Ben Johnson is a Disaster

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SHGopher said:
Yes, part of a combo of reasons. Minnesota won that competition. Yes.

Saying they didn't?

Garcia was a huge add. Huge. How convenient to just write that off.
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Because Garcia wouldn't have been able to transfer and play immediately anywhere else other than Minnesota. There was no competition.
 

SHGopher said:
Yes, part of a combo of reasons. Minnesota won that competition. Yes.

Saying they didn't?

Garcia was a huge add. Huge. How convenient to just write that off.
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Nobody is writing it off. But there's a difference between us enticing him to come here and him having family issues that left us as his only real option. Agree to disagree.
 

MNVCGUY said:
In regards to ceiling - there probably isn't a ton of growth left for Garcia, Mitchell, and Hawkins but Payne and Christie still have a ton of room for growth and improvement.

Definitely tougher to predict what will happen with guys like Carrington, JOJ and Betts.

For me, this last stretch has really emphasized the need for one more starter level player if everyone returns. Either a bigger shooting guard or a wing. If they could add one more starter to the mix of Hawkins, Christie, Payne and Garcia with Mitchell and Asuma as first 2 off the bench we could really have something. Depending on what happens with guys like Fox, JOJ, Betts, would probably need to add some front court depth from the portal but wouldn't necessarily need to find someone who could log heavy minutes.

Really feels like the team is one key player away from truly competing. But that is with everyone back next year, if some guys leave then the number of needed pieces obviously goes up along with that.
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As far as additional players needed to be acquired in the offseason, I'd say at least two if he has the room for them.
 

MonikerSchmoniker45 said:
Nobody is writing it off. But there's a difference between us enticing him to come here and him having family issues that left us as his only real option. Agree to
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Sucks for the North Carolina Tar Heels that they lost Garcia, Minnesota's huge gain.

Speaking of UNC....

The UNC football team landed top receiver Tez Walker. A big NIL payoff for Walker. He cited family reasons for his transfer but was denied by the NCAA.

With Garcia, got it done. And yes he was paid.
 


MonikerSchmoniker45 said:
But there's a difference between us enticing him to come here and him having family issues that left us as his only real option.
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There isn't a practical difference. Luck counts too. If one insists on disregarding the effects of bad luck on someone's poor performance, then one shouldn't bring up good luck to denigrate someone's positive achievements.

One of the biggest reasons I have no respect for most of the Johnson haters on this board is that, almost to a man, they lack any sense of intellectual consistency, objectivity, or fairness.
 

TwistingMyMelon said:
There isn't a practical difference. Luck counts too. If one insists on disregarding the effects of bad luck on someone's poor performance, then one shouldn't bring up good luck to denigrate someone's positive achievements.

One of the biggest reasons I have no respect for most of the Johnson haters on this board is that, almost to a man, they lack any sense of intellectual consistency, objectivity, or fairness.
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You consider me a CBJ hater?
 





SHGopher said:
Sucks for the North Carolina Tar Heels that they lost Garcia, Minnesota's huge gain.

Speaking of UNC....

The UNC football team landed top receiver Tez Walker. A big NIL payoff for Walker. He cited family reasons for his transfer but was denied by the NCAA.

With Garcia, got it done. And yes he was paid.
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Lol, I think North Carolina is doing just fine without him. Marquette too.
 

SHGopher said:
Sucks for the North Carolina Tar Heels that they lost Garcia, Minnesota's huge gain.

Speaking of UNC....

The UNC football team landed top receiver Tez Walker. A big NIL payoff for Walker. He cited family reasons for his transfer but was denied by the NCAA.

With Garcia, got it done. And yes he was paid.
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Didn't UNC go to the National Championship that year?
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Lol, I think North Carolina is doing just fine without him. Marquette too.
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The beat down on Garcia is on. That's from the you-know-who group. Not a loss to anyone and no credit to the Gophers organization.

The same group with a member that said Christie's slump against Indiana was the one positive outcome of the loss.

No credit given -- Garcia was a big get despite their smokescreen.

No credit given. Instead, systematic beat downs of Gophers players.

Payne, Christie, Garcia, Hawkins... Another day, another beat down on Gophers. Another spin of the roulette. Who gets the deat down next.
 




SHGopher said:
The beat down on Garcia is on. That's from the you-know-who group. Not a loss to anyone and no credit to the Gophers organization.

The same group with a member that said Christie's slump against Indiana was the one positive outcome of the loss.

No credit given -- Garcia was a big get despite their smokescreen.

No credit given. Instead, systematic beat downs of Gophers players.

Payne, Christie, Garcia, Hawkins... Another day, another beat down on Gophers. Another spin of the roulette. Who gets the deat down next.
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Lets verbally kneecap Ramberg.
 

MonikerSchmoniker45 said:
Didn't UNC go to the National Championship that year?
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Yeah, they lost to Kansas. Garcia played in 16 games, started 12. If I remember correctly, he didn't play much at all down the stretch (injury?), and I remember seeing a clip of his teammates giggling when his name was mentioned.

EDIT: The last game he played that season was Jan. 26 as far as I can tell.
 
