Marcus and Myron tweet about Gophers' situation

[BleedGopher]

Marcus:

"I was told that White could likely clear academic concerns he caused when he left by going to summer school. We'll see what Tubby decides."

"Not sure who Tubby is going to get at PG to add to his class this late in the game. I heard it was a 50-50 chance now that Gophs sign one."

"Minnesota is hurting for ball-handlers. But Royce White would solidify frontcourt. Don't think his academics are that much of a concern."

Myron:

"Right now, you have the undecided elite prospects and "I wouldn't risk it" guys. Not many in-between. That certainly raises Noreen's stock."

"It's not only about who the Gophers bring in. Al, Devoe, Ralph, CI, Blake all very important. But all eyes are on Rodney/his development."

"A person familiar with the situation and close to the Gophers says the staff doesn't believe Royce White is committed to basketball."

"Gophers must act like the New England Patriots in the third round. It's time to go into "best player available" mode to finalize 2010 class."

"Another question: Do you start Devoe Joseph or Al Nolen at point guard next season? I wouldn't rule out Devoe, Blake, Rodney, Trevor, CI."

Go Gophers!!

 

[scher215]

What is Marcus twitter account?

 

[CollegeBBallFan]

I hope Justin stays. If so...Cobbs at point, Blake and Oto as 3pt shooters; Nolen at point, Devoe at 3-point shooter and strongest front line. Devoe moves without the ball better and can step-back better than Blake or Oto. Justin needs to stay - he is important in the rotation.

 

[Section201]

2 things

Two things.

First, I agree with the staff!!!!

"A person familiar with the situation and close to the Gophers says the staff doesn't believe Royce White is committed to basketball."

Second, Devoe starts regardless what happens with AN. That being said, I certainly hope AN pulls it together and is back on the team ASAP.

 

[GopherLady]

Second, Devoe starts regardless what happens with AN. That being said, I certainly hope AN pulls it together and is back on the team ASAP.

Why would you say that? I think people forget, Nolen is a true point guard - he did a fantastic job, and when he was gone, we lost a lot on defense and ball handling. Devoe is a true SG - he stepped up when we needed him (thank you), and I say they both start if Nolen is back...but Nolen will be our #1 choice as a point, unless he really lost his edge during this hiatus.

 

[Unregistered User]

Why would you say that? I think people forget, Nolen is a true point guard - he did a fantastic job, and when he was gone, we lost a lot on defense and ball handling. Devoe is a true SG - he stepped up when we needed him (thank you), and I say they both start if Nolen is back...but Nolen will be our #1 choice as a point, unless he really lost his edge during this hiatus.

+1 I can't believe how quickly people forget about what A.N. brought to the game. I love watching his defense. I think he transforms the game more defensively than offensively. I love Devoe, and he did some wonderful things later in the year, but he is best served playing his rightful position of shooting guard. Maybe filling in at point when needed, but hopefully Cobbs sees the current situation and the opportunity and stays. I truly believe he will be a very solid B10 point guard.

 

[underground629]

Agreed. People really underestimate what Nolen brings to the team (when he's eligible).

Why would you say that? I think people forget, Nolen is a true point guard - he did a fantastic job, and when he was gone, we lost a lot on defense and ball handling. Devoe is a true SG - he stepped up when we needed him (thank you), and I say they both start if Nolen is back...but Nolen will be our #1 choice as a point, unless he really lost his edge during this hiatus.

 

[Blizzard]

Why would you say that? I think people forget, Nolen is a true point guard - he did a fantastic job, and when he was gone, we lost a lot on defense and ball handling. Devoe is a true SG - he stepped up when we needed him (thank you), and I say they both start if Nolen is back...but Nolen will be our #1 choice as a point, unless he really lost his edge during this hiatus.

I have to disagree. Considering Tubby's interview on KFAN regarding Al's situation and all of the help they TRIED to give him and that he essentially rejected it, I think Al is going to have to earn his spot on the team back.

 

[GoGophers2005]

If Al Nolan is back on the team and playing he will be the Gophers starting point guard. His defense and how he runs the press is game changing. I'll go out on a limb and say if Al Nolan is playing next year he will be the Big Ten defensive player of the year.

