Gophers Picked Last In Big Ten By CBS' Jon Rothstein

Donate To GopherHole
MadTown, love the comments. We're now officially the worst team going into the season. If it's true, Minnesota is a great opportunity for those top 25 recruits Pitino is going after to be part of something new. If we finish mid-coference, Pitino (and Norwood by proxy) is a genius after what he did in the Sunshine State. Plus it's a great opportunity for those top 25 recruits to be part of...... The key is, even when we lose, the team looks well directed and maintains a high level of energy and excitement. Really looking forward to this season.
 

I would pick Nebraska, PSU and Northwestern to be the worst 3 teams in the Big Ten. Minnesota is in that group with Indiana, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue and Iowa where they all seem to have a similar amount of talent but some are farther ahead than others in terms of the establishment of a winning culture and experience, and I could see any of that group of six teams finishing 4th behind MSU, OSU and Mich which I think are the 3 most talented teams this year and should finish in the top-3.

I think to some extent the rating of Minnesota has to be based on what you thought of Tubby's coaching. If you thought he was doing a great job of coaching up the Gophers (which apparently Rothstein did), naturally you would be inclined to rate the Gophers lower than most. But I don't think the coaching change itself will have a negative impact on the quality or development of the team.
 

Anytime you're ranked behind Nebraska in basketball it's insulting.
 

most writers not from the twin cities are too naive to know about Malik and Rakeem Buckles, with those 2 i think we are a tourney team, also i do think it is definitely possible for us to see Eliot lead the big ten in blocks, Austin lead the big ten in steals and Andre to lead the big ten in scoring, maybe not all 3 but one or 2 of them could do it
 



GophersInIowa said:
We finished 5th in the conference in scoring last year.

Not going to get in another argument about Rodney. But I will say once again that I think it's ridiculous to say "he could only dunk" like every one of his dunks were on a fast break. Many of those dunks came in put backs or drives were the average player may not have scored.

Sure he was a disappointment, but lets not act like he averaged 10.1 points a game by just being lucky.
Click to expand...

But he played most of the game, could jump over about anyone, and could grab offensive boards when he actually wanted them. Thus, his 10.1 points a game (skewed toward the non-conf. portion of the season) simply wasn't that great. I just wasn't that impressed with his game considering the athletic ability he had. He disappeared for the most part and sulked. Seemed like a nice kid, but he just never had "it" that would take him to that next level.

I take that back. He had "it" late in the 2012 season and throughout the NIT (until that championship blowout). We all thought that was the Rodney we were all waiting to see. And then 2012-2013 season came around...what exactly happened to his game? He stopped driving to the hole, stopped being confident, sulked on the court, and besides the occasional 3 and the typical once-a-game eye-bugging dunk, ... what the hell happened? Just seemed like his effort gave out. Perhaps it was the injuries he was having. I don't know. "It" just wasn't there in 2013.
 


cncmin said:
But he played most of the game, could jump over about anyone, and could grab offensive boards when he actually wanted them. Thus, his 10.1 points a game (skewed toward the non-conf. portion of the season) simply wasn't that great. I just wasn't that impressed with his game considering the athletic ability he had. He disappeared for the most part and sulked. Seemed like a nice kid, but he just never had "it" that would take him to that next level.

I take that back. He had "it" late in the 2012 season and throughout the NIT (until that championship blowout). We all thought that was the Rodney we were all waiting to see. And then 2012-2013 season came around...what exactly happened to his game? He stopped driving to the hole, stopped being confident, sulked on the court, and besides the occasional 3 and the typical once-a-game eye-bugging dunk, ... what the hell happened? Just seemed like his effort gave out. Perhaps it was the injuries he was having. I don't know. "It" just wasn't there in 2013.
Click to expand...

He actually scored 12 points that game and was the leading scorer, went 2-4 from 3 and got 2 assists and a block, although he also had 4 turnovers, but he was one of 4 Gophers that game who turned the ball over at least 3 times, so it wasn't a terrible game for him, in fact a pretty good one other than the turnovers. Perhaps a bit of a disappointment after the 18, 24, 21, 21, and 20 point games he had in the five previous games though.
 




