are obviously better than him. It's because he saw a ton of minutes early, kept seeing minutes and didn't improve - - while the others improved.

 

[9194Gophs]

They asked Ralph about this and he said, at least his freshman year, it was about it being a new thing. Being in MN. Away from his family, etc. and his dad told him to stick it out.

Who is they? Believe what you want, the quote says differently.

Sampson said his son thought about transferring from Minnesota to another school. “Every year, like everybody else,” Ralph II said. “First year to this year. I wouldn’t let him leave. We started it, we’re gonna finish it.”

 

[Markous15]

I find this thread pretty amusing because while watching a game the other day I realized what Ralph was good at, putting up stats. There is no question that NCAAGophers is right about that. I'm not really sure why people put so much stake in statistics however. There are so many parts of the game that can't be measured by statistics. How many times was Ralph scored on each year? How many times did Ralph have a chance at a loose ball and didn't get it? How many times did Ralph miss a box out and allow an offensive rebound? How many good screens did Ralph set to get a teammate open? How many times per game did Ralph move well without the ball? How many times to Ralph rotate properly on defense? How many times did Ralph deflect a pass? Statistics don't tell us any of these things.

So yes, Ralph had a statistically great career here at the U. There is no arguing with that. But that does nothing to prove that he was a great player. I'm not here trying to rip on Ralph, I believe that he is a great guy and a very good basketball player and that we would have been a worse team without him for the past 4 years. All I'm saying is that statistics don't tell the whole story about a player and citing a handful of statistics to prove how good or how productive a player has been (especially in comparison with other players on other teams in other conferences) is not a very accurate way to assess a player as a whole.

 

[goldengophers]

This is quite the thread, anyone who suggests Ralph even remotely came close to reaching his potential or was above the low end of average should never consider going into scouting.

 

[98VQueens]

This is quite the thread, anyone who suggests Ralph even remotely came close to reaching his potential or was above the low end of average should never consider going into scouting.

+1

 

[GophersInIowa]

This is quite the thread, anyone who suggests Ralph even remotely came close to reaching his potential

I haven't seen a single person say he did.

or was above the low end of average should never consider going into scouting.

I guess I shouldn't ever go into scouting. I think Ralph had an average to above average career. Not great by any means, but not below average either.

 

[scher215]

Who is they? Believe what you want, the quote says differently.

Sampson said his son thought about transferring from Minnesota to another school. “Every year, like everybody else,” Ralph II said. “First year to this year. I wouldn’t let him leave. We started it, we’re gonna finish it.”

It was An interview with Ralph, I believe they showed it during the Nebraska game (can't remember)

But i'm going to believe the words that came directly from the mouth of Ralph Sampson III. You can feel free to do differently.

 

[Parski1]

Some of you are questioning Ralph's lack of emotion through his four years - his tweet a couple months back....

@RalphSampson3: Last time I checked, being emotional on the court doesn't mean you are a better player. #timduncan

 

[zambam]

Some of you are questioning Ralph's lack of emotion through his four years - his tweet a couple months back....

@RalphSampson3: Last time I checked, being emotional on the court doesn't mean you are a better player. #timduncan

We've all seen it but the thing is, Ralph is nowhere as good as Tim Duncan.

 

[9194Gophs]

It was An interview with Ralph, I believe they showed it during the Nebraska game (can't remember)

But i'm going to believe the words that came directly from the mouth of Ralph Sampson III. You can feel free to do differently.

Can't remember? We'll I'm sticking with the quote that came from his fathers mouth. What else would RS3 say when confronted with that question? His father should have never been that honest considering Ralph3 is currently the captin of this team IMO.

 

[THE SCOUT!]

ralph ended up a decent big ten player not collecting any postseason honors, very nice career stats not much longitudinal improvement,tempered by lack of team success. control your man love. When ralph gets a NBA gig come back and tell us how great he was THESCOUT!

