Florida Gator QB signee wants release after $13MM NIL deal falls through

MNVCGUY

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
15,741
Reaction score
12,521
Points
113
NIL is a two way street. You're getting paid .... but you can also just as easily get screwed over. (Talking the POV of the players)

Is this really how you want to get paid?

Notice how not a single professional league in the world uses this model?
The problem isn't NIL - NIL as intended is a great thing for college athletes and should have been around for years.

The problem is the very predictable Pay for Play being labeled as NIL. But that kind of stuff has been going on forever they can now just do it out in the open and call it NIL.
 

Gophers_4life

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Messages
12,661
Reaction score
2,771
Points
113
The problem isn't NIL - NIL as intended is a great thing for college athletes and should have been around for years.

The problem is the very predictable Pay for Play being labeled as NIL. But that kind of stuff has been going on forever they can now just do it out in the open and call it NIL.
Baseball players sign contracts, with the Yankees or whomever can pay the most. There is no salary cap.

I'm sure some really good players also have NIL deals on the side, which never get reported in the public.


Why shouldn't college football be like that?
 

PhiloVance

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2021
Messages
1,968
Reaction score
1,169
Points
113
OK, fair enough, does seem like some bad faith things going on.

All the same - I still say stick it to the kid.

Sick of this buying recruits with NIL crap. Expose it all, blow it up.
As long as there is college football there will be fans who will offer you athletes money.
OK, fair enough, does seem like some bad faith things going on.

All the same - I still say stick it to the kid.

Sick of this buying recruits with NIL crap. Expose it all, blow it up.
As long as there is college football there will be booster money
OK, fair enough, does seem like some bad faith things going on.

All the same - I still say stick it to the kid.

Sick of this buying recruits with NIL crap. Expose it all, blow it up.
As long as there is college football there will be boosters offering young athletes money. And many of these athletes come from poor or lower middle income families and see this as a lifetime opportunity to have cash in their pockets. My thoughts are you go after the money not necessarily the athlete.
 

Gophers_4life

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Messages
12,661
Reaction score
2,771
Points
113
Yeah poor him, having to spend his first, developmental year in the lowly Florida program that barely has anything nice and barely spends any money on football.

He likely won't get any development or have a good experience there, at all.
 



A_Slab_of_Bacon

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 21, 2015
Messages
20,962
Reaction score
8,964
Points
113
Releasing him from his letter of intent sets a dangerous precedent though. In theory these NIL deals are independent of the school (we all know the reality). So if you start releasing kids from their signed letter of intent because some third party collective fell short of their promises.....
What choice do they have though?

Boosters lied to the kid….

School holds him to his signature looks / is bad too.

“Yeah well we’re not the collective so screw you.” Isn’t good either. And if the kid gets legal help… I bet the school and collective don’t want to go there.
 


MaxyJR1

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
9,890
Reaction score
3,210
Points
113
The problem isn't NIL - NIL as intended is a great thing for college athletes and should have been around for years.

The problem is the very predictable Pay for Play being labeled as NIL. But that kind of stuff has been going on forever they can now just do it out in the open and call it NIL.
Correct! NIL is Name, Image, & Likeness. Use of NIL is not what is happening. They are getting paid to play. That kid was never bringing in $13MM in marketing or use of his NIL. However, it shows how much wasteful $$ is directed to sports and entertainment.
 

Gophergrandpa

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 17, 2018
Messages
2,683
Reaction score
3,169
Points
113
Word has it the folks at Gator Collective we’re making promises with money they didn’t have and when they went to donors to ask for money the donors were blindsided / had no idea how much was being offered.
This fiasco makes clear that NIL is an independent personal marketing arrangement between the player and third-parties, that is not a recruiting device, and certainly isn't a prohibited "pay for play" arrangement, right? If this kid--the number 7 ranked QB in his national HS class under 247's composite rating (0.9721)--has multiple school's attempting to get him $13M to play, think how much Texas must have come up with to get Arch Manning's signature on the dotted line. What are the six QBs who are ranked ahead of this kid in the 2023 recruiting class commanding in NIL money? I'm glad the Gophers are what they are--an actual college football team.
 



