Now that Demry Croft can no longer redshirt, who should start at QB the rest of year?

Now that Demry Croft can no longer redshirt, who should start at QB the rest of year?

  • Play Leidner as he still has experience and gives us best chance to win.

    Votes: 25 15.0%

  • Gotta roll with Croft now. He is the future and gives us best chance to win this year

    Votes: 128 76.6%

  • Other

    Votes: 14 8.4%
  • Total voters
    167
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Whoever starts, you need to put a FB in there to shore up some blocking. JMHO
 

i'll join in the speculation. Nelson got sat for a kid that had less qb skills and ability. yeah it frosted PNels a22 that some lakeville kid who couldn't throw a spiral was put in for him so he went into the staff and barked back.....and that was the beginning of the end. without having seen #7 or #9 go through passing drills i would put $ on #9 everyday. oh, and i am confident Nels was told he play in Madison if he signed at the U. we all get to speculate.
 

jaymil said:
I'm just not buying the thought that the staff made promises to Nelson. He DID NOT have a Wisconsin offer. For all the talk about how "needed" Nelson was, Minnesota was his only big offer.
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CRG likes to call anyone who backed ML7 a PN9 hater and preaches of how PN9 has been wronged by these coaches and the fans on this site whenever he gets the chance. Everything he wrote is speculation, which is fine for this site, but should be represented for what it is. He is the biggest PN9 supporter on this site - and it ain't even close.

Personally, I thought PN9 was better than ML7, but let's all be honest that it was close. Neither was very good when they were both here. I wrote Phil off the second he was making demands to this staff, and I'm glad the coaches did too. ML7 hasn't worked out, but how folks look back and talk about PN9 like he was some budding star (which to be fair CRG didn't) that the coaches "chased off" is beyond me.
 


We need to stop dwelling on the past as far as liedner vs nelson. Nelson is gone and he isn't even starting at ecu, so it's not like we shunned a star qb. From what I remember, they were both comparable during games. We stuck with liedner though, and he seemed to be the higher caliber person/leader; he hasn't brutally assaulted someone yet at least. Croft did have a couple light throws to the sideline, but he also threw a couple of bullets. He needs to get more consistent with his throws, but there is hope. I think they will play both qbs against Purdue unless Liedner has a great game.
 


wait!what? said:
i'll join in the speculation. Nelson got sat for a kid that had less qb skills and ability. yeah it frosted PNels a22 that some lakeville kid who couldn't throw a spiral was put in for him so he went into the staff and barked back.....and that was the beginning of the end. without having seen #7 or #9 go through passing drills i would put $ on #9 everyday. oh, and i am confident Nels was told he play in Madison if he signed at the U. we all get to speculate.
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Is this referencing the bowl game against Syracuse? If so, would you not put in the QB who you think gives you the best chance to win that game? Nelson was bad to start that game and was really bad the previous two games. Leidner actually played okay.

Nelson had no one to blame but himself. He got benched because he was sucking it up.
 

Spoofin said:
CRG likes to call anyone who backed ML7 a PN9 hater and preaches of how PN9 has been wronged by these coaches and the fans on this site whenever he gets the chance. Everything he wrote is speculation, which is fine for this site, but should be represented for what it is. He is the biggest PN9 supporter on this site - and it ain't even close.

Personally, I thought PN9 was better than ML7, but let's all be honest that it was close. Neither was very good when they were both here. I wrote Phil off the second he was making demands to this staff, and I'm glad the coaches did too. ML7 hasn't worked out, but how folks look back and talk about PN9 like he was some budding star (which to be fair CRG didn't) that the coaches "chased off" is beyond me.
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I said Nelson was better than Leidner. I said we'd regret his departure. I said what he did in that street fight was wrong, stupid, gutless, etc. I also said the other guy was equally at fault, that Nelson would plead down & never do jail time. I'm feeling pretty good about all of those calls right now.

Limey screwed the pooch on a number of levels. One of those being his decision to choose Leidner over Nelson. Another being his talent evaluation. He's got us starting our 6th QB in 5 years, 5 of which have been Freshmen. This is his mess.
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
Limey screwed the pooch on a number of levels. <b>One of those being his decision to choose Leidner over Nelson. </b>Another being his talent evaluation. He's got trying our starting our 6th QB in 5 years, 5 of which have been Freshmen. This is his mess.
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I'm not going back to Mankato with you, but on the above I agree it is a mess and I think all the coaches are at fault. Limey at the top. Where we go in different directions is PN9 wasn't much, if any better than ML7 at the time they were both here. I preferred PN9 as well, as I thought his potential was higher, but man they were similar at the time and neither was that good. There is no need to romanticize PN9's ability when he was here.

