How many more wins for Ben to lose the disaster level?

Wins to drop disaster label?

  • 10 - plus another season

    Votes: 7 8.4%

  • 9

    Votes: 1 1.2%

  • 8

    Votes: 3 3.6%

  • 7

    Votes: 5 6.0%

  • 6

    Votes: 8 9.6%

  • 5

    Votes: 19 22.9%

  • 4

    Votes: 18 21.7%

  • 3

    Votes: 5 6.0%

  • 2

    Votes: 4 4.8%

  • He has already earned an extension!

    Votes: 13 15.7%
  • Total voters
    83
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Holy Man said:
You have read through my current confidence in the lineup. And that includes my belief that Garcia won't be back. I don't see any of the guys you mention as being able to consistently eat up a lot of minutes effectively.
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That depends on how you view JOJ. He filled in pretty well in Garcia's absence this year mainly playing the 4, which is his best position. His playing time is trending down when both Garcia and Payne are healthy.

JOJ will likely want to be a 30+ min per game player somewhere next season.
 

bga1 said:
That's not a good approach. With each progress point reached - give credit. As long as the progress continues- then keep doing it. This particular season, while bumpy is not at the present time a disaster. Hypothetically in your view, if he goes 12-8 he would still be a disaster. For a coach and team that was predicted by nearly everyone to finish last- that's a borderline coach of the year performance.
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.500 overall is the floor. It’s not my fault he dug the hole he did. I expect he will get there by next year. But the floor is still the floor.

Hypothetically, one 12-8 season does not erase a handful of 2 win seasons. The legacy is built on the full body of work.
 
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regardless of other things, Clem Haskins was a great coach and made a final 4, even though his players didn't excel academically. reality.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
That depends on how you view JOJ. He filled in pretty well in Garcia's absence this year mainly playing the 4, which is his best position. His playing time is trending down when both Garcia and Payne are healthy.

JOJ will likely want to be a 30+ min per game player somewhere next season.
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Fair analysis. I am of the view that JOJ is too small to be a consistently effective power forward/4 in the Big Ten. He has flashes, and he certainly dominates similar sized opponents. I think he gets knocked around a bit by more bruising and traditional B1G 4's. I can't read CBJ mind, but I suspect that has something to do with reduced court time.

He may need to go to the MVC to get 30 consistent minutes next year. I hope he stays. He has upside but has limitations at this level as well.
 

MUgopher32 said:
4 more wins to finish 9-11(especially with a 5th in tourney) will not only lock in his job, but also make it a reasonable decision.

Personally I still don’t think he’s a good in game coach. And not sure he will be anytime soon. But if they finish 9-11 he deserves the 4th year to prove that right or wrong.
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He’s going to get the 4th year as is but going 8 and 12 would be an excellent jump.
 


Unregistered User said:
Well...one of those years was his first year at arkansas, and that was the covid year.

Then 3 years of Elite 8, Elite 8, Sweet 16 (8-10 in conference), so that buys him a little slack.

I still think he's a scumbag, and never want to see him coach here, but there is a legitimate reason why people are/were enamored with him.
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That is some spin!
 


He doesn’t already have the extension. If they finish on an 11 game losing streak he will be fired.
I think 7-13 keeps his job.
Two weeks ago I thought he needed 8-12 to keep his job.

I think he is going to make one tourney before you can declare it wasn’t a bad hire.
 

Some guy said:
He doesn’t already have the extension. If they finish on an 11 game losing streak he will be fired.
I think 7-13 keeps his job.
Two weeks ago I thought he needed 8-12 to keep his job.

I think he is going to make one tourney before you can declare it wasn’t a bad hire.
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If he gets an “extension” with 7,8 or 9 wins I’m not in favor of that at all. I’m just saying he gets to comfortably stay another year.
I don’t see that we are building a powerhouse…without some nice transfer portal additions.
 



Unregistered User said:
Well...one of those years was his first year at arkansas, and that was the covid year.

Then 3 years of Elite 8, Elite 8, Sweet 16 (8-10 in conference), so that buys him a little slack.

I still think he's a scumbag, and never want to see him coach here, but there is a legitimate reason why people are/were enamored with him.
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I'd like to explore this a little. I admit I'm not fully educated about Musselman's career and the programs he's run. What of his actions and his programs' circumstances lead you to consider him a scumbag?
 

mnsportsgeek said:
.500 overall is the floor. It’s not my fault he dug the hole he did. I expect he will get there by next year. But the floor is still the floor.

Hypothetically, one 12-8 season does not erase a handful of 2 win seasons. The legacy is built on the full body of work.
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If his 2 wins seasons are his first two and he keeps building on this season, which has been a fun surprise, it's a bit silly to set some arbitrary number. Transfers, injuries, circumstances beyond his control, etc. can totally upend a year. Are we making overall progress; are they improving as players; are they competing? Rather judge him on these criteria. Oh, yes, having lived through the Ohio State brawl, Mitch Lee and Madison; Jan Gangelhoff, etc. are his players who we want representing the U of M?
 

Mulligan said:
If his 2 wins seasons are his first two and he keeps building on this season, which has been a fun surprise, it's a bit silly to set some arbitrary number. Transfers, injuries, circumstances beyond his control, etc. can totally upend a year. Are we making overall progress; are they improving as players; are they competing? Rather judge him on these criteria. Oh, yes, having lived through the Ohio State brawl, Mitch Lee and Madison; Jan Gangelhoff, etc. are his players who we want representing the U of M?
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Thank you for the big picture perspective.
 