upnorthkid

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 23, 2011
Messages
7,302
Reaction score
2,474
Points
113
I’ll be real curious to see how many of these “deals” end up being complete shit, particularly for these unproven commodities. Also, this kid is making more than the minimum nfl rookie salary. If that doesn’t ring alarm bells for the sustainability of the whole system for people
 

upnorthkid

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 23, 2011
Messages
7,302
Reaction score
2,474
Points
113
This fiasco makes clear that NIL is an independent personal marketing arrangement between the player and third-parties, that is not a recruiting device, and certainly isn't a prohibited "pay for play" arrangement, right? If this kid--the number 7 ranked QB in his national HS class under 247's composite rating (0.9721)--has multiple school's attempting to get him $13M to play, think how much Texas must have come up with to get Arch Manning's signature on the dotted line. What are the six QBs who are ahead of him in this year recruiting class commanding in NIL money? I'm glad the Gophers are what they are--an actual college football team.
I would imagine not 13 million given this kid isn’t getting that and this was clearly a lie to get him to sign. Every kid is going to sign for something different and this guy was looking for money.
Manning has no real incentive to do that given his family pedigree so id imagine the NIL played a much smaller role
 

Bob_Loblaw

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 23, 2009
Messages
17,840
Reaction score
10,308
Points
113
How long til he commits to Wisconsin? And then how long til that troll posts 10 links to the story?
It looked like exactly 1 post until it brought a troll out.
 

Gophers1992

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2019
Messages
2,055
Reaction score
2,653
Points
113
Correct! NIL is Name, Image, & Likeness. Use of NIL is not what is happening. They are getting paid to play. That kid was never bringing in $13MM in marketing or use of his NIL. However, it shows how much wasteful $$ is directed to sports and entertainment.
This is why the NCAA and whoever else is involved should stop trying to differentiate between NIL, pay for play, etc. Just let people spend their money however they wish.
 



A_Slab_of_Bacon

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 21, 2015
Messages
20,962
Reaction score
8,964
Points
113
This fiasco makes clear that NIL is an independent personal marketing arrangement between the player and third-parties, that is not a recruiting device, and certainly isn't a prohibited "pay for play" arrangement, right? If this kid--the number 7 ranked QB in his national HS class under 247's composite rating (0.9721)--has multiple school's attempting to get him $13M to play, think how much Texas must have come up with to get Arch Manning's signature on the dotted line. What are the six QBs who are ranked ahead of this kid in the 2023 recruiting class commanding in NIL money? I'm glad the Gophers are what they are--an actual college football team.
Well let’s be clear… he did NOT get 13 million.


It’s possible others are getting way less, but actually are getting money.
 

MNVCGUY

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
15,741
Reaction score
12,521
Points
113
I’ll be real curious to see how many of these “deals” end up being complete shit, particularly for these unproven commodities. Also, this kid is making more than the minimum nfl rookie salary. If that doesn’t ring alarm bells for the sustainability of the whole system for people
That is the crazy part of all this....some collective was saying they would throw 13 million in pay for play money (not NIL) at a recruit who hasn't even taken a single college snap and could be a total bust like so many of them end up being.

I just hope at some point there starts to be a distinction between the legit NIL deals and these bogus pay for play deals that are being called NIL even though they clearly are not.
 

Bob_Loblaw

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 23, 2009
Messages
17,840
Reaction score
10,308
Points
113
Interesting part of the story:

The situation could have long-term ramifications for Napier and the Gators. Rashada's representatives could file a lawsuit against the Gator Collective and maybe the athletic department.

I get why they could go after the collective for not coming through on financial promises but I wonder what grounds they would have for going after the Florida Athletic Department?

The idea of offering a high school recruit 13 million is just insane to begin with.
I think the argument would be breach of contract. His argument will be that he contracted with the University of Florida and it's affiliate (Gator Collective) to enter into this agreement. He would not have been a part of the contract but for the University of Florida's involvement. His case gets really strong if he has evidence Florida officials used terms like "we" when discussing the Gator Collective.

His argument will be that his deal was really with Florida and the Gator Collective. He signed the deal with Florida. It's Florida holding him to his scholarship. He worked with the Gator Collective through the U of Florida and they acted (and treated him) like they were one entity.

You're right that it's interesting though because it puts NIL on blast. I believe his allegations will be everything we know to be true but the NCAA has had to pretend wasn't happening - the schools are paying the players through NIL.
 

Gophers_4life

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Messages
12,661
Reaction score
2,771
Points
113
I’ll be real curious to see how many of these “deals” end up being complete shit, particularly for these unproven commodities. Also, this kid is making more than the minimum nfl rookie salary. If that doesn’t ring alarm bells for the sustainability of the whole system for people
It's completely sustainable for athletic departments -- they don't put in a single dime!
 

Gophers_4life

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Messages
12,661
Reaction score
2,771
Points
113
I think the argument would be breach of contract. His argument will be that he contracted with the University of Florida and it's affiliate (Gator Collective) to enter into this agreement. He would not have been a part of the contract but for the University of Florida's involvement. His case gets really strong if he has evidence Florida officials used terms like "we" when discussing the Gator Collective.

His argument will be that his deal was really with Florida and the Gator Collective. He signed the deal with Florida. It's Florida holding him to his scholarship. He worked with the Gator Collective through the U of Florida and they acted (and treated him) like they were one entity.

You're right that it's interesting though because it puts NIL on blast. I believe his allegations will be everything we know to be true but the NCAA has had to pretend wasn't happening - the schools are paying the players through NIL.
So if I enter into a parking contract with a parking garage that's next door to a coffee shop that I really like and go to daily and the garage has signage up saying "coffee shop parking here", and then the garage cancels my contract for no valid reason ... I can sue that coffee shop because I only entered that contract since they were affiliated with the coffee shop?


Far from a perfect analogy, I'm not claiming otherwise. But seems not that far off to me??
 
Last edited:

MNVCGUY

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
15,741
Reaction score
12,521
Points
113
I think the argument would be breach of contract. His argument will be that he contracted with the University of Florida and it's affiliate (Gator Collective) to enter into this agreement. He would not have been a part of the contract but for the University of Florida's involvement. His case gets really strong if he has evidence Florida officials used terms like "we" when discussing the Gator Collective.

His argument will be that his deal was really with Florida and the Gator Collective. He signed the deal with Florida. It's Florida holding him to his scholarship. He worked with the Gator Collective through the U of Florida and they acted (and treated him) like they were one entity.

You're right that it's interesting though because it puts NIL on blast. I believe his allegations will be everything we know to be true but the NCAA has had to pretend wasn't happening - the schools are paying the players through NIL.
Florida will probably release him from his obligation and try to get as clear as they can from all this before they get tangled up in any sort of legal mess.

As I said in another post it is a real shame that NIL is being associated with these pay for play deals. NIL is a great thing, when applied as it is meant to be applied. These pay for play deals are not NIL they are just using NIL as a cover to be able to do in the open and on a larger scale what used to have to be done behind closed doors and kept quiet.
 

Gophers_4life

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Messages
12,661
Reaction score
2,771
Points
113
If he does have hard, good evidence of Florida coaches treating it like a single deal, like a single package .... I mean, that's exactly what the NCAA said is not allowed.

Doesn't the NCAA have to give Florida the death penalty??
 

Gophers_4life

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 27, 2018
Messages
12,661
Reaction score
2,771
Points
113
Florida will probably release him from his obligation and try to get as clear as they can from all this before they get tangled up in any sort of legal mess.

As I said in another post it is a real shame that NIL is being associated with these pay for play deals. NIL is a great thing, when applied as it is meant to be applied. These pay for play deals are not NIL they are just using NIL as a cover to be able to do in the open and on a larger scale what used to have to be done behind closed doors and kept quiet.
Florida can try ... but the lawsuit against the collective is already coming? He was promised $13M and that is not coming, now. Bob is saying legal damages could apply to U of Florida, anyway, regardless if they release him, I believe.
 

Bob_Loblaw

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 23, 2009
Messages
17,840
Reaction score
10,308
Points
113
Florida will probably release him from his obligation and try to get as clear as they can from all this before they get tangled up in any sort of legal mess.

As I said in another post it is a real shame that NIL is being associated with these pay for play deals. NIL is a great thing, when applied as it is meant to be applied. These pay for play deals are not NIL they are just using NIL as a cover to be able to do in the open and on a larger scale what used to have to be done behind closed doors and kept quiet.
I agree. How NIL is being used now is a real problem and ruins what could be a great thing for a lot of college kids.

As to your first point, I agree. I'll be curious if the lawsuit goes further. Simply letting him out of his scholarship doesn't put him back to even. He likely walked away from other NIL deals that may or may not still be available to take the Florida offer.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out.
 