On the bolded, that isn't how it went down. PN9 wanted a guarantee he would be the starter and the coaches wouldn't give it to him. He pouted and left - no one chose Liedner and told Phil he would be a back-up. Maybe Phil thought the writing was on the wall, but clearly he would have had more opportunities to prove them wrong. He wanted it handed to him and no one should be given that - certainly not someone of his ability.
 

boofbonser said:
We need to stop dwelling on the past as far as liedner vs nelson. Nelson is gone and he isn't even starting at ecu, so it's not like we shunned a star qb. From what I remember, they were both comparable during games. We stuck with liedner though, and he seemed to be the higher caliber person/leader; he hasn't brutally assaulted someone yet at least. Croft did have a couple light throws to the sideline, but he also threw a couple of bullets. He needs to get more consistent with his throws, but there is hope. I think they will play both qbs against Purdue unless Liedner has a great game.
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Leidner sure is nice. Our whole O-line is nice. Where's nice gotten us? We need more swagger, less Jesus, imo. Also, I don't buy the leader thing. Leaders emerge, they're not appointed. Leidner was appointed. I have no doubt he's a hard worker, he's clearly a tough guy in the sense he plays through pain, but his psyche is booby soft & he has zero swagger. You think the players on the team look at Mitch and feel confident that he'll get it done?

Nelson btw, was the one brutally assaulted if you ever saw the video. If Kolstad hadn't intentionally escalated the situation, getting nose-to-nose with Nelson telling him he f*cked his girlfriend, that she was a whore, etc. as she stood there listening, then Nelson wouldn't have pushed him, and Kolstad wouldn't have gotten a run at him from behind and launched that cowardly sucker punch as Nelson walked away, then Kolstad wouldn't have gotten kicked in the head. Doesn't make the kick right, but you live by the cheap shot, you die by the cheap shot. The way you intentionally framed it makes Nelson seem like some psychopathic predator, rather than a guy who just got attacked from behind by a bigger, older guy.
 



Spoofin said:
I'm not going back to Mankato with you, but on the above I agree it is a mess and I think all the coaches are at fault. Limey at the top. Where we go in different directions is PN9 wasn't much, if any better than ML7 at the time they were both here. I preferred PN9 as well, as I thought his potential was higher, but man they were similar at the time and neither was that good. There is no need to romanticize PN9's ability when he was here.

On the bolded, that isn't how it went down. PN9 wanted a guarantee he would be the starter and the coaches wouldn't give it to him. He pouted and left - no one chose Liedner and told Phil he would be a back-up. Maybe Phil thought the writing was on the wall, but clearly he would have had more opportunities to prove them wrong. He wanted it handed to him and no one should be given that - certainly not someone of his ability.
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You've only heard one side of the story.
 


Costa Rican Gopher said:
Leidner sure is nice. Our whole O-line is nice. Where's nice gotten us? We need more swagger, less Jesus, imo. Also, I don't buy the leader thing. Leaders emerge, they're not appointed. Leidner was appointed. I have no doubt he's a hard worker, he's clearly a tough guy in the sense he plays through pain, but his psyche is booby soft & he has zero swagger. You think the players on the team look at Mitch and feel confident that he'll get it done?

Nelson btw, was the one brutally assaulted if you ever saw the video. If Kolstad hadn't intentionally escalated the situation, getting nose-to-nose with Nelson telling him he f*cked his girlfriend, that she was a whore, etc. as she stood there listening, then Nelson wouldn't have pushed him, and Kolstad wouldn't have gotten a run at him from behind and launched that cowardly sucker punch as Nelson walked away, then Kolstad wouldn't have gotten kicked in the head. Doesn't make the kick right, but you live by the cheap shot, you die by the cheap shot. The way you intentionally framed it makes Nelson seem like some psychopathic predator, rather than a guy who just got attacked from behind by a bigger, older guy.
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If Nelson had swagger, he would have said "bring on the competition, by the time the offseason is over, there will be no doubt as to who should start" as opposed to "name me the starter and exempt me from competition despite the fact that my last three performances were absolute garbage".
 