This season is honestly starting to remind me of Clem's third season. Records of 9-19 and 10-18 gave way to a young team with a lot of heart, that got hot toward the end of the 88-89 season and snuck into the NCAA's as an 11 seed with a 17-11 record, 9-9 in the Big Ten. Upset Kansas State and beat Siena (which had upset Stanford) before losing to the Dukies in the Sweet 16. In those days there was no Internet or polls on whether Clem was a disaster or not, but that third year team just kept being a pleasant surprise. Rather very like Ben's third year team.
 



TwistingMyMelon said:
Did you actually poll to come to this conclusion? I know I didn't feel that way and quite a few others around here didn't either. I think the majority of posters here thought this season would be better than last year to some degree. The disagreement was about how much better.

As far as your question, the answer depends upon who you ask. To some, Ben Johnson was, is, and always will be a disaster.
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So no number from you then?

What do your analytics say?
 


Holy Man said:
Fair analysis. I am of the view that JOJ is too small to be a consistently effective power forward/4 in the Big Ten. He has flashes, and he certainly dominates similar sized opponents. I think he gets knocked around a bit by more bruising and traditional B1G 4's. I can't read CBJ mind, but I suspect that has something to do with reduced court time.

He may need to go to the MVC to get 30 consistent minutes next year. I hope he stays. He has upside but has limitations at this level as well.
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Don’t give up on JOJ yet. Last year he was surprisingly the most big ten ready freshman and this year has added a little bit of an outside game. He needs to improve at the 3 and keep the energy consistent but can fill in admirably at the 4 when needed. If he can keep his motor running on high I see him being the poor man’s version of Jordan Murphy in a year or two
 

TheRealUncleRico said:
Don’t give up on JOJ yet. Last year he was surprisingly the most big ten ready freshman and this year has added a little bit of an outside game. He needs to improve at the 3 and keep the energy consistent but can fill in admirably at the 4 when needed. If he can keep his motor running on high I see him being the poor man’s version of Jordan Murphy in a year or two
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I tend to not give up on players. As fans we do that too quickly. Hard for me to see any scenario that he would get 30 minutes a game at any high major school. Someone speculated he may want that. He’s been out of sorts the last couple of times I’ve seen him.
 

I agree with you, and hopefully he is patient and realizes it’s a process but I can definitely see a scenario where he is playing 30 minutes a game by his junior or senior season is all I’m saying.
 

This is actually kind of a tough one because I think for the moment he has removed the disaster label completely but it could come back.

To me the hire is a disaster if he doesn't do enough to earn year 5. I think most feel pretty confident he is going to get year 4 at this point. If in year 4 we see a mass exodus of players or a complete implosion record wise which leads to his firing then I think it is 100% fair to call the hire a disaster. Essentially it would be the basketball version of Tim Brewster.

However, if he is still coaching here in year 5 and beyond I don't think you can call his tenure a disaster. Doesn't mean he was a great hire, just not a disaster.

Disaster to me implies a complete mess. I will go back to the example of Brewster, a first time head coach in way over his head who was never able to really get things on track. In year 3 Ben seems to have things going in the right direction. Now it will be on him to build on this and take another step next year.
 

If the starters stick around for another season, and the bench stays mostly intact, then this team will make the NCAA Tournament next year.

They have a chance to make the Tournament this year, but the non-conference schedule is really hurting them. They need to really take care of business this month.

The 2025 in-state recruits aren't looking great. Johnson needs to find a good headline recruit outside of Minnesota next year.

He's improved, but this thing could go either way. There are signs of hope, but obvious obstacles remain.

If he sticks around, it will be because he built his team and overcame some big roadblocks. He will have earned an extension.

I think they're NIT bound this year, NCAA Tournament bound next year, and a contract extension will be signed. We shall see.
 

mnsportsgeek said:
.500 overall is the floor. It’s not my fault he dug the hole he did. I expect he will get there by next year. But the floor is still the floor.

Hypothetically, one 12-8 season does not erase a handful of 2 win seasons. The legacy is built on the full body of work.
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I'll never understand the obsessing over the first 2 seasons. Especially of a first-time young coach who inherited an empty roster.
 

Things are slowly heading in the right direction. Unless the wheels fall off Ben gets another year.. his overall record and coaching acumen is still sub par... But the needle has stopped decending
 

EasyThere Pilgrim said:
I'll never understand the obsessing over the first 2 seasons. Especially of a first-time young coach who inherited an empty roster.
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I think some people just view this situation incorrectly. They're thinking that this job was like a loan where, if you miss payments, you owe more than normally scheduled later including extra interest ("juice" in the language of loan sharks).

The reality is that this is a high risk but well compensated job that employers view as an investment in the future. You can't keep losing and expect to keep it very long but, if you have a bad start, most employers will forgive that if your teams have improved and show good potential for the future. And, if the employer does fire you, you don't owe termination payments for the loan settlement. The employer gives you money to terminate the arrangement.
 




Otis said:
Your kidding right?

Everyone bailed except Ihnen. And he tore his knee up twice. Ben had to recruit an entire roster. That’s not a great starting point.

He’s not Deon after all!
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His bit is that Ben should have kept the scraps from the 13th place team in the B1G.
 

Otis said:
Your kidding right?

Everyone bailed except Ihnen. And he tore his knee up twice. Ben had to recruit an entire roster. That’s not a great starting point.

He’s not Deon after all!
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All those players bailed AFTER Ben was hired. He objectively did not inherit an empty roster. It's a lie.
 

TheRealUncleRico said:
I agree with you, and hopefully he is patient and realizes it’s a process but I can definitely see a scenario where he is playing 30 minutes a game by his junior or senior season is all I’m saying.
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I have a hard time thinking that Ben would give up on JOJ but I don't think it's so unlikely that JOJ might give up on the team and decide to transfer in hopes of a bigger role. I think that would just make him a fairly typical college basketball player these days.
 


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