Is the decision not to redshirt Wally Ellenson the right decision?

[MadtownGopher]

Somebody like Mich St's Dawson would score 30 points against him, he isn't going to be able to guard a physical 3 in the middle, how fast do you think it would take Izzo to isolate him and pound it down low if he was trying to cover a SF.

Ummmm, that's why we have Austin Hollins and Rodney Williams. Wally isn't going to play enough to let anyone score 30. We have LOTS of good defenders.

 

[Bad Gopher]

Saul must have dug him up on a tour of Vodka distilleries in Eastern Europe...

That's the funniest thing I've heard all day. That said, it's still morning.

 

[Monty519]

If this is what his family really wanted, I can't argue it. I'm sure there will be spurts of games where he will make an impact. I'm sure he's well aware that he won't be getting 15, 20 minutes most likely, but if they're okay with spot duty, then who am I to tell them otherwise.

And then there's always the chance he gets his feet under him and just blossoms and then we're talking about we need to make room for him to get more minutes.

 

[GopherinPhilly]

For those that feel he has missed too much time to contribute...consider what we hope/expect this team to do. Before the NDSU game, we had 20 regular season games left out of 29. 18 of them are conference games...where players get banged up, playing time for reserves can come in bunches, and fouls happen. Ellenson should get plenty of opportunities against other back ups and FR and hopefully some scrub time against lessor B1G teams.

When the conference season ends, we have the B1G Tourny. That will hopefully be 3 games against top B1G teams. Then we have the NCAAs.

If by the time we get through the 20 regular season games Ellenson can play in...we see the highly rated FR we expected and he is able to be part of our rotation, hit open jump shots, make drives to the basket and use his length and leaping ability to defend...and we get 10-12 productive minutes from him, then I think he helps up come tournament time.

Oto can't hit anything right now...even though Oto is a 4, he plays alot of 3 when Mo & Ingram are on the floor with him, Mav and Welch. Easily could replace Oto with Wally in that line up and make our second squad a better shooting team. Huge inside out game. Hurt a bit on rebounding, but should be able to run, hit threes and keep it close.

Oto isn't big enough to play the 4 on defense, too slow to guard the three and isn't able to hit anything at any position right now...we need minutes to go to Wally.

 

[Costa Rican Gopher]

Ingram's done his job well this year ... sets screens, rebounds, takes charges. Ellenson doesn't play the same position or role, so that's a non-issue. As for Oto, it's also not exactly a 1 to 1 comparison. Yes, they're both supposed to be "shooters," but Oto's 6-8 and gets minutes at PF. Ellenson's a guard/SF. He won't be able to guard the guys Oto does, and vice versa.

I wonder if this decision is more about "insurance" ... i.e., get Ellenson some experience in case one of the wings goes down for a game or longer in Big Ten play.

This is exactly right. Wally is a 6'4" G who'll play SF, just like Joe Coleman. Oto is a 6'8"+ PF who's playing the 3 because of the log jam with Trevor/Rodney/Ingram. Next year it's 6'8" Buggs who could potentially take 6'8" Oto's minutes, not 6'4" Ellenson. Ellenson's also not a 3 point shooter per se. He's a slasher, a transition guy, who happens to be a decent shooter. Imo the reasons for playing Wally are (in order) 1) He & his family want him to play. 2) He provides us with a 2nd athletic defender (Austin is our only other one) who can stay in front of quicker wings like #24 Braun last night. 3) Provide energy/spark off the bench.

 

[HOOP DREAMS]

Oto-Matic?

This board has really turned on our Latvian friend. Next up "Transfer Oto" chants at all home games...

 

[short ornery norwegian]

Obviously, if someone gets hurt, that might open up playing time for Ellenson. BUT - unless Tubby has a plan to get him consistent minutes - I would say at least 5-10 a game - then I do not agree with the decision to pull the redshirt.

This smells to me like the family had a lot of say in this - and the Gophs are REALLY trying to recruit the younger brother. I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have to wonder if there is a quid pro quo at work here - i.e. "Wally wants to play this season. If you (Tubby) let him play, then you will have a better chance of signing Henry."

 

[Dr.Don]

Obviously, if someone gets hurt, that might open up playing time for Ellenson. BUT - unless Tubby has a plan to get him consistent minutes - I would say at least 5-10 a game - then I do not agree with the decision to pull the redshirt.

This smells to me like the family had a lot of say in this - and the Gophs are REALLY trying to recruit the younger brother. I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have to wonder if there is a quid pro quo at work here - i.e. "Wally wants to play this season. If you (Tubby) let him play, then you will have a better chance of signing Henry."

