Official SEC Cham...I mean CFP Championship Game Thread.

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Bob_Loblaw said:
I know you asked someone else, but I'm not upset when lesser teams make the Super Bowl. However, I also don't point to the seasons where the best two teams play each other in the Super Bowl as proof that system isn't correct.

Once you build a playoff, the best case scenario, IMO, is to eventually have the best teams battle it out for the championship. This year, I actually think it worked perfectly. We keep hearing about how the UCF's/Boise's of the world just needed their shot, and Cinci looked pretty overmatched against Alabama. It was also a year where Michigan looked like they might belong and we found out pretty quickly that they did not.

Georgia sure looked like the best team all year and they lost to Alabama in another relatively modern invention (conference championship game). Those conference championship games do devalue the regular season games a bit.
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I don't disagree with anything you wrote here.

What I meant is: the NFL "could" just take those 14 teams into a single bracket, seeding the top 8 division winners perhaps, or some other way. But they purposefully have two separate brackets that feed into the championship.

This prevents something like the Rams vs the 49ers as the Super Bowl. And yes I realize that's probably a silly example, as there was a Super Bowl back in the Steve Young/Junior Seau days of the 9ers vs Chargers.

But college football conference are much more exclusive in geography. So you could rig it up with PAC/Big Ten/Big XII teams on one side, and SEC/ACC teams on the other side, or something like this. Likely won't happen, and maybe it would be a terrible idea. Just saying.

I think it's a big turn off to a lot of casual fans around the country, and perhaps some non-casual fans like myself, if the natty is just the Deep South Bowl every year. I have no interest in tuning into that. But that's speaking for myself.
 

Gophers_4life said:
I don't disagree with anything you wrote here.

What I meant is: the NFL "could" just take those 14 teams into a single bracket, seeding the top 8 division winners perhaps, or some other way. But they purposefully have two separate brackets that feed into the championship.

This prevents something like the Rams vs the 49ers as the Super Bowl. And yes I realize that's probably a silly example, as there was a Super Bowl back in the Steve Young/Junior Seau days of the 9ers vs Chargers.

But college football conference are much more exclusive in geography. So you could rig it up with PAC/Big Ten/Big XII teams on one side, and SEC/ACC teams on the other side, or something like this. Likely won't happen, and maybe it would be a terrible idea. Just saying.

I think it's a big turn off to a lot of casual fans around the country, and perhaps some non-casual fans like myself, if the natty is just the Deep South Bowl every year. I have no interest in tuning into that. But that's speaking for myself.
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Yeah. And the nature of college football is there aren’t enough games to create objective top 4s

Five thirty eight did a good article on how the committee has been given the wrong task

fivethirtyeight.com

The College Football Playoff Committee Is Answering The Wrong Question

Before losing to Alabama in the College Football Playoff semifinals, Notre Dame was widely considered one of the four best teams in the country. However, you’d …
fivethirtyeight.com
 

Some guy said:
you could expand the playoff to 12 and make the regular season more important if you did it right. Or you could expand to 12 and ruin college football.
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That's why auto-bids for conference champions are so important in an expanded system. It makes the regular season extremely important.
 

Some guy said:
Yeah. And the nature of college football is there aren’t enough games to create objective top 4s

Five thirty eight did a good article on how the committee has been given the wrong task

fivethirtyeight.com

The College Football Playoff Committee Is Answering The Wrong Question

Before losing to Alabama in the College Football Playoff semifinals, Notre Dame was widely considered one of the four best teams in the country. However, you’d …
fivethirtyeight.com
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I kinda hope they do the same simulation for this year. I don't think the outcome would have changed, but I'd be curious to see if Cincinnati or Michigan got swapped with a different team. I'd also be curious how the chances of being the best team changed when Georgia lost the SEC championship, we they still most likely or would it have flipped to Alabama?
 

swelna said:
I kinda hope they do the same simulation for this year. I don't think the outcome would have changed, but I'd be curious to see if Cincinnati or Michigan got swapped with a different team. I'd also be curious how the chances of being the best team changed when Georgia lost the SEC championship, we they still most likely or would it have flipped to Alabama?
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I think it is likely Michigan, Alabama and Cincinnati are all in

