Helwagen: Let’s see where Minnesota is in five years. We might be surprised.

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A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Yeah that's accurate.

Stuff like maybe our defense just doesn't hold up longer than that. I know we're running it different, but not sure if that is sustainability, or we changed the look enough that we got the job done, now someone else gets to adjust to it... and similar thoughts.

Not to say last year wasn't a good sign, absolutely was.
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I was nervous about the same things with the defense heading into the bowl game but the performance by the defense against GT put a lot of those fears to bed.

GT had a very good offense and they had a lot of time to dissect what Rossi was doing on defense leading up to the game. Had there been some major holes to exploit they would have found them most likely.

And I do think something clicked in the team over those last 4 games. I saw a dominant football team take the field, they put the hammer down on Purdue, Wisconsin and Georgia Tech and frankly outplayed Northwestern in a lot of ways just got careless with the ball. The offense was solid for most of the year but they got a major jolt from the defense finally playing well over those final few weeks. Everything came together.

No guarantee they can sustain it, but it was different then what we are used to around here. You really can't undersell confidence and momentum, especially in college sports.
 

MNVCGUY said:
I was nervous about the same things with the defense heading into the bowl game but the performance by the defense against GT put a lot of those fears to bed.

GT had a very good offense and they had a lot of time to dissect what Rossi was doing on defense leading up to the game. Had there been some major holes to exploit they would have found them most likely.

And I do think something clicked in the team over those last 4 games. I saw a dominant football team take the field, they put the hammer down on Purdue, Wisconsin and Georgia Tech and frankly outplayed Northwestern in a lot of ways just got careless with the ball. The offense was solid for most of the year but they got a major jolt from the defense finally playing well over those final few weeks. Everything came together.

No guarantee they can sustain it, but it was different then what we are used to around here. You really can't undersell confidence and momentum, especially in college sports.
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IIRC Northwestern was able to bring a lot of pressure on Morgan and forced a fumble or two. The guys really struggled to protect - and, NW played well. Morgan’s worst game, but there was a bad hands tipped pass INT IIRC.

That drive where they marched down the field before halftime and scored on a Thorson run was catastrophic in retrospective review.
 

fmlizard said:
Georgia Tech beat Virginia Tech by 3 TD on national television in Blacksburg, VA. The Georgia Tech win was a good win, everyone!
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Absolutely!

But, for reasons I don't entirely fathom, it's really hard for some Minnesota fans to accept that.
 

MNVCGUY said:
And I do think something clicked in the team over those last 4 games. I saw a dominant football team take the field, they put the hammer down on Purdue, Wisconsin and Georgia Tech and frankly outplayed Northwestern in a lot of ways just got careless with the ball.
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Serious question:

When was the last time we saw a Gopher squad dominate — not just beat, but thoroughly dismantle — three teams of that quality in one season?

I think you would have to go way back...
 


RememberMurray said:
Absolutely!

But, for reasons I don't entirely fathom, it's really hard for some Minnesota fans to accept that.
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Transitive property and sports don't tend to do well...

I liked the win, I'm not as hyped as most, but man transitive property and sports gets absurd almost immediately.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
Transitive property and sports don't tend to do well...

I liked the win, I'm not as hyped as most, but man transitive property and sports gets absurd almost immediately.
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True. I'm not going to argue that the Gophers are 9 TD better than Ohio State (via Purdue), for instance.

But folks have been saying that Va Tech and Miami were "better" opponents for the Gophers since the game was announced and based on the only things we have to measure 2018 -- head to head results and overall standings -- GT was better than those teams.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
IIRC Northwestern was able to bring a lot of pressure on Morgan and forced a fumble or two. The guys really struggled to protect - and, NW played well. Morgan’s worst game, but there was a bad hands tipped pass INT IIRC.

That drive where they marched down the field before halftime and scored on a Thorson run was catastrophic in retrospective review.
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Posted this below in another thread...the first INT bounced around after the NW player initially caught it, so it looked like it was tipped. Both were legit INTs.

Morgan also had those INTs in back to back series against NW. He locked on the receiver in both cases. First one killed what was looking like a nice drive and most likely a Gophs score. Second one gave NW a short field and led to their first TD. Strip fumble in 4th was a killer too.
 

fmlizard said:
True. I'm not going to argue that the Gophers are 9 TD better than Ohio State (via Purdue), for instance.

But folks have been saying that Va Tech and Miami were "better" opponents for the Gophers since the game was announced and based on the only things we have to measure 2018 -- head to head results and overall standings -- GT was better than those teams.
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Yes.

GT beat both head-to-head, and finished ahead of both in the ACC standings.