Total bull$hit comment. There are no coaches nor parents (with 1 FB exemption) that will ever put the success of the team, both present and future, at risk just for their own kid. (Oops, Kris Humphries, but that is in the past)

How do I know that? I am GOD!!!

Go Gophers!!!

 

[matt]

Obviously, if someone gets hurt, that might open up playing time for Ellenson. BUT - unless Tubby has a plan to get him consistent minutes - I would say at least 5-10 a game - then I do not agree with the decision to pull the redshirt.

This smells to me like the family had a lot of say in this - and the Gophs are REALLY trying to recruit the younger brother. I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have to wonder if there is a quid pro quo at work here - i.e. "Wally wants to play this season. If you (Tubby) let him play, then you will have a better chance of signing Henry."

Tubby also met with Charles Buggs and his family before deciding on his redshirt, so you can keep believing your conspiracy theory or go with logic.

 

[XMan]

Obviously, if someone gets hurt, that might open up playing time for Ellenson. BUT - unless Tubby has a plan to get him consistent minutes - I would say at least 5-10 a game - then I do not agree with the decision to pull the redshirt.

This smells to me like the family had a lot of say in this - and the Gophs are REALLY trying to recruit the younger brother. I hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but I have to wonder if there is a quid pro quo at work here - i.e. "Wally wants to play this season. If you (Tubby) let him play, then you will have a better chance of signing Henry."

That is not how Wally's parents operate.

 

[GoldInDirt]

Pulling the redshirt is not in the best interest of Wally and may or may not be in the best interest of the team. One more year to grow physically and mentally and getting four full seasons to play would increase his NBA draft potential (salary) or other-professional salary that most. This will likely cost him money in the long-term. Plus he'd get another free year of tuition to get a masters and further position himself to make more money post-basketball. It's possible that the team will have some benefit from him, but it's possible we don't need the deep rotation we already have and the team could use a 5th year senior more than a freshman who is only playing 1/2 the season. He looked really bad last night, hopefully that is first night jitters but it didn't create a positive reinforcement for pulling the redshirt.

 

[bemidjigopher]

redshirting would actually hurt your NBA chances, scouts like their players, the way their players like their women, like them young

 

[Parski1]

I like it - This is our chance to make a run deep in the tourney with Williams and Mbakwe still here. A bench with Wally will only make us better.

 

[oleboy41]

Yep. The more I think about it the more I like it. Without Wally we're in a shaky spot. Our starting wings have played very well and our guards off the bench are decent players but Wally is the only athletic option off the bench and that could be the difference at some point. In a season with high expectations when we're playing games that mean a lot in the B1G and B1G tourney and NCAA tourney, there may come a game where we need Wally to match up athletically against a good team. Plus most good teams have someone off the bench that can spark the team at times. I don't really count Trevor because he's going to be a starter in all but name and we really need more firepower in that second unit.

 

[Juicer]

Wally at 5 minutes per game gives us more than the other options. We will still have him for 3 more full years.

 

[BleedGopher]

Amelia weighs in from her chat yesterday:

"I can tell you I was surprised they pulled the redshirt. I’m not saying Ellenson can’t contribute, just that this team has so many players already – and he had already missed 11 games. The freshman is now going to be thrown into the fire of the Big Ten without really having the chance to learn and grow through the non-conference schedule. I don’t hate the move, I’m just a little surprised about it. But now that Smith took away the redshirt, he’s got to play Ellenson. I can see him getting around 10 minutes a game, but probably not more than that."

http://www.startribune.com/sports/gophers/183040841.html

Go Gophers!!

 

[Moses87]

For those who say pulling his Redshirt hurts his NBA chances, consider the exposure Wally COULD get if the Gophers make a huge run and he contributes...It could leave a lasting impression in the scouts minds...Wally hitting a few clutch shots in limited minutes will really help his profile and give him invaluable exposure and experience.

If you had a chance to be a part of a special season, would you take it or wait patiently on the pine? I think most of us, would take our chance, however slim...you never know, the Gophers could have injuries, thrusting Wally into a more prominent role. I don't blame him or Tubby for burning the redshirt. When you have a chance for greatness, go all in!

 

[SelectionSunday]

Amelia weighs in from her chat yesterday:

". ... But now that Smith took away the redshirt, he’s got to play Ellenson."

I understand what Amelia is saying, but reading between the lines it seems apparent Tubby preferred to redshirt Wally, but Wally and his family did not want that. Tubby then respected the family's wishes.

