Just so I understand...

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>>But I was implying that there are posters on here who make their comments about players based on their color.<<

I guess I've missed them all.

Why not name names? We call out posters for other reasons around here.
 

Gopher4Life said:
>>But I was implying that there are posters on here who make their comments about players based on their color.<<

I guess I've missed them all.

Why not name names? We call out posters for other reasons around here.
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Because I don't keep records. I don't care that much or find it to be that important. Next time one comes up, maybe I'll forward it to your inbox. I also don't figure most of these people are racists. They are just simplifying some player's abilities. I don't jump on the, "You must be a racist," badwagon that easily. You and From the Barn did, but my point wasn't to out people as racists. I was just outing arguments I found foolish.

I know of at least 5 people here that agree with me to at least an extent, so I'm not completely crazy either.
 


>>the Babtists will drink in front of each other.<<

That's not unusual in the South. The bartender's likely Baptist, too.
 



Utah Joke

Gopher4Life said:
>>the Babtists will drink in front of each other.<<

That's not unusual in the South. The bartender's likely Baptist, too.
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How do you keep your Mormon (LDS) friend from drinking all your beer?

Invite another Mormon (LDS) to your next party.
 

You hurt the team when you play certain combos of players, JAS and Busch for example because they are unable to create anything for themselves IMO. That doesn't have anything to do with their race, rather that they slow down the entire offense because the defense knows they pose no threat.

There is no race card at play, so just shut up already. Don't cry about the lack of respect for the white guys. Its about guys who can play, thats who GHers want to get the minutes. People push for Bostick, not because he is NOT white, but because in some action he has shown he can contribute something to our sluggish and lost offense. While in extended minutes, JAS and Busch have contributed very little.
 


Plinnius said:
What were those things?
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Move well without the ball. Create a better flow offensively. Make the entry-pass to the post. Make the reversal pass. Not turn it over. Defend the opposing 2 guard with efficiency. More rebounds/game than any of the other guards on the team up until that point.
 



What Up Guy said:
People push for Bostick, not because he is NOT white, but because in some action he has shown he can contribute something to our sluggish and lost offense.
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Disagree.

He's shown that in exactly 2 games all season out of 25 (WI & PSU). The other 23 games he's looked like a deer in headlights.

What I've seen most of the year, and based on his playing time, what Tubby has seen most of the year is: Ridiculously lost on defense. Lost on offense. Airballs. Turnovers. Scaring lack of box outs.
 


Plinnius said:
Relative to other white Big Ten SGs, like Jason Bohannon (scroll down and view TORate), Craig Moore, and Matt Roth, Hoffarber actually does turn it over quite a bit.
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I said up until the point where he started not playing as well. Also, as much as people say he's been in a year-long slump, he's still the 2nd best 3 pt shooter on our team behind Joseph as a percentage (for anyone that's shot more than 20).

Also, if that's the only point of contention, the argument that he only can shoot isn't that accurate.
 

ShowinGoldyLove said:
Move well without the ball. Create a better flow offensively. Make the entry-pass to the post. Make the reversal pass. Not turn it over. Defend the opposing 2 guard with efficiency. More rebounds/game than any of the other guards on the team up until that point.
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Ditto.

He actually moved the ball, made basic plays such as ball fakes few of our other players do, constant movement, weakside rebounding, even playing the point in the comeback at Wisconsin.

He has turned it over more lately, which is exactly what I said. He has slipped lately. Early in the slump, he was still damn effective and did plenty more than "just miss shots."
 



WilliamsArenaGuy said:
He has turned it over more lately, which is exactly what I said. He has slipped lately.
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Yet, Hoff only has 12 TOs in the past 10 games. Westbrook has 20 TOs in that period of time, and Nolen has almost double that with 23.

Hoffarber averaging just over 1 TO a game while playing 23 min/game is actually good in comparison.
 

What Up Guy said:
You hurt the team when you play certain combos of players, JAS and Busch for example because they are unable to create anything for themselves IMO. That doesn't have anything to do with their race, rather that they slow down the entire offense because the defense knows they pose no threat.

There is no race card at play, so just shut up already. Don't cry about the lack of respect for the white guys. Its about guys who can play, thats who GHers want to get the minutes. People push for Bostick, not because he is NOT white, but because in some action he has shown he can contribute something to our sluggish and lost offense. While in extended minutes, JAS and Busch have contributed very little.
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I didn't say we should throw all the white players out there. I said about the only time you see "these two shouldn't be on the floor together" is in reference to two white players.

And as far as JAS and Busch go, maybe they shouldn't play together; I wouldn't generally do that. However, I've seen each one of them create and convert as many shots on their own this year as Bostick. JAS has done it surprisingly more than a few times. Busch has probably done it even more, but not as much lately. I can count on one hand the number times Bositck has driven to the hoop and scored. Fortunately for him, a couple came in the Wisconsin game, so that is what everyone remembers. The guy has looked competent in two games. Shamala has contributed for four years. If I am so stupid and should just shut up, why don't you ask Tubby why Bostick isn't playing.
 


Plinnius said:
No, his TO rate was higher pre-slump. He's been in a year-long slump in that department.
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Disagree. Wouldn't call 1.5 TOs/game a slump. Out of all of the guards that play significant minutes (Nolen, Westbrook, Joseph & Hoff), Hoff averages the least turnovers this year by far.

Westbrook has 47, Nolen has 46, Joseph has 45, and Hoff has 35. The numbers don't lie.
 

Maybe you should factor in actual playing time and who handles the ball the most.
 



WilliamsArenaGuy said:
I didn't say we should throw all the white players out there. I said about the only time you see "these two shouldn't be on the floor together" is in reference to two white players.

And as far as JAS and Busch go, maybe they shouldn't play together; I wouldn't generally do that. However, I've seen each one of them create and convert as many shots on their own this year as Bostick. JAS has done it surprisingly more than a few times. Busch has probably done it even more, but not as much lately. I can count on one hand the number times Bositck has driven to the hoop and scored. Fortunately for him, a couple came in the Wisconsin game, so that is what everyone remembers. The guy has looked competent in two games. Shamala has contributed for four years. If I am so stupid and should just shut up, why don't you ask Tubby why Bostick isn't playing.
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The issue isn't BOSTICK versus JAS, Hoff or Busch, its more about playing the guys who actually get minutes a la Carter, Joseph. Would you rather have JAS and Busch out there or Carter and Joseph?

The appeal of Bostick is one that is similar to that of the appeal of a back-up QB in football. They are always heros when time is rough because we haven't seen much of them. JAS has played here for 4 years and everyone knows what he can and can't do. I believe Bostick has shown more potential on offense than JAS ever has, when he plays more than 3 minutes a game. You can't dismiss a guy when he gets a couple minutes, takes one shot and misses it. Well, I guess YOU can dismiss a guy. I will not do it.
 

What Up Guy said:
The issue isn't BOSTICK versus JAS, Hoff or Busch, its more about playing the guys who actually get minutes a la Carter, Joseph. Would you rather have JAS and Busch out there or Carter and Joseph?

The appeal of Bostick is one that is similar to that of the appeal of a back-up QB in football. They are always heros when time is rough because we haven't seen much of them. JAS has played here for 4 years and everyone knows what he can and can't do. I believe Bostick has shown more potential on offense than JAS ever has, when he plays more than 3 minutes a game. You can't dismiss a guy when he gets a couple minutes, takes one shot and misses it. Well, I guess YOU can dismiss a guy. I will not do it.
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Maybe the question should be why he has eternal faith in a couple of white players but none in Bostick?
 

From the Barn said:
Maybe the question should be why he has eternal faith in a couple of white players but none in Bostick?
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Holy crap, you are really blowing this out of proportion, and it's getting old. I've explained myself about 16 times so far. You clearly have absolutely no idea how to understand one thing I've written or how to engage in any conversation whatsoever. I've responded to several people on here who agree and disagree with me in one way or another, but I refuse to get into it with you.

BTW, when are you going to admit how ridiculous your notion was that making the NIT could be better for us than making the NCAA? I think that post was every bit as stupid as you thin mine was. If you're going to be an ass to someone in 90% of your posts, maybe you should just spend all your time at your little blog with Doug Gottleib.
 

I'm still waiting for you to name names.

No one else understood you either, so who has the communication problem?

By the way, you just go into it with me.
 

What Up Guy said:
The issue isn't BOSTICK versus JAS, Hoff or Busch, its more about playing the guys who actually get minutes a la Carter, Joseph. Would you rather have JAS and Busch out there or Carter and Joseph?

The appeal of Bostick is one that is similar to that of the appeal of a back-up QB in football. They are always heros when time is rough because we haven't seen much of them. JAS has played here for 4 years and everyone knows what he can and can't do. I believe Bostick has shown more potential on offense than JAS ever has, when he plays more than 3 minutes a game. You can't dismiss a guy when he gets a couple minutes, takes one shot and misses it. Well, I guess YOU can dismiss a guy. I will not do it.
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Sorry WUG, this is really the intent of my post at all. I would love it if Bostick would take off, and I had been wanting to see more of him as well. Lately, though, I think it's pretty clear it isn't going to happen this year.

In no way have I said I think we need to play the white players more nor that they are better. As I've said, I simply feel there have been times when they have gotten a bad rap by some posters, and it seemed to me it was mostly because of the white stereotype. That's it. Please reread the multitude of posts I have mae in this thread and see for yourself. Or don't, then maybe it will just go away and we can move on.

Just so you can further see we are not that different, I have used the backup QB analogy a bunch of times recently in reference to Tubby's stubborness in not changing the starting lineup or change anything offensively.
 



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