Odds Colton starts over Ralph?

[NurumbiCongo]

Trevor looks to be a pure, physical PF.

And Colt45 is the only pure physical center, who can bang, block and rebound. Mean combo.

 

[MEK711]

And Colt45 is the only pure physical center, who can bang, block and rebound. Mean combo.

Ralph has far more potential on the offensive end to not start alongside Trevor. His passing, shooting, and shot-blocking are all uprgrades over colton, who best served as muscle of the bench.

 

[98VQueens]

Ralph has far more potential on the offensive end to not start alongside Trevor. His passing, shooting, and shot-blocking are all uprgrades over colton, who best served as muscle of the bench.

I wouldn't call him an upgrade on passing, he holds the ball to long. Ralph makes his shots more difficult, by turning a would-be dunk into a hook shot. I expect Iverson to have a better fg percentage this season if he continues to finish at the rim. Iverson is actually a slightly better shot-blocker looking at mpg and not looking at mpg it's still very close.

 

[omniscient]

Ralph has much better assist to turnover ratio than Iverson 1.24 to 0.45. Ralph 1.6 blocks in 25 minutes. Iverson .9 blocks in 17 minutes. Do the math, Ralph is better. This is consistent pattern over last two years. Ralph had at least three times more dunks than Iverson last year. Where are you getting your information?

 

[ShowinGoldyLove]

All of those stats are fine and dandy...but if you look at the way Colton was progressing at the end of the year, he was easily outplaying Ralph. Those stats were acquired over the majority of the year where Ralph was a better post. However, it was readily apparent to anyone who watched the last 8+ games that Colton was playing much better than Ralph, and deserved to be getting more PT.

I hope for his sake that Ralph has improved markedly in the off-season, because if the end of last season was any indication, Colton may be seeing the floor more than RSIII this year. Let's all agree that it's good to have this problem...2 bigs improving, challenging each other for PT.

 

[omniscient]

Every player has ups and downs in a given season, that is reason to review stats from an entire season or from conference games before declaring a trend from a small sample. For example Iverson's first thirteen Big Ten games he scored 41 points, Ralph 121 points. There is an even bigger discrepancy in blocks. Let's just wait and see what happens before making factless statements.

 

[ShowinGoldyLove]

Let's just wait and see what happens before making factless statements.

Absolutely nothing "factless" about my statement.

Here are the stats for the last 7 games of the year:

Iverson: 19 min/game, 9 pts/game, 4 rebs/game, 12 blocks, 9 turnovers, 65% FG (28/43)
Sampson: 24 min/game, 6 pts/game, 4 rebs/game, 5 blocks, 14 turnovers, 42% FG (18/45)

Despite playing 5 fewer minutes per game, Iverson was superior to Sampson in every major statistical category over the last 7 games of the year.

Obviously, players have ups and downs, I didn't dispute that. However, the stats to close the year support the idea that Colton was/is really coming on strong and improving his game. There is no clear "better" player, at least not at this point.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

I actually think a lineup of Colt-Ralph-Mbakwe-Hoff-Devoe could get a little run (playing zone on defense), but that would be more of a gimmicky/rare occasion type of thing.

I personally think you will pretty much a three man rotation but that Ralph will be a starter. RSIII has a game that is a bit different to Colt and Trevor and I think would probably be a better match with either of them than they are with each other (not that they are a bad paring).

 

[omniscient]

That is my point exactly making inferences from a small sample of data. After a largely ineffective Big Ten regular season, Iveson had three good games in Big ten tournament followed by poor games in finale and NCAA tournament. Now he is world beater and Ralph can't
play. I'm not buying. Ralph's versatility should insure him plenty of opportunities this year. He's proven to be effective in low post, mid post, and high post. Has range out to three point line and has demonstrated that he can drive from three point line and finish at rim.

 

[Blizzard]

Ralph's versatility should insure him plenty of opportunities this year. He's proven to be effective in low post, mid post, and high post. Has range out to three point line and has demonstrated that he can drive from three point line and finish at rim.

Ralph is a great player, however, one thing that he's consistently been is soft. When he takes that step up to use that big body and bang with people he'll be a much more complete player, imo. Colt's like a bull out there. Ralph needs to bring that same physicality ( I hate that word ) to the table.

 

[ChemEGopher]

Absolutely nothing "factless" about my statement.

Here are the stats for the last 7 games of the year:

Iverson: 19 min/game, 9 pts/game, 4 rebs/game, 12 blocks, 9 turnovers, 65% FG (28/43)
Sampson: 24 min/game, 6 pts/game, 4 rebs/game, 5 blocks, 14 turnovers, 42% FG (18/45)

Despite playing 5 fewer minutes per game, Iverson was superior to Sampson in every major statistical category over the last 7 games of the year.

Obviously, players have ups and downs, I didn't dispute that. However, the stats to close the year support the idea that Colton was/is really coming on strong and improving his game. There is no clear "better" player, at least not at this point.

Thanks for putting these stats together. Although it is a small sample size I would argue that these were the most important games of the year and played against the stiffest competition, therefore player performance in these games is the most meaningful. Ralph had a lot of big games last year against our weaker non-conference opponents.

Alas, the whole reason I brought this topic up was not to bash Ralph. It's obvious Ralph can do somethings on the court athletically that Colton can't. I just thought it was interesting how we have heard multiple good things about Colton improving this off-season, especially considering how he finished out last season on a high note. As ShowinGoldyLove said, this is a good problem to have.

