Jerry Kill Slams PJ

[Thomasthetank]

As far as the on-field attire: there is this - on some teams, all of the coaches wear similar outfits - the conformity thing, I guess. With the Gophers, Fleck does his own thing. That's fine. he can wear whatever he wants to wear. but, I will note that the Gopher radio pre-game show will often mention what Fleck is wearing - especially his shoes, which he has custom-made for most games, as I recall.

Fleck says he wears a tie because of his time with Jim Tressel. again, fine.

As I've said before, both things can be true. Fleck loves his players and promotes his culture. And, Fleck is aware of his own image, and how he is portrayed. They are not incompatible. there is nothing inherently wrong with being aware of your own image. But some people apparently feel that saying Fleck is aware of his own image is the same as calling him phony. It is not. It is a more nuanced discussion, and some people seem to have a hard time with nuance. they want everything to be black and white, good or bad.

This whole argument is BS.

Kill is mad because Fleck is implementing modern business models and practices into a major football program: promotion, advertising, building a tight knit, well known feeling/culture.

This is what modern business is about: buy in combined with promotion. But it's not self promotion, its about promote the brand. Promoting himself promotes the brand.

Kill was old school and never about the brand. He sees PJs wild shoes and slogans as self promotion rather than brand promotion.

 

[A_Slab_of_Bacon]

I prefer coach's to wear something different .... if only so I can find them on the sidelines.

It's just handy.

 

[Gophers_4life]

The point is football coaches wear a variety of outfit and none of those instances (business meeting, fancy
dinner, wedding) you brought up apply.

You used the language "dresses well", which is what that implies. Poor choice of words on your behalf, then.

I mean he looks stylish out there.

Bright yellow is stylish?? You clearly have the style sense of a Costco shopper. Bright yellow is garish.

Who cares? (Personally I enjoy his outfits, I think it's kinda fun)

You are correct -- it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things.

But it was a supporting point in a discussion about his ego and calling attention to himself. You're trying to pretend that context isn't there.

 

[FredCoxRocks]

I've never given any thought to what Fleck wears during games either.

I don't even care what uniforms the players wear, or that there's a "beaver tail" on the helmet.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Whether Kill should have spoken on it (he shouldn't have) is a different matter.

I just wish he would be more eloquent and more fully elaborate his points.

He only meant to claim that Fleck's ego got massively inflated after he took the WMU job, that he changed, and that his flashy style isn't for the players, it's about stroking his own ego. Those are simple statements, and obvious to me that is what he was saying.


But because of his speaking style of half-sentences and unfinished thoughts ..... it allows internet people to blow it way out of proportion and see things that aren't there. Go way out of their way to take things in a manner that wasn't at all intended.

 

[Gophers_4life]

He sees PJs wild shoes and slogans as self promotion rather than brand promotion.

Well ???????


As we all agree, most P5 head coaches have egos. But how many have trademarked their own slogans???

 

[dpodoll68]

This coming from the poster most would like to see go away.... tell us again how offers don't impact recruiting rankings and all of your other great takes.

My point was very clear, so I won't continue to argue with an idiot.

You're under the extremely mistaken assumption that I care what any posters here think of me. Whether posters want me to "go away" or not is completely immaterial to me. If that's even true, it only reinforces that I'm right - people don't like to be told when they're wrong.

"Offers don't impact recruiting rankings" isn't a "take," by the way, it's fact. Show the high positive correlation between recruiting rankings and quantity/quality of offers. Let's see the data. Put up or shut up.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Show the high positive correlation between recruiting rankings and quantity/quality of offers.

I don't think this is what you mean.

Because it is very often coincidental that a highly rated recruit receives a lot of P5 (or elite P5) offers.

What I think you mean is that they're only coincidental, and that one does not cause the other.

 

[MNVCGUY]

I just wish he would be more eloquent and more fully elaborate his points.

He only meant to claim that Fleck's ego got massively inflated after he took the WMU job, that he changed, and that his flashy style isn't for the players, it's about stroking his own ego. Those are simple statements, and obvious to me that is what he was saying.


But because of his speaking style of half-sentences and unfinished thoughts ..... it allows internet people to blow it way out of proportion and see things that aren't there. Go way out of their way to take things in a manner that wasn't at all intended.

So you have a special Jerry Kill decoder ring then?

You are one of the only people whole heartedly defending good ole Jerry. The bottom line is unprovoked he decided to go on National show and try and tear Fleck down. it was petty and childish and right along with the Jerry Kill that many refused to see while they gobbled up his humble ole ball coach schtick while he was here.

