Mark Coyle in response to is Gophers Men's basketball HC Ben Johnson's job safe (Video)

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MennoSota said:
Coyle is a snake 🐍.

He said nothing, in that response, except that he makes the decisions.

Since Lindsay Whalen got 5 years to prove herself, I would be surprised if Ben Johnson gets fired after year two.

But...the snake removed Claeys so he could do anything.
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CBJ is not obese.
 

OK - on the Claeys situation, my issue is not 'what' Coyle did - it's 'how' he did it.

As I recall - late in the regular season, Coyle said he expected Claeys to return. then all the "stuff" happened. After the Gophers won the bowl game, Coyle was asked about Claeys' job status, and said "we evaluate all of our coaches after each season."

Then - (checked this online) - Claeys' firing was reported on Jan 3. Fleck's hiring was reported on Jan 6. there is no way Coyle conducted a job search, did interviews and negotiated a deal in 3 days. Ergo, he waited to officially fire Claeys until he had another coach already lined up.

with Pitino - Pitino's firing was announced on March 15. Ben Johnson's hiring was announced on March 22. again - either a warp-speed job search - or Coyle was looking for a new coach before announcing the firing of the old coach.

If he follows a similar pattern, he's not going to tip his hand. when Johnson leaves, he'll be walking out one door while the new coach is walking in another door.
 

Bad Gopher said:
The way I saw last night's game, we won even though there were numerous defensive lapses, offensive rebounds that should have been ours, and missed free throws, of course. Against a good opponent, no less. That tells me that this team has some capabilities but also that they're underperforming, especially when it comes to the fundamentals. Is that just youth? Mostly coaching? I can't say for sure myself, but it's the AD's job to observe and understand those things. I still think this team should have won more games, even with their inexperience.
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I took a look at the schedule, the team has played 13 games where the final score was within 10 points either way. 5 of those 13 were wins and he other 8 were losses. The majority of the loses were conference games, flip a few of those and people might have a slightly different outlook on the current state of the program.

Youth on the coaching and playing side is almost certainly playing a huge role in things. We are relying far more on freshman than most teams have to and we have an inexperienced head coach from the standpoint of being a head coach.

Coaches and players need to grow up bing time next year and hopefully that will translate to more wins on the court.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
OK - on the Claeys situation, my issue is not 'what' Coyle did - it's 'how' he did it.

As I recall - late in the regular season, Coyle said he expected Claeys to return. then all the "stuff" happened. After the Gophers won the bowl game, Coyle was asked about Claeys' job status, and said "we evaluate all of our coaches after each season."

Then - (checked this online) - Claeys' firing was reported on Jan 3. Fleck's hiring was reported on Jan 6. there is no way Coyle conducted a job search, did interviews and negotiated a deal in 3 days. Ergo, he waited to officially fire Claeys until he had another coach already lined up.

with Pitino - Pitino's firing was announced on March 15. Ben Johnson's hiring was announced on March 22. again - either a warp-speed job search - or Coyle was looking for a new coach before announcing the firing of the old coach.

If he follows a similar pattern, he's not going to tip his hand. when Johnson leaves, he'll be walking out one door while the new coach is walking in another door.
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I don't have the answer to this but was the public announcement of the coach being fired done on the same day the coach found out he was being fired? Again, I can't answer that, doubt any of us can but I would be very surprised to find out that they were.

Cleays said in the interview with Doogie they were pretty sure they weren't going to be retained during the season. Pitino getting fired after year 8 was not a shocker to fans, guessing they knew they were gone internally as well.

I am all for an AD that keeps the search process quiet and makes moves to avoid long gaps without a head coach. To me this is a good thing for Coyle not a bad one.
 


I don't mind Coyle's comments. I've been a vocal CBJ supporter and can still conclude that this season was unacceptable and can't happen again. I always said three years is a reasonable time frame to prove it.

While losing the Evans scholarship strings in the long run and w/ perception, that extra scholarship can be much better used to help the team win games next year. If it's not painfully obvious to CBJ what he needs to do in the offseason, he's not the guy. I think it's really that simple.

I'm rooting for him to succeed and won't be satisfied next season if we're not at least on the bubble with meaningful games in March.
 


