Ben Johnson is a Disaster

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Something about not counting chickens would seem to apply here.

I choose to live in a wave of optimism and work to see the glass full.

You wanna be a Negative Nancy? Fine, but Susie Sunshine is going to let those rays beam .

Worst case I was wrong on an anonymous chat board and had an absolute ball if and when that happens (not qualifying for a postseason tournament).

I’m not that fragile, where if I have to admit I was wrong, it’s a big deal; just like the rest of populace, I’m frequently wrong or incorrect.

Cheers, I got the first round ; it’s half full cause it’s Macallen 18 year old - top shelf just like CBJ

 

[BilldGopher]

Using a boat metaphor from another revenue sport, seems we've got a major salvage underway...


First step is to get it off the bottom. Coach Johnson is way past that stage and actually has it running...

Good luck against Nebbie! RTB! Ski U Mah!

 

[howeda7]

I choose to live in a wave of optimism and work to see the glass full.

You wanna be a Negative Nancy? Fine, Burt Susie Sunshine is going to let those rays beam .

Worst case I was wrong on an anonymous chat board and had an absolute ball if and when that happens (not qualifying for a postseason tournament).

I’m not that fragile, where if I have to admit I was wrong, it’s a big deal; just like the rest of populace, I’m frequently wrong or incorrect.

Cheers, I got the first round ; it’s half full cause it’s Macallen 18 year old - top shelf just like CBJ

Who's being negative? The post you quoted, I stated that every modern Gopher coach except Monson has made the NCAA tournament by the 4th season. That remains true. What am I "watching and learning" in regards to that fact? Ben might accomplish that too. He hasn't yet.

 

[MNVCGUY]

It's interesting to see the change over the course of the season.

early on, the "Ben is a disaster" posters were pretty vocal. then when the team started playing better, the pro-Ben posters became more outspoken.

and now, there are a lot of posters who are practically giddy in their praise of the team.

To be clear - I am happy the Gophers are playing better. It's fun to see them winning. but - for all the progress made this year, there is still a long way to go. the Gophers did not receive a single vote in the new AP top-25 poll. they need to keep playing well and make a showing in the B1G Tournament just to make the NIT, let alone the NCAA.

when you start in the cellar, getting to the 1st floor seems like an accomplishment. but if the ultimate goal is to make it to the penthouse, you still have a lot of stairs to climb.

There isn't a Pro Ben or Ben Apologist crowd, or if there is it is a very small group. What there is, is a group that was willing to let things play out over multiple years before giving up and bashing everything non-stop.

If the team had sucked again this year you would have been hard pressed to find anyone here that would not have been on board with Johnson getting fired because few have any strong attachment specifically to him.

I want Ben to succeed because he is the head coach of the Gophers and I want the Gophers to succeed. That said, he has grown on me and I really think the potential is there for him to have a really long career here if he can keep building on what he has put together this year.

Some of you seem determined to keep throwing a "but" on whatever the team does this season. The team is playing well, they are a lot of fun to watch.....let that be enough right now and just enjoy the ride. If it ends in an NCAA tournament berth, awesome, if they end up in the NIT, go win it......

This season has been a blast, if this is the ceiling for what Ben accomplishes here then it won't be enough and he won't last long.....but maybe......just maybe......they are building towards something special. They aren't there yet, but there is no denying this team has made a ton of progress.

 

[TwistingMyMelon]

There isn't a Pro Ben or Ben Apologist crowd, or if there is it is a very small group. What there is, is a group that was willing to let things play out over multiple years before giving up and bashing everything non-stop.

If the team had sucked again this year you would have been hard pressed to find anyone here that would not have been on board with Johnson getting fired because few have any strong attachment specifically to him.

I want Ben to succeed because he is the head coach of the Gophers and I want the Gophers to succeed. That said, he has grown on me and I really think the potential is there for him to have a really long career here if he can keep building on what he has put together this year.

Some of you seem determined to keep throwing a "but" on whatever the team does this season. The team is playing well, they are a lot of fun to watch.....let that be enough right now and just enjoy the ride. If it ends in an NCAA tournament berth, awesome, if they end up in the NIT, go win it......

This season has been a blast, if this is the ceiling for what Ben accomplishes here then it won't be enough and he won't last long.....but maybe......just maybe......they are building towards something special. They aren't there yet, but there is no denying this team has made a ton of progress.

