Fleck Effect

Donate To GopherHole
hungan1 said:
Why would PJ Fleck move to another head coaching gig other than for a better recruiting hotspot? This move has risks. He is in a great place where he can create his legacy.
Click to expand...
Right .. but is he content with a legacy of 8 average wins per year and one Big Ten title game in 12 years?

I suppose not that different than Ferentz.
 

I’d like to think PJ is on the path to AD. I’d love to get his opinion on Gopher basketball
 

Gophers_4life said:
He could decide to try his hand at NFL.

I could easily see him doing what Sean McVay did or maybe similar to the “motivator” role that Dan Campbell seems to be for Detroit.

If he wants to make that switch, one day.
Click to expand...
I don't see it. He seems to love working with kids while promoting his "RTB" mantra. Can't do either of those in the NFL.
 

Gophers_4life said:
He could decide to try his hand at NFL.

I could easily see him doing what Sean McVay did or maybe similar to the “motivator” role that Dan Campbell seems to be for Detroit.

If he wants to make that switch, one day.
Click to expand...
LOL.
 




PJ is a weird dude. He has all his slogans and different methods of doing things. He’s not particularly popular with his peers and has had a lot of turnover on his staff some promotions elsewhere but a lot that just weren’t good fits for his schtick. You got the bungee cord nonsense to explain his complete change in facial look and his wife is kinda a cartoon character. That said, his players that stick it out are very loyal it seems, he’s recruiting better than we have seen and even better this year, sticks to his guns with the values of his program and graduates kids with GPAs within the program the likes we have never seen. He and his staff and players overall are solid citizens. He’s won a lot of games but at least for me a good chunk of them have been hard to watch with his O philosophies. I think this will be a fun year. Last year with the team we had I think other coaches would have won the West. PJ’s not a great game coach. All in all, there have been more positives than negatives but does he have what it takes to take that next step to where we actually do get to the B10 championship game once in awhile? We’ll know in a a year, or two, I would guess. The schedule is probably too hard this year but in ‘24 and if 8 turns out to be what we think he can be that year will tell the tale, IMO.
 

Shiv0014 said:
This. PJ will coach the Gophs for another 6-10 years, then AD at the U.
Click to expand...
I’ll agree that in 6-10 years he won’t be coaching the gophers. He needs one big year to get a big time offer and he’s gone. If he doesn’t get that big year he’ll be out because fans eventually will turn on him and AD will be restless. Not that I like it but that’s the cycle on CFB
 

gopherbadgerman said:
I’ll agree that in 6-10 years he won’t be coaching the gophers. He needs one big year to get a big time offer and he’s gone. If he doesn’t get that big year he’ll be out because fans eventually will turn on him and AD will be restless. Not that I like it but that’s the cycle on CFB
Click to expand...
I think you overestimate the fan and administration expectations just a bit. Keep beating wisconsin and competing against the top teams and he is almost assured the job as long as he wants. The only thing keeping him from being a lock is he needs to start beating Iowa. Get that done and he can walk away by his own choice only.
 



Gophergrandpa said:
I wasn’t saying it was financial decision. My thought was that one wouldn’t normally go through all the effort of building a custom designed new home in a city if you had one foot out the door already. Why bother? He is building a home for his family and to impress visiting recruits. Seems like a plan for several more years here.
Click to expand...
Have you seen his other two houses?
 






Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
I think you overestimate the fan and administration expectations just a bit. Keep beating wisconsin and competing against the top teams and he is almost assured the job as long as he wants. The only thing keeping him from being a lock is he needs to start beating Iowa. Get that done and he can walk away by his own choice only.
Click to expand...
eventually everything sours. Did you ever think the hockey team would get rid of Woog?

My point was just if hes great I think hes gone, and if hes not great eventually he'll be gone for other reasons.
 

gopherbadgerman said:
eventually everything sours. Did you ever think the hockey team would get rid of Woog?

