Mount Rushmore - Cheating Coaches

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oak_street1981

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Who would be the best five coaches to add to a Mount Rushmore tribute for coaches who won a lot and cheated, either by paying players, abandoning all standards for admittance to the school, or committing academic fraud? A special wing should be added for schools admitting players that could not read. We can call that the Jimmy V wing.

My list:

1. John Wooden
2. Roy Williams or Dean Smith
3. Tark
4. Any Kentucky Coach- I'll pick Joe B Hall over "Cal"
5. Lou Henson or several Michigan coaches
 

oak_street1981 said:
Who would be the best five coaches to add to a Mount Rushmore tribute for coaches who won a lot and cheated, either by paying players, abandoning all standards for admittance to the school, or committing academic fraud? A special wing should be added for schools admitting players that could not read. We can call that the Jimmy V wing.

My list:

1. John Wooden
2. Roy Williams or Dean Smith
3. Tark
4. Any Kentucky Coach- I'll pick Joe B Hall over "Cal"
5. Lou Henson or several Michigan coaches
Click to expand...

Not sure what you're spewing here...

You would have to provide some links... to refute...

Wooden recruited Lee Alcindor and is probably the greatest coach of all time.

Roy recruited Jacque Vaughn, Raef among others, that were all big 8...academic

Tark I'll give you but he should be moved up the ranks but Augmen and even Johnson have proved to be productive members of society

Tubby refutes number 4

Michigan I'm too tired to think of a total rebuff, BUT it says something one of their former coaches is at Harvard...

Your missing Musselman from Cleveland St.....probably the worst offender of all time



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

oak_street1981 said:
Who would be the best five coaches to add to a Mount Rushmore tribute for coaches who won a lot and cheated, either by paying players, abandoning all standards for admittance to the school, or committing academic fraud? A special wing should be added for schools admitting players that could not read. We can call that the Jimmy V wing.

My list:

1. John Wooden
2. Roy Williams or Dean Smith
3. Tark
4. Any Kentucky Coach- I'll pick Joe B Hall over "Cal"
5. Lou Henson or several Michigan coaches
Click to expand...

When did Mt. Rushmore get room for five?
 

Hmm, never heard much about Wooden being a cheater.

1. Dean Smith - somebody gets credit for 22 years of fake classes!
2. Jerry Tarkanian - Just cause they couldn't prove it doesn't mean he wasn't doing something illegal.
3. John Calipari - Two schools got probation after he left. Kentucky is just above getting caught or the need to cheat.
4. Larry Brown - how many times did he get caught?
 

Crackhouse said:
Not sure what you're spewing here...

You would have to provide some links... to refute...

Wooden recruited Lee Alcindor and is probably the greatest coach of all time.

Roy recruited Jacque Vaughn, Raef among others, that were all big 8...academic

Tark I'll give you but he should be moved up the ranks but Augmen and even Johnson have proved to be productive members of society

Tubby refutes number 4

Michigan I'm too tired to think of a total rebuff, BUT it says something one of their former coaches is at Harvard...

Your missing Musselman from Cleveland St.....probably the worst offender of all time



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

I'm too lazy to find/post links but I completely agree with the list with the exception of moving Michigan way to the top. They are a lot more Lincoln than Teddy Roosevelt on the Mount Rushmore of cheating.

UCLA- Wooden is by no means the saint that he is portrayed. Google UCLA Sam Gilbert.

As for Roy Williams, have you not heard of the fake class issue that the NCAA has been avoiding for the last 10 years at UNC? Think Clem Haskins but over a 20-30 year period.Dean Smith was certainly involved as well.

For Kentucky, with the exception of Tubby and Pitino, that is essentially a who's who of cheating coaches going back to Rupp. Some who were caught (Sutton, Rupp, etc.) and some who were not. I truly feel that Calipari does not cheat anymore mainly because he put in so many years (from Umass to Memphis to recruiting Anthony Davis to UK) of cheating to create his recruiting machine where players can come to his NBA daycare for seven months.

As for Michigan, kudos to Tommy Amaker (the Harvard guy you referenced) and Beilein for cleaning up that hole. Google Ed Martin UM. The worst pay for play in NCAA history (although Gilbert and UCLA were probably right there with him). He was only caught for his "assistance" during the Steve Fisher/Brian Ellerbe era but it is well documented that his cheating goes back through the Bill Frieder years. Which players were involved? Essentially all of the Detroit area players. All I can say is that UM is lucky that Martin died of a heart attack during/or right before? the grand jury investigation and spilled the beans about just how deep and far back the cheating went including the 89 championship team.
 


