Joshua Ola-Joseph Enters Transfer Portal

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Bob_Loblaw said:
I think the much bigger reason is that Ben Johnson quit playing him at SF and Parker Fox emerged as the backup post player. A guy like JOJ is always going to feast on lesser opponents because they just cannot match up with him at all physically, but even if you look at this good stretch of play.

He played 91 minutes of Big 10 basketball in the example above and he did not have 1 assist. When we play a player like him at the 3 (doesn't handle the ball well for a guard, not a real threat to shoot, doesn't move well without the ball, not a distributor), it really gums up the works. If you add that WITH the defense, he just became hard to play. Every minute you gave JOJ was a minute you were likely taking for Fox.

There is a good player in there though, I agree. I think it's on him to unlock it. Right now, he's a Ferrari without much gasoline.
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I agree with most of that- JOJ is definitely a 4.

However- most teams play and rotate more than 3 guys at the 4/5 position. Even when Payne/Garcia/Fox got in foul trouble, or Payne's back was acting up, Ben was extremely reluctant to toss in JOJ even for some spot minutes. That just never made sense whatsoever.

Also- JOJ is a career 39.6% shooter from deep, so I wouldn't characterize him as not being a threat to shoot. Granted that is on a relatively low volume (21-53), but his stroke looks good and he's a decent free throw shooter, etc.
 

Block M said:
Big failure by the coaching staff. JOJ is an elite athlete with excellent size and plenty of skill, yet Johnson would not play him on a team that was getting killed late in games due to fatigue.
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In my experience, most players that went from starters to riding the pine benched themselves for a number of reasons that were well within the player's control. Occasionally it was a coach being malicious or just simply not liking the guy, but most of the time it was due to repeated attempts at course corrections that failed to fully materialize. CBJ certainly has his flaws, but I don't believe maliciousness is one of them.
 

This one hurts, I thought he'd make it. Tons of potential and one of few that could create his own shot on the team. Starting to really question coaching and player development. Hope this doesnt into Tubby where the players dont get better. Good luck JOJ, still a fan and will follow you wherever you land.
 
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leib0039 said:
Someone in another thread used this already but I think he's a lot like Henley. It's going to take the right coach, the right system and for him to buy into a role but he could be a nice piece. But on the flip side of that, if those things don't align he's kind of a wasted roster spot.

Him and Betts have been CBJs two biggest misses. Between the talent and lack of production/growth he really missed on them badly.
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How exactly did Johnson miss on a guy who started 42 games his freshman and s
howeda7 said:
So the reports of Betts dominating Battle in practice weren't true? I'm shocked.
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I’m shocked you believed that.
howeda7 said:
So the reports of Betts dominating Battle in practice weren't true? I'm shocked.
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Holy Man said:
He was not going to play with his teammates. He was on his way to a prep school that he hadn’t been at before. Ben likely signed him because there was an open scholarship and to prevent others from poaching him after his commitment.

By definition, I’m not giving up on an 18 year old just yet. Decision he has to make though.
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The theory that there were teams out there ready to poach Betts from under our nose is approaching big foot levels of conspiracy at this point - Reality: Ben couldn't sign enough players to make a minimum roster needed to practice so he brought in Betts a year early, too soon to say he will never contribute, but this could be considered a miss. He has been referred to as a "4 star" recruit by some on GH stating his 3 star ranking was only a result of his reclass to the year above him. A 4 star that redshirts and then is not a serious part of the rotation at all their RS Freshman year can be considered a miss to this point. 4 star players like Oturu/Coffey/Christie all contributed their freshman year. Those that didn't (martice mitchell/tre williams/Isaiah Ihnen) would be considered misses.
 

DarthGopher said:
In my experience, most players that went from starters to riding the pine benched themselves for a number of reasons that were well within the player's control. Occasionally it was a coach being malicious or just simply not liking the guy, but most of the time it was due to repeated attempts at course corrections that failed to fully materialize. CBJ certainly has his flaws, but I don't believe maliciousness is one of them.
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Especially when he gave him 42 starts in two years.
 

Dakota2 said:
How exactly did Johnson miss on a guy who started 42 games his freshman and s

I’m shocked you believed that.
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You don't think there is an emptiness felt when starting a guy 42 games, who then can't even see the floor, who then transfers? That's not a miss to you? I'm shocked you believe that.
 

Pretty much what I was thinking...