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as Twisting and I were discussing/arguing earlier:

If you don't have a real superstar, you need a balanced roster with legitimate depth. The Gophers' starting 5 is decent, but the talent level drops off sharply after the starting 5. Fox and Carrington have made contributions, but each is limited in what they can do.

for me, a major issue is too many bodies wearing uniforms that contribute nothing to the team. Jack Wilson is a fun story. He's played 30 minutes this season. 30 minutes.
Betts - 57 minutes. and Ihnen - 320 minutes, avg 3.4 pts/gm. essentially, he hangs out on the perimeter for 11 minutes a game and makes one 3-point shot a game.

if you want the Gophers to be an NCAA team, Johnson has to add quality depth.
 

Scottsdale Gopher said:
It feels to me that Coyle has planted the seeds of expectations for next year with his "preseason top 25" comments. This is a public statement that the program is improving and gives him an opening to make a move next year during the season rather than at or near season's end. On the latter point, I believe that if there is a change next year, Coyle's best shot at landing someone exciting will be to act first.

I know that most here don't hold Coyle in high esteem, but I believe he was very intentional with his comments in this case and they will serve him regardless of how next season pans out.
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Good point and agreed. Coyle wasn't just going for hype here - Clear message to Ben as well.
 

TwistingMyMelon said:
Feeling like a "victim" are we? You can see that I addressed Moniker's question.
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Not at all. It's 78 degrees outside. Hardly feeling like a victim today.

I tend to believe a person's character extends a little further than his or her viewpoints on Ben Johnson. In fact, I appreciate all of them (viewpoints). It makes for a more interesting board.

But have a great day @TwistingMyMelon!
 

SHGopher said:
The beat down on Garcia is on. That's from the you-know-who group. Not a loss to anyone and no credit to the Gophers organization.

The same group with a member that said Christie's slump against Indiana was the one positive outcome of the loss.

No credit given -- Garcia was a big get despite their smokescreen.

No credit given. Instead, systematic beat downs of Gophers players.

Payne, Christie, Garcia, Hawkins... Another day, another beat down on Gophers. Another spin of the roulette. Who gets the deat down next.
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Who's beating players down? You're the one who's not understanding the reality of Garcia's history.

Garcia transferred from Marquette to UNC after one season.
Garcia left UNC in the middle of the season due to family health issues in MN.
UNC then went on a run to the national title game the same season Garcia left. Marquette also went to the NCAA tournament that same season.
Garcia couldn't transfer for the 2nd time in 2 years and play immediately without getting a waiver.
The only place he could get that waiver was at MN, where his family lives.
Garcia has been a highly efficient and productive player throughout his career.
Yet Garcia has never played in the NCAA tournament.
Both Marquette and UNC improved after he left.

These are all indisputable facts.
 

I’ve stayed out of this thread for a couple months, mostly because I no longer believe “disaster” is the correct descriptor. While he hasn’t yet proven he can be a top coach, he met my criteria for retention.

As for the roster and portal adds, if the rotation players all return (plus Asuma), it’ll be hard to attract a meaningful portaler. Even last year with 3 starters leaving, it was a slog and required identifying players with few other offers to hit. The premier transfers all want to play starter minutes. You grab one if you can, but that means someone in the rotation will likely leave as a consequence. May not be the worst thing if it’s an upgrade, but it won’t improve depth.
 

formerlybis said:
I’ve stayed out of this thread for a couple months, mostly because I no longer believe “disaster” is the correct descriptor. While he hasn’t yet proven he can be a top coach, he met my criteria for retention.

As for the roster and portal adds, if the rotation players all return (plus Asuma), it’ll be hard to attract a meaningful portaler. Even last year with 3 starters leaving, it was a slog and required identifying players with few other offers to hit. The premier transfers all want to play starter minutes. You grab one if you can, but that means someone in the rotation will likely leave as a consequence. May not be the worst thing if it’s an upgrade, but it won’t improve depth.
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No premier transfer prospect is going to shy away from the competition of Carrington and Mitchell.
 



short ornery norwegian said:
as Twisting and I were discussing/arguing earlier:

If you don't have a real superstar, you need a balanced roster with legitimate depth. The Gophers' starting 5 is decent, but the talent level drops off sharply after the starting 5. Fox and Carrington have made contributions, but each is limited in what they can do.

for me, a major issue is too many bodies wearing uniforms that contribute nothing to the team. Jack Wilson is a fun story. He's played 30 minutes this season. 30 minutes.
Betts - 57 minutes. and Ihnen - 320 minutes, avg 3.4 pts/gm. essentially, he hangs out on the perimeter for 11 minutes a game and makes one 3-point shot a game.

if you want the Gophers to be an NCAA team, Johnson has to add quality depth.
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Good description of our "reserve" situation!
 




Ski-U-Ham said:
Yeah, they lost to Kansas. Garcia played in 16 games, started 12. If I remember correctly, he didn't play much at all down the stretch (injury?), and I remember seeing a clip of his teammates giggling when his name was mentioned.

EDIT: The last game he played that season was Jan. 26 as far as I can tell.
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That video says a lot. It’s out there if people want to find it. Didn’t want to post here because it’s awkward and unnecessary to bring it back to the limelight. But some of us are reimagining Dawson’s departure from Unc. Huge pick up for us nonetheless.
 

stocker08 said:
Still never said that.
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You said the reason this year's team is better than Pitino's last team was because of the number of Big Ten wins. I said that was because of the easier schedule(because you ignored every other statistical metric that favored Pitino's team).

How else am I supposed to take that? So are you admitting this year's schedule was easier?
 

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