Fleck absolutely has an ego, all power 5 head coaches have massive egos for the most part. They get paid millions of dollars and are paid significantly more then their boss. Kill's ego was just as massive he just buried it behind his act which played better with people in this state who don't like flashy things or for people to be energetic.

This idea that Fleck's style is just for him is foolish. If Fleck was doing all the things he does and players were checking out or not following him he would fail miserably and get fired.

Is Fleck over the top at times, yep....but he also took a Western Michigan program to great heights and there are some real signs that what he is doing here is working as well. So while his style may tick off a lot of people it seems pretty clear that he at least has some idea what he is doing and that the players are buying into it.

 

[Pompous Elitist]

Lots of guys take a keen interest in their image. He’s a fancy boy, so what? The fitted clothes, tartan suits, skinny pants, gonzo shoes are to me, at times kind of ridiculous but hey, we’re all wierd.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/yqQvEcc3y1U" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[Urbandale]

Now, if Fleck or Kill or Claeys or Coyle pulled a Bob Kraft and got busted for soliciting a prostitute at a massage parlor, then we'd REALLY have some fun arguments.

 

[A_Slab_of_Bacon]

Now, if Fleck or Kill or Claeys or Coyle pulled a Bob Kraft and got busted for soliciting a prostitute at a massage parlor, then we'd REALLY have some fun arguments.

Oh man ....

 

[zman]

Some people have no capacity to accept that their opinion may be incorrect or even not the only possible one. Then they compound it by saying the same thing over and over, apparently believing that somehow, the last word wins.

If Gopherhole ever dies and has a headstone, this needs to be what is engraved on it.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Is Fleck over the top at times, yep....but he also took a Western Michigan program to great heights and there are some real signs that what he is doing here is working as well. So while his style may tick off a lot of people it seems pretty clear that he at least has some idea what he is doing and that the players are buying into it.

So if this is true ....... why are you having such a massive heart attack over a guy essentially just saying "boy, Fleck has a big ego now. That guy changed from back when I used to know him!" ???

That was all that was said, in a nutshell.

 

[MennoSota]

So if this is true ....... why are you having such a massive heart attack over a guy essentially just saying "boy, Fleck has a big ego now. That guy changed from back when I used to know him!" ???

That was all that was said, in a nutshell.

Agreed.
Also, it's not a big deal if one former coach holds disdain for another coach. Look at the disdain Brew had for Bielema. It was comical.
I see no problem with Kill saying he doesn't like Fleck. So what.

 

[John Galt]

You're under the extremely mistaken assumption that I care what any posters here think of me. Whether posters want me to "go away" or not is completely immaterial to me. If that's even true, it only reinforces that I'm right - people don't like to be told when they're wrong.

"Offers don't impact recruiting rankings" isn't a "take," by the way, it's fact. Show the high positive correlation between recruiting rankings and quantity/quality of offers. Let's see the data. Put up or shut up.

You're a genius in your own mind... always right and others hate you for it. What a martyr. Maybe you and Donald should hang out together.

Go look at the fake recruit from a few weeks ago. He was given a 3-star ranking by Rivals based on offers from Alabama and others. Even though he doesn't exist. There's no further proof needed that offers impact rankings.

 

[benlaur]

I agree with the other poster that he wears the above in order to stand out, and call attention to himself.

Yes, he should have no sense of style like other people just to please you. Seriously strange posts.

 

[MrC]

Jerry Kill needs to decide whether he wants to be the Athletic Director of SIU, or the bitter ex-football coach of Minnesota. The two are incompatible.

I can’t imagine Coyle or any responsible AD going off on some interview about someone at another institution who had hurt their feelings. Seen in light of his current role, Kills comments reflect an attitude that he is bigger than the program he manages. Bigger than the University he represents, whose interests should come first.

 

[Thomasthetank]

Well ???????


As we all agree, most P5 head coaches have egos. But how many have trademarked their own slogans???

It's for the brand.

If kill had started coaching again, he would not be able to use brick by brick because he didn't trademark it and Tennessee stole it.

Plus, fleck donated a bunch of money from the slogans proceeds to charity.

This is the stuff ppl get hung up on: he trademarked his slogan, he wears recognizable clothes, hes energetic. This makes the brand. It's not a show but there is a definite strategy to it. Its modern business practices

 

[dpodoll68]

You're a genius in your own mind... always right and others hate you for it.

