Reusse Mailbag: Why do you hate Coach Fleck so much?

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Spoofin said:
So if I got this right - JK/TC don’t deserve much credit because it was PJ’s staffs coaching that got them there. At the same time WMU recruits that get drafted next year would be credited to PJ and not the current WMU staff. And folks wonder why Pat trolls our fan base.
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Uh, not at all what I said, not even close. In fact, what you said is exactly what Pat is suggesting, give credit to the staff who recruited them. I am showing why that is stupid to suggest, but whatever.
 



Plato said:
What did he write that was not true?
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I’d say the key to was finding Rossi to take advantage of Martin, Winfield, and Coughlin is not true for why we won 11 games. Considering Coughlin didn’t have a great year and Martin missed several games with injury.
 

tjgopher said:
Uh, not at all what I said, not even close. In fact, what you said is exactly what Pat is suggesting, give credit to the staff who recruited them. I am showing why that is stupid to suggest, but whatever.
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Then why run down the draft numbers for PJ at WMU thru next year?

Look, PJ is a better recruiter and coach than JK/TC. It would be hard for anyone to dispute that. Even Pat knows that. The rub is so many still need to downplay all of JK/TC’s accomplishments (enter your post) for some reason. 2016 was a hell of a recruiting class. 4 kids from that class were drafted. Credit due.
 


btowngopher said:
I’d say the key to was finding Rossi to take advantage of Martin, Winfield, and Coughlin is not true for why we won 11 games. Considering Coughlin didn’t have a great year and Martin missed several games with injury.
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I think the work he got his team to do, the trust his players have in him and the passion he has for his truth and commitment to it is a tremendous gift.
 

Spoofin said:
Then why run down the draft numbers for PJ at WMU thru next year?

Look, PJ is a better recruiter and coach than JK/TC. It would be hard for anyone to dispute that. Even Pat knows that. The rub is so many still need to downplay all of JK/TC’s accomplishments (enter your post) for some reason. 2016 was a hell of a recruiting class. 4 kids from that class were drafted. Credit due.
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Could be five if Durr gets picked next year. Yes a very nice class where a lot of stars aligned and things fell into place nicely for Claeys.
 

Spoofin said:
+1. Honestly, if you can’t laugh at that response you are taking it way too seriously.
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One really has to hope that someday that he'll write down how he really feels about people and let us all in on it. Kind of like when an author eventually tells their readers what they intended for characters of a novel, etc.
 

BleedGopher said:
per Pat's Q&A:

I give Mr. Fleck full credit for raising the Gophers from the 9-4 team with an upset bowl victory in 2016 that he inherited
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The bolded above is the heart of the dishonesty, and is parroted by every fan leaping to the defense of Coach Claeys. Fleck didn't inherit a 9-4 team. The team he took the field with in 2017 was completely different from that 9-4 team in 2016. The main reason, of course, was that he was handed quarterbacks named Demry Croft and Connor Rhoda.

Let me say that again, because it's still hard to believe. The returning Gopher quarterbacks were Demry Croft and Connor Rhoda.
 



Urbandale said:
The bolded above is the heart of the dishonesty, and is parroted by every fan leaping to the defense of Coach Claeys. Fleck didn't inherit a 9-4 team. The team he took the field with in 2017 was completely different from that 9-4 team in 2016. The main reason, of course, was that he was handed quarterbacks named Demry Croft and Connor Rhoda.

Let me say that again, because it's still hard to believe. The returning Gopher quarterbacks were Demry Croft and Connor Rhoda.
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Even that aside. Isn't going 11-2 and finishing ranked 10 a large step up from 9-4 and finishing unranked?
 

btowngopher said:
Even that aside. Isn't going 11-2 and finishing ranked 10 a large step up from 9-4 and finishing unranked?
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Yes it is, and PJ Fleck get's "full credit" for that accomplishment.
 

@BleedGopher I don't blame you at all, but I suspect if you hadn't posted this no one would've said anything.

It's as blatant a troll attempt as I've ever seen by a newspaper "reporter". Nothing of news or substantive opinion, it was literally an attempt to rile people up on GH.

In such obvious situations, I relieve you of your duty to post it here. Please and thank you in advance :cool:
 

btowngopher said:
I’d say the key to was finding Rossi to take advantage of Martin, Winfield, and Coughlin is not true for why we won 11 games. Considering Coughlin didn’t have a great year and Martin missed several games with injury.
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Also Winfield was out that whole year after Maryland.

Also, Barber and Cashman got run roughshod over vs Illinois (the game that ultimately got Smith fired). They were out of position and missing tackles as much as I've seen.


Yes, Rossi was key, and obviously still is key.

No, not in the slightest, did he "figure out" something like "oh man, we have all these great defensive players, I should finally just allow them to make great plays".

Point being, Rossi's philosophy on defense will continue to work without the recent draft picks that committed to Kill/Claeys.
 
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Spoofin said:
Then why run down the draft numbers for PJ at WMU thru next year?

Look, PJ is a better recruiter and coach than JK/TC. It would be hard for anyone to dispute that. Even Pat knows that. The rub is so many still need to downplay all of JK/TC’s accomplishments (enter your post) for some reason. 2016 was a hell of a recruiting class. 4 kids from that class were drafted. Credit due.
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And the root of this thread is Reusse downplaying PJ's accomplishments...

Reusse is great at what he does, I just think that what he does (trolling) is not something to strive to be great at.
 