 

[NoTalentGopher]

First, this is a silly way of saying Sampson was successful. You are comparing him to a weak class of centers. One, there haven't been that many good Gopher's centers, so saying he is one of the best doesn't mean a whole lot. Two, the 2008 class of centers is pretty weak. It's not the case that Ralph outperformed his ranking. It's the case that many of these centers didn't live up to their potential. If you are trying to tell me that a guy who averages 9-10 ppg and 5-6 rpg is anything more than above-average (and that's being generous), then you are absolutely crazy. Ralph never dominated for more than a two game stretch, often turned up below-average games in big games and didn't develop much strength to be able stay in the post.

Second, since you wanna compare him to his class, here are some better players to go along with other ones already mentioned (Note: some play forward and center, just like Ralph has)

Better centers from 2008:

Tyler Zellers
Draymond Green (listed as forward but plays as a center)
Kevin Jones (plays center and forward)
Greg Monroe
Morris twins (probably more Marcus)
Nikola Vucevic
Trey Thompkins

And finally, those career numbers are decent but aren't anything that special. Sure, not many Gophers have those numbers, but that speaks more about our program than the success of Ralph's career.

I love the Gophers, but the fact is, Ralph has always been about average to above-average. He's definitely helped more than he's hurt us. However, the guy is 6'11'' and 240 lbs. He is bigger than most bigs in the Big Ten, and the Gophers have played some weak non-conference games during his time. His numbers should be more inflated if anything.

 

[dpodoll68]

there haven't been that many good Gopher's centers, so saying he is one of the best doesn't mean a whole lot

lolwut?

Ron Behagen
Randy Breuer
Jim Brewer
Jim Petersen
Kleggie Hermsen
Kevin McHale
Mychal Thompson
Joel Przybilla


Care to try again?

 

[From the Barn]

First, this is a silly way of saying Sampson was successful. You are comparing him to a weak class of centers. One, there haven't been that many good Gopher's centers, so saying he is one of the best doesn't mean a whole lot. Two, the 2008 class of centers is pretty weak. It's not the case that Ralph outperformed his ranking. It's the case that many of these centers didn't live up to their potential. If you are trying to tell me that a guy who averages 9-10 ppg and 5-6 rpg is anything more than above-average (and that's being generous), then you are absolutely crazy. Ralph never dominated for more than a two game stretch, often turned up below-average games in big games and didn't develop much strength to be able stay in the post.

Second, since you wanna compare him to his class, here are some better players to go along with other ones already mentioned (Note: some play forward and center, just like Ralph has)

Better centers from 2008:

Tyler Zellers
Draymond Green (listed as forward but plays as a center)
Kevin Jones (plays center and forward)
Greg Monroe
Morris twins (probably more Marcus)
Nikola Vucevic
Trey Thompkins

And finally, those career numbers are decent but aren't anything that special. Sure, not many Gophers have those numbers, but that speaks more about our program than the success of Ralph's career.

I love the Gophers, but the fact is, Ralph has always been about average to above-average. He's definitely helped more than he's hurt us. However, the guy is 6'11'' and 240 lbs. He is bigger than most bigs in the Big Ten, and the Gophers have played some weak non-conference games during his time. His numbers should be more inflated if anything.

Draymond is more of a small forward than anything now, jones is not a center, morris twins weren't centers

 

[NoTalentGopher]

Draymond is more of a small forward than anything now, jones is not a center, morris twins weren't centers

Just because Green shoots some 3s doesn't make him a small forward. Most of his damage comes in the paint. He's definitely a F/C. Not many teams have a true center anymore, but he acts like theirs.

Jones plays a lot in the paint. Again, another team without a true center. He plays a F/C.

Again, with the Morris twins, Markieff was more of an outside shooter, but they both guarded down low, and Marcus played down low a lot of the time.

As someone mentioned before. It's not so much of a center in college as it is big men. Ralph played a lot of forward before this year when he was on the court at the same time as Iverson.