So to my thinking, Tubby doesn't "have to play him", not at all. He doesn't owe Wally anything. We can presume Wally and his family know the deal, that stripping the redshirt doesn't guarantee anything with regards to playing time? If Wally earns PT, Tubby will give it to him. Simple.

 

[e.bigelow]

Ellenson will hopefully get the little minutes that Oto has been getting this season. Oto has been absolutely awful to watch. He looks lost and is continually making bad decisions on the court. And, I don't remember the last time he hit a wide open jump shot. It has been a while.

 

[Gopher Bandanna Guy]

Keep Wally happy. We want his brother in a few years.

Yes. Agree with this. Also agree with the notion that this is an 'all-in' year for the Gophers, so we need to have a reserve like Wally ready to play if injury strikes. I'm hoping Tubby can afford to give him some more minutes before Big Ten play starts.

 

[Dr.Don]

For all we know, maybe the Ellenson family preferred the red shirt, and Tubby told them, "Look, after evaluating Wally, he is ready to help us this year go deep into the B1G race and also into the NCAA Tournament."

Can anyone prove me wrong?

From what I have read from anyone who has commented about the Ellenson family, they want what is best for their kid AND the TEAM.

 

[Monty519]

For all we know, maybe the Ellenson family preferred the red shirt, and Tubby told them, "Look, after evaluating Wally, he is ready to help us this year go deep into the B1G race and also into the NCAA Tournament."

Can anyone prove me wrong?

From what I have read from anyone who has commented about the Ellenson family, they want what is best for their kid AND the TEAM.

Well this seems to indicate otherwise:

“He wanted to play, his parents felt comfortable with him wanting to play,” Smith said immediately when asked of the decision.

I think Tubby sees a role for him, but it won't be a major role, and basically, if the family is okay with that, then so be it, let him play it. If they would have said to him "You know, we REALLY don't want him to play this year at this point", I honestly don't believe Tubby would have pulled it.

 

[THE SCOUT!]

Will not help gophers win any games, will not play more than 3 minutes in any very close game. No big harm in playing him as he is a very replaceable recruit. Since his parents wanted him to play and he wanted to play and his brother Henry is very highly rated no point in teeing off the family.

 

[Costa Rican Gopher]

For all we know, maybe the Ellenson family preferred the red shirt, and Tubby told them, "Look, after evaluating Wally, he is ready to help us this year go deep into the B1G race and also into the NCAA Tournament."

Can anyone prove me wrong?

From what I have read from anyone who has commented about the Ellenson family, they want what is best for their kid AND the TEAM.

There was an article the other day that stated in the meeting with the Ellensons, that Wally said he wanted to play this year & that his parents supported his decision. That part appears to be fact.

What is speculation is whether or not Tubby would have done it without them asking for it? I suspect Tubby would not have burned the red shirt, but that's just my opinion. We had very good seats right behind the Gopher bench & Wally had a look on his face the entire game like he was constipated or something. I was even commented to my friend about how the kid's facial expressions & body language looked not-so-happy. In retrospect I guess he must have been waiting the whole night to get into the game as they'd agreed & probably wasn't enjoying watching all the way until garbage time. The fact that Tubby held him out until the very end, despite the blowout suggested to me Tubby wasn't exactly itching to get him on the court.

 

[THE SCOUT!]

Nothing he does this year will impact his future as a pro ... Wally will never be a NBA first round draft choice. THE SCOUT!

 

[scher215]

Nothing he does this year will impact his future as a pro ... Wally will never be a NBA first round draft choice. THE SCOUT!

That has been said about countless players their freshman season that end up being NBA draft choices.

How many people had Jimmer Fredette (3-Star) or Steph Curry (3-Star) or Minnesota's own Patrick O'bryant (NR) as lottery picks before they ever set foot on a college basketball court?

I realize these are the exception to the rule, but it is no where near impossible that Wally develop into a first round NBA draft pick.

 

[THE SCOUT!]

I tell like it is ... granted anything is theoretically possible but if he was a future NBA player he would be in the rotation now. He lacks NBA speed and quicks for a 6'4" guy. NBA Hops is not enough

 

[Parski1]

It all out this year with Mbakwe and Williams. Add anybody you can to make the bench deep for March.

 

[mplarson7]

Not only was it his first game back from injury, it was his first collegiate game. I'm not at all surprised he didn't play much.

For all we know, he could really catch on this year and take minutes from Oto, Mav, and Welch.

 

[THE SCOUT!]

maybe he will be an All American and a lottery pick in 2013 also