Big Dawg said:
I heard nothing negative in his response. A great win last night. But, it doesn't negate the historically bad 2 seasons of Ben ball so far. I certainly do not want to see another extension for Ben. Not until he shows us something. His after season portal grabs will be telling along with who leaves via portal. Sunday's game along with our performance in the BIG tourney will be of some importance. I would be shocked-no, surprised if Ben is gone after this season. I'm guessing bar pretty low for next season. 5-6 min BIG victories next year or he's gone. Also cannot have big blowouts next season. Not all 5-15 conference records are the same. If our 15 BIG losses next year are all decent efforts and 10 point or less point dif then he will get some credit.
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If he goes 5-15 in the BIG next year he is gone. I promise.

He needs to be in that bubble area or he will be fired unless his 2024 recruiting class ends up being one for the record books.
 





cjbfbp said:
Since Evans de-committed, can we stop with the trite (and unfunny) wingspan remarks now? Thank you.
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Some posters still bring up year zero on the football board so guessing we will be seeing wingspan comments well past the time when they have any relevance at all.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Some posters still bring up year zero on the football board so guessing we will be seeing wingspan comments well past the time when they have any relevance at all.
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There's an expiration date on inside jokes and it's clear that more than a few people aren't aware of that approximate date.
 






Finally got to watch the full presser.

I really didn’t take much away from what Coyle said. Think all he’s really saying is Ben needs to win and Ben knows that. No shock there.

He’s for sure got a 3rd year which is fair and I’d imagine if they get 5-6+ Big 10 wins next year Ben will be back for a 4th.

Once again, this is all roster dependent as I anticipate the core coming back.

I could be wrong, but that’s how I took it.
 



skiumah1 said:
Finally got to watch the full presser.

I really didn’t take much away from what Coyle said. Think all he’s really saying is Ben needs to win and Ben knows that. No shock there.

He’s for sure got a 3rd year which is fair and I’d imagine if they get 5-6+ Big 10 wins next year Ben will be back for a 4th.

Once again, this is all roster dependent as I anticipate the core coming back.

I could be wrong, but that’s how I took it.
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I agree that what Coyle said isn't anything different than what the overwhelming majority of this board, including most Ben Johnson supporters, would believe.

I do think the coach needs to do better than 5 or 6 conference games next season. Winning that many likely would result in an overall losing season. As you mention, there is a pretty good chance of the core players returning next season but that would be the last for Battle and Cooper and quite possibly Garcia. One could have a reasonable belief that expectations for Ben's 3rd season should be higher than the expectations for his 4th. Looking forward, I think I would be pessimistic about the potential for success in year 4 if Ben didn't achieve as least a winning season in year 3.
 

bleedsmaroonandgold said:
Mixed results at best. His football hire has obviously been successful. His hockey hire has been as well, but they were good before he got here, and the results in Coyle's 7 years are not appreciably better than the results from the 7 years prior to him. In men's basketball he extended Pitino (which seems to have been a mistake because he had to fire him), and maybe the replacement will be good but early returns are awful. His women's basketball hire was on a downward trajectory for 5 years, then fired. His softball hires aren't working out great (that is just the other sport I have on top of my head as a sport where I know he made hires). Open to hearing any other successful hires he has had, but it seems like his basic track record is great football hire, didn't screw up hockey, and the other ones have us moving in the wrong direction. If the argument is football and hockey revenue are so important, that those two hires make him a solid AD, I can listen to that, but the entire body of his hiring and extension decisions certainly don't make me feel confident that he is making the next hire in any given sport where a vacancy occurs.
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Hockey tailed off at the end of Lucia’s tenure, correct?

Strib had an article showing how per game attendance plummeted and how now it’s back to where is was pre plummeting levels and there are some sellouts again and fans are happy with both the results and style if play.

The article is worth a read and IIRC was within the last couple of weeks after wrapping up another B10 title.
 

Bad Gopher said:
The way I saw last night's game, we won even though there were numerous defensive lapses, offensive rebounds that should have been ours, and missed free throws, of course. Against a good opponent, no less. That tells me that this team has some capabilities but also that they're underperforming, especially when it comes to the fundamentals. Is that just youth? Mostly coaching? I can't say for sure myself, but it's the AD's job to observe and understand those things. I still think this team should have won more games, even with their inexperience.
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In every game both teams have those things happen. In fact, someone on the Rutgers board could have posted your exact words and it would have applied just to their last 2 minutes of the game. Was Rutgers downfall youth or coaching? Rutgers had the game won, but all of those things you listed, the Gophers took advantage of and came up with a nice win.
 