Bill Self is working hard to put himself on this list as well.

Looking at who can consistently recruit in Chicago is a good gauge of who is willing to bend the rules to appease the plethora of dirty HS and AAU coaches in that area.
 

spartans67 said:
Bill Self is working hard to put himself on this list as well.

Looking at who can consistently recruit in Chicago is a good gauge of who is willing to bend the rules to appease the plethora of dirty HS and AAU coaches in that area.
Click to expand...

Anyone that thinks the elite programs in college basketball are playing by the rules is fooling themselves. One or two top players can win you a National Championship so you know there is all kinds of money changing hands behind the scenes when those top guys are being recruited.
 

Jim Boeheim

Steve Alford

Coach K

Jim Calhoun

Bill Self

Lute Olson

Todd Bozeman

Lou Henson

Bruce Pearl, Scott Drew

Rick Pitino

So this is just from a few google searches of coaches who popped into my head randomly. I didn't bother with Roy Williams, Dean Smith, Wooden, Calipari, or Tarkanian. A few years ago, cbs sports' college basketball writers polled 100 coaches on who was the biggest cheater amongst coaches in CBB. The quote that stands out to me? "They all (expletive) cheat. Every high level coach cheats."

Even the purported clean coaches have scandals attached to them, if not through recruiting, through other incidents. Izzo-do you recall this from 2010? Bo Ryan's affair? Bobby Knight staked his claim as running a clean program, while simultaneously existing as an overall awful human being.

There are no saints in college basketball. Forget Mount Rushmore and try the Terracotta Warriors. Any Gopher fan should know that after Clem's house collapsed upon itself. That they are being governed by as corrupt of an organization as the NCAA, which once cited Rick Majerus for violations in buying pizza for the team's film sessions, makes the whole charade even more of a folly.
 

Always thought this survey of college coaches was interesting. Obviously it offers no proof so take it for what it's worth, but gives insight to what people in the business think. (Also, it's five years old and was only asked about current coaches. Think ESPN did another one more recently, but I can't find it.)

http://www.cbssports.com/college-ba...eived-to-be-the-biggest-cheater-in-the-sport/

I'll add that Bruce Pearl was out of coaching (due to a show-cause penalty) at the time of this survey. Gotta imagine he would have gotten a few votes. I was in Knoxville just after he left Tennessee, and found it amazing how much the Vol fans still loved him. I don't know if that speaks to the culture of cheating at Tennessee and in the SEC or the intelligence of Tennesseans or a combination of both, but it blew me away how much they respected a coach who cheated and lied about it AND tried to get others to lie too.
 



So this is just from a few google searches of coaches who popped into my head randomly. I didn't bother with Roy Williams, Dean Smith, Wooden, Calipari, or Tarkanian. A few years ago, cbs sports' college basketball writers polled 100 coaches on who was the biggest cheater amongst coaches in CBB. The quote that stands out to me? "They all (expletive) cheat. Every high level coach cheats."

Ha, you beat me to it.
 

oak_street1981 said:
Who would be the best five coaches to add to a Mount Rushmore tribute for coaches who won a lot and cheated, either by paying players, abandoning all standards for admittance to the school, or committing academic fraud? A special wing should be added for schools admitting players that could not read. We can call that the Jimmy V wing.

My list:

1. John Wooden
2. Roy Williams or Dean Smith
3. Tark
4. Any Kentucky Coach- I'll pick Joe B Hall over "Cal"
5. Lou Henson or several Michigan coaches
Click to expand...

Slick Cal absolutely has to be on this list. Probably in the #1 slot.
 

One comment I meant to make in my original post about Cal and Tark-you could probably make an awfully good argument that these are the two most egregious rule-breakers in college basketball history. I've always loved Tark and I have developed a strange sort of respect for Calipari over the years, due to the fact that I feel he's pretty damn honest about who he is and what he's looking to accomplish. I'd trust his word over the sanctimonious prick Jim Boeheim's each and every day of the year. Is he a cheat? Probably so. Has he exploited the one and done system more frequently and better than any other coach? Pretty much so. But I feel that he is as straight up with his players as any coach in the nation and he aims to put his players in the NBA as soon as they deem themselves ready. Unlike other coaches, I've never seen Cal belittle a player's abilities when making the early entry decision. He's definitely not my favorite dude coaching, but I respect that he cuts through the hypocrisy and b.s. that college basketball wades in.
 