You've completely changed your point. My post was in response to you saying that having him on the court was like being down a player on offense. Again, pretty impressive that he was 1st and 3rd considering he was nonexistent on offense, according to you.

MadtownGopher said:
The fact he fell to third as a senior tells you all you need to know. Being the 3rd leading scorerer on a offensively challenged team like the Gophers is nothing to write home about. Plus, his scoring average was almost entirely made up of nonconference games and a few conference games where he scored significantly more (usually in transition or off oops) than his average. He was pretty much nonexistant during our entire slide in the 2nd half of the season last year. If you can't see that he was essentially nothing more than a body on offense I don't know what to tell you.
Click to expand...
 

underground629 said:
You've completely changed your point. My post was in response to you saying that having him on the court was like being down a player on offense. Again, pretty impressive that he was 1st and 3rd considering he was nonexistent on offense, according to you.
Click to expand...

He was nonexistant, he never did anything to create. All he could do is put backs and ally-oops when the defense sagged off him too much. He never drove to the basket and couldn't make a jumper outside of 5 feet. He wasn't a great passer or dribbler so he couldn't create for others. So unless we were throwing oops to him, it felt a lot like playing 4 on 5. He never stepped up when we needed him to. If you watched the games you know this.
 

We will definitely suffer with the loss of Rodney and Trevor. Trevor was a beast on the boards and don't forget what a force Rodney was defensively either. Hopefully we still land Buckles.
 

38% of Rodney's shots last year were two point jumpers, behind only Coleman, Osenieks, and Eliason (wait what?). He did shoot a pretty rough 29% on those shots, but that was better than Austin Hollins (27%) and right there with Dre Hollins (32%) and Coleman (31%). In addition he was second only to Mbakwe in both free throw rate and offensive rebounding and was behind just Austin Hollins in turnover rate. To suggest the Gophers were playing 5-on-4 with him out there is laughable.
 



Down with Goldy said:
38% of Rodney's shots last year were two point jumpers, behind only Coleman, Osenieks, and Eliason (wait what?). He did shoot a pretty rough 29% on those shots, but that was better than Austin Hollins (27%) and right there with Dre Hollins (32%) and Coleman (31%). In addition he was second only to Mbakwe in both free throw rate and offensive rebounding and was behind just Austin Hollins in turnover rate. To suggest the Gophers were playing 5-on-4 with him out there is laughable.
Click to expand...

Rodney contributed offensively last year but not that much in a half court set offense, he was probably a detriment to running an efficient offense, he got alot of his points in the open court and off of offensive rebounds, his rebounding will be missed, hopefully somebody will step up, and he was a stopper on defense, I don't see anyone filling that void.
 

OSUfan said:
I would pick Nebraska, PSU and Northwestern to be the worst 3 teams in the Big Ten. Minnesota is in that group with Indiana, Wisconsin, Illinois, Purdue and Iowa where they all seem to have a similar amount of talent but some are farther ahead than others in terms of the establishment of a winning culture and experience, and I could see any of that group of six teams finishing 4th behind MSU, OSU and Mich which I think are the 3 most talented teams this year and should finish in the top-3.

I think to some extent the rating of Minnesota has to be based on what you thought of Tubby's coaching. If you thought he was doing a great job of coaching up the Gophers (which apparently Rothstein did), naturally you would be inclined to rate the Gophers lower than most. But I don't think the coaching change itself will have a negative impact on the quality or development of the team.
Click to expand...

OSUfan, you always have had good points until now. Richard has 1 year of coaching. Anybody who knows a bit about basketball knows that B1G is not a place for a 2nd year coach. Gophers will be eaten alive. Andre will have 3 fouls before the 10 minutes mark. MW and EE are a bit slow for forwards from Iowa,...... the only way that Richard can win some games is if he plays fast offense that is almost imposible in B1G. UW will beat the Gophers all the way. Purdue has a guy in the middle who was a Gopher's target. He will kill both MW and EE at the same time. Nebraska and PSU have really good coachs. The only team that is worse than Gophers is NWU.

