Play Calling

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MaxyJR1 said:
I've said this often to people I watch football with when they get all upset about plays. "You do realize the other team is trying to stop us." You can call a good play and the defense on that play maybe calls the perfect defense or executes better. There are 22 players and 8 officials that have to do their job on each play.

Now I think more people are saying they'd like to go off script a bit more and be less predictable. That's a different discussion.
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That first paragraph is a really good point.
I think another thing to consider is that saying a coach made a bad play call shouldn’t be considered some major insult.
Every single coach would say they make bad play calls in every single game. If they don’t say that, they’re probably a terrible coach.
 

FireDaveLee said:
I remember this one play, at the end of the Northwestern-Michigan game in 2000. 4th down, Zak Kustok faked a hand-off, rolled out to his right, and then threw back to Damian Anderson, who was a 1st Team All-Big Ten RB.....all alone, & Anderson dropped the ball as he lost it in the lights at the last second.

Awful call because it wasn't able to be executed.

I'm just having fun with you, but I think you can see some of the flaws in your theory....
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Who said awful?
Clearly not the right play call for the time though


they did something different than they usually did and they didn’t execute it.
 

In my experience calling plays, not at the college level...

there have been bone head calls I’ve made that score touchdowns.
There have been “great” calls I’ve made that haven’t worked.

Usually the great calls I’ve made that didn’t work I could’ve called something else that would’ve worked on the exact same snap.




I think we need to get over this thing we have going that saying a coach Made a bad decision is some major insult or something that needs to be immediately changed (fire the OC! Fire the DC! Change the offense!)
 

FireDaveLee said:
I remember this one play, at the end of the Northwestern-Michigan game in 2000. 4th down, Zak Kustok faked a hand-off, rolled out to his right, and then threw back to Damian Anderson, who was a 1st Team All-Big Ten RB.....all alone, & Anderson dropped the ball as he lost it in the lights at the last second.

Awful call because it wasn't able to be executed.

I'm just having fun with you, but I think you can see some of the flaws in your theory....
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If he can in fact see the flaws, he has shown no sign of it.
 



Some guy said:
In my experience calling plays, not at the college level...

there have been bone head calls I’ve made that score touchdowns.
There have been “great” calls I’ve made that haven’t worked.

Usually the great calls I’ve made that didn’t work I could’ve called something else that would’ve worked on the exact same snap.




I think we need to get over this thing we have going that saying a coach Made a bad decision is some major insult or something that needs to be immediately changed (fire the OC! Fire the DC! Change the offense!)
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Wow. Like trying to follow the flight of a gnat.
 



Taji34 said:
But also, just because a play didn't work doesn't make it a bad call. Like I pointed out, factors that no one could predict or anticipate can effect the outcome of a play.
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Yes.

I think it's important, and multiple people are on board (now):

there is an important distinction between not being a good play call and being a bad play call. A play not working doesn't automatically make it one or the other.
 



MaxyJR1 said:
I've said this often to people I watch football with when they get all upset about plays. "You do realize the other team is trying to stop us." You can call a good play and the defense on that play maybe calls the perfect defense or executes better. There are 22 players and 8 officials that have to do their job on each play.

Now I think more people are saying they'd like to go off script a bit more and be less predictable. That's a different discussion.
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The actual thing is, each play call is really a percentage chance of working. Just because you made a great call that had a 90% chance of working ... it still might fail. But usually that meant someone did a really poor job of executing.

A bad play call might only have a 10% chance of working, but it still might do well. Usually a bust by the other team and/or outstanding execution by your guys.
 

RememberMurray said:
Yes.

A question to the board at large: Which is usually more important — being "unpredictable", that is, catching the opponent off-guard with clever play-calling... or executing a game plan really well, blocking really well, etc. even if the play-calling is somewhat "predictable"?

Looking at it the opposite way: would you rather your team was unpredictable but with shaky execution, or predictable with excellent execution?
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Here's the hard thing to digest and come to terms with: you can't just decouple those two factors and try to look at them independently.

They're coupled. The right play call gives your guys the best chance to execute well. Doesn't guarantee they will, or that the other guy won't.
 

Schnauzer said:
Play calling in the last two possessions was horrific. No denying that. This team continues to put itself in danger or worse by going ultra conservative late. This extends at least to last season. Some of these head scratchers have thankfully been wins.
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Correct. And it was the same at the end of the Maryland game when we gave up a 17-point lead. Same last year against Wisconsin when we punted from their 37-yard line on 4th and 2. Same against Penn State last year. Same as running outside zone on 3rd and 6 in hopes of setting up a shorter fourth down against Iowa this year (that one was after a time out).

Way, way, way too conservative.

We get these leads and then Glen Mason morphs into PJ.
 

Replacement Gopher said:
Correct. And it was the same at the end of the Maryland game when we gave up a 17-point lead. Same last year against Wisconsin when we punted from their 37-yard line on 4th and 2. Same against Penn State last year. Same as running outside zone on 3rd and 6 in hopes of setting up a shorter fourth down against Iowa this year (that one was after a time out).

Way, way, way too conservative.

We get these leads and then Glen Mason morphs into PJ.
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I hate to tell you this, but we are ultra conservative in the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd quarter too.
we don’t morph. You just notice it more.

I, too, wish we would be more aggressive at times. Not just in the 4th quarter but a cross the board.

Against Maryland we only ran 6 plays in the 4th quarter while we had the lead.

4 runs, 2 passes.

our running back was having a career day. I bet they’d call different plays if they had a chance and maybe throw on first down the first drive and probably on second down on the second drive.

13 minutes left - 10 point lead
1st and 10 - 3 yard run (we run 70% of the time on 1st down this season...not like we are newly in some shell)
2nd and 7 - 3 yard run (I bet they’d rather have called a pass here or on first down in retrospect)
3rd and 4 - sack


7 minutes left - 7 point lead
1st and 10 - 5 yard run (we run 70% of the time on first down this season...and a 5 yard run is unquestionably a good play)
2nd and 5 - 1 yard loss (no question they’d wish to call a different play here)
3rd and 6 - sack


contrary to many’s belief....we didn’t go into some shell up 17....we never even ran a play up 17. We ran an offensive style identical to what we always run and it didn’t work.
 
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And not stupid aggressive like running fake punts that blow up in our face.

We are like 52% run on second down.
But we are 70% run on first down.

I think if we were 60% run on first down, we would have greater team success.


(hard to know true percentages because RPO is hard to take out of those numbers)
 

Some guy said:
I hate to tell you this, but we are ultra conservative in the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd quarter too.
we don’t morph. You just notice it more.

I, too, wish we would be more aggressive at times. Not just in the 4th quarter but a cross the board.

Against Maryland we only ran 6 plays in the 4th quarter while we had the lead.

4 runs, 2 passes.

our running back was having a career day. I bet they’d call different plays if they had a chance and maybe throw on first down the first drive and probably on second down on the second drive.

13 minutes left - 10 point lead
1st and 10 - 3 yard run (we run 70% of the time on 1st down this season...not like we are newly in some shell)
2nd and 7 - 3 yard run (I bet they’d rather have called a pass here or on first down in retrospect)
3rd and 4 - sack


7 minutes left - 7 point lead
1st and 10 - 5 yard run (we run 70% of the time on first down this season...and a 5 yard run is unquestionably a good play)
2nd and 5 - 1 yard loss (no question they’d wish to call a different play here)
3rd and 6 - sack


contrary to many’s belief....we didn’t go into some shell up 17....we never even ran a play up 17. We ran an offensive style identical to what we always run and it didn’t work.
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Our last three plays in regulation - when the game was tied - were all runs. We punt it to MD from our 47 and MD proceeds to pass it five straight times before time runs out in regulation.

Who do you think was calling plays to win that game?

Additionally, I have Mo with 19 second half carries in that game. Potts had one. For 14 yards.

It's not even that we just went into a shell, we did the same run with the same player over and over and over again.

Then to top it all off, we literally played for a tie and missed an extra point in double overtime.
 

have NOT read the entire thread.

my personal opinion is that the emphasis on play-calling is over-rated.

Sure, there are times when a play does catch the defense by surprise, but for the most part, the teams have studied each other's tendencies and personnel groupings, and have a good idea what to expect.

I firmly believe that execution outweighs play-calling about 95% of the time. (assuming the two teams are a relatively even match).

If the Gophers call a run, and the other team expects a run, that can still be a good play if the OL executes the blocking scheme and/or the RB makes a good cut or finds a hole.

doesn't matter what play is called - the players need to execute that play to the best of their abilities.
a missed block, a player forgetting an assignment - that turns a good play call into a bad play call in a heartbeat. or a player on defense covering the wrong person or missing an assignment can turn a bad call into a great call just as quickly.
 

Replacement Gopher said:
It's not even that we just went into a shell, we did the same run with the same player over and over and over again.
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Thanks for admitting that we didn’t go into a shell.
Thanks for admitting that we came in a shell and never left it
 


short ornery norwegian said:
have NOT read the entire thread.

my personal opinion is that the emphasis on play-calling is over-rated.

Sure, there are times when a play does catch the defense by surprise, but for the most part, the teams have studied each other's tendencies and personnel groupings, and have a good idea what to expect.

I firmly believe that execution outweighs play-calling about 95% of the time. (assuming the two teams are a relatively even match).

If the Gophers call a run, and the other team expects a run, that can still be a good play if the OL executes the blocking scheme and/or the RB makes a good cut or finds a hole.

doesn't matter what play is called - the players need to execute that play to the best of their abilities.
a missed block, a player forgetting an assignment - that turns a good play call into a bad play call in a heartbeat. or a player on defense covering the wrong person or missing an assignment can turn a bad call into a great call just as quickly.
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Kirk Ciarroca said "we just call them, players make plays" (something like that).
 

Numbers from MD game

Number of drives resulting in a Gopher punt: 4
Number of those drives in the second half: 3
Number of punts in the fourth quarter: 3
Number of first or second down passes in drives resulting in a punt: 1
Number of yards gained on that passing play: 12
Number of runs called the next three plays before punting: 3
 

“That end around or short passes to Moore put their best athlete in a position to make plays all game. I wish Bateman could have had more things planned around him.”

Except, Bateman does not possess the same abilities as Moore.
 

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