Great post that I think explains the more positive crowd's views pretty accurately! As far as the person you're replying to, well, I'd just consider the source. This line made me shake my head:

"the Gophers did not receive a single vote in the new AP top-25 poll."

Well, that just makes them like 10 of the 14 teams in the conference. I think few, if any, of us ever suggested that the Gophers were among the Top 4 in the conference. This yo-yo's specialty is refuting arguments that no one is making.

I will make a little addendum to your post. You're right that few of us had any real attachment to Ben during the first two years but I think the ceaseless mocking and bashing from the usual suspects actually made him a more sympathetic figure and probably increased support for the coach once the team started turning it around.

 

[PMWinSTP]

I choose to live in a wave of optimism and work to see the glass full.

You wanna be a Negative Nancy? Fine, but Susie Sunshine is going to let those rays beam .

Worst case I was wrong on an anonymous chat board and had an absolute ball if and when that happens (not qualifying for a postseason tournament).

I’m not that fragile, where if I have to admit I was wrong, it’s a big deal; just like the rest of populace, I’m frequently wrong or incorrect.

Cheers, I got the first round ; it’s half full cause it’s Macallen 18 year old - top shelf just like CBJ

Not at the same level, but recently had some Johnnie Walker 18 Year. Blended vs. single malt, but my goodness is it smooth and flavorful. I think it is an absolute bargain for the price.

 

[short ornery norwegian]

Is making the Dance the penthouse for you?

I think the penthouse would be making a real run in the NCAA - maybe a Sweet 16? Something that establishes the program as being relevant on a national level.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

Classic

I'm happy the Gophers finally don't have the worst roster in the league for the first time in the BJ era. They are playing really well and this season is a lot more fun. Ben has earned another year.

But if they fail to make the NCAA tournament this year, or next, he is still a disaster. If they do, I will admit I was wrong and remove the disaster status.

 

[PMWinSTP]

Great post that I think explains the more positive crowd's views pretty accurately! As far as the person you're replying to, well, I'd just consider the source. This line made me shake my head:

"the Gophers did not receive a single vote in the new AP top-25 poll."

Well, that just makes them like 10 of the 14 teams in the conference. I think few, if any, of us ever suggested that the Gophers were among the Top 4 in the conference. This yo-yo's specialty is refuting arguments that no one is making.

Yeah, and there's 20+ teams that will make the Dance that also didn't get a single vote either. Definitely a weird stat to use as an argument.

 

[BarnBurner]

There isn't a Pro Ben or Ben Apologist crowd, or if there is it is a very small group. What there is, is a group that was willing to let things play out over multiple years before giving up and bashing everything non-stop.

If the team had sucked again this year you would have been hard pressed to find anyone here that would not have been on board with Johnson getting fired because few have any strong attachment specifically to him.

I want Ben to succeed because he is the head coach of the Gophers and I want the Gophers to succeed. That said, he has grown on me and I really think the potential is there for him to have a really long career here if he can keep building on what he has put together this year.

Some of you seem determined to keep throwing a "but" on whatever the team does this season. The team is playing well, they are a lot of fun to watch.....let that be enough right now and just enjoy the ride. If it ends in an NCAA tournament berth, awesome, if they end up in the NIT, go win it......

This season has been a blast, if this is the ceiling for what Ben accomplishes here then it won't be enough and he won't last long.....but maybe......just maybe......they are building towards something special. They aren't there yet, but there is no denying this team has made a ton of progress.

Oh, yes there is. And you are the President of the CBJ Protection Detail, since he arrived as coach.

 

[MNVCGUY]

I will make a little addendum to your post. You're right that few of us had any real attachment to Ben during the first two years but I think the ceaseless mocking and bashing from the usual suspects actually made him a more sympathetic figure and probably increased support for the coach once the team started turning it around.

I think you are definitely onto something with this line of thinking. The constant bashing on Ben and the program got so tiring over the past few years. Sad that there are still a few really struggling to hold onto things to be negative about as opposed to just enjoying the season.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Not at the same level, but recently had some Johnnie Walker 18 Year. Blended vs. single malt, but my goodness is it smooth and flavorful. I think it is an absolute bargain for the price.

A virtual glass clinking as continue our match through March?

 

[stocker08]

There isn't a Pro Ben or Ben Apologist crowd, or if there is it is a very small group. What there is, is a group that was willing to let things play out over multiple years before giving up and bashing everything non-stop.

