Ben Johnson is a Disaster

[RockChalk]

It sure does. One 5-star, 2 other good recruits, and 3 or 4 freshmen improving certainly does fix 0-20.

Haskins made the Sweet-16 after 2-16 & 4-14 in conference in the previous years.

Although we CAN look for progress this year. If our freshmen don't improve enough to help us win any games late in the season, then I will start to worry.

Yeah but if you are a below average coach it doesn't. My example would be Memphis and Penny Hardaway. #1 recruiting class the year of Wiseman and didn't make the tourney.

 

[Johnnyboy18]

Yeah but if you are a below average coach it doesn't. My example would be Memphis and Penny Hardaway. #1 recruiting class the year of Wiseman and didn't make the tourney.

Bad example. Wiseman quit in December that year. He then proceeded to win the NIT the following year and make the 2nd round the following year. Good thing they didn't fire him.

 

[bc2211]

So, after one season and 12 games have you, in your great discernment, determined that Coach Johnson is a "sh!tty" coach?
I suppose it doesn't matter that last year's team is entirely different from this year's team. And, I suppose that you have broken down every decision Ben has made to determine which decision was "sh!tty" and which wasn't.
From basic observation I will state that when Ben calls a timeout and draws up a play, it is almost always successful in getting the Gophers a basket. His inbounds plays have been solid. When have you seen the Pitino patented toss the ball 3/4 of the court to inbound play?

The conclusion I am left with is that you are being illogical.

we’ve sucked so badly in the first four minutes of the second half. He could be able to draw up 5 plays a game coming out of timeouts, but he doesn’t seem to be winning the half time adjustments.

 

[MUgopher32]

This issue with BJ currently is in his first two seasons we have no team identity. No style of play. Most games look like there is zero game plan or offensive plan except to chuck. And there is a extremely disproportionate amount of guards vs non guards on the team.

Now can all of this still get fixed/sorted out?? Absolutely.

But anyone saying that we are just auto going to improve next year because of recruiting and guys getting older/more experienced are nuts. The way players develop best is by getting comfortable in a efficient system and to a coaches style of play. Complimentary players developing together with defined roles. You could recruit the 7 best players in the country. But if all 7 are 6'8 forwards with poor jump shots and your offense is to pass around the arc and chuck 3s. No one is going to get better.

His biggest thing is developing a team identity and getting a diverse roster that fits that identity and hopefull have a lot of 3-4 year program guys.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

Bad example. Wiseman quit in December that year. He then proceeded to win the NIT the following year and make the 2nd round the following year. Good thing they didn't fire him.

Memphis had another 5* and 5 other 4*s in that same class besides Wiseman. They also had the #1 overall class in 2021 and all he has to show for it is a 2nd round NCAA tournament appearance.

Memphis has been loaded with talent every year Penny has been there and they have vastly underachieved.

 

[RockChalk]

Bad example. Wiseman quit in December that year. He then proceeded to win the NIT the following year and make the 2nd round the following year. Good thing they didn't fire him.

I actually think it is a good example when using it to show recruiting prowess to success. Penny has had wonderful to great classes and yet hasn't had the success that, according MNJay, 5 & 4 star recruit will change the fortunes of a program. You still have to have the ability to communicate and coach. To date that has not come to the forefront with regards to BJ

 

[RockChalk]

Memphis had another 5* and 5 other 4*s in that same class besides Wiseman. They also had the #1 overall class in 2021 and all he has to show for it is a 2nd round NCAA tournament appearance.

Memphis has been loaded with talent every year Penny has been there and they have vastly underachieved.

EXACTLY!!! So to MNJay point, all the talent in the world doesn't matter if you can't coach'em up.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

So, after one season and 12 games have you, in your great discernment, determined that Coach Johnson is a "sh!tty" coach?
I suppose it doesn't matter that last year's team is entirely different from this year's team. And, I suppose that you have broken down every decision Ben has made to determine which decision was "sh!tty" and which wasn't.
From basic observation I will state that when Ben calls a timeout and draws up a play, it is almost always successful in getting the Gophers a basket. His inbounds plays have been solid. When have you seen the Pitino patented toss the ball 3/4 of the court to inbound play?

The conclusion I am left with is that you are being illogical.

No, I’m pretty mixed on Ben.

I thought he looked really good at times last year and I’ve disagreed with many of the things he’s done this year. So I’m in the undecided category with Ben. I’ve actually said that numerous times but when you see any criticism you start calling people racists and going on a hissy fit.

I’m undecided on Ben. I was closer to thinking he was a good coach last year, but I’ve always said he should get into next year.

