Doogie: Outgoing AD Maturi made errors, but he wasn't a failure.

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GophBen said:
Joel Maturi's reign was a Quixotic one. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and the road to the bottom of the B1G standings in Football and Basketball pass right by a boathouse.
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Joel's epitaph.
 


badgergopher said:
I'm curious. From the above you seem to be implying that the verdict is in on Tubby Smith. If so, what is it?
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Yes, the verdict is in on the Tubby hire. At the time, it was the most significant hire in Gopher history. The verdict is still out on Tubby's success as coach of the Gophers. (Sorry, to discuss Tubby on the FB board, just defending by defense of Maturi.)
 


Bob_Loblaw said:
Well, before that it was Mason (at the end), the defense, Maturi, Monson, Cupido . . . so to answer your question, Gopher Nation will bicker about anyone that they feel isn't doing a good job. If Kill doesn't start producing more wins, Gopher Nation will turn on him. If Nelson ends up flopping, he'll receive a lot of criticism from Gopher Nation.

That's just the nature of sports. (look at people constantly hating Vikes coaches, Vikes QBs, now a lot of people have turned on Mauer)
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Ha, sorry Bob, I was being sarcastic. shoulda used the [/sarcasm] brackets.

If Joel ever did anything right it was get people all riled up on this board.
 


I do have an opinion on the topic, but the great part is I don't have to waste time discussing it because he aint the AD anymnore.
 

Nokomis said:
Pros:
Effectively merged the Women's & Men's AD (this should not be under-emphasized) Middle mgmt stuff...not rocket science. Failure here was not making it clear to every coach that isn't in a plus revenue sport that their job and salary are 100% based on success of football and MBB so get on board with that or take a hike!
No major NCAA infractions (also should not be under-emphasized) Really...he hired a bunch of people to enforce the rules? Again, not rocket science.
Majority of teams saw success (NC in hockey, wrestling & golf under his tenure) As a % of opportunities...not great...and none in the two that matter money wise.
Tubby hire (give credit where credit is due) - Tubby called us.
Kill hire (verdict still out but looking like a great hire) - Need we rehash the fact that kill was about the 20th person we contacted and was called on Friday and hired on Sunday after a total failure of the expensive and exhaustive search process that was an embarrassment to the U.
McCutcheon hire (Team USA Olympic volleyball coach) -
TCF Bank Stadium ('nuff said) - And the failure here is that this wasn't part of a real plan to improve all of our athletic facilities but instead a one and done process. The opportunity was to build a real plan for our facilities and build a fund raising apparatus that would raise funds and build our athletic bank accounts for project after project...instead we can't raise enough money to be the last B1G team with a BB practice facility and we have a BB field being built that resembles a GA high school field.

Cons:
Revenue sports (at best stagnated at worst regressed)
Brewster hire (by far the biggest knock on his record)
Mason fire (costly due to poorly handled and timed)
Monson fire (costly due to poorly handled and timed)

Based on the above, I see his tenure as a net positive on The U. Not a chance these list even out.
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Ole got it right...total failure.
 

GopherinPhilly said:


Ole got it right...total failure.
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No. Words have meaning. Total failure has meaning.

If he was a total failure, the athletics department would be bleeding money, and the athletics department would be crushed with NCAA sanctions. There are other ADs who have failed in this way, at least in this area, Maturi didn't fail. Total failure would mean that the Gophers were now scheduled to be tenants in the new Vikings stadium because there was no on campus stadium. And you're really reaching to call the new baseball stadium a failure.

The existence of TCF Bank Stadium disproves the hypothesis that Maturi was a total failure. And dismissing the positives as "rocket science" doesn't make them go away. Since Maturi's performance could have been much worse, he can't be said to be a total failure. Any failure must be only partial.
 

RodentRampage said:
No. Words have meaning. Total failure has meaning.

If he was a total failure, the athletics department would be bleeding money, and the athletics department would be crushed with NCAA sanctions. There are other ADs who have failed in this way, at least in this area, Maturi didn't fail. Total failure would mean that the Gophers were now scheduled to be tenants in the new Vikings stadium because there was no on campus stadium. And you're really reaching to call the new baseball stadium a failure.

The existence of TCF Bank Stadium disproves the hypothesis that Maturi was a total failure. And dismissing the positives as "rocket science" doesn't make them go away. Since Maturi's performance could have been much worse, he can't be said to be a total failure. Any failure must be only partial.
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And this is why America is falling behind other countries...we deem doing the basic requirements of our job as a success. I don't give my assistant a raise because she answers the phone and is able to manage my calendar...that is a basic requirement of her job and if she fails, she is fired. She does get praise and a raise for doing exceptional work on items that separate her from others...performance on a particular project or exceeding the minimums on a task. In this way, Maturi was a total failure.

His sole achievement is TCF, which was blundered in my opinion because fundraising for it was treated like an event instead of a process. Because it was not part of a larger plan, but instead was a one and done. Because he hired a moron to coach our team in its first years and he failed to market a game day experience or consider the need for building tradition from day 1. Oh yeah...and don't get me started on concessions where people where counting on their fingers and toes to figure out how much you owed for a hotdog and a coke.

Maturi did the bare minimum of his job which is what I give him credit for...but an AD for a B1G school has to be better than OK...has to have imagination, has to have a plan and has to understand that winning in FB is priority 1, 2, 4, and 6 of you daily activities!
 



Building the first new Big Ten football stadium in almost 5 decades is the "bare minimum" for a Big Ten AD? So every other Big Ten AD in the last 50 years has been doing less than the bare minimum?

Yet another in a long line of GopherHole posters using gross hyperbole to redress all the horrible injustices done to them by the evil Joel Maturi. I also love how you pretend to have any clue about what his actual job requirements are.
 

GopherinPhilly said:
And this is why America is falling behind other countries...we deem doing the basic requirements of our job as a success. I don't give my assistant a raise because she answers the phone and is able to manage my calendar...that is a basic requirement of her job and if she fails, she is fired. She does get praise and a raise for doing exceptional work on items that separate her from others...performance on a particular project or exceeding the minimums on a task. In this way, Maturi was a total failure.
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Nonsense. Who said that Maturi was a success? Success and total failure are not the only categorizations, life doesn't work that way. To be a total failure, he would have had to have done a much worse job than he did. The University of Minnesota is not crushed by NCAA sanctions, and we're not being shuffled off to be tenants in the new Vikings stadium. That counts for something.
 

GopherinPhilly said:
Pros:
Effectively merged the Women's & Men's AD (this should not be under-emphasized) Middle mgmt stuff...not rocket science. Failure here was not making it clear to every coach that isn't in a plus revenue sport that their job and salary are 100% based on success of football and MBB so get on board with that or take a hike!
No major NCAA infractions (also should not be under-emphasized) Really...he hired a bunch of people to enforce the rules? Again, not rocket science.
Majority of teams saw success (NC in hockey, wrestling & golf under his tenure) As a % of opportunities...not great...and none in the two that matter money wise.
Tubby hire (give credit where credit is due) - Tubby called us.
Kill hire (verdict still out but looking like a great hire) - Need we rehash the fact that kill was about the 20th person we contacted and was called on Friday and hired on Sunday after a total failure of the expensive and exhaustive search process that was an embarrassment to the U.
McCutcheon hire (Team USA Olympic volleyball coach) -
TCF Bank Stadium ('nuff said) - And the failure here is that this wasn't part of a real plan to improve all of our athletic facilities but instead a one and done process. The opportunity was to build a real plan for our facilities and build a fund raising apparatus that would raise funds and build our athletic bank accounts for project after project...instead we can't raise enough money to be the last B1G team with a BB practice facility and we have a BB field being built that resembles a GA high school field.

Ole got it right...total failure.
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Of these listed, the only one we can quantify is success of his teams. The others are opinion only. By my count, the Gophers rank #3 in NC's during Maturi's tenure -- PSU 8, WI 8, MN 5. That's a little better than "not great". True, none are obviously from the big two. But no B1G has won a NC in FB or BB during Maturi's tenure either.

TCF, Tubby, & Kill are viewed are great "gets" for The U both locally and nationally. His one HUGE mistake was Brewster. I'll stand by my "net positive for The U".
 

I give Maturi a 3 out of 10.

I'm probably in the minority on a couple of fronts:

I think Maturi gets a huge amount of credit for keeping the 'U' scandel-free. 10 out of 10 on that category alone.

I think Maturi gets a huge amount of credit for getting TCF built. He did a good job fundraising. 10 out of 10 on that category as well.

I think Maturi should get no credit for the Tubby hire so it's a n/a. Maturi wasn't even close to the top 10 as to why Tubby showed up. Also, it's my opinion that the Tubby hire has been anything but positive. It's not something I would brag about.

I think Maturi gets all the blame in the world for the current state of the Gopher FB team. He gets a 0 out of 10 on that front. In fact, he's the reason TCF is a morgue on some Saturdays. Such a huge negative that anybody that gives him a positive review has their head in the sand. He could end world hunger but it wouldn't matter if the AD is the primary reason the FB team is back to the duldrums. Just an awful, awful job with the most high profile part of his job. Just awful.

3 out of 10 overall.
 



dpodoll68 said:
Building the first new Big Ten football stadium in almost 5 decades is the "bare minimum" for a Big Ten AD? So every other Big Ten AD in the last 50 years has been doing less than the bare minimum?

Yet another in a long line of GopherHole posters using gross hyperbole to redress all the horrible injustices done to them by the evil Joel Maturi. I also love how you pretend to have any clue about what his actual job requirements are.
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Last time I checked...we were the only team in the B1G that needed a new football stadium. So yes, it was a bare minimum of his job to make sure we had a place to play football. Fundraising is part of his job description. Who doesn't have a clue what an AD's job description is? Not like it is a secret....duh.

And I give him credit for getting TCF built...I call him a failure for not having a long term plan that would have taken the fundraising for TCF and continued it towards a long term facilities plan with funding. Notice the first thing Teague speaks of is creating a long term plan for facilities...building a fund raising infrastructure to support it...and making sure the most important sport (Football) wins games. Whether he accomplishes any of these goals or is successful overall will be shown over time...but at least he knows what his job is...unlike Maturi.

And I'm sorry if I offended you with my hyperbole...but after 50 years of failures...I thought maybe we should stop pretending that OK is good enough...and a little hyperbole goes along way.
 

GopherinPhilly said:
And I'm sorry if I offended you with my hyperbole...but after 50 years of failures...I thought maybe we should stop pretending that OK is good enough...and a little hyperbole goes along way.
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It goes a long way to make your arguments look overblown and silly. Maturi is gone. Using hyperbole to make his time here appear worse than it was serves no purpose (except maybe to make yourself feel better?). Acknowledging what he did ok or well doesn't mean folks saying ok is good enough. It just means they are trying to truthfully and accurately look at his tenure.
 

Pewterschmidt said:
I give Maturi a 3 out of 10.

I'm probably in the minority on a couple of fronts:

I think Maturi gets a huge amount of credit for keeping the 'U' scandel-free. 10 out of 10 on that category alone.

I think Maturi gets a huge amount of credit for getting TCF built. He did a good job fundraising. 10 out of 10 on that category as well.

I think Maturi should get no credit for the Tubby hire so it's a n/a. Maturi wasn't even close to the top 10 as to why Tubby showed up. Also, it's my opinion that the Tubby hire has been anything but positive. It's not something I would brag about.

I think Maturi gets all the blame in the world for the current state of the Gopher FB team. He gets a 0 out of 10 on that front. In fact, he's the reason TCF is a morgue on some Saturdays. Such a huge negative that anybody that gives him a positive review has their head in the sand. He could end world hunger but it wouldn't matter if the AD is the primary reason the FB team is back to the duldrums. Just an awful, awful job with the most high profile part of his job. Just awful.

3 out of 10 overall.
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+1 I'd also say he gets a 10 for being a good guy. Maybe the right guy to pick up the pieces of some prior mismanagement but the wrong guy to take the program to the next level?
 

dpodoll68 said:
Building the first new Big Ten football stadium in almost 5 decades is the "bare minimum" for a Big Ten AD? So every other Big Ten AD in the last 50 years has been doing less than the bare minimum?

Yet another in a long line of GopherHole posters using gross hyperbole to redress all the horrible injustices done to them by the evil Joel Maturi. I also love how you pretend to have any clue about what his actual job requirements are.
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"Gross Hyperbole"? Can you please bring it down to my beer drinking\sports loving level please? Curious...Do you have a pocket protector?
 

Parski1 said:
"Gross Hyperbole"? Can you please bring it down to my beer drinking\sports loving level please? Curious...Do you have a pocket protector?
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Those aren't big words at all. Not even a little.
 

Parski1 said:
"Gross Hyperbole"? Can you please bring it down to my beer drinking\sports loving level please? Curious...Do you have a pocket protector?
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If you have trouble with that phrase, I hope like hell you didn't graduate from the U. Sort of cheapens my degree.

Not nearly as ready to defend Maturi as I used to. Haven't really changed my mind about him, but I'm ready to move on. Although that sweet deal he got might also have changed my perspective on him. With the weight people are giving his management of football though, maybe the final evaluation of Maturi needs to wait. He does deserve quite a bit of credit for TCF. Although he squandered a lot of opportunity with the hiring of Brewster, he also hired Kill. If Kill is successful down the road, Maturi will deserve credit for that because he sure will get the blame if Kills fails.

So, ya, Brewster was a major screw-up. But we have the new stadium and we have a coach that inspires hope in quite a few of us. Maturi didn't run the football program into the ground. We have about 50 years of being mediocre at our best and being abysmal at our worst. Would be great (and also funny) if Maturi's final hire turns it around a couple of years after Joel is gone.

You can't have it both ways with the man. Ridiculous to castigate him for all of the failures or hold him personally responsible for anything a person disagrees with and then deny him credit for the positive things he did or refuse to acknowledge he was responsible for all of the sports. Also, it might bear repeating, most of us have no real idea of what priorities he was given or the bureaucracy and special interests with which he had to deal.
 

JoeDirt said:
Ole, I think you are the best at summarizing in clear detail Maturi's tenure here. The U has had so many opportunities to get the football program headed in the right direction. They obviously have failed in many areas and MAturi is as much, if not more, to blame than anyone. It makes me frustrated to think about the last 5 years leading up to the new stadium and coaching debacles. I hope so badly for a great future. It really sucks when I have to tell my wife about how fun it was tailgating at the dome. I long for the day we can have a true college saturday atmosphere.
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Ok, that was pretty funny.
 

Mulligan said:
If you have trouble with that phrase, I hope like hell you didn't graduate from the U. Sort of cheapens my degree.

Not nearly as ready to defend Maturi as I used to. Haven't really changed my mind about him, but I'm ready to move on. Although that sweet deal he got might also have changed my perspective on him. With the weight people are giving his management of football though, maybe the final evaluation of Maturi needs to wait. He does deserve quite a bit of credit for TCF. Although he squandered a lot of opportunity with the hiring of Brewster, he also hired Kill. If Kill is successful down the road, Maturi will deserve credit for that because he sure will get the blame if Kills fails.

So, ya, Brewster was a major screw-up. But we have the new stadium and we have a coach that inspires hope in quite a few of us. Maturi didn't run the football program into the ground. We have about 50 years of being mediocre at our best and being abysmal at our worst. Would be great (and also funny) if Maturi's final hire turns it around a couple of years after Joel is gone.

You can't have it both ways with the man. Ridiculous to castigate him for all of the failures or hold him personally responsible for anything a person disagrees with and then deny him credit for the positive things he did or refuse to acknowledge he was responsible for all of the sports. Also, it might bear repeating, most of us have no real idea of what priorities he was given or the bureaucracy and special interests with which he had to deal.
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Even the Brewster hiring...at the time I thought it was a decent strategy. With two major openings & a limited amount of money, hire/pay one big time coach & one up & comer. He was able to land Tubby (whether that's a home run hire in 2012 is debatable, but at the time it was a very impressive get.) That left the need for an up & comer & that's where Brewster & his NFL talent developer/recruiter/hot-chili babble fooled a lot of us. Maturi seems to have followed up a mistake with a solid hire. If Kill ever gets us where we want to be (and if Tubby's squads can do some damage this/next year) then Maturi's legacy will be far different. That said I never liked to guy & am glad he's gone.
 

Mulligan said:
If you have trouble with that phrase, I hope like hell you didn't graduate from the U. Sort of cheapens my degree.

Not nearly as ready to defend Maturi as I used to. Haven't really changed my mind about him, but I'm ready to move on. Although that sweet deal he got might also have changed my perspective on him. With the weight people are giving his management of football though, maybe the final evaluation of Maturi needs to wait. He does deserve quite a bit of credit for TCF. Although he squandered a lot of opportunity with the hiring of Brewster, he also hired Kill. If Kill is successful down the road, Maturi will deserve credit for that because he sure will get the blame if Kills fails.

So, ya, Brewster was a major screw-up. But we have the new stadium and we have a coach that inspires hope in quite a few of us. Maturi didn't run the football program into the ground. We have about 50 years of being mediocre at our best and being abysmal at our worst. Would be great (and also funny) if Maturi's final hire turns it around a couple of years after Joel is gone.

You can't have it both ways with the man. Ridiculous to castigate him for all of the failures or hold him personally responsible for anything a person disagrees with and then deny him credit for the positive things he did or refuse to acknowledge he was responsible for all of the sports. Also, it might bear repeating, most of us have no real idea of what priorities he was given or the bureaucracy and special interests with which he had to deal.
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"Castigate" - You could have just used the word "criticize" like a normal person. That's about all I got out of your four paragraphs.
 

For those of you that want to blame Maturi for the fall of western civilization, keep in mind he made the decision to not accept a contract extension from President Bruininks.
 

Parski1 said:
"Castigate" - You could have just used the word "criticize" like a normal person. That's about all I got out of your four paragraphs.
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Wow...you're really going with the "don't use slightly more complex words around me because they're too hard" schtick? Yikes...
 

GoAUpher said:
Wow...you're really going with the "don't use slightly more complex words around me because they're too hard" schtick? Yikes...
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At least you have a better understanding of who you are arguing with. :)
 

The Boathouse is illustrative of the old saying putting the cart before the horse. It would seem that Teague is of the opinon you feed and care for the horse and he can pull any cart. Joel by his actions never got it.
 

husker70 said:
The Boathouse is illustrative of the old saying putting the cart before the horse. It would seem that Teague is of the opinon you feed and care for the horse and he can pull any cart. Joel by his actions never got it.
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So are you saying it was Maturi's decision to build a boathouse and not President Bruininks and the Board of Governors responding to pressure from high profile and wealthy supporters of women's athletics as well as powerful and influential state legislators and other government officials? Think again and maybe try doing a little research before you display your ignorance by posting on a topic you don't know near enough about.

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Women's Crew Wants Funding For Boathouse.
Star Tribune (Minneapolis, MN)
September 9, 2003 | Weiner, Jay | Copyright

The campaign to build a new football stadium at the University of Minnesota is about to open the fundraising floodgates for the Gophers women's rowing team.

In so doing, it could also avoid a Title IX dispute.

The announcement of a $35 million proposed gift last week for an on-campus football stadium galvanized supporters of women's athletics, who have been working for three years to get a boathouse for the rowing team.

The squad is the largest women's team on campus, with 85 members. But it has no facilities of its own, except a tent and construction trailer near the Mississippi River. ...

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-107498367.html

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U' Clears Way For Stadium, Boathouse Fundraising
Star Tribune (Minneapolis, MN)
September 13, 2003 | Smetanka, Mary Jane | Copyright

Eager to capitalize on a proposed offer of $35 million in private money for a new on-campus football stadium, University of Minnesota President Robert Bruininks Friday lifted the moratorium on raising money for some athletics facilities.

Bruininks said the ban was lifted for the football stadium and will be lifted for a boathouse that would serve the women's rowing team and men's rowing clubs. A ban on raising money remains in place for other sports facilities, he said.

The fundraising moratorium was imposed in the spring of 2002 as administrators tried to stem red ink in athletics by reorganizing the …

http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-107749671.html


 



Major Accomplishment: TCF Bank Stadium (doubtful this would have been done without the urging of Glen Mason) Also keeping the athletic dept. in the black, he was a great bean counter.
Major Disappointments: No Big 10 Championships in football or basketball - only 1 winning Big 10 Season in football and only 2 in basketball (totally unacceptable). AND the the total cluster f@#K of a hire of Tim Brewster to lead us into the new era of Gopher Football.
 

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