BC and JOJ lost their starting spots to Cam and Mitchell- both had things to overcome. BC took a step away- perhaps JOJ needed something similar? He seemed stressed and pressured on the court- I remember seeing his demeanor look progressively more sad in each of the postgame celebration team pics.

If Fox and Christie had both been coming back from playing the previous year, JOJ wouldn't have started at all but would also probably have had time to adapt to a role before the year started and could have had "Fox Minutes" type of energy value.

But 25 assists over two years? Doesn't speak much to playmaking abilities outside of creating his own shot. Hawkins was our setup man, but even Christie dished out over 2/gm.

Since that Wisconsin game, 0 assists, 0 3ptrs, and (from what I recall) quite a few forced shots around the rim.

I wouldn't have minded CC at the 2 with JOJ at the 3 a bit more, but you just never knew when Mitchell was going to drop five in a row from 3pt land.
Bob_Loblaw said:
I think the much bigger reason is that Ben Johnson quit playing him at SF and Parker Fox emerged as the backup post player. A guy like JOJ is always going to feast on lesser opponents because they just cannot match up with him at all physically, but even if you look at this good stretch of play.

He played 91 minutes of Big 10 basketball in the example above and he did not have 1 assist. When we play a player like him at the 3 (doesn't handle the ball well for a guard, not a real threat to shoot, doesn't move well without the ball, not a distributor), it really gums up the works. If you add that WITH the defense, he just became hard to play. Every minute you gave JOJ was a minute you were likely taking for Fox.

There is a good player in there though, I agree. I think it's on him to unlock it. Right now, he's a Ferrari without much gasoline.
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GopherBlood777 said:
The theory that there were teams out there ready to poach Betts from under our nose is approaching big foot levels of conspiracy at this point - Reality: Ben couldn't sign enough players to make a minimum roster needed to practice so he brought in Betts a year early, too soon to say he will never contribute, but this could be considered a miss. He has been referred to as a "4 star" recruit by some on GH stating his 3 star ranking was only a result of his reclass to the year above him. A 4 star that redshirts and then is not a serious part of the rotation at all their RS Freshman year can be considered a miss to this point. 4 star players like Oturu/Coffey/Christie all contributed their freshman year. Those that didn't (martice mitchell/tre williams/Isaiah Ihnen) would be considered misses.
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Friendly amendment accepted. I'll buy the practice player theory as more credible than the poaching theory. Sadly, that could well have hurt the kid more than helped him.
 

GopherBlood777 said:
The theory that there were teams out there ready to poach Betts from under our nose is approaching big foot levels of conspiracy at this point - Reality: Ben couldn't sign enough players to make a minimum roster needed to practice so he brought in Betts a year early, too soon to say he will never contribute, but this could be considered a miss. He has been referred to as a "4 star" recruit by some on GH stating his 3 star ranking was only a result of his reclass to the year above him. A 4 star that redshirts and then is not a serious part of the rotation at all their RS Freshman year can be considered a miss to this point. 4 star players like Oturu/Coffey/Christie all contributed their freshman year. Those that didn't (martice mitchell/tre williams/Isaiah Ihnen) would be considered misses.
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For the most part, I agree with everything you've written in the above paragraph but I don't think the bolded part was a widely held belief. I think a relatively small group of gullible people bought into that. I always thought that idea was preposterous and I was pissed when Ben gave that final scholarship to a redshirted Betts.

What you do see a lot around here is something you see a lot in society these days: people feel they have to be all in one way or another, either they're constantly criticizing or they're constantly defending. So, you see people criticizing Ben Johnson for reasons they shouldn't and you see people defending coaching choices that don't deserve to be defended. You see much of the same thing in politics today.
 

Well, it seems Ben got his wish. I think Ola Joseph has ability, athleticism and potential. I don't think Ben did a good job of utilizing him. Ola Joseph and Henley were two guys we recruited who want to run and have the ability to excel at it. However, that's not how we play...so why did recruit them?

Can't just keep experimenting with freshmen you don't develop who could become core contributors as juniors. But instead, they just leave out of frustration.

So ya, the portal has a lot of guys in it...easy to replace people, but will our "new guys" be better immediately?

I liked the talent of Henley and Ola Joseph...sorry it didn't work out for them. Very disappointed in Ben. Take away the last 10 games when Ola Joseph played 6 minutes or less in each in of those to tank his averages....and he was averaging 10 plus points per game. Finished at 7.5 ppg.
That is not easy to replace. Henley averaged 8.6 for DePaul. They are both better players than those numbers.
 