Frankly, I don’t really care about your conclusions. This subject is extremely emotional for you.

 

[WindyCityGopher]

Ben's first recruits are freshmen.

You won't give names to prove otherwise, because you know you can't.

Deep down you guys know that your temper-tantrums are childish and nonsensical. But you can't help yourselves.

This isn’t 1983 anymore when the only recruiting a coach did was with high school players who were freshmen the first time they stepped on campus. Roster building in 2023 also involves the portal and like it or not, that requires identifying talent you think will fit with your program and selling them on switching to your school. In other words, recruiting them. With the exception of Ihnen, every player who has put on a Gophers uniform the last two years has been recruited by Johnson and his staff.

 

[Crappie]

I actually think it is a good example when using it to show recruiting prowess to success. Penny has had wonderful to great classes and yet hasn't had the success that, according MNJay, 5 & 4 star recruit will change the fortunes of a program. You still have to have the ability to communicate and coach. To date that has not come to the forefront with regards to BJ

The culture is missing.

 

[Wet_Blanket_Guy]

Bad example. Wiseman quit in December that year. He then proceeded to win the NIT the following year and make the 2nd round the following year. Good thing they didn't fire him.

Memphis had another 5* and 5 other 4*s in that same class besides Wiseman. They also had the #1 overall class in 2021 and all he has to show for it is a 2nd round NCAA tournament appearance.

Memphis has been loaded with talent every year Penny has been there and they have vastly underachieved.

They waste talent like it’s going out of business

 

[WindyCityGopher]

Haskins started 2-16 & 4-14 in conference play.

Shouldn't we at least see if Ben can follow-up on his excellent recruiting class that isn't even on the team yet?

And in doing so Clem laid down a rock solid foundation of the identity of the program that would carry them to a Sweet 16 and Elite 8 in years 3 and 4: relentless defense and toughness personified by Newbern, Coffey, Burton, Bond and Lynch, among others. I’ve seen nothing from Johnson yet that hints at any identity to build on. What do we do well that anyone can point to as being the foundation for success over the next 2-3 years?

 

[Spaulding!No!]

They waste talent like it’s going out of business

Out of style.

 

[formerlybis]

They waste talent like it’s going out of business

In some ways, Memphis is a bad comparison - they play in the AAC where the only other good team in a 11-school conference is Houston, and Houston is joining the B12 soon. That's a league where you definitely can out-talent the competition, and the Memphis area has produced a ton of high-end players for decades.

My go-to comp is Tom Crean.

 

[MennoSota]

Here's what we have so far:

Ben is 19-23 overall and 4-18 in the Big Ten

What we are being sold is that we should be okay with being 6-34 in the Big Ten after year 2. And furthermore the same people that tell us to be happy with that are saying that next year might bring it to 13-47. Come on back in year 5- that will be awesome!!

That's not okay and it is totally rational to say that. I think it is reasonable to expect, 6 Big Ten wins this year as a baseline performance and 10 next year. That would be good progress. Less than those numbers is poor. Less than that and he can win the conference title for plays after time outs and out of bounds plays and it is still a poor job of coaching.

You show shallow thinking here, basing success mostly by winning games. By your method, of reasoning the process of building a sustained program is jettisoned. In other words, you want Richard Pitino as coach where he scrounges for people every year without building a sustained program and culture.

 

[MennoSota]

we’ve sucked so badly in the first four minutes of the second half. He could be able to draw up 5 plays a game coming out of timeouts, but he doesn’t seem to be winning the half time adjustments.

How so? Care to point out games where Coach Johnson didn't make halftime adjustments?

 

[MennoSota]

No, I’m pretty mixed on Ben.

I thought he looked really good at times last year and I’ve disagreed with many of the things he’s done this year. So I’m in the undecided category with Ben. I’ve actually said that numerous times but when you see any criticism you start calling people racists and going on a hissy fit.

I’m undecided on Ben. I was closer to thinking he was a good coach last year, but I’ve always said he should get into next year.

Frankly, I don’t really care about your conclusions. This subject is extremely emotional for you.

You realize Coach Johnson had nearly all seniors last season and this year it's mostly freshmen, but you think he's doing a lousy job this year.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

You realize Coach Johnson had nearly all seniors last season and this year it's mostly freshmen, but you think he's doing a lousy job this year.

Yeah, I think he's doing a terrible job this year.

You do realize that Ben Johnson is in charge of putting the roster together, right? You do realize no one forced him not to go after an experienced wing, right? These were either decisions he made (not to go after them) or failures on his end (not to get them).