It may have turned out the same this year as the only two one loss candidates are Notre dame (who lost to cinci) and Georgia

Louisiana would’ve likely been the 4th team in unbeaten but they weren’t
Oklahoma st would’ve been the 4th team if only one loss

Because there weren’t good candidates this year I would guess still Georgia…But hard to say without running numbers.




if ok state would’ve beat Baylor, they would’ve been in instead of cinci I think. And imo the team that should’ve been out was Georgia (even knowing Georgia is the best team). I think college football is about the best season not the best team. Georgia didn’t win their conference. I am fine with them being in this year though because there was no other alternative that was logical
 


Some guy said:
I think it is likely Michigan, Alabama and Cincinnati are all in

It may have turned out the same this year as the only two one loss candidates are Notre dame (who lost to cinci) and Georgia

Louisiana would’ve likely been the 4th team in unbeaten but they weren’t
Oklahoma st would’ve been the 4th team if only one loss

Because there weren’t good candidates this year I would guess still Georgia…But hard to say without running numbers.




if ok state would’ve beat Baylor, they would’ve been in instead of cinci I think. And imo the team that should’ve been out was Georgia (even knowing Georgia is the best team). I think college football is about the best season not the best team. Georgia didn’t win their conference. I am fine with them being in this year though because there was no other alternative that was logical
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The problem of potentially leaving Georgia out even though they ended up winning it all gets fixed with expansion...Do I think all eight or twelve teams realistically have a chance to win it all? No, but at least some of the quarter and semi final games would be more entertaining vs the 2 semi final games we got this year...and if a 12 seed makes it to the final, there would be so much buzz around "can they actually do it" that I think would be worth it.
 

Some guy said:
For sure:
Bama throws a bubble on 3rd and 3 on their second drive of the game and has to punt
Georgia QB never throws a ball into the end zone on their first scoring drive
Bama second field goal drive they throw it short of the sticks on 3rd and 6
Georgia second field goal drive Georgia throws it short of the sticks on 3rd down and then kicks field goal


I get it though. When Minnesota throws it short of the sticks it’s because they’re trying to get a field goal. If Bama and Georgia do it they are playing for a touchdown but just not succeeding.
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No, I don't think you do get it if you are trying to equate the play calling of Mike Sanford with the offenses of Georgia and Alabama. Neither Smart nor Saban fired his OC after the game either.
 

Dakota2 said:
No, I don't think you do get it if you are trying to equate the play calling of Mike Sanford with the offenses of Georgia and Alabama. Neither Smart nor Saban fired his OC after the game either.
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Hate to tell you this but Fleck was conservative long before sanford. You’re going to be disappointed next year
 

swelna said:
The problem of potentially leaving Georgia out even though they ended up winning it all gets fixed with expansion...Do I think all eight or twelve teams realistically have a chance to win it all? No, but at least some of the quarter and semi final games would be more entertaining vs the 2 semi final games we got this year...and if a 12 seed makes it to the final, there would be so much buzz around "can they actually do it" that I think would be worth it.
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I personally think 8 with top 6 conference champs getting auto bids is the most realistic possibility of happening of all the things I would like.

My favorite would be 12 with auto bids for all conference in the BCS computer ranking top 25 (max 10). Conference whose champ is not top 25 in the formula is converted to an extra at large. At large teams can’t play a home game.

but that isn’t happening.
 



Some guy said:
Hate to tell you this but Fleck was conservative long before sanford. You’re going to be disappointed next year
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I think the issue is "explosive" passing plays. I recall very few this past year compared to 2019. Now, was that due to having Bateman and Johnson or was it a function of KC's play calling. We'll find out.

I think most people realize we're never going be Air Fleck and Fleck will always want to run and control TOP, but I think (hope) we will see a better mix and the passing portion we be a threat for big plays (thinking of the bomb to Johnson in the Outback Bowl when he went max protection and caught Auburn in coverage snafu). We will see.
 