Seems pretty clear that GT was the best team of those three.
 



PMWinSTP said:
Posted this below in another thread...the first INT bounced around after the NW player initially caught it, so it looked like it was tipped. Both were legit INTs.

Morgan also had those INTs in back to back series against NW. He locked on the receiver in both cases. First one killed what was looking like a nice drive and most likely a Gophs score. Second one gave NW a short field and led to their first TD. Strip fumble in 4th was a killer too.
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NW played well, Morgan a redshirt freshman. Sure we want him to improve but let’s not pretend many/most young QBs lock on to receivers and tempt fate. I expect better out of both this season with their second year jump.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
NW played well, Morgan a redshirt freshman. Sure we want him to improve but let’s not pretend many/most young QBs lock on to receivers and tempt fate. I expect better out of both this season with their second year jump.
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Northwestern was a really good football team last year. I still think there are a lot of people that see the name Northwestern on the schedule and assume a win regardless of how well the team is actually doing. They aren't flashy so they don't get noticed but they win a lot of games and last year they won the division by a wide margin.

That said, as you and others have pointed out, we made some young team mistakes in that game that cost us. Against a team like Northwestern you have to play well and you can't give them anything because if you do they are almost a lock to capitalize on it.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
NW played well, Morgan a redshirt freshman. Sure we want him to improve but let’s not pretend many/most young QBs lock on to receivers and tempt fate. I expect better out of both this season with their second year jump.
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Agreed.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Northwestern was a really good football team last year. I still think there are a lot of people that see the name Northwestern on the schedule and assume a win regardless of how well the team is actually doing. They aren't flashy so they don't get noticed but they win a lot of games and last year they won the division by a wide margin.

That said, as you and others have pointed out, we made some young team mistakes in that game that cost us. Against a team like Northwestern you have to play well and you can't give them anything because if you do they are almost a lock to capitalize on it.
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Yeah I see that with a lot of predictions on here. Northwestern is pretty damn good, folks seem to predict wins vs them pretty casually.
 



PMWinSTP said:
Posted this below in another thread...the first INT bounced around after the NW player initially caught it, so it looked like it was tipped. Both were legit INTs.

Morgan also had those INTs in back to back series against NW. He locked on the receiver in both cases. First one killed what was looking like a nice drive and most likely a Gophs score. Second one gave NW a short field and led to their first TD. Strip fumble in 4th was a killer too.
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Went back to look at it as that didn’t fit my recollection and yeah, I’d argue Bateman let up instead of powering forward into the ball. It was just beyond his fingers as a result. The way our passing game requires the qb to thread the needle through the middle of the field (and teams know what’s coming at this point) we need aggressive, fearless possession receivers to go get the ball. It wasn’t a particularly egregious pass IMO. The second INT, yep, probably a bad decision trying to connect on that long of a pass into that coverage.

About the 14:13 mark

https://youtu.be/zoelCeHK1Lo
 

MNVCGUY said:
Northwestern was a really good football team last year. I still think there are a lot of people that see the name Northwestern on the schedule and assume a win regardless of how well the team is actually doing. They aren't flashy so they don't get noticed but they win a lot of games and last year they won the division by a wide margin.

That said, as you and others have pointed out, we made some young team mistakes in that game that cost us. Against a team like Northwestern you have to play well and you can't give them anything because if you do they are almost a lock to capitalize on it.
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I think they're what Kill wanted to be. Tough, don't make mistakes, force the other team into mistakes and capitalize all without looking flashy
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Went back to look at it as that didn’t fit my recollection and yeah, I’d argue Bateman let up instead of powering forward into the ball. It was just beyond his fingers as a result. The way our passing game requires the qb to thread the needle through the middle of the field (and teams know what’s coming at this point) we need aggressive, fearless possession receivers to go get the ball. It wasn’t a particularly egregious pass IMO. The second INT, yep, probably a bad decision trying to connect on that long of a pass into that coverage.

About the 14:13 mark

https://youtu.be/zoelCeHK1Lo
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Thanks. The back to back nature of the INTs changed the vibe of the first half. Just never got into a rhythm on offense.
 


salzie said:
I think they're what Kill wanted to be. Tough, don't make mistakes, force the other team into mistakes and capitalize all without looking flashy
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I wish we looked a little more flashy on offense in the Kill years...
 