There are plenty of opportunities to have Joseph handle the ball up the court while Nolan is out there. But the main point guard duties will be Al's.

 

[minngg]

Al Nolen is no better than a below average Big Ten pg. His defense is solid, but it takes more than that to be a good pg in the Big Ten. PG's in the Big Ten need to score. He can't. If he starts look for MN to again finish around 6th in conference.

 

[jovs]

Al Nolen is no better than a below average Big Ten pg. His defense is solid, but it takes more than that to be a good pg in the Big Ten. PG's in the Big Ten need to score. He can't. If he starts look for MN to again finish around 6th in conference.

Doesn't shoot well from the outside and has a hard time finishing around the basket. He needs to do one or the other to be effective.

 

[Section201]

GLady

Quote:
Originally Posted by Section201

"Second, Devoe starts regardless what happens with AN. That being said, I certainly hope AN pulls it together and is back on the team ASAP. "

Quote:
Originally Posted by GopherLady

Why would you say that? I think people forget, Nolen is a true point guard - he did a fantastic job, and when he was gone, we lost a lot on defense and ball handling. Devoe is a true SG - he stepped up when we needed him (thank you), and I say they both start if Nolen is back...but Nolen will be our #1 choice as a point, unless he really lost his edge during this hiatus.'

GL, Reviewing what I wrote confirms I said what I meant. Devoe starts regardless what happens with AN. I did not say he would or should start at point instead of AN, though he may very well do so.

I said Devoe STARTS.

 

[fan of Ray Williams]

Does anyone know where Nolen is academically at this time?

 

[GopherJake]

Devoe is a true SG

Serious question here, GL: Why do you say that? I'm not sure I agree - although it seems to be consensus opinion around here.

 

[NurumbiCongo]

Serious question here, GL: Why do you say that? I'm not sure I agree - although it seems to be consensus opinion around here.

I agree, its just people echoing Myron's opinion. Devoe has played his best basketball with the ball in his hands at the point and if he wants to have a future in basketball that is his position.

http://blogs.twincities.com/gophers/2010/04/former-gopher-rautins-talks-co.html

Devoe wasn't able to try out for the national team last year because he needed to attend summer school. But Rautins said Gophers coaches told him Devoe would be able to play this year. Rautins invited Devoe, Cory and Cory's high school teammate, Tristan Thompson, to play on a developmental team that will tour Europe in July.

The top players on the developmental team, which includes high school, college and pro level players, could join the senior team in competition at any time this summer, Rautins said.

"To give these guys a taste is very good," he said. "It's a much more physical, much more aggressive game (internationally). Players are pretty savvy and pretty smart. You have to take your game to a different level."

Rautins said he would play Devoe Joseph primarily as a point guard. He will also play shooting guard, but only as a backup, for the Canadian team.

 

[scher215]

Rautins said he would play Devoe Joseph primarily as a point guard. He will also play shooting guard, but only as a backup, for the Canadian team.

so hed be playing PG, essentially, over Cory (if Devoe is starting anyway ... but he didnt say hed be a backup PG) ... hm, considering Devoe is a gopher. kinda cool.

 

[jovs]

so hed be playing PG, essentially, over Cory (if Devoe is starting anyway ... but he didnt say hed be a backup PG) ... hm, considering Devoe is a gopher. kinda cool.

The little bit I saw of Cory was that his game was very similar to Devoe's. There is no way that Cory's is at Devoe's level. Two years of experience means quite a bit at that level.

 

[GophersOnTheRise]

Serious question here, GL: Why do you say that? I'm not sure I agree - although it seems to be consensus opinion around here.

When I think of a point guard, I think of a player who can get into the lane and set up teammates for easy scores, thus making them look better. It's also important for a point guard to be able to bring the ball up the court under pressure, which he isn't necessarily bad at, but I don't know if it's one of his strengths. Typically a point guards best skills and assets are floor vision, ball handling, passing, and quickness. I do not think these are Devoes bests skills/assets. He is a good shooter and a very good overall scorer. He's the type of player that would excel while playing off the ball. I think all of these things make him an ideal shooting guard (or maybe a combo guard would be more accurate).