My point was just if hes great I think hes gone, and if hes not great eventually he'll be gone for other reasons.
Click to expand...
And you think the expectations of the hockey program and the football program are the same?
That's adorable!
 

MonikerSchmoniker45 said:
I don't see it. He seems to love working with kids while promoting his "RTB" mantra. Can't do either of those in the NFL.
Click to expand...
He loves it now, but sometimes doing the same thing can get old and a new challenge can present itself. You could easily be right though, he may never want to leave college.

All the same, if he feels like he can never be a legit contender at Minnesota, I think he'll eventually look for an opportunity to do that somewhere else. It's either that, or decide to be Minnesota Ferentz.
 

Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
And you think the expectations of the hockey program and the football program are the same?
That's adorable!
Click to expand...
No. But people always want more. If the FB team wins 8-9 games a year the next five years and never has another 11-12 win year I guarantee you there will be some unrest
 

Ever wonder where the program would have been if the Gophers beat Iowa in 2019? Win that, go to a major bowl game, recruiting gets to elite player level. Seems like it would have been a tipping point to being a top program. Instead, had a nice final bowl game, stumbled in Covid year and now stuck in solid but not top program record or recruiting wise. I am big Fleck fan, but think that 2019 game changed the trajectory from wunderkid to just a good coach.
 

corcorangopher said:
Ever wonder where the program would have been if the Gophers beat Iowa in 2019? Win that, go to a major bowl game, recruiting gets to elite player level. Seems like it would have been a tipping point to being a top program. Instead, had a nice final bowl game, stumbled in Covid year and now stuck in solid but not top program record or recruiting wise. I am big Fleck fan, but think that 2019 game changed the trajectory from wunderkid to just a good coach.
Click to expand...
I agree but is it a be careful what you wish for scenario? Seems to me if PJ was white hot in 2019 the chances he would have left were much higher then than they are now? PJ doesn't believe in momentum but in 2019 he had it. Rise up again he'll have juice but with it comes the meh of the recent past in between. I agree, that a couple more wins would have been his peak....just question if he'd still be here.
 

gopherbadgerman said:
No. But people always want more. If the FB team wins 8-9 games a year the next five years and never has another 11-12 win year I guarantee you there will be some unrest
Click to expand...
If he can get 8-11 wins consistently, keep beating wi, and starts beating Iowa regularly, he has little to worry about! He does need to start beating the Hawkeyes though or he could be in trouble.

I'm confident we will see a 2019 like seasons going forward because he's the best recruiter I've ever seen and is a very good coach imo.
I'm not the biggest fan of the slogans and the acronyms etc but it is getting results!
 

Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
If he can get 8-11 wins consistently, keep beating wi, and starts beating Iowa regularly, he has little to worry about! He does need to start beating the Hawkeyes though or he could be in trouble.

I'm confident we will see a 2019 like seasons going forward because he's the best recruiter I've ever seen and is a very good coach imo.
I'm not the biggest fan of the slogans and the acronyms etc but it is getting results!
Click to expand...
8-11 wins is a lot different than 8-9 wins though. And he has never beaten Iowa. In the next 5 years if fleck goes 40-25, does not beat Iowa or get to a big ten championship game I guarantee there will be people saying he’s peaked and where else can we go. It’s still way better than any other coach the last 40 years but expectations will change.
 

This is what happens when you stop being just a mediocre team and become consistent.
 

gopherbadgerman said:
8-11 wins is a lot different than 8-9 wins though. And he has never beaten Iowa. In the next 5 years if fleck goes 40-25, does not beat Iowa or get to a big ten championship game I guarantee there will be people saying he’s peaked and where else can we go. It’s still way better than any other coach the last 40 years but expectations will change.
Click to expand...
I don't think we're far apart here.

You sound less confident that PJ can beat Iowa and get 10+ win seasons going forward!
 

Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
If he can get 8-11 wins consistently, keep beating wi, and starts beating Iowa regularly, he has little to worry about! He does need to start beating the Hawkeyes though or he could be in trouble.