Like I have said before, I hope that everybody including myself will be proven wrong with the Gophers and TT.

Go Gophers
 


MadtownGopher said:
He was nonexistant, he never did anything to create. All he could do is put backs and ally-oops when the defense sagged off him too much. He never drove to the basket and couldn't make a jumper outside of 5 feet. He wasn't a great passer or dribbler so he couldn't create for others. So unless we were throwing oops to him, it felt a lot like playing 4 on 5. He never stepped up when we needed him to. If you watched the games you know this.
Click to expand...
Rodney was clearly the 3rd or 4th most productive player on the team ...Statistics clearly point this out... to say he was nonexistent(did not exist) is to illuminate oneself as being foolish .
 

Jim Cramer said:
Rodney was clearly the 3rd or 4th most productive player on the team ...Statistics clearly point this out... to say he was nonexistent(did not exist) is to illuminate oneself as being foolish .
Click to expand...

Let's not pretend we just lost Bobby Jackson, Kevin McHale, Voshon Lenard, (insert favorite Gopher player here). He was a decent, not great, Golden Gopher (particularly on the offensive end). Given how great an athlete he was and his rebounding/defensive ability, I think it is pretty telling that not one NBA team felt he was worthy of a 2nd round draft pick. Primary reason: not a good offensive player.
 

golfing18now said:
Let's not pretend we just lost Bobby Jackson, Kevin McHale, Voshon Lenard, (insert favorite Gopher player here). He was a decent, not great, Golden Gopher (particularly on the offensive end). Given how great an athlete he was and his rebounding/defensive ability, I think it is pretty telling that not one NBA team felt he was worthy of a 2nd round draft pick. Primary reason: not a good offensive player.
Click to expand...

I'd go as far as NO PROFESSIONAL TEAM has shown any interest in him. I'd be very surprised if he played professionally in Europe. I see his options being similar to Damian Johnson's when he played professionally in Japan for a year or two.
 

The-Real-Truth said:
OSUfan, you always have had good points until now. Richard has 1 year of coaching. Anybody who knows a bit about basketball knows that B1G is not a place for a 2nd year coach. Gophers will be eaten alive. Andre will have 3 fouls before the 10 minutes mark. MW and EE are a bit slow for forwards from Iowa,...... the only way that Richard can win some games is if he plays fast offense that is almost imposible in B1G. UW will beat the Gophers all the way. Purdue has a guy in the middle who was a Gopher's target. He will kill both MW and EE at the same time. Nebraska and PSU have really good coachs. The only team that is worse than Gophers is NWU.

Like I have said before, I hope that everybody including myself will be proven wrong with the Gophers and TT.

Go Gophers
Click to expand...

Well, I don't happen to think Tubby did a very good job coaching these guys up. Maybe I'm giving Pitino too much of a benefit of the doubt based on John Groce taking over for a middling coach and turning things around quickly in one year with similar players. But the reality is a couple swing games can make a huge difference in where a team finishes in the conference rankings. I think Smith and Buckles can be major contributors, and put them with the Hollinses and you have a pretty good core. Don't need a lot from the others to have a pretty solid team if those four play well. I don't think the style of play change is going to be much of a problem - and actually Wisconsin is prone to struggling against teams that push the ball on offense more than you might expect (see their games with Iowa recently for example).
 

golfing18now said:
Let's not pretend we just lost Bobby Jackson, Kevin McHale, Voshon Lenard, (insert favorite Gopher player here). He was a decent, not great, Golden Gopher (particularly on the offensive end). Given how great an athlete he was and his rebounding/defensive ability, I think it is pretty telling that not one NBA team felt he was worthy of a 2nd round draft pick. Primary reason: not a good offensive player.
Click to expand...
Do not kid yourself there can be a huge difference between not being all Big Ten and being non existent...
 

I think will give wisconsin fits, if we're pressing them after every basket, it'll force their guards to play faster and they'll turn the ball over. Every time I watched the badgers I always thought why don't teams press these guys, they play that slow style because opponents let them.
 