Gophers_4life said:
I think it's a big turn off to a lot of casual fans around the country, and perhaps some non-casual fans like myself, if the natty is just the Deep South Bowl every year. I have no interest in tuning into that. But that's speaking for myself.
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The issue with this is the Minnesota hockey tournament situation where the two best teams play each other in the quarter final and then some team that barely squeaked by on a luck gets demolished 7-0 in the final. There's parity in the NFL that keeps that from happening. Any team can win any game. That's not really true in college. Georgia rolling Michigan in primetime would have been boring as hell. As it was, it was a pretty entertaining game.
 





hello-world said:
This is factually correct as is the fact that Fleck has always run a super conservative offense.
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The latter is not factually correct. Fleck built a winner at WM with a balanced offense and strong passing game. His 2019 Gopher team was more of the same.
 

Dakota2 said:
The latter is not factually correct. Fleck built a winner at WM with a balanced offense and strong passing game. His 2019 Gopher team was more of the same.
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Oh... no. You're wrong. The Gophers ran the ball on over 60% of their plays in 2019. That was good #115 in passing attempts / play. In other words, 114 teams were more likely to throw the ball on any given play than the Gophers in 2019.

Granted, they were actually _less_ balanced than that this year and ran the ball on almost 70% of their plays which was good for #127 in passing attempts / play and was only outdone by the service academies.

To your point, Fleck and Ciarrocca were much more balanced at WMU where they ran on 55% of their plays (good for 79th in passing /attempts per play), but that is likely because they had an NFL-caliber receiver on a G5 team.

Fleck has coached one of the run-heaviest teams in football since getting to Minnesota.

The last time the Gophers ran a truly 'balanced' offense was in 2015-2016 and that's likely because they were playing from behind all year. They also ran a balanced offense under Brewster.
 
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hello-world said:
Oh... no. You're wrong. The Gophers ran the ball on over 60% of their plays in 2019. That was good #115 in passing attempts / play. In other words, 114 teams were more likely to throw the ball on any given play than the Gophers in 2019.

Granted, they were actually _less_ balanced than that this year and ran the ball on almost 70% of their plays which was good for #127 in passing attempts / play and was only outdone by the service academies.

To your point, Fleck and Ciarrocca were much more balanced at WMU where they ran on 55% of their plays (good for 79th in passing /attempts per play), but that is likely because they had an NFL-caliber receiver on a G5 team.

Fleck has coached one of the run-heaviest teams in football since getting to Minnesota.

The last time the Gophers ran a truly 'balanced' offense was in 2015-2016 and that's likely because they were playing from behind all year. They also ran a balanced offense under Brewster.
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And I’m not even talking about that.
I am saying we always have been more likely to run the ball on 3rd and 4 than the average team. We are always more likely to punt on the opponents 41 yard line.

Sanford isn’t the one making us “play for field goals”
Especially if you watched his offense at Notre dame or western Kentucky (I never watched a Utah state game when he was there)
 

hello-world said:
The issue with this is the Minnesota hockey tournament situation where the two best teams play each other in the quarter final and then some team that barely squeaked by on a luck gets demolished 7-0 in the final. There's parity in the NFL that keeps that from happening. Any team can win any game. That's not really true in college. Georgia rolling Michigan in primetime would have been boring as hell. As it was, it was a pretty entertaining game.
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Agree. You're correct.

As was said previously by someone else, the basic calculation is: do you want more people to tune in, and then it be a worse game, or have a better game but less people tune in?

Both matter.


To me, college football is far more provincial. Like you say, the NFL does a great job spreading talent around. Teams in Seattle and Boston are just as likely to have as many players from the deep south as teams in New Orleans and Atlanta, and vice versa.

So I'll watch the Super Bowl that's Jacksonville vs New Orleans, just fine.


I won't turn into the SEC Bowl. Nope. Won't do it. Don't care that they really are the two best teams in the country. Don't care in the slightest.

I'll just watch NFL if I want to see the highest quality football.

College is about "which state/region is best", just as much as the game, for me. Probably a silly attitude, I know.