I'm confident we will see a 2019 like seasons going forward because he's the best recruiter I've ever seen and is a very good coach imo.
I'm not the biggest fan of the slogans and the acronyms etc but it is getting results!
Click to expand...
Wisc will come back into being more than a 50/50 game. With two additional teams and most likely no divisions, the chances for 9 regular season wins and 5-6 conference wins gets more challenging, IMHO.
 

Gophers_4life said:
I think I prefer a head coach from a lower program over a coordinator, especially one who hasn't been a head coach.

That's just me.

Doesn't really address your point of how Fleck elevating the profile of the program means we could potentially attract higher profile candidates, I do buy that.
Click to expand...
Was it Joel Maturi, George W. Bush, or Pete Townsend who said "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, we won't get fooled again." Seriously, Maturi learned after Brewster that head coaching experience is a trait not to be undervalued. I think a co-ordinator serving as Ye Old Assistant Head Coach could also be a reasonable target. But I prefer someone who has had to run a program top-to-bottom at at least a highly-rated FCS program and hopefully higher than that.
 

MBIII_Fan said:
I saw Damian Johnson use the hastag FleckEffect in regards to a tweet of the top 25 best college football programs in the past 5 years. It made me think back to when we hired PJ, many people were afraid that he'll use us as a stepping stone. A response I always liked was "well if thats the case, then it means he turned us into a successful program and we will be an attractive job"

In my lifetime, our new hires were position coaches or MAC coaches who got their shot at a power 5 school.

Hypothetically, if Fleck were to leave after this next season - I think he has elevated our program where we would attract at least a big time coordinator from a power school or a big name retread (bigger than Les Miles).

Thoughts?
Click to expand...
It’s dumb that people fear the coach just leaving. It has only happened with Holtz. Also, Jerry came from the MAC, Brewster a position coach, and Mason before then was a well-established P5 head coach coming from Kansas, and had just accepted and turned down Georgia the year before. Walker came from TCU, the Southwest Conference, and had been successful there and NDSU prior to that. So, have had established head coaches from strong programs in the past.

All that said, I don’t see many coaches leaving here or anywhere P5 if they turn it around, unless it’s going home or to one of the 4-5 helmet schools. Even then it’s rare because you are leaving your program to just be the next coach at a helmet school and can be run out quick. I’m not even a PJ fan, but I would be really surprised to see him leave if he can get over the jump here.
 

Gophers7NatTitlesBadgers0 said:
I don't think we're far apart here.

You sound less confident that PJ can beat Iowa and get 10+ win seasons going forward!
Click to expand...
Depends how confident you are I guess. I believe he will beat Iowa in the next couple years and I expect at least one 10 win season in the next few years too. I am not confident he’ll win 50 games over the next 5 years or make the CFP or win the big ten. It certainly could happen but I’m not confident it will.
 

gopherbadgerman said:
Depends how confident you are I guess. I believe he will beat Iowa in the next couple years and I expect at least one 10 win season in the next few years too. I am not confident he’ll win 50 games over the next 5 years or make the CFP or win the big ten. It certainly could happen but I’m not confident it will.
Click to expand...
Beating Iowa, getting 10+ win seasons occasionally, and continuing to develop NFL caliber players will appease the core fans imo. For the most part, we understand that 10+ win seasons regularly and championship aspirations aren't very realistic.

The fair weather bandwagon fans are the ones mostly chirping about titles and get pissed if Fleck falls short. They have no affect on Fleck getting pushed out by the AD as far as I'm concerned if it comes to that.
 


gopherbadgerman said:
8-11 wins is a lot different than 8-9 wins though. And he has never beaten Iowa. In the next 5 years if fleck goes 40-25, does not beat Iowa or get to a big ten championship game I guarantee there will be people saying he’s peaked and where else can we go. It’s still way better than any other coach the last 40 years but expectations will change.
Click to expand...
People are saying it now. Doesn't make it right or the prevaling thought though.
 

You must log in or register to reply here.



Top Bottom