If the team had sucked again this year you would have been hard pressed to find anyone here that would not have been on board with Johnson getting fired because few have any strong attachment specifically to him.

I want Ben to succeed because he is the head coach of the Gophers and I want the Gophers to succeed. That said, he has grown on me and I really think the potential is there for him to have a really long career here if he can keep building on what he has put together this year.

Some of you seem determined to keep throwing a "but" on whatever the team does this season. The team is playing well, they are a lot of fun to watch.....let that be enough right now and just enjoy the ride. If it ends in an NCAA tournament berth, awesome, if they end up in the NIT, go win it......

This season has been a blast, if this is the ceiling for what Ben accomplishes here then it won't be enough and he won't last long.....but maybe......just maybe......they are building towards something special. They aren't there yet, but there is no denying this team has made a ton of progress.

Correct. It wasn't the "Pro-Ben" crowd. It was the pro-rationality vs the anti-rationality crowd.

 

[Five Toes]

I'm happy the Gophers finally don't have the worst roster in the league for the first time in the BJ era. They are playing really well and this season is a lot more fun. Ben has earned another year.

But if they fail to make the NCAA tournament this year, or next, he is still a disaster. If they do, I will admit I was wrong and remove the disaster status.

I agree, we can not create excitement this year and take a big step back. It seems we have nice pieces in place to continue the upward tend.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Great post that I think explains the more positive crowd's views pretty accurately!

I’m in that crowd - Good Company.

As far as the person you're replying to, well, I'd just consider the source. This line made me shake my head:

"the Gophers did not receive a single vote in the new AP top-25 poll."

I don't see the value in communicating something like this, not sure how that’s germane to celebrating a W, still being in the hunt for a postseason, knowing we have the right coach - that’s time baby, shortly followed by 911 time

Well, that just makes them like 10 of the 14 teams in the conference. I think few, if any, of us ever suggested that the Gophers were among the Top 4 in the conference. This yo-yo's specialty is refuting arguments that no one is making.

I will make a little addendum to your post. You're right that few of us had any real attachment to Ben during the first two years but I think the ceaseless mocking and bashing from the usual suspects actually made him a more sympathetic figure and probably increased support for the coach once the team started turning it around.

For the life of me, I cannot figure out the animus towards him. He is universally liked, played & coached here as well; Frick, if you were ever going to give someone some extra slack, it would be him, right?

I didn’t get the hire and stated so; after briefly mulling it over, my Douglas County common sense kicked and I made a vow to myself to stay positive and we’d know at the end of year three, whether we had something or not. It also occurred to me that Coyle, probably knows more about hiring coaches than I do, based on our CVs.

Regardless of why he was hired, he’s the coach of my team, so he my coach. The vitriol showed to him is anything, but nice, it’s downright shameful and embarrassing, especially to one of us.

I’m thrilled as to what the rest of the season and the future portend.

 

[Big Dawg]

I think you are definitely onto something with this line of thinking. The constant bashing on Ben and the program got so tiring over the past few years. Sad that there are still a few really struggling to hold onto things to be negative about as opposed to just enjoying the season.

I think there is room for discussion regarding words like "constant" and bashing. I have posted a few negative comments regarding Ben since his hiring. I am enjoying this season and regardless of who the coach is, I want the Gophers to win. What I don't like from the pro Ben crowd over the past three years is the revisionist history or the excuses. The first is that he inherited no one. That is just not true. When Ben signed on the dotted line, he had a full roster. Yes, one player left the same day, Carr was obviously leaving, etc..... I checked only a few (5-6 other coaches who took over for fired coaches similar to Ben's situation) and most of them also lost the majority of the previous roster. I look at the situation he inherited as the same as almost any coach who takes over for a fired HC. The second fallacy is the "it takes time to build" excuse. It doesn't. It can and having a SYSTEM to sell or a culture is nice but numerous other programs (since NIL started) have rebuilt much much faster. I think Ben WAS a disaster but like someone posted it's like a dial. The dial is now off disaster and moving up nicely. The hire WAS and will always be a disaster. No P6 program EVER should hire a HC that has NEVER been a HC at ANY level. That's on Coyle and the administration. I'll argue that even poster's who posted negative things regarding Ben, still want the Gophers to win and enjoy all of those victories. Ben seems to have figured it out. I thoroughly enjoyed watching the game last night and will rewatch it tonight.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

Who's being negative?
The post you quoted, I stated that every modern Gopher coach except Monson has made the NCAA tournament by the 4th season. That remains true.