I hope the top level of college football, whether that's the P5 or an even smaller sub-set of that, gets to something like what the NFL has with spreading around the top level talent to around the country.
 

hello-world said:
Oh... no. You're wrong. The Gophers ran the ball on over 60% of their plays in 2019. That was good #115 in passing attempts / play. In other words, 114 teams were more likely to throw the ball on any given play than the Gophers in 2019.

Granted, they were actually _less_ balanced than that this year and ran the ball on almost 70% of their plays which was good for #127 in passing attempts / play and was only outdone by the service academies.

To your point, Fleck and Ciarrocca were much more balanced at WMU where they ran on 55% of their plays (good for 79th in passing /attempts per play), but that is likely because they had an NFL-caliber receiver on a G5 team.

Fleck has coached one of the run-heaviest teams in football since getting to Minnesota.

The last time the Gophers ran a truly 'balanced' offense was in 2015-2016 and that's likely because they were playing from behind all year. They also ran a balanced offense under Brewster.
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Running 55-60% of the time is not "super conservative". It is balanced and keeps the defense honest. Running 70% of the time and passing when the defense is pretty sure you will, is conservative, not to mention stupid. That is why Fleck fired Sanford.
 

Dakota2 said:
Running 55-60% of the time is not "super conservative". It is balanced and keeps the defense honest. Running 70% of the time and passing when the defense is pretty sure you will, is conservative, not to mention stupid. That is why Fleck fired Sanford.
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Fleck fired Sanford because he didn’t do a good job of teaching the passing game that he was brought in to help enhance. And sanford was so bad at teaching it that fleck told him to run the ball all the time.
I actually think THAT is why he fired Sanford.

Sanford ran a more wide open offense in previous stops than he did here. Not wide open, but more wide open.
 

Dakota2 said:
Running 55-60% of the time is not "super conservative".
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It is more conservative than most of the FBS. Also, I don't think that Fleck has ever thrown the ball on more than 40% of plays at Minnesota. 45% happened when he was at WMU.

I can name 100+ college teams that threw the ball more than the Gophers in 2019. They didn't run a 'balanced' offense by anyone's definition and they looked downright archaic compared to teams running modern concepts.
 
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Some guy said:
Fleck fired Sanford because he didn’t do a good job of teaching the passing game that he was brought in to help enhance. And sanford was so bad at teaching it that fleck told him to run the ball all the time.
I actually think THAT is why he fired Sanford.

Sanford ran a more wide open offense in previous stops than he did here. Not wide open, but more wide open.
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A novel new reason for Sanford's dismissal -- he just didn't teach Morgan, CAB, and the 6th year OLs the passing game. LOL.
 

hello-world said:
It is more conservative than most of the FBS. Also, I don't think that Fleck has ever thrown the ball on more than 40% of plays at Minnesota. 45% happened when he was at WMU.

I can name 100+ college teams that threw the ball more than the Gophers in 2019. They didn't run a 'balanced' offense by anyone's definition and they looked downright archaic compared to teams running modern concepts.
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Nobody cares who throws the ball more than the Gophers any more than we care how many sit-ups they do. We are only interested in a balanced attack that keeps the defense guessing.
 

Dakota2 said:
A novel new reason for Sanford's dismissal -- he just didn't teach Morgan, CAB, and the 6th year OLs the passing game. LOL.
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You think he did? Pretty obvious we were running deeper passing progressions in 2020 that Morgan never got through. Then this year we shit canned it
 

Some guy said:
You think he did? Pretty obvious we were running deeper passing progressions in 2020 that Morgan never got through. Then this year we shit canned it
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We were running dumb routes because Sanford called stupid plays. Has nothing to do with teaching the passing game.
 

Dakota2 said:
We were running dumb routes because Sanford called stupid plays. Has nothing to do with teaching the passing game.
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Ok

are you aware that most of college football runs the same plays as each other?
 

Some guy said:
Ok

are you aware that most of college football runs the same plays as each other?
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Most of college football runs plays appropriate to the situation. Did you have any idea about that?
 



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