I'd roll my eyes back at you but I'm not a 12 year old girl.

 

[Crappie]

You show shallow thinking here, basing success mostly by winning games. By your method, of reasoning the process of building a sustained program is jettisoned. In other words, you want Richard Pitino as coach where he scrounges for people every year without building a sustained program and culture.

Shallow is saying this season s recruiting are cbj first class. In fact, it's downright nutty.

 

[bc2211]

How so? Care to point out games where Coach Johnson didn't make halftime adjustments?

+\- of second half until media timeout:

Chicago State: 0
UAPB: -6 (mn timeout acted as media time out)
Mississippi St: -2 (-6 over first two minutes before MN timeout)
Michigan: -5 (-5 over first 90 seconds before MN timeout)
Purdue: -1, not bad
VT: +1
UNLV: 0
CA Baptist: +4
….

Michigan was particularly bad. UAPB was pretty bad too.

 

[MennoSota]

Yeah, I think he's doing a terrible job this year.

You do realize that Ben Johnson is in charge of putting the roster together, right? You do realize no one forced him not to go after an experienced wing, right? These were either decisions he made (not to go after them) or failures on his end (not to get them).

I'd roll my eyes back at you but I'm not a 12 year old girl.

I realize he is coach and you are not. You are a seemingly entitled person who has been whining from the get go. You deserve eye rolls for your petulance.

 

[Johnnyboy18]

+\- of second half until media timeout:

Chicago State: 0
UAPB: -6 (mn timeout acted as media time out)
Mississippi St: -2 (-6 over first two minutes before MN timeout)
Michigan: -5 (-5 over first 90 seconds before MN timeout)
Purdue: -1, not bad
VT: +1
UNLV: 0
CA Baptist: +4
….

Michigan was particularly bad. UAPB was pretty bad too.

Bigger issue is long scoring droughts in both halves of basketball.

 

[MennoSota]

Shallow is saying this season s recruiting are cbj first class. In fact, it's downright nutty.

Have I said that? I don't recall saying that. Last year coach Johnson brought in mostly seniors from the portal. This year he brought in 4 freshmen and 3 portal players with one being a senior.
For both seasons the turnover was massive.

This year Coach Johnson is teaching young kids how to play the game at the B1G level. I see progress. You don't.

 

[MennoSota]

+\- of second half until media timeout:

Chicago State: 0
UAPB: -6 (mn timeout acted as media time out)
Mississippi St: -2 (-6 over first two minutes before MN timeout)
Michigan: -5 (-5 over first 90 seconds before MN timeout)
Purdue: -1, not bad
VT: +1
UNLV: 0
CA Baptist: +4
….

Michigan was particularly bad. UAPB was pretty bad too.

So not nearly as terrible as you acted. Got it.

 

[bc2211]

So not nearly as terrible as you acted. Got it.

I didn’t act in any particular way, I provided judgement.

Going down 6 points in three possessions coming out of half against mediocre power five teams is bad. Calling timeouts two minutes into the half is a sign of being out coached at the break. In the last handful of games, we only substantially outperformed ca Baptist coming out of half.

 

[MennoSota]

I didn’t act in any particular way, I provided judgement.

Going down 6 points in three possessions coming out of half against mediocre power five teams is bad. Calling timeouts two minutes into the half is a sign of being out coached at the break. In the last handful of games, we only substantially outperformed ca Baptist coming out of half.

This doesn't equate to being out coached. It does equate to kids not executing well. Ben may have the best plan, but not executing is on the kids playing the game. My contention is that the kids will improve over this season.

 

[bc2211]

This doesn't equate to being out coached. It does equate to kids not executing well. Ben may have the best plan, but not executing is on the kids playing the game. My contention is that the kids will improve over this season.

Fair enough - certainly players aren’t executing. But I disagree. I think the first four minutes of second half is an excellent way to judge a coaching staff.

 

[Spaulding!No!]

Fire Gabel!

 

[Wet_Blanket_Guy]

I realize he is coach and you are not. You are a seemingly entitled person who has been whining from the get go. You deserve eye rolls for your petulance.

Btw winning is the only thing college basketball programs and coaches are judged on. Good coaches at lower programs get promoted to better programs (more prestige / pressure) and vice versa. And the main factor (unless scandal) is wins and losses

 

[MennoSota]

Btw winning is the only thing college basketball programs and coaches are judged on. Good coaches at lower programs get promoted to better programs (more prestige / pressure) and vice versa. And the main factor (unless scandal) is wins and losses

The bold is false. This is especially false in a program that was decimated from players leaving and a program that has never been elite.