I don't see the value in communicating something like this after another win; not sure how that’s germane to celebrating a W. That comes across as negative to me.

Feel free to enlighten me on how it’s not negative - I’m here to learn .

What am I "watching and learning" in regards to that fact?

The implication was that it will happen this season, hence “watch” as it comes to fruition. It’s a tongue and cheek zinger, ergo a joke.

Ben might accomplish that too. He hasn't yet.

The season hasn’t finished yet, has it?

Lastly, this is only his third season not his fourth, so it seems disingenuous as heck, to post that and say it’s not negative, as that’s incorrect and unfair comparison.

Feel free to keep rocking and rolling to your own beat, I won’t comment about your basketball comments again, since I simply won’t read them any longer, thus this will be a non-issue in the future

 

[Johnnyboy18]

I'm happy the Gophers finally don't have the worst roster in the league for the first time in the BJ era. They are playing really well and this season is a lot more fun. Ben has earned another year.

But if they fail to make the NCAA tournament this year, or next, he is still a disaster. If they do, I will admit I was wrong and remove the disaster status.

No you won't. You'll triple down on it.

 

[RockChalk]

I choose to live in a wave of optimism and work to see the glass full.

You wanna be a Negative Nancy? Fine, but Susie Sunshine is going to let those rays beam .

Worst case I was wrong on an anonymous chat board and had an absolute ball if and when that happens (not qualifying for a postseason tournament).

I’m not that fragile, where if I have to admit I was wrong, it’s a big deal; just like the rest of populace, I’m frequently wrong or incorrect.

Cheers, I got the first round ; it’s half full cause it’s Macallen 18 year old - top shelf just like CBJ

How long did it take to acquire the taste for Scotch?

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

No you won't. You'll triple down on it.

Based on what?

 

[howeda7]

I don't see the value in communicating something like this after another win; not sure how that’s germane to celebrating a W. That comes across as negative to me.

Feel free to enlighten me on how it’s not negative - I’m here to learn .

What you should learn is to pay attention to the date of the post you're replying to, which was February 12th, not today and was not after a win.

The implication was that it will happen this season, hence “watch” as it comes to fruition. It’s a tongue and cheek zinger, ergo a joke.

The season hasn’t finished yet, has it?

I never said otherwise. If they go 4-1 they can make it. Is it likely? No. Possible, yes.

Lastly, this is only his third season not his fourth, so it seems disingenuous as heck, to post that and say it’s not negative, as that’s incorrect and unfair comparison.

Feel free to keep rocking and rolling to your own beat, I won’t comment about your basketball comments again, since I simply won’t read them any longer, thus this will be a non-issue in the future

Again, you responded to random post from 11 days ago that was part of a longer discussion and decided to get butt hurt about it being negative about last night's win when it wasn't.

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

How long did it take to acquire the taste for Scotch?

Several and it’s only a special occasion choice for me; like after a great meal at an excellent bistro - more than that is
Gophers making the NCA tourney would qualify.

My normal choice is bourbon.

How about you?

 

[Gopher_In_NYC]

What you should learn is to pay attention to the date of the post you're replying to, which was February 12th, not today and was not after a win.

I was wrong and I apologize as I conflated with comments in other the game threads.

My bad.

I never said otherwise. If they go 4-1 they can make it. Is it likely? No. Possible, yes.

I was explaining my “watch & learn” comment and the 50K foot view perspective, so why can’t the season play out. What’s the harm in that? It’s not illegal to enjoy the small victories in life, this became clearer to me as I aged and faced challenges with thst process.

Again, you responded to random post from 11 days ago that was part of a longer discussion and decided to get butt hurt about it being negative about last night's win when it wasn't.

Agree to disagree, you’ve been negative about Ben from the jump and still are.

Have you ever posted something positive about him as a coach (not the team)? I can’t recall one.

Regardless of context of the conversation, I sill find it unfair to compare someone in the midst of their third season and other coaches who completes their fourth.

Feel free to reply back if you desire, I will read it, but not respond to that, so you can have the last word. I also won’t respond to any of your future basketball posts.

BTW- my butt is fine and unscathed ; but, hehe, your concern is touching.