On a team who lacked point guards last season, he did well in the point guard position, but if you remember it took him a little while to adjust and really excel there. If point guard was his true position, why would he need time to adjust there? Just because a team plays you at a position, doesn't make that your natural position. Not saying I think Devoe is bad at playing point guard, I just don't think it's his natural position. I think Devoe will be very good at whatever position he plays for us though. I'm bitter that we didn't get Cory, but I am very happy to still have Devoe.

 

[GopherJake]

If point guard was his true position, why would he need time to adjust there?

Because he's hasn't played the position for at least 2 years. Maybe a lot longer - I'm not sure if he played PG when he was high school age at all (maybe he did, I just don't know).

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you. Chew on this:

1. 2008-09: Devoe shot 40% FG, 37% 3-pointers, 0.91 assist/TO (Nolen: 2.51)

2. 2009-10, all games: Devoe shot 39%, 39% 3-pointers, 1.59 A/TO (Nolen: 2.96)

3. Nolen sophmore year A/TO: 1.96

From what I'm seeing here-

1. Devoe isn't that great of a shooter, as you contend.

2. His assist/TO ratio improved dramatically even though he was asked to change positions mid-year and assume a much greater role in taking care of and distributing the basketball. He also did most of the bringing the ball up the floor, despite heavy pressure applied, especially toward the end of the year.

3. His improvement in A/TO is particularly impressive because a) he didn't get to pad his stats against the little-sisters of the poor, but instead had trial-by-fire during Big Ten play; b) he did get off to a pretty rough start when he took over and c) he continued to score, maybe even improving there, but certainly not being a non-threat a la Al Nolen.

<b>It is my contention that PG is, indeed, Devoe's "natural" position. If he plays there 2 more years getting significant minutes at PG, and continues to improve as much as he did in 8 or so weeks under-the-gun, he'll be a damn good point guard. One thing is for sure - he better *make it* his natural position, or he won't play pro ball anywhere ever.</b>

 

[GophersOnTheRise]

Because he's hasn't played the position for at least 2 years. Maybe a lot longer - I'm not sure if he played PG when he was high school age at all (maybe he did, I just don't know).

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you. Chew on this:

1. 2008-09: Devoe shot 40% FG, 37% 3-pointers, 0.91 assist/TO (Nolen: 2.51)

2. 2009-10, all games: Devoe shot 39%, 39% 3-pointers, 1.59 A/TO (Nolen: 2.96)

3. Nolen sophmore year A/TO: 1.96

From what I'm seeing here-

1. Devoe isn't that great of a shooter, as you contend.

2. His assist/TO ratio improved dramatically even though he was asked to change positions mid-year and assume a much greater role in taking care of and distributing the basketball. He also did most of the bringing the ball up the floor, despite heavy pressure applied, especially toward the end of the year.

3. His improvement in A/TO is particularly impressive because a) he didn't get to pad his stats against the little-sisters of the poor, but instead had trial-by-fire during Big Ten play; b) he did get off to a pretty rough start when he took over and c) he continued to score, maybe even improving there, but certainly not being a non-threat a la Al Nolen.

<b>It is my contention that PG is, indeed, Devoe's "natural" position. If he plays there 2 more years getting significant minutes at PG, and continues to improve as much as he did in 8 or so weeks under-the-gun, he'll be a damn good point guard. One thing is for sure - he better *make it* his natural position, or he won't play pro ball anywhere ever.</b>

We must have different definitions of what it means to be a "natural position." To me, in order to be your natural position, it needs to be natural, which means it is determined by nature and isn't something you have to work towards achieving. If he needs two more years of significant minutes at the point guard position in order to become a damd good point guard, then how is that his natural position? If it's natural it's natural, he doesn't need to work to become that. Also those assist/turnover ratios that you highlighted are not very good. He played some point guard last year too and averaged more turnovers than assists. Was that really part of your argument? Some people are hard on Nolen, but his assist/turnover ratio was significantly better than Devoe's, because he is a natural point guard.

Also, 39% is a very good three point shooting percentage. Since you're throwing stats out there though, Devoe shot 25/51 from three ever since the second Northwestern game. That's 49% from three point range over the last 12 games of the season. That is an incredible percentage.