Mark, just a little tip here.

Hire a minority candidate for the women and you will have a little more leeway to eventually hire a qualified men's coach ... even if he is a white guy.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
Hockey tailed off at the end of Lucia’s tenure, correct?

Strib had an article showing how per game attendance plummeted and how now it’s back to where is was pre plummeting levels and there are some sellouts again and fans are happy with both the results and style if play.

The article is worth a read and IIRC was within the last couple of weeks after wrapping up another B10 title.
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Lucia and Notre Dame was the last straw.
 

cjbfbp said:
I agree that what Coyle said isn't anything different than what the overwhelming majority of this board, including most Ben Johnson supporters, would believe.

I do think the coach needs to do better than 5 or 6 conference games next season. Winning that many likely would result in an overall losing season. As you mention, there is a pretty good chance of the core players returning next season but that would be the last for Battle and Cooper and quite possibly Garcia. One could have a reasonable belief that expectations for Ben's 3rd season should be higher than the expectations for his 4th. Looking forward, I think I would be pessimistic about the potential for success in year 4 if Ben didn't achieve as least a winning season in year 3.
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To me, it's all about momentum. Is this program moving forward? These last couple games to end the year feel like big ones.

If we lose to WI and lose game 1 in the BTT, the Rutgers game basically means nothing and I'd mark that seat HOT with a missed chance to move forward.

However, I'd believe winning 5-6 Big 10 games and being more competitive throughout the season next year will still provide that move forward feeling. 8-9 would be a lot more comforting to get him off the HOT seat going into year 4 though.

Not exactly enjoyable to start going into every year with the coach on life alert.
 

Coyle is a liar. Just that simple.

He has plain lied to people that firing Whalen was a mutual decision. That is plain as day to see.


He hit home runs with Fleck and Motzko, and those two programs are the true identity of the U athletics. Sucks to hear for basketball fans I'm sure, but that is the truth of it.
 
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skiumah1 said:
However, I'd believe winning 5-6 Big 10 games and being more competitive throughout the season next year will still provide that move forward feeling.
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That's the problem with how bad this has been though. Pitino was fired for winning 6 B1G games and being competitive in most. Now it's forward momentum if Ben gets back to that point in year 3?

No way.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
That's the problem with how bad this has been though. Pitino was fired for winning 6 B1G games and being competitive in most. Now it's forward momentum if Ben gets back to that point in year 3?

No way.
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I can get your point. But that was year 8 I believe for Pitino. If we hadn't already known he couldn't get it done, we sure as hell knew in year 8. There was no more building. And 5 of those years were with Coyle.

Ben we don't actually know the ceiling through 2 years. To me, he can still build and improve. The question then becomes how much time will Coyle give him to reach that ceiling? And how much progress needs to be made every year?
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
That's the problem with how bad this has been though. Pitino was fired for winning 6 B1G games and being competitive in most. Now it's forward momentum if Ben gets back to that point in year 3?

No way.
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I'm a little surprised at how this is being lost in the shuffle here.

This isn't just "the team isn't great right now, they're struggling a little bit". We are talking epic level failure and production, bordering on historic proportion level of failure and incompetence.

This is NOT just "1 or 2 mediocre years"....
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
That's the problem with how bad this has been though. Pitino was fired for winning 6 B1G games and being competitive in most. Now it's forward momentum if Ben gets back to that point in year 3?

No way.
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Ogee Ogilthorpe said:
I'm a little surprised at how this is being lost in the shuffle here.

This isn't just "the team isn't great right now, they're struggling a little bit". We are talking epic level failure and production, bordering on historic proportion level of failure and incompetence.

This is NOT just "1 or 2 mediocre years"....
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How many wins would you guys need next year to feel good about Ben going into year 4?

How few of wins would it take for you to fire him after year 3?
 

MNVCGUY said:
Claeys was never a long term solution he was a stop gap for one year.
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This could easily be true.

I'm just wondering why you think that's so obvious.

Is your answer along the lines of "Coyle was always going to get to pick his own coach", or some other reason?
 

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