My choice: It's hard to top former Memphis coach Dana Kirk. His prison time is a bonus.

http://www.espn.com/gen/s/2001/0604/1209371.html

Trouble was, Kirk and his assistants cut corners and abused their power. Only six of Kirk's 60 four-year scholarship players earned degrees, including just two of 12 on the 1984-85 roster. Some of the most talented players wound up driving luxury cars supplied by boosters. Government witnesses testified in his 1988 trial that, among other things, Kirk accepted money from boosters for players, sought kickbacks from tournament promoters and sold game tickets for up to five times their face value.

Kirk was forced to leave after the 1985-86 season and the NCAA eventually slapped a two-year probation and a one-year postseason ban on Memphis State and forced the school to return nearly $1 million in tournament earnings. Kirk served four months in a federal minimum-security prison in Montgomery, Ala., but has landed, as always, on his feet.

One of his many friends – Kirk's name-dropping ability is, frankly, astonishing – owned a string of radio stations, so today he hosts the "Dana Kirk Show." He drives a big SUV, lives in a gorgeous home full of art and candles, is married (for the second time) to a beautiful lawyer and is finishing up his second book. The working title: "The Slickest Rat in the Barn".
 




Hard not to put Grilled Turkey on the list.
 


bizzle22 said:
Always thought this survey of college coaches was interesting. Obviously it offers no proof so take it for what it's worth, but gives insight to what people in the business think. (Also, it's five years old and was only asked about current coaches. Think ESPN did another one more recently, but I can't find it.)

http://www.cbssports.com/college-ba...eived-to-be-the-biggest-cheater-in-the-sport/

I'll add that Bruce Pearl was out of coaching (due to a show-cause penalty) at the time of this survey. Gotta imagine he would have gotten a few votes. I was in Knoxville just after he left Tennessee, and found it amazing how much the Vol fans still loved him. I don't know if that speaks to the culture of cheating at Tennessee and in the SEC or the intelligence of Tennesseans or a combination of both, but it blew me away how much they respected a coach who cheated and lied about it AND tried to get others to lie too.
Click to expand...

Considering how many people here say stuff like "I don't care what the record books say, the 1996-97 season happened, I was there for it," it doesn't surprise me too much to know that a cheater to brings a program high levels of success will still be loved. Ohio State fans seem to still love Jim Tressel. The Fab Five at Michigan seem to be spoken of in adulation as much as scorn. I'd guess UNC fans won't hold too much ill will toward athletes who took fake classes.
 

Clem isn't getting any love?

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 


Ignatius L Hoops said:
My choice: It's hard to top former Memphis coach Dana Kirk. His prison time is a bonus.

http://www.espn.com/gen/s/2001/0604/1209371.html

Trouble was, Kirk and his assistants cut corners and abused their power. Only six of Kirk's 60 four-year scholarship players earned degrees, including just two of 12 on the 1984-85 roster. Some of the most talented players wound up driving luxury cars supplied by boosters. Government witnesses testified in his 1988 trial that, among other things, Kirk accepted money from boosters for players, sought kickbacks from tournament promoters and sold game tickets for up to five times their face value.

Kirk was forced to leave after the 1985-86 season and the NCAA eventually slapped a two-year probation and a one-year postseason ban on Memphis State and forced the school to return nearly $1 million in tournament earnings. Kirk served four months in a federal minimum-security prison in Montgomery, Ala., but has landed, as always, on his feet.

One of his many friends – Kirk's name-dropping ability is, frankly, astonishing – owned a string of radio stations, so today he hosts the "Dana Kirk Show." He drives a big SUV, lives in a gorgeous home full of art and candles, is married (for the second time) to a beautiful lawyer and is finishing up his second book. The working title: "The Slickest Rat in the Barn".
Click to expand...

I remember reading a piece on Bob Huggins years ago while at Cincy. At the time he'd had something like 18 convicted felons on his rosters, but had never had a player graduate.
 



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