I guess it's never too early to jump in on the predictions game. This year's team is going to score more points than last year's squad with a Malik and the Hollins boys in the backcourt. That's a pretty formidable trio. I also think Buckles at 90%-100% health is going to be a key addition. He's one of those guys that doesn't need plays run for him to succeed. In the best case scenario, he'll play 22-25 minutes and average 7-9 rebounds and 7-9 points. That would be sweet. EE is also going to need to stay healthy and step forward.
However, I don't think this team is going to defend anyone, giving them a huge disadvantage, especially on the boards. I believe this squad is one injury in the frontcourt away from a disaster. I just don't trust Walker--yet.
As for where they will finish, who knows? I do know that WON'T finish in the top five. But, dead last is a bit of a stretch. I think a decent NIT run would be a success for this squad.
There is an element of excitement though. Any time a team gets a new coach and new philosophy, people get excited. There is always that hope that the Hollins boys play like first-team all-conference guys and Buckles is a top five rebounder and EE mans-up.
 

Wisconsin last season.......consider average possessions per 40 min game are ~66 and uw-madison had an adj tempo of 61.7.. When uw-madison had 67 or more possessions in a game (adjusted for overtime(s)), they were 5-1 with the only loss being in a 67 possession loss to Creighton on a neutral court. uw-madison only turned it over 8 times in those ~67 possessions (11.9%) - extremely low. McDermott scored 30.

In games where possessions were lower than the D1 average, uw-madison was only 18-11.

Also, there was no significant correlation between pace of play and uw-madison's offensive or defensive efficiency (which is generally the case with all teams).

That said, simply trying to speed uw-madison up isn't going to equal an easy win.
 

You can't just look at the pace of play and assume that it won't make a difference by looking at a raw number games with possessions over a certain amount - of course you will score easily against some teams that have extremely poor defense (such as Cornell and Nebraska-Omaha for UW last year), and that will tend to speed up the pace significantly. Just because you play a couple porous defensive teams and have higher possessions in the game doesn't mean you're good at playing fast. I think teams need to pay more attention to what Iowa under McCaffery has done against Wisconsin, because they are the one team that seems to have been a bad matchup for Bo's style - they push the ball in transition and they don't want to be forced to execute against the halfcourt defense, which is smart. More teams should emphasize attacking them before the defense gets set.
 

Do you posters even understand the running game?

Rebound, outlet pass, center the ball with pass or dribble, pressure the basket, get the 3 on 1. And lots of ways to pressure the basket.

Trust me, youngens, it takes time for it to turn into a machine.
 

Dr.Don said:
Do you posters even understand the running game?

Rebound, outlet pass, center the ball with pass or dribble, pressure the basket, get the 3 on 1. And lots of ways to pressure the basket.

Trust me, youngens, it takes time for it to turn into a machine.
Click to expand...

This isn't the 60's when you coached Gramps.
 

Thank you. People make such a big deal out of how he got his buckets. Who cares. I'll take dunks any day. I guess people don't like that Rodney was efficient.

Down with Goldy said:
38% of Rodney's shots last year were two point jumpers, behind only Coleman, Osenieks, and Eliason (wait what?). He did shoot a pretty rough 29% on those shots, but that was better than Austin Hollins (27%) and right there with Dre Hollins (32%) and Coleman (31%). In addition he was second only to Mbakwe in both free throw rate and offensive rebounding and was behind just Austin Hollins in turnover rate. To suggest the Gophers were playing 5-on-4 with him out there is laughable.
Click to expand...
 

And DJ was one of the greatest recent Gophers we've had.

MadtownGopher said:
I'd go as far as NO PROFESSIONAL TEAM has shown any interest in him. I'd be very surprised if he played professionally in Europe. I see his options being similar to Damian Johnson's when he played professionally in Japan for a year or two.
Click to expand...
 

underground629 said:
And DJ was one of the greatest recent Gophers we've had.
Click to expand...

And he had only a fraction of the physical tools that Rodney has. Damian will always be one of my favorite Gophers, still pissed he got screwed over his senior year by not being selected to the Defensive All Conference Team. He was something like 2nd in blocks and 3rd in steals. He could also guard PG-PF. He should have been defensive player of the year.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom