Credibility of EOAA Report

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^she never backed down from her statement of consent with DJam and the recruit. Its when a line formed, and she is naked and alone, that the consent is in question.
 

skauma said:
^she never backed down from her statement of consent with DJam and the recruit. Its when a line formed, and she is naked and alone, that the consent is in question.
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Based on what evidence? She herself said she has little to no recollection of events.
 



Pompous Elitist said:
Why should I believe a thing she says?
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I don't know. You made up that she said she had little to no recollection of the events, and you seem to believe that. So maybe instead of believing the things you made up that she said, you could believe the things she actually said?
 


skauma said:
I don't know. You made up that she said she had little to no recollection of the events, and you seem to believe that. So maybe instead of believing the things you made up that she said, you could believe the things she actually said?
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I made it up? Read the report my man, for comprehension. It's all laid out in rather plain english within the first several pages.
 

I read it. Nowhere does she say she has little to no recollection of the events. Some pieces are missing, which is to be expected, but she is pretty detailed in her account.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
I don't see that report as anything more than hearsay and possible regrets.
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Can you categorize these for me? Hearsay or Regret?
  • "Me and the recruit finna double team this bitch.''
  • "Lol we forreal going brazy lol."
  • "I took good videos."
  • "Damn [name redacted], all 3 them n****s hitting rn."
 

Pompous Elitist said:
Why should I believe a thing she says?
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Because if you don't believe her that means you have to believe the players who have every reason in the world to tell any lie they can think of to avoid prison time, stay on the football team, keep their scholarship, and not get kicked out of the U. That would make you a moron, wouldn't it?
 



I believe DJam felt he did nothing wrong, and his reasoning would be that she consented to having a threesome with him and the recruit...which she admitted her consent to the police before they even questioned DJam. Where DJam is wrong, is that he believed her consent to him and the recruit meant she was consenting to a much larger train than just two carts. He just kept facilitating man after man, where now every man in that apartment are now there to either ride the train, or to see and cheer what was going on. She had no trusted friends there that could help her out.
 

GhostofBronko said:
Can you categorize these for me? Hearsay or Regret?
  • "Me and the recruit finna double team this bitch.''
  • "Lol we forreal going brazy lol."
  • "I took good videos."
  • "Damn [name redacted], all 3 them n****s hitting rn."
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Not in good taste but what does that prove other than these guys are not from high class backgrounds? She was willing to tag-team two guys she had just met. We are not talking about a sweet little girl here.
 

skauma said:
I read it. Nowhere does she say she has little to no recollection of the events. Some pieces are missing, which is to be expected, but she is pretty detailed in her account.
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She became more detailed as time went on which is a big red flag. She changed her story with the police.
She repeatedly said she remembered having sex with between 10-20 men, but she doesn't remember who. She named Kiondre then decided no, it was somebody else after looking at roster photos.

Inconsistencies. Do you think any of this would stand up to a serious questioning? A jury of non-partial peers?
 

UpnorthGo4 said:
Because if you don't believe her that means you have to believe the players who have every reason in the world to tell any lie they can think of to avoid prison time, stay on the football team, keep their scholarship, and not get kicked out of the U. That would make you a moron, wouldn't it?
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She has every reason to lie to protect her reputation. People do that, you know. Don't you understand that ? Is it even the smallest possibility in your tiny, reflexive reptilian brain?
 



skauma said:
I believe DJam felt he did nothing wrong, and his reasoning would be that she consented to having a threesome with him and the recruit...which she admitted her consent to the police before they even questioned DJam. Where DJam is wrong, is that he believed her consent to him and the recruit meant she was consenting to a much larger train than just two carts. He just kept facilitating man after man, where now every man in that apartment are now there to either ride the train, or to see and cheer what was going on. She had no trusted friends there that could help her out.
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And then she said she did not give consent. She changed her story.
 


Pompous Elitist said:
She became more detailed as time went on which is a big red flag. She changed her story with the police.
She repeatedly said she remembered having sex with between 10-20 men, but she doesn't remember who. She named Kiondre then decided no, it was somebody else after looking at roster photos.

Inconsistencies. Do you think any of this would stand up to a serious questioning? A jury of non-partial peers?
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Becoming more detailed as time goes on is not a red flag. Like the investigator told the woman...sometimes pieces come back to memory after time, and asked her to come back to him if she remembered any more details. When you reflect on things, that when memory comes back! Thats not a red flag.

She said she remembered having sex with between 10-20 men...yup. Sounds like thats the case. We know at least 5 football players who did, and 1 recruit...So that's at least 6. Did any of them come in for repeats, and she didnt recognize them from before? 2 are initially there...then a 3rd walks in, and the other two leave...then a 4th and 5th come in and take their turns...maybe 1 or 2 of the first 3 come back in...then the 6th person identified comes in, and then then one or both of the 4th and 5th come back...Also blurred from the report is others, who werent football players who were present. Word on campus apparently spread quickly, as in the report, she contacted a friend, who had already heard about the incident, but didnt know it was her.

What are the inconsistencies? That she doesnt know the names of the 10-20 guys that ****ed her, and cant pick each one of them out from photos?
 

Pompous Elitist said:
And then she said she did not give consent. She changed her story.
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Are we reading different reports? From what I read, she never backed up from her comments of consenting with DJam and the recruit. Its the train that DJam facilitated she did not give consent to.
 

skauma said:
Are we reading different reports? From what I read, she never backed up from her comments of consenting with DJam and the recruit. Its the train that DJam facilitated she did not give consent to.
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She absolutely did recant that. You are not doing well at this. Again, how do you know she didn't consent?
 

skauma said:
Becoming more detailed as time goes on is not a red flag. Like the investigator told the woman...sometimes pieces come back to memory after time, and asked her to come back to him if she remembered any more details. When you reflect on things, that when memory comes back! Thats not a red flag.

She said she remembered having sex with between 10-20 men...yup. Sounds like thats the case. We know at least 5 football players who did, and 1 recruit...So that's at least 6. Did any of them come in for repeats, and she didnt recognize them from before? 2 are initially there...then a 3rd walks in, and the other two leave...then a 4th and 5th come in and take their turns...maybe 1 or 2 of the first 3 come back in...then the 6th person identified comes in, and then then one or both of the 4th and 5th come back...Also blurred from the report is others, who werent football players who were present. Word on campus apparently spread quickly, as in the report, she contacted a friend, who had already heard about the incident, but didnt know it was her.

What are the inconsistencies? That she doesnt know the names of the 10-20 guys that ****ed her, and cant pick each one of them out from photos?
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Geez man...

Please tell me you are not in any part of a management structure.

She explicitly says she does not remember vast lengths of time while at the apartment, framed Kiondre then recanted after she "remembered".

What else is she mis-remembering? How can anything at all be counted on as fact from this girl?
 

Here you go. Read and comprehend this time.



The woman recounted going to an apartment building near the stadium after a football team win over Oregon State. She described a sexual encounter with player Carlton Djam in his room, but said she wasn't a willing participant. "I felt very overpowered and fearful," she testified.

She then described a series of successive assaults by men in Djam's apartment, but conceded she didn't remember all the details clearly, possibly including the number of young men involved.

But she also conceded, when asked by Lee Hutton, the attorney for the players, that she'd later told police investigators that the sex with Djam was consensual — a potential explanation for why the case didn't result in criminal charges.

"Yes, I did say that," the woman testified. "I do not believe it was true." She describes being "frozen with fear" as the assaults continued.

Hutton's cross examination focused on whether the sexual encounters were consensual or involved any use of force.

He also made reference to Instagram messages passing between the woman and the players, to her drinking before she went to Djam's apartment, as well as the woman's opportunities to leave the apartment.

Hutton's questions also touched on some other sensitive details, including a discussion of whether at least one of the encounters was videotaped and shared via a phone app or other means.

The emotional cross-examination was interrupted by a lunch break, and then by talks between the two parties.

A series of closed-door meetings led to the announcement of a settlement.

http://www.mprnews.org/story/2016/11/02/u-minnesota-football-players-restraining-orders-dropped
 

Regarding credibility; A2 was dinged because he didn't remember who took their shirt off first. Are you kidding me? Data point after data point of RS being a totally unreliable witness yet A2 is not credible because he didn't remember the proper order of "shirt removal ".

I'd like to put this investigator on the stand. The jury would already have the verdict in hand but I'd at least like to have something to put in the paper.

An absolute witch hunt. Period. End of story.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
She described a sexual encounter with player Carlton Djam in his room, but said she wasn't a willing participant. "I felt very overpowered and fearful," she testified.
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Bingo - I want to see her state to the police that she was a willing participant with Djam prior to him producing the video tape that showed that she was. I don't think that was the case and I didn't get that impression from the police report. To me, it read like the entire incident was a 90 minute assault where she was drunk - which is why the alcohol was mentioned. I want to see proof that she consistently claimed the early encounters were 100% consensual before I give her credibility in the later statements. We will never know for sure what happened over 90 minutes - but we can be pretty confident about how the whole story started.
 

It was actually 55 minutes in Apartment B. The 90 minute thing keeps being brought up, may have been another mis-remembered detail.
 

Pompous Elitist said:
It was actually 55 minutes in Apartment B. The 90 minute thing keeps being brought up, may have been another mis-remembered detail.
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I know the discrepancy....one of many. Also, I can't see blaming 4-5 shots of 100 proof vodka taken 4 hours before the assault having any bearing on her judgement. She could have legally driven a car and blown legal at that point.
 

I can somewhat understand the reasoning for the victim to not want to have the EOAA view the 90 second video (although it is evidence), but what reason is there for her not allowing them to see the medical report ? Other than the fact that it does not support her side of the story.
 

Too many people are still judging this morally. What SOME of the 10 did was gross and will result in their dismissal (IMO). However, because you morally object to it doesn't mean some people (not talking this case) don't enjoy it. Take the moral aspect off the table and what you have is a biased report. That doesn't make any of it untrue, but if you can't see the bias of this report from page 1 then you just don't want to see it. Sorry, that aspect is undeniable - no matter how you feel about the events that took place. That is unjust. Lumping the others that didn't participate in because of what a biased report feels they "likely knew" is grounds for a lawsuit - IMO.


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Reposting here b/c the thread is more relevant, would like anyone that cares to take a crack at this to explain this:

We do not find that these behaviors indicate that RS did not experience the sexual misconduct that she describes. Rather, we find that RS' conduct during the sexual encounters likely resulted from her shock, confusion, and inability to focus because of the events she was experiencing.
 

bigticket1 said:
I can somewhat understand the reasoning for the victim to not want to have the EOAA view the 90 second video (although it is evidence), but what reason is there for her not allowing them to see the medical report ? Other than the fact that it does not support her side of the story.
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And why would she plead the fifth? And why would she make them agree to not sue her in a civil court? Maybe there are good reasons for these things but why didn't the EOAA even consider them. I seem to seldom agree with PE on here, but he nailed this one - a conclusion searching for supportive info.

Terrible situation. There will be punishments, but how can folks not see the report is biased in every way it is written.


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westcoastgopher11 said:
Reposting here b/c the thread is more relevant, would like anyone that cares to take a crack at this to explain this:

We do not find that these behaviors indicate that RS did not experience the sexual misconduct that she describes. Rather, we find that RS' conduct during the sexual encounters likely resulted from her shock, confusion, and inability to focus because of the events she was experiencing.
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It means the authors of the report are offering their own explanations for someone's conduct without fact to back it up. It is pure conjecture and completely unsubstantiated.
 

Spoofin said:
And why would she plead the fifth? And why would she make them agree to not sue her in a civil court?
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There are very simple answers to your questions. She pleaded the Fifth because that is what her attorney advised her to do. She had consensual sex with a 17 year old high school student. And she made the players agree not to sue her in civil court because that is what her lawyer advised here to do. Lawyers insert that kind of thing in every contract they negotiate. It would be malpractice for them not to. People file lawsuits against innocent victims every day whether they are justified or not. They often do it just to harass the person they are suing. If you don't know that then you don't know any lawyers.

You guys continue to ignore the fact at least one or more of the players admitted that they heard the girl say she wanted the sex to stop at some point after the first couple of guys came through the door. Any sexual activity that occurred after that was rape. Needless to say, we are not going to let you ignore that inconvenient fact. It is going to continue to be brought up in every thread.
 

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