NYtoWItoMN said:
Pretty much what I was thinking...

BC and JOJ lost their starting spots to Cam and Mitchell- both had things to overcome. BC took a step away- perhaps JOJ needed something similar? He seemed stressed and pressured on the court- I remember seeing his demeanor look progressively more sad in each of the postgame celebration team pics.

If Fox and Christie had both been coming back from playing the previous year, JOJ wouldn't have started at all but would also probably have had time to adapt to a role before the year started and could have had "Fox Minutes" type of energy value.

But 25 assists over two years? Doesn't speak much to playmaking abilities outside of creating his own shot. Hawkins was our setup man, but even Christie dished out over 2/gm.

Since that Wisconsin game, 0 assists, 0 3ptrs, and (from what I recall) quite a few forced shots around the rim.

I wouldn't have minded CC at the 2 with JOJ at the 3 a bit more, but you just never knew when Mitchell was going to drop five in a row from 3pt land.
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I think reasonable people can disagree on how much we should have used JOJ at the 3. I am perfectly fine with Ben's decision to not play him or Ihnen another minute at the wing, but I do get that other people disagree.

For me, I just watched too much of it last year with Battle and JOJ and for me the college game is all about guards. I think it's a difficult decision to essentially bench a guy as talented as JOJ for the sake of rolling out healthier (IMO) lineups and I applaud Ben for making that decision. I think the path of least resistance would be to squint and try to see a wing with JOJ because that's what we needed.
 



Dakota2 said:
How exactly did Johnson miss on a guy who started 42 games his freshman and s

I’m shocked you believed that.
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Because he was unplayable the last third of his sophomore season and decided to transfer?
 

60's Guy said:
Well, it seems Ben got his wish. I think Ola Joseph has ability, athleticism and potential. I don't think Ben did a good job of utilizing him. Ola Joseph and Henley were two guys we recruited who want to run and have the ability to excel at it. However, that's not how we play...so why did recruit them?

Can't just keep experimenting with freshmen you don't develop who could become core contributors as juniors. But instead, they just leave out of frustration.

So ya, the portal has a lot of guys in it...easy to replace people, but will our "new guys" be better immediately?

I liked the talent of Henley and Ola Joseph...sorry it didn't work out for them. Very disappointed in Ben. Take away the last 10 games when Ola Joseph played 6 minutes or less in each in of those to tank his averages....and he was averaging 10 plus points per game. Finished at 7.5 ppg.
That is not easy to replace. Henley averaged 8.6 for DePaul. They are both better players than those numbers.
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I am really not opposed to ripping on CBJ, but what more could he have done with Jaden Henley?

He started 18 fames for us as a true freshman, played 20 minutes per game (28 minutes per game from February till the end of the year). Ben runs a pretty open system for guards to shot.
 

GopherBlood777 said:
You don't think there is an emptiness felt when starting a guy 42 games, who then can't even see the floor, who then transfers? That's not a miss to you? I'm shocked you believe that.
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Not a miss by any wild measurement. Recruited, played, and was relegated downward eventually by better players. Not a miss.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
I think reasonable people can disagree on how much we should have used JOJ at the 3. I am perfectly fine with Ben's decision to not play him or Ihnen another minute at the wing, but I do get that other people disagree.

For me, I just watched too much of it last year with Battle and JOJ and for me the college game is all about guards. I think it's a difficult decision to essentially bench a guy as talented as JOJ for the sake of rolling out healthier (IMO) lineups and I applaud Ben for making that decision. I think the path of least resistance would be to squint and try to see a wing with JOJ because that's what we needed.
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JOJ lost his starting position to Payne. Remember for a year and a half people here were screeching about Payne not starting?

JOJ lost his reserve role to Fox. There is no comparison between what Fox brought to the team vs. JOJ.
 


Dakota2 said:
JOJ lost his starting position to Payne. Remember for a year and a half people here were screeching about Payne not starting?

JOJ lost his reserve role to Fox. There is no comparison between what Fox brought to the team vs. JOJ.
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What Fox brought to the floor is what every coach needs on their team - instant spark, swagger, energy, etc. They may not be the best player on the floor and they may make mistakes, too, but there was no denying as the season went on, whenever Fox entered the game, the team responded. JOJ could not match that same intensity. It is not an indictment of JOJ, but rather complimenting Fox on an intangible that is hard to coach. Guys seem to either have it or they don't.
 