Bob_Loblaw

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 23, 2009
Messages
17,840
Reaction score
10,308
Points
113
If he does have hard, good evidence of Florida coaches treating it like a single deal, like a single package .... I mean, that's exactly what the NCAA said is not allowed.

Doesn't the NCAA have to give Florida the death penalty??
Not a chance (IMO). The NCAA knows this is happening and even if some schools are smart enough to not leave a paper trail, it's only a distinction without a difference.
 



Gopher_In_NYC

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 19, 2010
Messages
11,488
Reaction score
7,537
Points
113
Have you researched how NIL came to be?
Per my post below
@PMWinSTP
My source for the following, where I am quoting from the source, it is note as (per source)-

My premise is that the NCAA knew they were screwed -
  1. after losing two lower court decisions (per source)
  2. and knew that it was highly likely that the SC would uphold the lower courts' decisions.
  3. they were also aware of pending legislation in several states and went about to lobby that legislation so it would be an NIL model vs. pay for play.
  4. the NIL model removes them from being the administrator of that program.
  5. allows them to bogusly, IMO, cling to a notion of amateurism.
  6. MOST importantly they don't have to put in any of their own money.
The timing detailed from an excellent summation (per source) I found online, shows the NCAA was playing Chess while everyone else was playing checkers. Just like at the carnival ring toss where you can win the ginormous bear and everyone is mezmized by them - very few win those bears, just like very few athletes will make real cash off of this.

The just F'ed the players one more time with thier BS. They are a corrupt, venal organization and I will love when they finally die.


Summation -

The NCAA’s decision on name, image, and likeness was announced one day before laws in more than a dozen states were set to take effect that provided the same standards as the new policy.(per source)
(My comments - magically one day or was this coordinated, so they are still running the show dominate the news cycle).

The decision also came weeks after a unanimous Supreme Court decision in NCAA v. Alston that found the NCAA cannot bar colleges from making education-related payments to college athletes. The decision affirmed two previous rulings by lower courts that held that such actions by the NCAA were in violation of the Sherman Antitrust Act.(per source)
(My comments - Ruh Roh").

"The NCAA is not above the law," Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh wrote in a June 21, 2021, opinion. "The NCAA couches its arguments for not paying student athletes in innocuous labels. But the labels cannot disguise the reality: The NCAA's business model would be flatly illegal in almost any other industry in America."(per source)
(My comments -Tongue lashing from a justice and by announcing before the state laws went into effect, they can say, wink wink, we fixed and get your filly robes off our anti-trust exemption.

Sure, this is a bit Michael Claytonish, but when you're talking about the type of cash the NCAA makes with March Madness and a Anti-trust exemption to boot, nothing is beyond the pale.
 

MaxyJR1

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 20, 2008
Messages
9,890
Reaction score
3,210
Points
113
This is why the NCAA and whoever else is involved should stop trying to differentiate between NIL, pay for play, etc. Just let people spend their money however they wish.
I'm kinda at that point
 


Replacement Gopher

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 29, 2009
Messages
2,492
Reaction score
1,213
Points
113
Kid should be free to walk. Florida will argue that it was an independent that was offering the money not the University, but we all know the reality. Kid picked them because of money, no money no reason to stay. I don’t like this because now you are looking at players that think they are bigger than the team but this is what NIL has brought. At the same time, life changing money? Who wouldn’t want it!
No he shouldn’t be allowed to walk.
Sorry dude, should have seen a deposit before you signed, but fact is, you did sign.
 

MNVCGUY

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
Messages
15,741
Reaction score
12,521
Points
113
I agree. How NIL is being used now is a real problem and ruins what could be a great thing for a lot of college kids.

As to your first point, I agree. I'll be curious if the lawsuit goes further. Simply letting him out of his scholarship doesn't put him back to even. He likely walked away from other NIL deals that may or may not still be available to take the Florida offer.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out.
The reality is that "NIL" is probably only being abused in basketball and football where the money in the whole system is huge.

For the vast majority of college sports I would bet that NIL is being applied as it was intended and some athletes are able to make some money on the use of their Name, Image, Likeness although in dollar figures that are nothing like the pay for play deals being tossed around in football and basketball.
 




Top Bottom