Jerry Kill Slams PJ

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John Galt said:
So are you saying the culture was still Kill’s after Tracy had been the coach for 1.5 years? If so that’s funny, because you’ve been adamant for years that Claeys was a first year coach and the team was fully his.

After Fleck had been here for 1.5 years, there is no question whose culture it was.
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Did you hit your head?
 

Gophers_4life said:
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I agree with the other poster that he wears the above in order to stand out, and call attention to himself.
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I hope you were outraged at Tom Landry for wearing a shirt and tie along with a fedora. What a self-serving, sanctimonious schmuck he was.

We've seen football coaches wear polo shirts, hoodies, sweatshirts with the sleeves cut off, huge bulbous jackets, ties, overcoats, etc. What is the norm that you feel everyone should conform to?

What a ridiculous complaint.
 


Gophers_4life said:
It was referring to the flashy, gimmick stuff that Fleck does, like running up and down the sidelines. Or like another poster just pointed out, why does he wear those ridiculous outfits on the sidelines?

Kill was saying that Fleck doesn't do all that stuff for the players. He does it to stroke his own ego.

That's specific what that comment was addressing.


It wasn't anything even remotely close to making the claim that Fleck doesn't care about his players. He clearly does.
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Why does anyone care what he wears, or that he sprints down the field at the end of the quarter, or any of this other stuff? Clearly, his players love him and have no issue with it. It also does not seem to be hindering him on the recruiting trail. He's recruiting very well, considering our recent history of mediocrity on the field. Those things are a heck of a lot more important than what us fans think.

I don't care if he wears the Goldy costume, coaches from the booth, or coaches games remotely via web conferencing. If he wins and runs a clean program while doing it, that's all I care about.
 

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John Galt said:
I’ll bet most posters would agree with this take. It’s not really controversial.
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I'll bet not. Why don't you start a poll and find out?

When Claeys was named head coach, it was largely seen as a continuation what Kill had started here. Nearly the entire staff under Claeys in 2016 (minus Jay Johnson and Bart Miller) had come over with Kill in 2011, and many were with Kill long before that. Kill views them as his guys. The culture probably did not change much with the Kill-to-Claeys transition.

Is it really that hard to understand why Kill would be offended?
 

WCCO: PJ Fleck ‘Saddened’ By Former Gopher Coach Jerry Kill’s Comments

Minnesota football coach P.J. Fleck says he’s “saddened” by critical remarks from former coach Jerry Kill suggesting Fleck cares more about himself than his players.

Kill, who coached the Gophers from 2011-15, said on Sirius XM radio this week that Fleck’s “ego gets carried away” and he’s “about himself” rather than his players.

Kill, now the athletic director at Southern Illinois , acknowledged he was bothered that Fleck talked about needing to “completely change the culture” when he took over the program in 2017.

Fleck said Thursday on KTLK-AM that he respects Kill but doesn’t understand the criticism.

He says “the one thing that’s really important to me is our players.”

https://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2019/02/22/pj-fleck-saddened-by-jerry-kill-comments-gophers/

Go Gophers!!
 




BulldogGopher said:
Why does anyone care what he wears, or that he sprints down the field at the end of the quarter, or any of this other stuff?
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You're trying to ignore the context of the discussion, which isn't fair.

The context of the discussion is very, very narrow and specific. Namely, that Kill claims that Fleck has a large ego and that he changed after he got the WMU job (his ego got much larger). That's it.

Wearing bright yellow, long sleeve shirt (even when it's 90 degrees out) is a very minor detail in the grand scheme of things, but in the context of the discussion, would seem to support what Kill said.
 

Word said:
What do you think of this look?
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First off, I just puked in my mouth a little, thanks jacka$$!!! :)

But putting this into perspective to the stupid argument a79krgm started, look at the Arkansas player in the background. OMG - the Ole Miss Coach is wearing white when his team is not wearing white!!!!!!!! And Burt is wearing red when his team is wearing all white!!! Stop the presses! What ridiculous outfits!!!! Must be doing it to get noticed on TV!!!!!
 
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Urbandale said:
I hope you were outraged at Tom Landry for wearing a shirt and tie along with a fedora. What a self-serving, sanctimonious schmuck he was.

We've seen football coaches wear polo shirts, hoodies, sweatshirts with the sleeves cut off, huge bulbous jackets, ties, overcoats, etc. What is the norm that you feel everyone should conform to?

What a ridiculous complaint.
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Right? Hahaha never change gopherhole. Literally criticizing a coach because he dresses well on the sidelines. Can't make this sh** up
 




John Galt said:
I’ll bet most posters would agree with this take. It’s not really controversial.
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You're right. You see people refer to Mason/Brewster in the same way they refer to Kill/Claeys. No difference at all.
 


Gophers_4life said:
You wore a long sleeve bright yellow shirt to a business meeting, to a fancy dinner, to a wedding?

No need to be dishonest.
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Would you wear a gray sweatshirt to a business meeting, to a fancy dinner, to a wedding?

You're the one being dishonest.
 

As far as the on-field attire: there is this - on some teams, all of the coaches wear similar outfits - the conformity thing, I guess. With the Gophers, Fleck does his own thing. That's fine. he can wear whatever he wants to wear. but, I will note that the Gopher radio pre-game show will often mention what Fleck is wearing - especially his shoes, which he has custom-made for most games, as I recall.

Fleck says he wears a tie because of his time with Jim Tressel. again, fine.

As I've said before, both things can be true. Fleck loves his players and promotes his culture. And, Fleck is aware of his own image, and how he is portrayed. They are not incompatible. there is nothing inherently wrong with being aware of your own image. But some people apparently feel that saying Fleck is aware of his own image is the same as calling him phony. It is not. It is a more nuanced discussion, and some people seem to have a hard time with nuance. they want everything to be black and white, good or bad.
 


short ornery norwegian said:
As far as the on-field attire: there is this - on some teams, all of the coaches wear similar outfits - the conformity thing, I guess. With the Gophers, Fleck does his own thing. That's fine. he can wear whatever he wants to wear. but, I will note that the Gopher radio pre-game show will often mention what Fleck is wearing - especially his shoes, which he has custom-made for most games, as I recall.

Fleck says he wears a tie because of his time with Jim Tressel. again, fine.

As I've said before, both things can be true. Fleck loves his players and promotes his culture. And, Fleck is aware of his own image, and how he is portrayed. They are not incompatible. there is nothing inherently wrong with being aware of your own image. But some people apparently feel that saying Fleck is aware of his own image is the same as calling him phony. It is not. It is a more nuanced discussion, and some people seem to have a hard time with nuance. they want everything to be black and white, good or bad.
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There's nothing wrong with calling out Fleck for wearing a flashy outfit, as a means of calling attention to himself. He clearly does it. There's really not much discussion to be had there.

In the grand scheme of things, it's a very minor thing, which doesn't affect the outcome of the game one way or another.
 

John Galt said:
So are you saying the culture was still Kill’s after Tracy had been the coach for 1.5 years? If so that’s funny, because you’ve been adamant for years that Claeys was a first year coach and the team was fully his.

After Fleck had been here for 1.5 years, there is no question whose culture it was.
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You're talking about two separate things, and poorly attempting to conflate them into the same. Claeys was a first-year coach and the results were fully his. That doesn't mean we can go back and retroactively pretend that he recruited and trained the entire roster as the head coach.

Are you this dishonest in real life, or just for your message board persona? What would Ayn Rand say?
 

Some people have no capacity to accept that their opinion may be incorrect or even not the only possible one. Then they compound it by saying the same thing over and over, apparently believing that somehow, the last word wins.
 

PhillyGopher said:
Some people have no capacity to accept that their opinion may be incorrect or even not the only possible one. Then they compound it by saying the same thing over and over, apparently believing that somehow, the last word wins.
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Na uh!
 

dpodoll68 said:
You're talking about two separate things, and poorly attempting to conflate them into the same. Claeys was a first-year coach and the results were fully his. That doesn't mean we can go back and retroactively pretend that he recruited and trained the entire roster as the head coach.

Are you this dishonest in real life, or just for your message board persona? What would Ayn Rand say?
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hahaha. Passive aggressive insults. Is that just your message board persona? I bet your friends think you are hilarious.

Again, it's pretty simple. You want to give credit to Claeys for results but state the culture wasn't his. It doesn't matter who recruited the players. Fleck clearly had his culture in place after 1.5 years, but there were many players who originally committed or played for Kill or Claeys. But yet you are claiming this is different during Claeys tenure and it was still Kill's culture. You're not making any logical sense.
 

Gophers_4life said:
No, of course not.

What's your point??
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The point is football coaches wear a variety of outfit and none of those instances (business meeting, fancy dinner, wedding) you brought up apply. When I say he dresses well, I mean he looks stylish out there. That's part of his brand. Who cares? (Personally I enjoy his outfits, I think it's kinda fun)
 

John Galt said:
hahaha. Passive aggressive insults. Is that just your message board persona? I bet your friends think you are hilarious.

Again, it's pretty simple. You want to give credit to Claeys for results but state the culture wasn't his. It doesn't matter who recruited the players. Fleck clearly had his culture in place after 1.5 years, but there were many players who originally committed or played for Kill or Claeys. But yet you are claiming this is different during Claeys tenure and it was still Kill's culture. You're not making any logical sense.
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How is that passive aggressive? I'm being pretty aggressive - you're a terrible poster with bad takes on almost every topic, whether football, basketball, or off-topic.

Of course it matters who recruited the players.

Where have I stated that the culture didn't belong to Claeys? Find the post and link to it for me. I'll be waiting.

Kill recruited most of the roster, not to mention led their training/player development/non-football activities, etc., etc., etc. for their first 1-3 years on campus, so an insinuation that the culture was bad would be a direct assault on him. You can bend over backwards in your Fleck sycophancy to pretend otherwise, but that's the way it is, plain and simple. Whether Kill should have spoken on it (he shouldn't have) is a different matter.
 

NBC Sports: P.J. Fleck goes high after Jerry Kill’s low blows

Jerry Kill fired the shot — or, more precisely, shots — but his target won’t respond in kind.

During an interview on SiriusXM earlier this week, Kill, the former Minnesota head coach, launched a blistering verbal assault on P.J. Fleck, the current Minnesota head coach. Kill, who had Fleck on his Northern Illinois coaching staff for two seasons in 2009 and 2010, stepped down as the Gophers’ coach in October of 2015 amidst health concerns and was replaced by his long-time lieutenant Tracy Claeys, who was fired amidst controversy a year later.

Kill blasted the university’s decision to rid themselves of Claeys at the time — “I won’t be stepping foot back in the stadium and I won’t be stepping foot back at the university,” the coach said — even as he was initially supportive of Fleck taking over the program. Per Kill in this week’s interview, he spoke to Fleck once since he took over the Gophers, and “it wasn’t good. … That’s the last time.”

“Do I still root for the Gophers? I do. Do I enjoy him running up and down the sideline? No. Do I think that he’s about the players? No. He’s about himself,” Kill said Tuesday, adding, “I just lost a lot of respect.”

Thursday, during his own radio appearance, Fleck was given the opportunity to respond — and opted to kill his former boss with kindness.

https://collegefootballtalk.nbcspor...-fleck-goes-high-after-jerry-kills-low-blows/

Go Gophers!!
 

Pioneer Press: Gophers coach Fleck responds to Kill's critical remarks

Minnesota Gophers football coach P.J. Fleck expressed surprise Thursday, Feb. 21, over critical comments former U coach Jerry Kill made about Fleck earlier this week.

“I got a lot of respect for Jerry Kill; I always will,” Fleck said on KTLK-AM 1130 during halftime of the Gophers men’s basketball game against Michigan. “I’ve learned so much from him, especially working for him and knowing him a lot of years. I’m really sorry he feels that way. I’m not sure where that came from.”

https://www.grandforksherald.com/sp...s-coach-fleck-responds-kills-critical-remarks

Go Gophers!!
 

AP: Minnesota coach P.J. Fleck 'saddened' by criticism from former coach Jerry Kill

Kill, now the athletic director at Southern Illinois , acknowledged he was bothered that Fleck talked about needing to "completely change the culture" when he took over the program in 2017.

Fleck said Thursday on KTLK-AM that he respects Kill but doesn't understand the criticism.

He says "the one thing that's really important to me is our players."

https://www.chicagotribune.com/spor...esota-pj-fleck-jerry-kill-20190222-story.html

Go Gophers!!
 

By ridiculous, does the OP mean outfits that about 3/4ths of us who comment here wish we could wear but can't because we would look like Augustus Gloop?
 

dpodoll68 said:
How is that passive aggressive? I'm being pretty aggressive - you're a terrible poster with bad takes on almost every topic, whether football, basketball, or off-topic.

Of course it matters who recruited the players.

Where have I stated that the culture didn't belong to Claeys? Find the post and link to it for me. I'll be waiting.

Kill recruited most of the roster, not to mention led their training/player development/non-football activities, etc., etc., etc. for their first 1-3 years on campus, so an insinuation that the culture was bad would be a direct assault on him. You can bend over backwards in your Fleck sycophancy to pretend otherwise, but that's the way it is, plain and simple. Whether Kill should have spoken on it (he shouldn't have) is a different matter.
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This coming from the poster most would like to see go away.... tell us again how offers don't impact recruiting rankings and all of your other great takes.

My point was very clear, so I won't continue to argue with an idiot.
 

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