Costa Rican Gopher said:
I said Nelson was better than Leidner. I said we'd regret his departure. I said what he did in that street fight was wrong, stupid, gutless, etc. I also said the other guy was equally at fault, that Nelson would plead down & never do jail time. I'm feeling pretty good about all of those calls right now.

Limey screwed the pooch on a number of levels. One of those being his decision to choose Leidner over Nelson. Another being his talent evaluation. He's got us starting our 6th QB in 5 years, 5 of which have been Freshmen. This is his mess.
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I'm confused by some of you saying this. When did this happen? Are you just talking about the bowl game? If that's the case, then I'm not sure I want a guy on the team who transfers after getting benched in one game.

I don't think anyone here really knows for sure what happened that off-season. Some say the coaches named Leidner the starter for the following season. Others say Nelson wasn't happy he had to compete with Leidner or that he wasn't happy with the offense we were running.
 



Spoofin said:
Well, at least you have him a chance before writing him off. How about we just move to Perra? smh
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I meant he's not better today. If people want to mail it in, so be it. I don't believe that a week's worth of snaps in practice is going to change things for him. ML led the team to a Jan. 1 bowl last year. Maybe it's time to start calling a Tebow playbook for him. He's a tough kid. He seems to be better all around when his nose is bloody. If he gets hurt running it then put Croft in.
 

I am really torn on what I think is the best decision here. Unfortunately, neither of the two options is that appealing. It would be more exciting to go with Croft and it might be the best for the program long term.

My concerns with going with Croft:

The offense as a whole is in shambles right now and coming in and failing might wreck him mentally for future seasons. The second concern is that Croft is very slight physically and it was especially noticeable when he took no more than an average hit near the sideline late and flew back like 3 yards. Getting Croft hurt because he's not physically ready to play would be unfortunate. The final issue is I have no idea if he's mentally ready to play at this level. It would be surprising if a true freshman QB of his pedigree (lightly recruited, not one of the kids going to all the elite passing camps, etc) was ready to play for a power 5 school.

On the other hand, Mitch is at a place where it's tough to keep rolling him out there. The issues with his mechanics, ball placement, and ball security are all still there and show no signs of improvement. I feel like he's actually regressed as a runner (possibly due to injury) as well. With that said, Mitch is certainly a tough,veteran kid and the Gophers might need that presence in the huddle right now.

I guess I come back to the fact that you don't pull a kids redshirt in the 5th game of the year for him to sit. I would probably lean towards continuing to play Leidner (maybe give Perra a shot if things don't improve) if Croft didn't play against Northwestern.
 

How the hell did a thread mostly about starting Croft now, get hijacked so bad with a
pissing match about Nelson and Leidner and what happened in the 2013 season?

jayzuz...
 

How can people seriously think Mitch gives us a better chance to win? He struggled to lead our offense in the non-conference and put up a goose egg in our first B1G game. He can't pass and he has apparently lost his ability to run the ball as well. He has never been a great athlete and is beginning to turn into turn over machine. Go with Croft, he at least throws spirals and has the athleticism to make plays on the ground. If Mitch continues to start I'm done with this team.
 


Does this mean Mitch needs a refresher course at the Manning Academy?
 



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EG#9 said:
I am really torn on what I think is the best decision here. Unfortunately, neither of the two options is that appealing. It would be more exciting to go with Croft and it might be the best for the program long term.

My concerns with going with Croft:

The offense as a whole is in shambles right now and coming in and failing might wreck him mentally for future seasons. The second concern is that Croft is very slight physically and it was especially noticeable when he took no more than an average hit near the sideline late and flew back like 3 yards. Getting Croft hurt because he's not physically ready to play would be unfortunate. The final issue is I have no idea if he's mentally ready to play at this level. It would be surprising if a true freshman QB of his pedigree (lightly recruited, not one of the kids going to all the elite passing camps, etc) was ready to play for a power 5 school.

On the other hand, Mitch is at a place where it's tough to keep rolling him out there. The issues with his mechanics, ball placement, and ball security are all still there and show no signs of improvement. I feel like he's actually regressed as a runner (possibly due to injury) as well. With that said, Mitch is certainly a tough,veteran kid and the Gophers might need that presence in the huddle right now.

I guess I come back to the fact that you don't pull a kids redshirt in the 5th game of the year for him to sit. I would probably lean towards continuing to play Leidner (maybe give Perra a shot if things don't improve) if Croft didn't play against Northwestern.
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I have the same concerns about Croft - I wish he would have stayed redshirted. I would have rather seen Perra be given a chance ahead of him.
 

