Kill and MN kids

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Herd said:
Contrary to the majority opinion on this board, you don't win games by recruiting in February. While recruiting is important, it pales in comparison to training, player development, attitude and team unity. If Kill recruits MN hard and starts to develop some team unity and a mental edge at MN, that will go a long way toward winning. MN's team concept and mental toughness have long been lacking. Brewster was the emperor with no clothes, building no toughness or unity.

MN is not competing with NDSU, but they could certainly learn something from NDSU player development, team concept, and playing for the guy next to you in the trenches. That is the MO at NDSU. MN should be and will be recruiting harder in-state. It is absolutely critical to future success. MN could also learn from NDSU in creating a style of play. NDSU recruits defense and powder running, focusing everything on that style of play. MN used to have a style of play under Mason, but that has been lost in recent years. Kill needs to establish a style of play, not try to change it each year . . . and most importantly teach the team how to win, to expect to win. If you want to learn what expecting to win can do for you, watch K-State NDSU next fall.
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Player development and team concept are preached and practiced by every single coach that ever lived. Kill has a style of play, he's had a family of staff together for a very long time and doesn't try to change it every year.
 

3399 said:
I seem to remember NDSU kicking the Gophers butt a couple of times, that's why. The hype on Wolitarsky is amazing. A young man who sets a receiving record, has good grades, but no interest from UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, or Fresno State. What's the big deal? Give me the hometown kid who will work his tail off at the hometown university. You mean you wouldn't take Billy Turner, Grant Olson, Carlton Littlejohn, etc.??? I have heard this tune before.
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MN has better athletes than NDSU but this ain't track. If JK gets his kids into position to make plays, folks will begin to bug you for a ticket to the game.
 

Bo Darville said:
We should cut all the out-of-state players and then hold open tryouts. Bring your birth certificates. We are born and bred winners here in the Land of the Honeycrisp Apple and Prince.
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MN will have players from all over the country, but to have a core of MN players that bleed maroon and give everything for their university would help the team. You disagree? I watched the post game interviews after a recent national championship. It was special for everyone, but it was emotional, gut wrenchng and a lifelong dream for the in state players to win a championship for the team they grew up wanting to play for. That's sometimes hard to find in a California recruit playing in MN.
 

Herd said:
While recruiting is important, it pales in comparison to training, player development, attitude and team unity.
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No. You can have a staff who is A+ in all of the other attributes, but if you don't have the players, you will lose a lot more than you win. Recruiting is not everything, but it is the most important thing. Urban Meyer wouldn't (and couldn't) win a national title at Ohio St. with NDAC's roster. NDAC couldn't have won the JV national title with Mount Union's roster. All of those other things you mentioned are important, but they are the difference between winning and losing when comparing teams with similar talent levels. A vast disparity in talent is almost impossible to overcome on a consistent basis. The disconnect is that some see the scouting services' ratings/rankings as infallible, while others say they have no value. Both are wrong. The truth is somewhere in the middle. Low recruiting rankings don't necessarily mean you have low talent, just as high recruiting rankings don't necessarily mean you have high talent. But make no mistake - it is almost impossible to win big without high talent.
 

btowngopher said:
Player development and team concept are preached and practiced by every single coach that ever lived. Kill has a style of play, he's had a family of staff together for a very long time and doesn't try to change it every year.
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Please enlighten my on Kill's style of play. It seems to bounce from QB to QB. Time to euthanize the Pistol and run the damn ball IMO. WI has a style of play.
 


3399 said:
I seem to remember NDSU kicking the Gophers butt a couple of times, that's why. The hype on Wolitarsky is amazing. A young man who sets a receiving record, has good grades, but no interest from UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford, San Diego State, or Fresno State. What's the big deal? Give me the hometown kid who will work his tail off at the hometown university. You mean you wouldn't take Billy Turner, Grant Olson, Carlton Littlejohn, etc.??? I have heard this tune before.
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I'm certain that Wolitarsky will turn out to be a better receiver than both Turner and Olson.
 

dpodoll68 said:
No. You can have a staff who is A+ in all of the other attributes, but if you don't have the players, you will lose a lot more than you win. Recruiting is not everything, but it is the most important thing. Urban Meyer wouldn't (and couldn't) win a national title at Ohio St. with NDAC's roster. NDAC couldn't have won the JV national title with Mount Union's roster. All of those other things you mentioned are important, but they are the difference between winning and losing when comparing teams with similar talent levels. A vast disparity in talent is almost impossible to overcome on a consistent basis. The disconnect is that some see the scouting services' ratings/rankings as infallible, while others say they have no value. Both are wrong. The truth is somewhere in the middle. Low recruiting rankings don't necessarily mean you have low talent, just as high recruiting rankings don't necessarily mean you have high talent. But make no mistake - it is almost impossible to win big without high talent.
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Based on your input, were looking at 3-9 season in 2013 at MN after we close the barn door on recruiting. Just set the record in February, why even try when you don't have players that are as good as the other guy.

