PJ Fleck's secrecy

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EG#9

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With the talk of PJ Fleck's refusal to issue a depth chart or talk about injuries, I was reminded of an article I read while researching the NFL Draft in a few years ago. Here are the key lines from Gil Brandt:


"P.J. Fleck does things interestingly. For example, at Minnesota's pro day on Monday, the head coach asked every scout in attendance what school they had graduated from. He wrote every one down on a piece of paper to make sure none were ever credentialed for a future Gophers game that immediately preceded a contest involving their alma mater.
Now that's next-level thinking."

From: https://www.nfl.com/news/pro-day-results-minnesota-wake-forest-kansas-montana-0ap3000000793823

I personally love that Fleck looks for every advantage (perceived or real) that he can legally use. Is is disappointing to find out 30 minutes before the game that the Gophers don't have their kicker or punter and feel (as a fan) that your optimism for the game has taken a hit? Yes. I personally care much more about the result and even if these tactics combine for a 2% more likely outcome of a win, I still am in favor of them no matter how paranoid they may seem or how inconvenient to the fan base they are.
 


They're his calls, if he feels

I think there's a lot of assumptions about what if any advantages there are to these things, and I'm not sure even the coaches know the real outcomes / if it matters.

But he's captian of the boat, it's his call.
 


Really gotta wonder what ELSE he is hiding. If I know Fleck, and I definitely do not, he is a schemer. If he is hiding the depth chart, is he hiding his job interviews? What else is cooking in case de la Fleck? IF you're not first, you're last, he always says.
 


UpAndUnder43 said:
Really gotta wonder what ELSE he is hiding. If I know Fleck, and I definitely do not, he is a schemer. If he is hiding the depth chart, is he hiding his job interviews? What else is cooking in case de la Fleck? IF you're not first, you're last, he always says.
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Same as ... anyone else might I would assume.


I mean who tells everyone everything?

 


Naturally, it’s all part of the Farmers Alliance.
100% honesty all the time.
 

60's Guy said:

Naturally, it’s all part of the Farmers Alliance.
100% honesty all the time.
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I’m probably totally wrong for thinking this, but there might be a smidge of difference between lying and revealing all your secrets to opponents.
 

Chalk this up as one of those weird things that seems just like peak "Football coach" but it's no skin off my back so whatever. PJ is odd. If the team wins, I'm cool with him continuing to go about things with his style.
 



60's Guy said:

Naturally, it’s all part of the Farmers Alliance.
100% honesty all the time.
Click to expand...

I don't think Fleck considers Gopherhole to be 'within our walls.' Probably closer to the opposite actually lol
 

Jeshurun said:
I’m probably totally wrong for thinking this, but there might be a smidge of difference between lying and revealing all your secrets to opponents.
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I’d agree with you but PJ bases his culture on not agreeing with us. He defines it, not me.
 


#2Gopher said:
Fleck can do whatever he wants to do. Doesn't offend me as long as he's looking out for the Gopher program.
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There's still a group that's going to look to find something dishonest about P.J. The tea leaf readers so up in arms about "Year Zero" and were convinced he's nothing but a con man didn't all just convert because of the Auburn game. They simply shut up but will be back full force given the chance. He's a control freak like every other college football coach.
 



The thread was not titled "PJ Fleck's dishonesty".

There is indeed quite a difference between dishonesty and secrecy.


No doubt several of you have mistakenly conflated them, and then based your anger on your own mistake, in this regard.
 

Biggsohnasty said:
Chalk this up as one of those weird things that seems just like peak "Football coach" but it's no skin off my back so whatever. PJ is odd. If the team wins, I'm cool with him continuing to go about things with his style.
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Sure, this is correct. Doesn't mean I have to like those things, or even commit to never complaining about them, in order to "go along with them".
 

MplsGopher said:
Sure, this is correct. Doesn't mean I have to like those things, or even commit to never complaining about them, in order to "go along with them".
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You can like or not like whatever, that doesn't mean it's not stupid to do so.

Dude has a big job, entertaining folks with giving out the tidbits some rando out there wants is not one of them.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
You can like or not like whatever, that doesn't mean it's not stupid to do so.

Dude has a big job, entertaining folks with giving out the tidbits some rando out there wants is not one of them.
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Yep, tidbits such as:
- confirming that Branden Oliver injured his knee in the spring and won't play this fall
- confirming that Curtis Dunlap injured his foot/ankle this fall and probably won't play this fall
- confirming that Dan Faalele opted out of the season and won't play this fall
- releasing a depth chart.

Indeed, "tidbits".

Indeed, just a couple randos out on the internet, would be interested in such information.


Fleck and/or the team will likely claim that the law prevents them disclosing that information due to medical privacy laws.

But saying things like "hurt his knee", "hurt his foot", "chose to opt out" are not medical diagnoses. Those aren't protected medical information. They're generic statements, not at all covered by the law.
 
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Alright. I've made my point.

It is an extremely unpopular point, that a vast majority of Gopher fans don't care about.


I'm not going to bring this up again for the rest of the season.
 

MplsGopher said:
Yep, tidbits such as:
- confirming that Branden Oliver injured his knee in the spring and won't play this fall
- confirming that Curtis Dunlap injured his foot/ankle this fall and probably won't play this fall
- confirming that Dan Faalele opted out of the season and won't play this fall
- releasing a depth chart.

Indeed, "tidbits".

Indeed, just a couple randos out on the internet, would be interested in such information.


