Ben Johnson and this team

[Dakota2]

As I recall, we got rid of the last guy because we were tired of excuses about injuries and such. This looks like and excuse about injuries...

Ben made some mistakes on roster construction. He coached very well this year in my opinion. He needs to build a much better roster for next year. The no injury squad you listed was likely a 6-7 win club in the Big Ten.

What was his mistake on roster construction?

 

[howeda7]

Well, if you add in Fox and Ihnen, potentially two starters, then you can add another 58 games missed to this point.

It's an admitted arbitrary line, but certainly in the case of Fox, they had more than adequate time to come up with an alternative option. So, no I would not count him. And I'm not sure Curry comes back if they both play, or even if one of them does.

 

[GopherWeatherGuy]

Curry is not either a better rebounder, defender, or shot blocker than Iihnen or Fox, both of whom were, prior to injury, explosive athletes. Eric has been good given his many surgeries and limited mobility and total loss of vertical.

I agree on Fox, disagree on Ihnen. Being an explosive athlete doesn't make you a better rebounder or shot blocker. I also haven't seen much out of Ihnen to consider him an explosive athlete prior to his injury. Curry was an explosive athlete prior to injury.

 

[salzie]

Seems like you are lashing out because people aren't congratulating you for your unique take that the Gophers weren't going to be good this year. Quick.....find some of your other posts in threads that have fallen to the second page and beyond.....so that you can bump them and wait for people to rush in and ask how you knew.

i really thought we were going all the way this year

 

[MNVCGUY]

Yeah. I am blaming the coach for the team.
My bad.

It is okay to criticize the coach.
it is okay to think the coach didn’t do a good job constructing this years roster while at the same time understanding that he had a tough task to put together a good roster.

*sigh*. We never got to see the roster Johnson constructed in action. We only got to see what was left of it after the injuries.

Is what it is and time to move on from banging my head against this particular wall.

Good lord, it was year 1. Are we really at a point where there is no honeymoon/wait and see period at all for coaches now?

 

[salzie]

As I recall, we got rid of the last guy because we were tired of excuses about injuries and such. This looks like and excuse about injuries...

Ben made some mistakes on roster construction. He coached very well this year in my opinion. He needs to build a much better roster for next year. The no injury squad you listed was likely a 6-7 win club in the Big Ten.

Ben had to balance building a roster this and start recruiting next class

Given situation, I had no issue with his approach. It was obvious he didn't want to commit long term scholarships and was looking short term plug holes and start fresh. If rumors are true, he was a bit too confident on some transfer bigs that went elsewhere and did hurt us

Next year, he needs finish better than last place
Year three, minimum, tourney bubble
And if we're still floundering by year 4, he should be fired

but I'm going to give him 4 years and he deserves that. MN Gopher basketball isn't going to from a dumpster fire to NCAA darlings overnight. It also shouldn't take 10 years

 

[Some guy]

*sigh*. We never got to see the roster Johnson constructed in action. We only got to see what was left of it after the injuries.

Is what it is and time to move on from banging my head against this particular wall.

Good lord, it was year 1. Are we really at a point where there is no honeymoon/wait and see period at all for coaches now?

Who wants him fired?


does “honeymoon phase” have to include immunity from evaluation?
I’m not sure I’ve seen a single person who wants him fired on here

 

[Some guy]

Ben had to balance building a roster this and start recruiting next class

Given situation, I had no issue with his approach. It was obvious he didn't want to commit long term scholarships and was looking short term plug holes and start fresh. If rumors are true, he was a bit too confident on some transfer bigs that went elsewhere and did hurt us

Next year, he needs finish better than last place
Year three, minimum, tourney bubble
And if we're still floundering by year 4, he should be fired

but I'm going to give him 4 years and he deserves that. MN Gopher basketball isn't going to from a dumpster fire to NCAA darlings overnight. It also shouldn't take 10 years

Yeah I would rather have good freshmen than one year guys but I’d rather have one year guys than bad freshmen

I wish he was a good enough recruiter to have been able to swing another high quality guy or two even on the shortened calendar but he did get a few nice pieces and hopefully he builds around them.

 

[Bob_Loblaw]

Who wants him fired?


does “honeymoon phase” have to include immunity from evaluation?
I’m not sure I’ve seen a single person who wants him fired on here

I expect a lot of this on this board over the next few years.

 

[Dakota2]

Obviously, mostly subjective, but if we go by raw numbers - here are their per 40 minute averages:

BLOCKS:
Curry (1.0 blocks per 40 minutes)
Ihnen (1.8 blocks per 40 minutes)

REBOUNDS:
Curry (8.7 rebounds per 40 minutes)
Ihnen (9.5 rebounds per 40 minutes)


Ihnen is a relatively small sample size, as he averaged 13.1 minutes per game in a 50-game college career so far, while Curry is at 20.4 minutes per game in a 103-game college career.

Add to that, Curry's first season -- included in his career stats -- he was an athletic specimen and destined for stardom.

 

[tjgopher]

It's an admitted arbitrary line, but certainly in the case of Fox, they had more than adequate time to come up with an alternative option. So, no I would not count him.

Fox blew out his knee in late April, three weeks after spring signing day. Not sure how many bigs were still left, but evidence would indicate not many. They got Charlie Daniels about three weeks later.

 

[howeda7]

Fox blew out his knee in mid-May, five weeks after spring signing day. Not sure how many bigs were still left, but evidence would indicate not many.

The bar was Charlie Daniels and Danny Ogele. Hard to believe they were the best available.

 

[BarnBurner]

*sigh*. We never got to see the roster Johnson constructed in action. We only got to see what was left of it after the injuries.

Is what it is and time to move on from banging my head against this particular wall.

Good lord, it was year 1. Are we really at a point where there is no honeymoon/wait and see period at all for coaches now?

And next season, if there are injuries, we will hear the exact same refrain from you.

 

[tjgopher]

The bar was Charlie Daniels and Danny Ogele. Hard to believe they were the best available.

Go ahead and name all of the centers who signed with other programs after that. I doubt there were many. Also, I said mid-May, it was late-April on Parker's knee.

 

[Dakota2]

BJ recruited this roster for a reason, per his own plan. Injuries certainly hindered his plan. What is the win impact of Fox and Ihnen on the 21-22 roster? We will never know for certain, however they would have had to be really, really good to improve even 3 wins in conference.

We know what II could do pre injury. Not yet on Fox.

How long had Ben been "planning" his "recruitment" of the Fiddler and Ogele? Since they were in 9th grade no doubt. I'll bet his master plan all along if he got a head coach job was to immediately grab Loewe, Stephens, and Sutherlin. Must have been recruiting them all through their college careers in order to land them at Minnesota. Let's hope there is a statute of limitations on tampering.

 

[Dakota2]

And next season, if there are injuries, we will hear the exact same refrain from you.

Injuries on any team, any sport, are reasons, not excuses.

 

[BarnBurner]

How long had Ben been "planning" his "recruitment" of the Fiddler and Ogele? Since they were in 9th grade no doubt. I'll bet his master plan all along if he got a head coach job was to immediately grab Loewe, Stephens, and Sutherlin. Must have been recruiting them all through their college careers in order to land them at Minnesota. Let's hope there is a statute of limitations on tampering.

Am guessing he was planning his roster/targets a bit before he was hired officially.

Been told right here on GH numerous times BJ only wanted certain types of players that fit the culture. And the praises of the current roster with respect to said culture has been repeated here over and over.

If he didnt want these kids, DAKota, why did he recruit them and, more importantly sign them? Or, could he not land the fish he really wanted?

Hmm.

 

[BarnBurner]

Injuries on any team, any sport, are reasons, not excuses.

Sure thing - look back a few seasons, review the injuries and comments around said injuries.

The word excuse was prevalent.

 

[howeda7]

Go ahead and name all of the centers who signed with other programs after that. I doubt there were many. Also, I said mid-May, it was late-April on Parker's knee.

Eric Curry?

 

[Dakota2]

Ben had to balance building a roster this and start recruiting next class

Given situation, I had no issue with his approach. It was obvious he didn't want to commit long term scholarships and was looking short term plug holes and start fresh. If rumors are true, he was a bit too confident on some transfer bigs that went elsewhere and did hurt us

Next year, he needs finish better than last place
Year three, minimum, tourney bubble
And if we're still floundering by year 4, he should be fired

but I'm going to give him 4 years and he deserves that. MN Gopher basketball isn't going to from a dumpster fire to NCAA darlings overnight. It also shouldn't take 10 years

Would certainly agree if program is flounder in year 4 Ben or anybody else should be gone.

 

[Dakota2]

Sure thing - look back a few seasons, review the injuries and comments around said injuries.

The word excuse was prevalent.

Sorry, Greta, but you are one of the few here with time available to "look back a few seasons, review comments" (would that be, what, five or six hundred thousand posts?)

What next? You advise us to read Obama's speeches? Maybe Castro's.

 

[stocker08]

The bar was Charlie Daniels and Danny Ogele. Hard to believe they were the best available.

The best available transfer players at every position get courted by a bunch of teams. Ben Johnson had to fill 80% of a roster as a first year coach while also making sure not to neglect his first incoming high school class.

I really don't get how people are having trouble figuring out that Ben Johnson is one person....who was working off an extremely limited timeline.

 

[Dakota2]

Am guessing he was planning his roster/targets a bit before he was hired officially.

Been told right here on GH numerous times BJ only wanted certain types of players that fit the culture. And the praises of the current roster with respect to said culture has been repeated here over and over.

If he didnt want these kids, DAKota, why did he recruit them and, more importantly sign them? Or, could he not land the fish he really wanted?

Hmm.

You have somehow stumbled (hopefully no injuries) on something factual and true. Ben could not land some of the fish he really wanted. Several portal guys, including several centers, were really wanted by quite a few good programs.

There was a lot of demand and small supply of impact players in the portal. Ben got beat on all of those, possibly because Minnesota was not viewed as a tournament team landing spot. Twins failed to land Reggie and ARod a couple times too.

 

[short ornery norwegian]

They are recruits that came through transfer onto the Mn bb team, the first of the cbj era. Recruits.

more quibbling over definitions.

how about this:

next season will bring in Ben Johnson's first full class of high school recruits.

that is clearly what Dakota meant.

I suspect you knew that, but you chose to spin it in another direction because it allows you to take another shot at Ben Johnson and the Gopher program.

Look, I'm sorry the Gophers didn't hire "your" coach, or hire the "right" coach - whatever definition for "right" you have in your head.

But, like it or not, Ben Johnson is the coach of the Gophers. You can choose to support the program, or you can choose to keep making sarcastic comments after every game. Your choice.

 

[short ornery norwegian]

Well we got the 14 seed. I thought northwestern and Penn state had passed Maryland when I wrote that. I was wrong. My bad.
No. The team being bad isn’t a hot take. Yet for some reason people are really offended by it.
It’s a terrible team. We should applaud coach Johnson for having his terrible roster win more games than expected. We should expect more of his roster construction.


You call me a troll for saying we are a bad team but then insinuate I am making an obvious statement. Which is it? Am I trolling or am I making an obvious statement? If the truth is trolling then lol

Some - I think this is another "definition" issue.

How do you define a "bad" team?

To me, a bad team is more than just the win-loss record. it's subjective. it deals with how they play, and how they look on the court.

to be sure, the Gophers were not a good team. I could live with "poor" - but I would not call them a "bad" team.

To me, a bad team is one that consistently loses by 20+ point margins. A team that looks like it has no clue what is going on. A team that quits. A team that doesn't listen to the coach, or is unable to take what they work on in practice and carry that into the game.

The Gophers may have been a poor team, but I don't think they were a "bad" team - based on my definition of bad.

You may define "bad" differently. Fine, that's your right. But, it would help if we knew more about what a "bad" team is from your point of view.

 

[leib0039]

A few notes. I agree with the post about not seeing Curry if Fox and Ihnen don't get hurt. I think at that point he just moves on to coaching.

Also I think there is some contradictions here from some who say it's obvious we didn't have the talent to compete because we lost a kid who played in the NSIC the year before and another who averages 3p and 3r a game for his career. I think fox and ihnen will be fine but I'm getting some vibes here that people think they are going to be something akin to Lebron and Chris Bosh next year!

Also I must have missed the memo, is Greta the new Karen? I would just like to know what club some of us are in Dakota! Give it up man

 

[BarnBurner]

more quibbling over definitions.

how about this:

next season will bring in Ben Johnson's first full class of high school recruits.

that is clearly what Dakota meant.

I suspect you knew that, but you chose to spin it in another direction because it allows you to take another shot at Ben Johnson and the Gopher program.

Look, I'm sorry the Gophers didn't hire "your" coach, or hire the "right" coach - whatever definition for "right" you have in your head.

But, like it or not, Ben Johnson is the coach of the Gophers. You can choose to support the program, or you can choose to keep making sarcastic comments after every game. Your choice.

How about pipe down, genius. DAKota is being cute with terms, so challenge him.

I didnt spin anything. The players on the 21-22 roster that arrived in later 21 were all recruited and signed by MN Gophers, coached by Ben Johnson. Some were transfers from other programs, and were recruited to MN by the coaching staff.

I dont have a coach, so save your breath. Sensitive lot here on GH.

 

[BarnBurner]

Sorry, Greta, but you are one of the few here with time available to "look back a few seasons, review comments" (would that be, what, five or six hundred thousand posts?)

What next? You advise us to read Obama's speeches? Maybe Castro's.

Cant do it, genius? Proves you wrong, as usual.

 

[MNVCGUY]

And next season, if there are injuries, we will hear the exact same refrain from you.

Depends on the injuries. If we have a rash of season ending injuries, before the year starts, that severely limit the roster then yeah you will probably hear the same thing from me.

 

[MNVCGUY]

more quibbling over definitions.

how about this:

next season will bring in Ben Johnson's first full class of high school recruits.

that is clearly what Dakota meant.

I suspect you knew that, but you chose to spin it in another direction because it allows you to take another shot at Ben Johnson and the Gopher program.

Look, I'm sorry the Gophers didn't hire "your" coach, or hire the "right" coach - whatever definition for "right" you have in your head.

But, like it or not, Ben Johnson is the coach of the Gophers. You can choose to support the program, or you can choose to keep making sarcastic comments after every game. Your choice.

I think we all know what he is going to choose....