I am a genius, in my own mind and otherwise. I'm not always right, though. I will gladly admit it when I'm wrong, it just doesn't happen very often. Oh, and others do hate me for proving them wrong. They've flat-out said so, and you've even stated as such yourself.

Go look at the fake recruit from a few weeks ago. He was given a 3-star ranking by Rivals based on offers from Alabama and others. Even though he doesn't exist. There's no further proof needed that offers impact rankings.

Great, you found one instance of Rivals being lazy. Go back through the profiles of the 30,000+ other recruits signed by FBS schools since the beginning of the internet recruiting era and let me know when you've found enough to establish a strong positive correlation. Oh, and you have to do this not only for Rivals, but 247, ESPN, and Scout as well. I anxiously await your data.

 

[PoockItInfor6]

We literally have a coach who is going to bring us back to the Rose Bowl, and posters in GH get caught up in him having a TM on Row the Boat? Isn’t the fact he bright that slogan with him proof of how authentic his belief in that ideology is? Isn’t that proof that for him it is engrained in the loss of his child? He’s not profiting off of the trademark either, so there really is no other explanation.

 

[Denver_Gopher]

This is all so ridiculous. Whatever the reason Kill had for talking about Fleck; he was wrong and should apologize. It is like he took a note from our politicians (on both sides). I think Kill (along with the aforementioned politicians) has either forgotten or never were taught: If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. I liked Kill, but have lot a great deal of respect for him over this. Fleck's response was short and classy.

 

[fan of Ray Williams]

I don't think this is what you mean.

Because it is very often coincidental that a highly rated recruit receives a lot of P5 (or elite P5) offers.

What I think you mean is that they're only coincidental, and that one does not cause the other.

Stay out of it, Donny.

 

[Gophers_4life]

We literally have a coach who is going to bring us back to the Rose Bowl, and posters in GH get caught up in him having a TM on Row the Boat? Isn’t the fact he bright that slogan with him proof of how authentic his belief in that ideology is?.

Yep, I’m sure you’ll be saying that when he takes that trademark with him to Michigan. Just like W Mich fans were saying that when he took it from them and came here.

 

[dpodoll68]

We literally have a coach who is going to bring us back to the Rose Bowl

We do? What are tomorrow's Powerball numbers? I would really like to not work anymore.

 

[Gophers_4life]

Stay out of it, Donny.

Just saying, it would be very easy to show a positive correlation between the two, when why’re so often coincidental.

 

[PhillyGopher]

If Fleck gets poached my Michigan, it likely means we have had a pretty good run.

And DPDolly will be asking you for Powerball numbers

 

[Spoofin]

We literally have a coach who is going to bring us back to the Rose Bowl, and posters in GH get caught up in him having a TM on Row the Boat? Isn’t the fact he bright that slogan with him proof of how authentic his belief in that ideology is? Isn’t that proof that for him it is engrained in the loss of his child? <b>He’s not profiting off of the trademark either, </b>so there really is no other explanation.

Haven’t we already covered this?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Gophers_4life]

If Fleck gets poached my Michigan, it likely means we have had a pretty good run.

Indeed, W Mich fans got to go to a Cotton Bowl and almost beat Wisconsin. That’s more than their little G5 program deserves in this lifetime. Their little program fans can stfu and we’ll be taking those oars now.

 

[John Galt]

I am a genius, in my own mind and otherwise. I'm not always right, though. I will gladly admit it when I'm wrong, it just doesn't happen very often. Oh, and others do hate me for proving them wrong. They've flat-out said so, and you've even stated as such yourself.



Great, you found one instance of Rivals being lazy. Go back through the profiles of the 30,000+ other recruits signed by FBS schools since the beginning of the internet recruiting era and let me know when you've found enough to establish a strong positive correlation. Oh, and you have to do this not only for Rivals, but 247, ESPN, and Scout as well. I anxiously await your data.

You've been backed into a corner you can never get out of fat boy. We have conclusive proof that not only did the ratings service not evaluate the recruit prior to giving him a rating, the player didn't even exist. The idea that this is a one-time event is laughable and the only leg you can try and stand on. The problem with your explanation is that the same people that gave the phantom recruit 3 stars due to his fake offers have evaluated hundreds of other recruits. So I have data that shows offers impact ratings, and you have no data that supports evaluations are unbiased.


So the next time a poster says offers affect recruiting rankings and you dispute it, they will only need to remind you of this example for you to be proven dead wrong. Again.

Checkmate