MNVCGUY said:
I just remember wishing we looked like a team that understood the forward pass was a legal play. :cool:
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xVtcQfP.gif
 


MNVCGUY said:
I just remember wishing we looked like a team that understood the forward pass was a legal play. :cool:
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https://gophersports.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1324

Mitch Leidner

CAREER: Played in 47 career games (29-18 record) and started 41 (24-17 record as a starter) • rushed 446 times (15th all-time in school history) for 1,495 yards (third in school history for a quarterback) and 33 career touchdowns (most in school history for a quarterback, fourth for any player) • passed for 7,287 yards (third most in school history) and 36 touchdowns (fifth in school history) • ranks fifth all-time in school history in completion percentage (56.4), second in completions (580) and second in attempts (1,029) • only Minnesota quarterback ever to pass and rush for 30 career touchdowns • ranks second all-time in total offense with 8,882 yards.
 

PMWinSTP said:
https://gophersports.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1324

Mitch Leidner

CAREER: Played in 47 career games (29-18 record) and started 41 (24-17 record as a starter) • rushed 446 times (15th all-time in school history) for 1,495 yards (third in school history for a quarterback) and 33 career touchdowns (most in school history for a quarterback, fourth for any player) • passed for 7,287 yards (third most in school history) and 36 touchdowns (fifth in school history) • ranks fifth all-time in school history in completion percentage (56.4), second in completions (580) and second in attempts (1,029) • only Minnesota quarterback ever to pass and rush for 30 career touchdowns • ranks second all-time in total offense with 8,882 yards.
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Cool, Mitch's passing stats were cumulative because he was a 4 year starter. Or are you somehow trying to imply our passing offense looked good during those years? Here are some numbers that might show otherwise.

Team stats
2016 - 12th in passing with 173.6 ypg
2015 - 8th in passing with 214.8 ypg
2014 - 13th in passing with 141.9 ypg
2013 - 12th in passing with 148.1 ypg - there were only 12 teams in the conference at that point.

Obviously there is more to it then just yards per game but to say our passing offense was not a strong point during those years would be putting it very mildly.
 

MNVCGUY said:
Cool, Mitch's passing stats were cumulative because he was a 4 year starter. Or are you somehow trying to imply our passing offense looked good during those years? Here are some numbers that might show otherwise.

Team stats
2016 - 12th in passing with 173.6 ypg
2015 - 8th in passing with 214.8 ypg
2014 - 13th in passing with 141.9 ypg
2013 - 12th in passing with 148.1 ypg - there were only 12 teams in the conference at that point.

Obviously there is more to it then just yards per game but to say our passing offense was not a strong point during those years would be putting it very mildly.
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P. Nelson was starter a large majority of 2013, so Mitch's numbers are really from 2014-16. I'm not implying anything. Relative to themselves, he is a top five Gopher QB as a passer.
 

PMWinSTP said:
P. Nelson was starter a large majority of 2013, so Mitch's numbers are really from 2014-16. I'm not implying anything. Relative to themselves, he is a top five Gopher QB as a passer.
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Agree. He was by most objective measures an average (and in my opinion) adequate big ten qb.

Sent from my phone using Tapatalk
 

I always felt that, for whatever reason, the receiving corps during those years was pretty sad.

It seemed like most of those years they had usually one reliable pass catcher — a K.J. Maye or a Wolitarsky — accompanied by mostly mediocrity.
 

A_Slab_of_Bacon said:
All good signs (I think Fresno beats us if they didn't go bonkers with play calling... but still good on the team for taking advantage).

I'm hopeful, but nervous.
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Fresno may be in for a surprise starting with a new look huge offensive line.
 

RememberMurray said:
I always felt that, for whatever reason, the receiving corps during those years was pretty sad.

It seemed like most of those years they had usually one reliable pass catcher — a K.J. Maye or a Wolitarsky — accompanied by mostly mediocrity.
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Not sure why this is turning into another Leidner thread....it all started due to a general comment about the passing game struggles during the Kill years....Think the majority agree that Mitch was an OK starter with very few resources around him in the passing game. I also think that if Mitch Leidner was on this team right now he would be comfortably situated behind both Morgan and Annexstad on the depth chart and the majority of the receivers from those years would have a really hard time getting reps with this current group.
 

hungan1 said:
Fresno may be in for a surprise starting with a new look huge offensive line.
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At least from what I've seen it looks like Fresno really did loose a lot of talent. I'm still nervous as they said that last year too, and Tedford has proven to be a really good coach, but I kinda feel like just on the Fresno side they lost an amount / quality of dudes that will impact them.

If we can come out swinging on both sides of the ball ... I think we should be good.

Then again in Gopher history... we don't do that a lot. Hopefully we see that change too ;)
 

MNVCGUY said:
I just remember wishing we looked like a team that understood the forward pass was a legal play. :cool:
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I remember that too. And seeing MAC teams that had better wide receivers. And wonder what kind of mechanics it takes for the ball to spike into the ground 8 yards short of the receiver.
 

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