BleedGopher said:
per Pat's Q&A:

These are the questions received by me for the Star Tribune's columnist week for the Sports Mailbag. Few but meaty -- and not a surpise for the subject presented by the leadoff man.

Q: “Why do you hate Coach Fleck so much? What did he do to bother you? You never covered him, yet bash him for no reason.’’—Ron P.

A: Hate is an intense and passionate dislike for someone or some thing and has become vastly overused in modern nomenclature. “Hater’’ has turned into a throwaway term in the internet age to label anyone with a differing sports opinion.

I give Mr. Fleck full credit for raising the Gophers from the 9-4 team with an upset bowl victory in 2016 that he inherited to an 11-2 team with an upset bowl victory in a mere three seasons. The key, of course, was finding a coordinator in Joe Rossi to take full advantage of those defensive leaders and NFL draftees -- Antoine Winfield Jr., Carter Coughlin and Kamal Martin – recruited by Tracy Claeys.

www.startribune.com

Reusse's mailbag: The hate/haters label comes too easily in internet age

" 'Hater' has turned into a throwaway term in the internet age to label anyone with a differing sports opinion." Patrick Reusse answers the Fleck question and more.
www.startribune.com www.startribune.com

Go Gophers!!
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Wasn't Carter Coughlin recruited by Kill? He was coming here since he was a sophomore... and Fleck had to RE-recruit AW11jr after the whole fiasco that went down on Tracy Claey's watch..
...sooooooo, there's that, fatrick.
 

Jeshurun said:
The cherry picking and clever framing of some facts while ignoring others is a form of deception. Facts can be editorialized. Seems like most people these days can’t see through that.

Nobody really knows who said it first, but... "there are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."
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I believe that was Mark Twain.
 


Spoofin said:
Then why run down the draft numbers for PJ at WMU thru next year?

Look, PJ is a better recruiter and coach than JK/TC. It would be hard for anyone to dispute that. Even Pat knows that. The rub is so many still need to downplay all of JK/TC’s accomplishments (enter your post) for some reason. 2016 was a hell of a recruiting class. 4 kids from that class were drafted. Credit due.
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I have a hard time understanding peoples' need for things to be so completely black and white. We live in the greys! Yes, Coach Fleck has done amazing job and has me as excited for Gopher football as I have ever been (other than maybe the Rickey Foggie/Darryl Thompson years). But that doesn't mean that Coach Kill and Coach Claeys were bad. We can recognize the positives of the past without taking away from current accomplishments and vice-versa. We live in the greys. I'm happy with the shade in which we're living now.
 

Spoofin said:
Then why run down the draft numbers for PJ at WMU thru next year?

Look, PJ is a better recruiter and coach than JK/TC. It would be hard for anyone to dispute that. Even Pat knows that. The rub is so many still need to downplay all of JK/TC’s accomplishments (enter your post) for some reason. 2016 was a hell of a recruiting class. 4 kids from that class were drafted. Credit due.
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I was running through PJ's numbers at WMU as a comparison to what Pat posed.

I was simply presenting the entire set of facts, as opposed to the bully newspaper columnist who was trolling with a set of facts that fit his narrative, but didn't tell the story nearly as well. In fact, it was Pat downplaying PJ's stuff, not me downplaying anything.
 

Holy hell people. Grow up. He's playing the foil. It's a bit. Some of you act like Pat broke into your house and microwaved leftover fish.
 

CurveballJesus said:
Holy hell people. Grow up. He's playing the foil. It's a bit. Some of you act like Pat broke into your house and microwaved leftover fish.
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Same thing with Barreiro. They are playing a character. It's all fake - just to get clicks, readers/listeners.
 


I am more worried about the universe blinking out of existence and me missing the experience than anything Reusse has to say about anything. Yet, I will read his take because it makes me think that the universe contains a great deal of trash.
 



tjgopher said:
I was running through PJ's numbers at WMU as a comparison to what Pat posed.

I was simply presenting the entire set of facts, as opposed to the bully newspaper columnist who was trolling with a set of facts that fit his narrative, but didn't tell the story nearly as well. In fact, it was Pat downplaying PJ's stuff, not me downplaying anything.
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So you didn't downplay JK/TC's abilities? My bad :rolleyes:
 

GophersInIowa said:
What's funny to me is there are so many people that consider trolling entertaining.
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I have to admit, I chuckle every time Pat does this ---- because, every time Gopher Football fans lose their minds. The sensitivity of this fan base is the worst part about it.
 


Spoofin said:
I have to admit, I chuckle every time Pat does this ---- because, every time Gopher Football fans lose their minds. The sensitivity of this fan base is the worst part about it.
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Just about every large fan base in the country would react in a similar fashion. No one has ever claimed that fans are rational. When it comes to sports we're like kids. Doing this over and over is lazy IMO.
 

People criticize Reusse for cheap and lazy potshots.

And then they call him "Fat Pat," as if that was some kind of clever response.

Look, Reusse is not for everyone. but Pat Reusse is a very talented writer. And he is one of the biggest boosters for Gopher Volleyball. so when People say "Reusse hates the Gophers" - that is not correct. And that was one of the points of his response - people using the word "hate" when "dislike" or "disagree with" would be more correct.

And again:
when Fleck was hired, he said "I'm not for everyone." Fleck said that. he understands that.
And yet, when someone criticizes Fleck, his fans go ballistic. that is a level of irony that some here apparently cannot grasp.
 

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