 

[GopherJake]

We must have different definitions of what it means to be a "natural position." To me, in order to be your natural position, it needs to be natural, which means it is determined by nature and isn't something you have to work towards achieving.

For the record, I'm not trying to pick a fight - just discussin'. I take your point, I just don't agree.

If he needs two more years of significant minutes at the point guard position in order to become a damd good point guard, then how is that his natural position? If it's natural it's natural, he doesn't need to work to become that.

Really, if it's "natural," you don't have to work? You don't really believe that, do you? Even if he hasn't played there for several years (he played no significant time at PG in 08-09).

Also those assist/turnover ratios that you highlighted are not very good. He played some point guard last year too and averaged more turnovers than assists. Was that really part of your argument?

Yes, they are. My point is that his numbers shot up, despite the mid-year position change vs. Big Ten competition, despite being coached for the entire year to play a different position. I am VERY impressed with how quickly he improved when thrown to the wolves.

Some people are hard on Nolen, but his assist/turnover ratio was significantly better than Devoe's, because he is a natural point guard.

Maybe this is what everybody means by "natural." Nolen's A/TO ratio is better because he is a pass-first PG. Not every PG is pass-first, but every pass-first is a PG. There are LOTS of examples of score-pass or score-first PGs. Are they not natural PGs because of this?

Also, 39% is a very good three point shooting percentage. Since you're throwing stats out there though, Devoe shot 25/51 from three ever since the second Northwestern game. That's 49% from three point range over the last 12 games of the season. That is an incredible percentage.

39% is good. It's not "very good". Quibbling a bit. The last 12 games he was great. Hmm. He played PG those last 12 games, didn't he? That's weird. I thought he would thrive at the off-guard position..............just sayin'.

 

[Friend Of Tubby]

For the record, I'm not trying to pick a fight - just discussin'. I take your point, I just don't agree.

Really, if it's "natural," you don't have to work? You don't really believe that, do you? Even if he hasn't played there for several years (he played no significant time at PG in 08-09).

Yes, they are. My point is that his numbers shot up, despite the mid-year position change vs. Big Ten competition, despite being coached for the entire year to play a different position. I am VERY impressed with how quickly he improved when thrown to the wolves.

Maybe this is what everybody means by "natural." Nolen's A/TO ratio is better because he is a pass-first PG. Not every PG is pass-first, but every pass-first is a PG. There are LOTS of examples of score-pass or score-first PGs. Are they not natural PGs because of this?

39% is good. It's not "very good". Quibbling a bit. The last 12 games he was great. Hmm. He played PG those last 12 games, didn't he? That's weird. I thought he would thrive at the off-guard position..............just sayin'.

I think Devoe played PG and Cory was SG for Pickering HS in 2008. Both are really "combo" G who can play either position.

 

[GophersOnTheRise]

"For the record, I'm not trying to pick a fight - just discussin'. I take your point, I just don't agree."

You don't agree that someone isn't a natural point guard if the position isn't natural for them?


"Really, if it's "natural," you don't have to work? You don't really believe that, do you? Even if he hasn't played there for several years (he played no significant time at PG in 08-09)."

I'm not saying you don't have to work hard to improve, I'm just saying you don't have to work hard to become a point guard if that is what your natural position is. You shouldn't need to work hard to become labeled something that you already are, just doesn't make sense You still do need to work hard to become a better player though.


"Yes, they are. My point is that his numbers shot up, despite the mid-year position change vs. Big Ten competition, despite being coached for the entire year to play a different position. I am VERY impressed with how quickly he improved when thrown to the wolves."

Of course his numbers went up. As you get more experience and practice doing something your numbers should go up. That doesn't mean point guard is your natural position though.

"Maybe this is what everybody means by "natural." Nolen's A/TO ratio is better because he is a pass-first PG. Not every PG is pass-first, but every pass-first is a PG. There are LOTS of examples of score-pass or score-first PGs. Are they not natural PGs because of this?"

That would be the difference between being a "scoring point guard" and a "pure point guard."


"39% is good. It's not "very good". Quibbling a bit. The last 12 games he was great. Hmm. He played PG those last 12 games, didn't he? That's weird. I thought he would thrive at the off-guard position..............just sayin'."