Here's my take:
I didn't want them to pull crofts RS, why? It started with give him more time to learn, bulk up so he doesn't get hurt, and time for chemistry with some of the freshmen recievers to build. Over the past few games it turned into: Don't pull it, because he deserves a better offensive. Our OL is in shambles because of injuries, so he won't have nearly the time he would want/need to examine the feild during a pass. Our WRs, while I think are better than last year, haven't really shown up. Whether that was leidner and his passing or not, we'll find out. If it's the latter, using Croft may be no better than leidner, and we just wasted a year of prep.

Now that the RS is burned, you have to commit. At least equal playing time between the two. Run passing and running plays with both, because they both need it, and if we only ever pass with one and run with the other, we're back to being too predictable (not that we aren't now that croft has his RS burned, but there's hope). If one starts to shine, and the other doesn't, reward said player. Will it be croft or leidner? The best we can do is guess.

The play calling has also been too reserved. Why? we don't know. LG/JK could be stubborn, or the team isn't ready for it. We don't know what has been going on in practice, maybe they haven't gotten to the ability level we need to open the playbook. Maybe they have, but aren't running the plays right consistently, we don't know. Should we try to mix it up even if we aren't ready? Yes. Might as well do it now, when we've blown our hopes for the season. Keep in mind LG has called interesting and dynamic games before (see Nebraska two years ago), but the team was different back then, and JK was not present. We don't know the limiting factor here, so all we can do is speculate.
 

gopher7 said:
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I really hope this is just coach speak and he isn't going to do the rotating QB scenario.
 

Taji34 said:
Here's my take:
I didn't want them to pull crofts RS, why? It started with give him more time to learn, bulk up so he doesn't get hurt, and time for chemistry with some of the freshmen recievers to build. Over the past few games it turned into: Don't pull it, because he deserves a better offensive. Our OL is in shambles because of injuries, so he won't have nearly the time he would want/need to examine the feild during a pass. Our WRs, while I think are better than last year, haven't really shown up. Whether that was leidner and his passing or not, we'll find out. If it's the latter, using Croft may be no better than leidner, and we just wasted a year of prep.

Now that the RS is burned, you have to commit. At least equal playing time between the two. Run passing and running plays with both, because they both need it, and if we only ever pass with one and run with the other, we're back to being too predictable (not that we aren't now that croft has his RS burned, but there's hope). If one starts to shine, and the other doesn't, reward said player. Will it be croft or leidner? The best we can do is guess.

The play calling has also been too reserved. Why? we don't know. LG/JK could be stubborn, or the team isn't ready for it. We don't know what has been going on in practice, maybe they haven't gotten to the ability level we need to open the playbook. Maybe they have, but aren't running the plays right consistently, we don't know. Should we try to mix it up even if we aren't ready? Yes. Might as well do it now, when we've blown our hopes for the season. Keep in mind LG has called interesting and dynamic games before (see Nebraska two years ago), but the team was different back then, and JK was not present. We don't know the limiting factor here, so all we can do is speculate.
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I think a portion of those who wanted Croft to remain redshirted are scared he might be exposed. Better him sit on the bench providing unproven hope for the future rather than being exposed. With the offense over the past 5 years there have been various head in the sand excuses from some the fanbase:

-Brick by brick, we'll focus on the defense at the detriment of the offense intentionally
-Stability of offensive coordinator/staff superceeds results, Jerry knows what he's doing without question
-Mitch is exactly like Adam Weber and being maligned without reason
-We are red shirting a starting basketball team of wide receivers who will blow the doors off B1G defenses
-We have to play conservative because we don't trust young guys or we're too injured
 


Leidner is going to start this weekend, and maybe Croft will get a few series. This is the most winnable game on the schedule, and Leidner still gives them the best chance to win and gain some momentum going into the Nebraska game. Lose this game, the season's over and it's Croft's team the rest of the way.
 

beavergopher said:
Does this mean Mitch needs a refresher course at the Manning Academy?
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I recall an article where Mitch says that Manning approached him and asked if MN was any good. I'm beginning to wonder why Manning asked this question.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Leidner is going to start this weekend, and maybe Croft will get a few series. This is the most winnable game on the schedule, and Leidner still gives them the best chance to win and gain some momentum going into the Nebraska game. Lose this game, the season's over and it's Croft's team the rest of the way.
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whatever you see for the qb play against PU is what you will see the rest of the season.
 

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