Fleck and/or the team will likely claim that the law prevents them disclosing that information due to medical privacy laws.

But saying things like "hurt his knee", "hurt his foot", "chose to opt out" are not medical diagnoses. Those aren't protected medical information. They're generic statements, not at all covered by the law.
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If you know or don't know these things ... what's the problem?
 


MplsGopher said:
Alright. I've made my point.

It is an extremely unpopular point, that a vast majority of Gopher fans don't care about.


I'm not going to bring this up again for the rest of the season.
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Yea!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

EG#9 said:
"P.J. Fleck does things interestingly. For example, at Minnesota's pro day on Monday, the head coach asked every scout in attendance what school they had graduated from. He wrote every one down on a piece of paper to make sure none were ever credentialed for a future Gophers game that immediately preceded a contest involving their alma mater.
Now that's next-level thinking."

From: https://www.nfl.com/news/pro-day-results-minnesota-wake-forest-kansas-montana-0ap3000000793823
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This anecdote feels like one of those DO NOT EAT signs on a traffic cone or something, because someone tried to pull this stunt before.
 

fmlizard said:
This anecdote feels like one of those DO NOT EAT signs on a traffic cone or something, because someone tried to pull this stunt before.
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Did you try eating a traffic cone once? Be honest.
 

Oh, bleep - I agree with MplsGopher on this one.

the U of MN is a state school. There is a great deal of interest in the football program. the Coach is paid millions of dollars (minus the recent roll-back) to coach the program.

I do not think it is asking too much for the Coach to provide - at the very least - some basic information on the status of players AT THIS TIME.

I used capital letters because of the covid issues. Let's face it - if a player misses a game, the 1st thing people are going to think is "covid."

So if a player misses a game, and no "official" reason is given, that puts fans and the media in the position of speculating.

At the very least, the Gophers could give a generic reason for players missing game - "covid" - "non-covid injury/medical" - "player's decision" (i.e opt out) - or "coaches' decision" (i.e. rules violation).

for someone like Faalele, the Gophers have given no indication, leaving people free to speculate. In the long run, I think it would be better for the player and the program to end the speculation and give some kind of explanation.
 

Respectfully disagree with you on this one Son. You're in the reporting industry (for a radio station I believe). You folks are trying to get all the news possible. I get that. Why tip off the other team though?

As to people speculating what is going on that is stirred up by the media. This could clearly be handled differently. Media can flair up an issue for no reason, media can get a candidate elected. Media can do many things and I have great respect for media especially when covering government and foreign affairs. Over a game of football a coach trying to get an edge. NO WAY.
 

Why’s the coach gotta divulge this information? Especially when it involves a public institution blabbing the personal health status of amateur athletes.
 

short ornery norwegian said:
Oh, bleep - I agree with MplsGopher on this one.

the U of MN is a state school. There is a great deal of interest in the football program. the Coach is paid millions of dollars (minus the recent roll-back) to coach the program.

I do not think it is asking too much for the Coach to provide - at the very least - some basic information on the status of players AT THIS TIME.

I used capital letters because of the covid issues. Let's face it - if a player misses a game, the 1st thing people are going to think is "covid."

So if a player misses a game, and no "official" reason is given, that puts fans and the media in the position of speculating.

At the very least, the Gophers could give a generic reason for players missing game - "covid" - "non-covid injury/medical" - "player's decision" (i.e opt out) - or "coaches' decision" (i.e. rules violation).

for someone like Faalele, the Gophers have given no indication, leaving people free to speculate. In the long run, I think it would be better for the player and the program to end the speculation and give some kind of explanation.
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This is PJ's gig and his to handle as he chooses.

Stop all the whining and gnashing of teeth just because you feel that you haven't been duly informed.

Get a pair.
 

Weird stance to assume that wanting more information from the head coach in a year where the media is severely restricted in its ability to cover the team is equivalent to not having a pair.

Safe to assume nobody is losing sleep over if the team releases its official depth chart, or if the coach tells us that Dunlap has a bum achilles and won't play this year. Those things, on their own, aren't a big deal (by sports standards not actual real life standards if that actually needs clarification).

I think, and I'm projecting my feelings to a lot of other posters based on what I've seen, that those that are annoyed by Fleck's secrecy are annoyed because it feels like he's arbitrarily secretive. He gains no advantage by being secretive about admitting that a few of his players won't be playing this fall. There's gamesmanship in coaching, we get that. But sometimes it feels like he's extra close to the chest on things he doesn't have to be close to the chest on.

Fans aren't "entitled" to information and ultimately, stuff gets out anyways. So I guess the "whining" that some of them (us) do isn't worth it. But if that stuff gets out eventually, why not just make life easy and be forthcoming with things that aren't going to hurt you anyways?

But again, nobody is losing sleep or gnashing their teeth over this stuff. I know we live in a very black and white world with no room for grey, but being minorly annoyed by minor things doesn't mean people need to grow a pair.
 

All coaches at every level play games with this type of reporting, as it is an advantage to their opponents to have more detailed info than they had before.

MPLS is not a stupid person, (who I often do not agree with), so why he does not understand this is a mystery to me.
 

Bayfieldgopher said:
This is PJ's gig and his to handle as he chooses.

Stop all the whining and gnashing of teeth just because you feel that you haven't been duly informed.

Get a pair.
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Actually, what I think people are saying is PJ needs to grow a pair. This secretive stuff just makes him looked scared and insecure.
 

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