Do you want me to send you a crying towel, or are you going to work to have the best and most united team on the field? The team concept vastly overshadow what people perceive as individual talent. I can't believe we are even having this conversation. Is this what the B1G teaches MN fans? I guess we are all defeated before the season even starts, after all, we lost the recuiting battle. Now Northwestern is a team, and they probably have the lowest ranked class in recruiting each year, but they play to their strengths and style as a team.

Please expalin your quote: "When comaring teams with similar talent levels, recruiting this the biggest difference". Huh? . . . that is completely wrong. When comparing teams with similar talent levels, team concept, discipline and unity are the deciding factors by far.
 

Herd said:
Please enlighten my on Kill's style of play. It seems to bounce from QB to QB. Time to euthanize the Pistol and run the damn ball IMO. WI has a style of play.
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Obviously he prefers a mobile qb, god curse him for making adjustments when injuries strike a roster that he didn't put together.
 

Herd said:
Based on your input, were looking at 3-9 season in 2013 at MN after we close the barn door on recruiting. Just set the record in February, why even try when you don't have players that are as good as the other guy.

Do you want me to send you a crying towel, or are you going to work to have the best and most united team on the field? The team concept vastly overshadow what people perceive as individual talent. I can't believe we are even having this conversation. Is this what the B1G teaches MN fans? I guess we are all defeated before the season even starts, after all, we lost the recuiting battle. Now Northwestern is a team, and they probably have the lowest ranked class in recruiting each year, but they play to their strengths and style as a team.

Please expalin your quote: "When comaring teams with similar talent levels, recruiting this the biggest difference". Huh? . . . that is completely wrong. When comparing teams with similar talent levels, team concept, discipline and unity are the deciding factors by far.
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This is false, but go on.
 



Herd said:
Based on your input, were looking at 3-9 season in 2013 at MN after we close the barn door on recruiting. Just set the record in February, why even try when you don't have players that are as good as the other guy.
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Dead wrong. What I'm saying is that we don't know whether our players are as good as the other guy's.

Herd said:
Do you want me to send you a crying towel, or are you going to work to have the best and most united team on the field? The team concept vastly overshadow what people perceive as individual talent. I can't believe we are even having this conversation. Is this what the B1G teaches MN fans? I guess we are all defeated before the season even starts, after all, we lost the recuiting battle. Now Northwestern is a team, and they probably have the lowest ranked class in recruiting each year, but they play to their strengths and style as a team.
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↑↑↑↑ Tons and TONS of not even remotely getting it.

Herd said:
Please expalin your quote: "When comaring teams with similar talent levels, recruiting this the biggest difference". Huh? . . . that is completely wrong. When comparing teams with similar talent levels, team concept, discipline and unity are the deciding factors by far.
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What the hell are you jibber-jabbering about? I made no such quote. In fact, I made a quote that is virtually the exact opposite of what you claim that I "quoted".
 


Herd said:
Where does NW typically rank with recruiting in the B1G? I just assumed they would be in the last group with academic stds and reputation. But they are, "Chicago's Big Ten team".
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Just a quick look on rivals:
2012 - 9th
2011 - 11th
2010 - 10th
2009 - 9th
 

So what's the original idea here?

We should recruit the top 3 players from MN each year? We do.
He then said, it's the top 3 players from MN "that we can get"? Does he mean, that we DO get or that we can get? I mean, would Will Johnson have counted last year or do we have to get them for them to be "can gets"?

Then it begs the question, what if we don't get 3 of the top 5 players from MN, do we automatically offer 6-8?

He's essentially saying that he wants 3 more players from MN, irregardless of how many players from MN we are already recruiting. That's kind of a bizarre way to look at it.
 



Herd said:
Based on your input, were looking at 3-9 season in 2013 at MN after we close the barn door on recruiting. Just set the record in February, why even try when you don't have players that are as good as the other guy.

Do you want me to send you a crying towel, or are you going to work to have the best and most united team on the field? The team concept vastly overshadow what people perceive as individual talent. I can't believe we are even having this conversation. Is this what the B1G teaches MN fans? I guess we are all defeated before the season even starts, after all, we lost the recuiting battle. Now Northwestern is a team, and they probably have the lowest ranked class in recruiting each year, but they play to their strengths and style as a team.

Please expalin your quote: "When comaring teams with similar talent levels, recruiting this the biggest difference". Huh? . . . that is completely wrong. When comparing teams with similar talent levels, team concept, discipline and unity are the deciding factors by far.
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Well told, brother.
 

By the way....according to rivals.