 

[omniscient]

This is another false statement. Ralph played better in Big Ten regular season than Iverson by a lot. Check the box scores. Every game in Big Ten regular season is big and not meaningless.

 

[Gold Vision]

This is another false statement. Ralph played better in Big Ten regular season than Iverson by a lot. Check the box scores. Every game in Big Ten regular season is big and not meaningless.

Did you actually watch the games towards the end of the season? Or are you just going by the composite box scores? There was no doubt that Colton was gaining more confidence towards the end of the season and was much more effective as a true 5. People are going by the way things were trending towards the end of the season. To say Ralph outplayed Colt throughout the Big 10 season is just plain wrong. Ralph had some big games, and Colt had some big games. Both had a tendency to disappear.

With that said, I think both of them will play about equal minutes this year and both will benefit greatly from being on the court at the same time or with Mbakwe.

 

[98VQueens]

Where are you getting your information?

I accidentally compared Iverson 08-09 stats vs. Ralph's 09-10. Career averages at 20mpg each Iverson is at 1.27 blocks per game and Ralph 1.34.

Also, Iverson has a career FG% of 542.5 Ralph 501.5

Ralph had at least three times more dunks than Iverson last year.

False. Where are you getting your information from?

Has range out to three point line and has demonstrated that he can drive from three point line and finish at rim.

Say what? Ralph almost always goes away from the defender and basket.

Iverson: 19 min/game, 9 pts/game, 4 rebs/game, 12 blocks, 9 turnovers, 65% FG (28/43)
Sampson: 24 min/game, 6 pts/game, 4 rebs/game, 5 blocks, 14 turnovers, 42% FG (18/45)

Despite playing 5 fewer minutes per game, Iverson was superior to Sampson in every major statistical category over the last 7 games of the year.

Although it is a small sample size I would argue that these were the most important games of the year and played against the stiffest competition, therefore player performance in these games is the most meaningful.

+1

 

[omniscient]

These are Ralph's stats from the entire Big Ten regular season 2009-10. Ralph 54%FG(49-91), 8.5 points per game, 6.2 rebounds per game, 24 blocks(1.5avg/gm), 24 turnovers and 31 assists. Ralph played in 16 games.

Iverson's stats from entire Big Ten regular season 2009-10. 43FG%( 24-56), 3.75 points per game, 3.5 rebounds per game, 10 blocks( 0.55avg/gm), 22 turnovers and 10 assists. Iverson played in all 18 games.

Ralph had 25 dunks during the entire season. Iverson had 5 dunks during the entire season. During Big Ten regular season Ralph had 14 dunks and Iverson 2 dunks. Data obtained from GopherSports. Remember Ralph's dunk at Penn State when he drove baseline from three point line and dunked on two players. That 's called finishing at rim.

 

[underground629]

Do you remember the Xavier game or are you just looking at the total points he scored? He's one of the few players who played well that game. I can't speak for others, but if Ralph and Iverson play like they both did at the end of the year (or even close to that), Iverson is the better player. Yes though, Ralph was better for the majority of the season. It is frustrating though that when Iverson dominates and Ralph struggles, Ralph still plays more.

Ralph has demonstrated he has range out to the 3 point line and can drive from there? I can think of a single example of each. I assume that's a joke.

That is my point exactly making inferences from a small sample of data. After a largely ineffective Big Ten regular season, Iveson had three good games in Big ten tournament followed by poor games in finale and NCAA tournament. Now he is world beater and Ralph can't
play. I'm not buying. Ralph's versatility should insure him plenty of opportunities this year. He's proven to be effective in low post, mid post, and high post. Has range out to three point line and has demonstrated that he can drive from three point line and finish at rim.

 

[ChemEGopher]

Ralph finished off the dribble with a dunk once. I almost fell out of my chair when I saw it happen live. It was awesome, but it's not something I'm expecting to see from RSIII on a regular basis.

No one is arguing that Colton had better overall stats than Ralph last season. Point is, if you watched the end of the season last year, when we needed to string together multiple big wins to make the tourney, Colton was our best big man. Anyone who actually watched the games would agree. Hopefully they both have improved this season b/c they each bring a different but equally valuable skill set to the table.

 

[monsonville]

chemEgopher.. im calling you out on this one! terrible call!

 

[underground629]

If you're just referring to the comment above yours, he didn't say anything that wasn't true in there. Colton was clearly playing better at the end of last season. Is Sampson clearly outplaying him so far this year? Absolutely.

chemEgopher.. im calling you out on this one! terrible call!

 

[ChemEGopher]

chemEgopher.. im calling you out on this one! terrible call!

Haha. I will gladly eat crow on this if proven wrong one but I don't think the debate is over yet. I wasn't able to see the game last night but please keep in mind that Ralph's two 20+ point performances this year have come against teams with much smaller front lines.

If you're just referring to the comment above yours, he didn't say anything that wasn't true in there. Colton was clearly playing better at the end of last season. Is Sampson clearly outplaying him so far this year? Absolutely.

Thanks for the back up underground. You're exactly right. I will always stand by my statement that Colton outplayed Ralph down the stretch last season. My main justification for starting this thread was that last we saw Colton and Ralph, Colton looked like he was the better player. After seeing Ralph knock down a few outside shots early this season I am getting more comfortable with the fact that Ralph and Colton are different players with skillsets that can compliment one another. Here's to both of them continuing to improve!

 

[ChemEGopher]

smug face