 

[Dakota2]

I think there is room for discussion regarding words like "constant" and bashing. I have posted a few negative comments regarding Ben since his hiring. I am enjoying this season and regardless of who the coach is, I want the Gophers to win. What I don't like from the pro Ben crowd over the past three years is the revisionist history or the excuses. The first is that he inherited no one. That is just not true. When Ben signed on the dotted line, he had a full roster. Yes, one player left the same day, Carr was obviously leaving, etc..... I checked only a few (5-6 other coaches who took over for fired coaches similar to Ben's situation) and most of them also lost the majority of the previous roster. I look at the situation he inherited as the same as almost any coach who takes over for a fired HC. The second fallacy is the "it takes time to build" excuse. It doesn't. It can and having a SYSTEM to sell or a culture is nice but numerous other programs (since NIL started) have rebuilt much much faster. I think Ben WAS a disaster but like someone posted it's like a dial. The dial is now off disaster and moving up nicely. The hire WAS and will always be a disaster. No P6 program EVER should hire a HC that has NEVER been a HC at ANY level. That's on Coyle and the administration. I'll argue that even poster's who posted negative things regarding Ben, still want the Gophers to win and enjoy all of those victories. Ben seems to have figured it out. I thoroughly enjoyed watching the game last night and will rewatch it tonight.

First year full roster: Trey Williams, Both Standing on the Wrong Side of the White Line Gach, Maurtice Mitchell, Jarvis Omersa, Treyton Thompson, Sam Freeman ... and two guys a new coach would want: Brandon Johnson and maybe Ihnen.

No coach of any experience or reputation wanted what Pitino left, other than Brandon Johnson.

 

[howeda7]

I was explaining my “watch & learn” comment and the 50K foot view perspective, so why can’t the season play out. What’s the harm in that? It’s not illegal to enjoy the small victories in life, this became clearer to me as I aged and faced challenges with thst process.

Who said the season couldn't play out.

Agree to disagree, you’ve been negative about Ben from the jump and still are.

Have you ever posted something positive about him as a coach (not the team)? I can’t recall one.

Regardless of context of the conversation, I sill find it unfair to compare someone in the midst of their third season and other coaches who completes their fourth.

Feel free to reply back if you desire, I will read it, but not respond to that, so you can have the last word. I also won’t respond to any of your future basketball posts.

BTW- my butt is fine and unscathed ; but, hehe, is touching.

Yes, I have been negative on him overall, I don't deny that. He's been a decent recruiter. His development and in game coaching appeared to be lacking until recently. But he's earned next season barring a complete collapse. The goal should be to make the NCAA's. And hopefully they will. If it happens this year, that's a bonus.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

First year full roster: Trey Williams, Both Standing on the Wrong Side of the White Line Gach, Maurtice Mitchell, Jarvis Omersa, Treyton Thompson, Sam Freeman ... and two guys a new coach would want: Brandon Johnson and maybe Ihnen.

No coach of any experience or reputation wanted what Pitino left, other than Brandon Johnson.

Yeah no one wanted Carr, Gabe, Mashburn Jr, Robbins, Gach, or Johnson, that's why they all ended up at other P6 schools.

Keep making things up though. That's the only thing you do on here.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

First year full roster: Trey Williams, Both Standing on the Wrong Side of the White Line Gach, Maurtice Mitchell, Jarvis Omersa, Treyton Thompson, Sam Freeman ... and two guys a new coach would want: Brandon Johnson and maybe Ihnen.

No coach of any experience or reputation wanted what Pitino left, other than Brandon Johnson.

Strange. You left out all the good players.

 

[TwistingMyMelon]

Several and it’s only a special occasion choice for me; like after a great meal at an excellent bistro - more than that is
Gophers making the NCA tourney would qualify.

My normal choice is bourbon.

How about you?

Me too, bourbon or rye. Scotch is a bit of an acquired taste and quite variable I find depending upon the brand. Some of it tastes awful and some of it is quite good. Lately I've gotten lazy and have been consuming more pre-mixed cocktails from a bottle (Manhattans or Old Fashioneds).

 

[TwistingMyMelon]

But if they fail to make the NCAA tournament this year, or next, he is still a disaster. If they do, I will admit I was wrong and remove the disaster status.

I've got a better idea. Why don't you remove yourself instead?

You know, there was an old time-honored tradition by aristocratic European officers (certainly Japanese too) who would fall on their swords to atone for their defeats.

You been defeated, repudiated, thoroughly discredited, and guilty of ringleading the shameless abomination that is this thread, Gopher Wanker Guy. The least you could do is a self-imposed exile, let's say three months.

 

[SHGopher]