2013: We offered the top 3 and Wipson
2012: We offered 9 of the top 10 (also offered Leidner and Lauer (out of the top 10).
2011: We offered 8 of the top 10 (all of them)
2010: We offered the top 6 (#7 is playing hockey for the U).
 


dpodoll68 said:
No. You can have a staff who is A+ in all of the other attributes, but if you don't have the players, you will lose a lot more than you win. Recruiting is not everything, but it is the most important thing. Urban Meyer wouldn't (and couldn't) win a national title at Ohio St. with NDAC's roster. NDAC couldn't have won the JV national title with Mount Union's roster. All of those other things you mentioned are important, but they are the difference between winning and losing when comparing teams with similar talent levels. A vast disparity in talent is almost impossible to overcome on a consistent basis. The disconnect is that some see the scouting services' ratings/rankings as infallible, while others say they have no value. Both are wrong. The truth is somewhere in the middle. Low recruiting rankings don't necessarily mean you have low talent, just as high recruiting rankings don't necessarily mean you have high talent. But make no mistake - it is almost impossible to win big without high talent.
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+1. Exactly.
 



Not to sidetrack this, but what is the secret to turning Eden Prairie and CDH, who probably produce the most high profile D1 football prospects, into U of M feeders? Can Coach Kill forge deep relationships with the staffs at those programs so we are less likely to lose kids to places like Notre Dame (yuck) and Boston College (huh?)?
 

nokomismod said:
Not to sidetrack this, but what is the secret to turning Eden Prairie and CDH, who probably produce the most high profile D1 football prospects, into U of M feeders? Can Coach Kill forge deep relationships with the staffs at those programs so we are less likely to lose kids to places like Notre Dame (yuck) and Boston College (huh?)?
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We didn't lose anyone to BC, Kill didn't want Cottrel.
 


gopherguy05 said:
If you look at his previous posts....it isn't sarcasm. There is a small but vocal group on this Site that have no idea how recruiting works in the current age.
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UGH. You gotta love that. I have noticed a few of them pop up from time to time. I usually do not comment to much on the recruiting process as I do not get to see a lot of the metro kids play out in West Central MN. I get to see there highlight video's, but that is about it. So, I usually comment when I am impressed by a player, but they are always typically on our radar.

It is just funny to read these people that think we REALLY missed on these kids that are at NDSU, etc. Typically, there is a reason they ended up at NDSU, UNI, wherever, be that grades, physical size, experience or whatever. It just compounds for them we we "miss" on players that we bring in from out of state who may be close to similar caliber (i.e., star ratings, recruit ratings, what have you) to an instate player that went to a FCS or smaller college and preforms well.

What can you do I guess?
 

nokomismod said:
Not to sidetrack this, but what is the secret to turning Eden Prairie and CDH, who probably produce the most high profile D1 football prospects, into U of M feeders? Can Coach Kill forge deep relationships with the staffs at those programs so we are less likely to lose kids to places like Notre Dame (yuck) and Boston College (huh?)?
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Eden Prairie confuses me. As dominant as they've been over the years, doesn't it seem like they should have more D1 recruits? I'm sure I'm just out of the loop, but I can't remember the last time a QB, RB or WR from EP went on to play D1 football.
 

Breakin' The Plane said:
Eden Prairie confuses me. As dominant as they've been over the years, doesn't it seem like they should have more D1 recruits? I'm sure I'm just out of the loop, but I can't remember the last time a QB, RB or WR from EP went on to play D1 football.
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Nick Davidson - OL - Last Year

http://rivals.yahoo.com/minnesota/football/recruiting/player-Nick-Davidson-113953

2013 - Jack Cottrell - LB

http://rivals.yahoo.com/minnesota/football/recruiting/player-Jack-Cottrell-134421
 



Breakin' The Plane said:
Eden Prairie confuses me. As dominant as they've been over the years, doesn't it seem like they should have more D1 recruits? I'm sure I'm just out of the loop, but I can't remember the last time a QB, RB or WR from EP went on to play D1 football.
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They run a primarily Wing-T 1960's offense that doesn't give a WR or QB much to showcase. They've primarily done it w/pure size and strength and good not elite skill players offensively. They've had a several D1 defensive recruits that have been spread amongst the 3 defensive levels but heavier at DL and LB.

However, the last 2 QB's I remember were Jason Kapsner '96 or '97 (Michigan...don't think he ever saw a snap) and Ryan Grant whom played LB at the U.

Last 2 RB's that I remember were Jay Foreman '94? (Nebraska LB) and Leroy McFadden '95? (Michigan State Fullback). They were in the same backfield with Kapsner.
 

Brian Athey, QB, 2011 - West Virginia
Taylor Grant, TE, 2010 - North Dakota
Carter Bykowski, TE, 2008 - Iowa St.
 

Does Nick Davidson count he was imported when his dad took a job with the Vikes, he was already a finished product when he showed up.
 

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