He's going to be the same caliber shooter no matter what position he plays. If he was playing power forward do you think he would suddenly become a bad shooter because it's not his natural position? He improved as the season went on because that is the way it goes, people improve with time. He was only a sophomore, of course he is going to get better as the season goes on. Simply moving to point guard isn't what made his shooting improve, unless it was because he was more confident with being given control of the offense, which could certainly be part of it.

For the record, I think Devoe is a natural shooting guard, but due to his lack of height and due to his ability to play point guard (as his secondary position) as well, I consider him a combo guard. Point guard just isn't his natural position in my opinion because it isn't completely natural for him like shooting guard is. Also out of the three main scouting services (Rivals, Scout, and ESPN), they all listed him as a shooting guard, so you are in the minority in thinking that he's not more of a shooting guard than a point guard. Just sayin'.

 

[GopherJake]

.. so you are in the minority in thinking that he's not more of a shooting guard than a point guard. Just sayin'.

Clearly. It will be interesting to see what happens if Nolen returns.

 

[GophersOnTheRise]

Clearly. It will be interesting to see what happens if Nolen returns.

Yes it will. I hope he does as we will be extremely thin at the point guard position without him. I would like to see him play point guard with Devoe off the ball in a scoring role. I really hope that Cobbs decides to stay too.

 

[JohnnyGopher]

update from today was that Nolen was doing well and odds of him playing next year are looking good.

 

[rosevillegopher]

update from today was that Nolen was doing well and odds of him playing next year are looking good.

Finally -- a bit of good news. Thank you.

 

[GopherLady]

I have to disagree. Considering Tubby's interview on KFAN regarding Al's situation and all of the help they TRIED to give him and that he essentially rejected it, I think Al is going to have to earn his spot on the team back.

I think Al will earn his spot in the classroom. I believe that when he has that straigtened out, he will be fine. I don't think he'll be penalized with playing time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Section201

"Second, Devoe starts regardless what happens with AN. That being said, I certainly hope AN pulls it together and is back on the team ASAP. "

Quote:
Originally Posted by GopherLady

Why would you say that? I think people forget, Nolen is a true point guard - he did a fantastic job, and when he was gone, we lost a lot on defense and ball handling. Devoe is a true SG - he stepped up when we needed him (thank you), and I say they both start if Nolen is back...but Nolen will be our #1 choice as a point, unless he really lost his edge during this hiatus.'

GL, Reviewing what I wrote confirms I said what I meant. Devoe starts regardless what happens with AN. I did not say he would or should start at point instead of AN, though he may very well do so.

I said Devoe STARTS.

Haha - you got me on that one - you were right, I misread and was wrong. I thought you were talking about an either or, but you were not.

Serious question here, GL: Why do you say that? I'm not sure I agree - although it seems to be consensus opinion around here.

I guess I should rephrase - I personally think Devoe is a better shooting guard. I shouldn't of said he is a true SG, but that's what I see him as, just as I see Nolen as a true PG. Devoe obviously played the point in HS, and coming in, I thought he was going to be fantastic at it. He did a good job, but I am a lot more comfortable with Nolen's ball handling abilities. I also think that Devoe did not shine before he switched to PG, partially because of the time he was given to play. It's tough for a shooter to come in cold, and be nervous about being pulled out at any point. With him starting at that position, I feel like we get the best of both worlds with his shooting abilities, and Nolen's D and ball-handling.

I wouldn't say it's the consensus opinion, just mine.

 

[Saber]

The part about Devoe being a better point or 2-guard that a lot of people miss is that he's a much better shooter off the dribble than he is spotting up. Most guys are the other way around. So sure, he's best when playing with an aggressive mentality, looking for his own shot like a 2-guard, but he's also most dangerous when he's handling the ball in the half court like a point.

So, there's a bit of a conflict there, I don't have the answers... but I'll trust however Tubby wants to play them. The only thing I know for sure is that Devoe starts and he probably plays the most minutes on the team.

 

[fan of Ray Williams]

update from today was that Nolen was doing well and odds of him playing next year are looking good.

Great news! I like Nolen, love his defense. I'm really excited for next year already. I know there's a few "if's", but this info on Al eliminates one of them. Couple more "if's" resolved and the Gophs will be tough to handle.