I wouldn’t call JOJ a miss either. I will say there seemed to be a major disconnect between Josh and the staff all season.I blame both sides equally. Josh needs to mature and be open to constructive criticism. The staff needs to do way better in connecting with the team and defining roles. Towards the end, it felt like Ben lost the locker room. He lost JOJ well before that. That’s on him and any good coach has to be better. Joj has elite athleticism who can develop into a very good player. He undoubtedly could have helped this team late in the year.
 

Bummed about this one. Imo, the only "miss" is CBJ's missed opportunity to coach up a raw talent. I think he would do well in an offense like Indiana State runs. And you could say the benching was because of defense, but everyone played terrible defense much of the year.
 

Dakota2 said:
He was unplayable because the coach didn't give him a chance with 42 starts or because he (JOJ) didn't take advantage of the opportunity?
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Because he wasn't good enough. Or wasn't developed properly, or wasn't progressing. It would have been nice to see some progression from the SO class(and Betts), but it just wasn't there.
 

MonikerSchmoniker45 said:
Bummed about this one. Imo, the only "miss" is CBJ's missed opportunity to coach up a raw talent. I think he would do well in an offense like Indiana State runs. And you could say the benching was because of defense, but everyone played terrible defense much of the year.
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There couldn't be a worse fit for JOJ than an offense like Indiana State runs. The wings are in constant motion, they are all good shooters, and they are all decent distributors. He would have to learn to move without the ball and somehow develop vision.

Their bigs are also highly skilled and good passers (they are often feeding the wings in constant motion).

IMO, I literally could not think of a worse offense for JOJ.
 

Coa
Gophs24 said:
wish him the best as well......he far out preformed what i was expecting out of him coming out of the gates

still dont quite understand how a guy can go from starting to not even seeing the floor on an exhausted basketball team
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Coaching you think or no?
 

leib0039 said:
Someone in another thread used this already but I think he's a lot like Henley. It's going to take the right coach, the right system and for him to buy into a role but he could be a nice piece. But on the flip side of that, if those things don't align he's kind of a wasted roster spot.

Him and Betts have been CBJs two biggest misses. Between the talent and lack of production/growth he really missed on them badly.
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How do we know that Betts is a miss? He reclassified and redshirted. How old is he, 18?

I would agree with you if this time next year Betts has the same amount of minutes, then it is a miss.
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
There couldn't be a worse fit for JOJ than an offense like Indiana State runs. The wings are in constant motion, they are all good shooters, and they are all decent distributors. He would have to learn to move without the ball and somehow develop vision.

Their bigs are also highly skilled and good passers (they are often feeding the wings in constant motion).

IMO, I literally could not think of a worse offense for JOJ.
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Nice. I wanted to bring that up earlier. JOJ really, desperately, needed to learn to cut. With his athleticism. My god, I think even you might have said play that dude out of positon.
 

Gophers7633 said:
Because he wasn't good enough. Or wasn't developed properly, or wasn't progressing. It would have been nice to see some progression from the SO class(and Betts), but it just wasn't there.
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I think some of that has to do with Ben's logic of, "I have to win now". At this point in his tenure I don't think you can say Ben is looking to develop players rather win with what he has.
 

howeda7 said:
Would you feel good about it if you were him? Or would you rather have stayed and played your senior season with your teammates?
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Unless I'm a 5* there would be no way I would reclassify w/o a guarantee of minutes. It was a poor choice for Betts and if Ben encouraged him to reclassify shame on Ben
 

Bob_Loblaw said:
I am really not opposed to ripping on CBJ, but what more could he have done with Jaden Henley?

He started 18 fames for us as a true freshman, played 20 minutes per game (28 minutes per game from February till the end of the year). Ben runs a pretty open system for guards to shot.
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Flip answer is...probably not recruit him. It seemed so obvious to me Henley wanted to run, play fast, up tempo. Ben kept slowing things down. They were not a good fit for each other.

Ola Joseph is the same. Ben wants to control tempo. Ola Joseph just wants to play fast.

The problem to me goes back to Ben wanting to play 7 guys and control tempo. Not the formula in 2024. Not what those two guys want to do.
 

Josh played at the 4 spot only. as he did last year. Fox became the backup to the 4 spot and the 5 spot. No other players cost him playing time.
 

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