AT WHAT POINT DO YOU SAY ENOUGH IS ENOUGH

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TwistingMyMelon said:
As you know, we seldom agree on much but that is a very good point. I think our defensive coordinator right now is pretty good. Wouldn't mind getting someone different for the offensive side but maybe we're better off paying the extra money for better linemen.
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You know, the $3 or $4 million doesn't necessarily need to be paid to KC or Rossi. There are other coordinators.
 



Go Gophs said:
Also do some research and tell me which football programs have been the most dominant for the last 30 years and see where they come from/are located...
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I've lived in 5 states as an adult. 3 of them (including one in the south) were more football crazy than Minnesota. I think I'll stick with Minnesota.
 

MNVCGUY said:
They go hand in hand but if Drake makes a bad decision and throws into double or triple coverage leading to an interception, he 100% wasn't coached to do that.
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Sure, but he was recruited by the coaching staff, handed the keys, coached all week on the field and in film, etc & etc. Players make boneheaded plays and one boneheaded play isn't necessarily a reflection of coaching but the whole body of work on Saturday wasn't just players making bad plays. The coaching staff failed the players as much as the players failed on the field.
 


swede2 said:
Sure, but he was recruited by the coaching staff, handed the keys, coached all week on the field and in film, etc & etc. Players make boneheaded plays and one boneheaded play isn't necessarily a reflection of coaching but the whole body of work on Saturday wasn't just players making bad plays. The coaching staff failed the players as much as the players failed on the field.
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Tons of blame to go around after a performance like Saturday. Coaches, players.....everyone could have done better.

In the end though it is the players that make the plays. Drake had a bad game, it was one of the first where he has truly looked like the Freshman QB that he is. Loss of course was not all his fault by any stretch of the imagination but he had a rough game.

He looks like a quality player and has been playing at a high level for a redshirt freshman. That reflects well on the coaching in general, and the coaching comes back into play after a game like this past Saturday to help Drake learn from the mistakes and improve as a player.
 

swede2 said:
Is that not, at least sometimes, a reflection of coaching?
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Sometimes yes. But Lindsey's throws on the 3 picks were awful. Weston had a punt of 13 yards, then followed that up with a 36 yard punt returned for a TD.

I'm not putting that all on the coaches, otherwise you are saying any good coach can win any roster and that's just not true.
 

howeda7 said:
I'd like to know what % of these reported buyouts ever get paid out. James Franklin is going to get another job. Penn State won't pay $55 million. He might sit for year and collect $12 million of it or something. Or they will negotiate some partial settlement. Same for Brian Kelly etc.
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Depends on the offset language in the contract.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Sometimes yes. But Lindsey's throws on the 3 picks were awful. Weston had a punt of 13 yards, then followed that up with a 36 yard punt returned for a TD.

I'm not putting that all on the coaches, otherwise you are saying any good coach can win any roster and that's just not true.
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I agree you can only blame coaches for so much. But we got our asses handed to us by Iowa two years in a row. And I think everyone would agree we lose this game 19 out of 20 times. Iowa is not out recuiting us by that much but they our out coaching us by miles and miles. We lived in the big ten west but PJ could never win the game to win the division. I like PJ and we should not fire him but come on. Hire some good coaches with experience and let them coach. Pay them some competitive wages. PJ is not a good game manager but in year 9 to be breaking in new never before coordinators is unacceptable.
 



howeda7 said:
I'd like to know what % of these reported buyouts ever get paid out. James Franklin is going to get another job. Penn State won't pay $55 million. He might sit for year and collect $12 million of it or something. Or they will negotiate some partial settlement. Same for Brian Kelly etc.
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It’s been reported that he receives 8 million a year for the buyout, but has to demonstrate to PSU that he is seeking a job in coaching or some form of football media. Any coaching or media job he accepts, the money offsets.
 

LeftofThaDial said:
It’s been reported that he receives 8 million a year for the buyout, but has to demonstrate to PSU that he is seeking a job in coaching or some form of football media. Any coaching or media job he accepts, the money offsets.
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Isn't that why Blart took some super low paying assistant job with the Patriots after Arkansas fired him? So they'd have to pay the majority of his buyout?
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Sometimes yes. But Lindsey's throws on the 3 picks were awful. Weston had a punt of 13 yards, then followed that up with a 36 yard punt returned for a TD.

I'm not putting that all on the coaches, otherwise you are saying any good coach can win any roster and that's just not true.
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Nobody said that, but the original premise was in defense of the coaching staff, as if they had no hand in the shit product on the field.
 

disco said:
Isn't that why Blart took some super low paying assistant job with the Patriots after Arkansas fired him? So they'd have to pay the majority of his buyout?
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The beauty of the analyst/consultant role. I think it's just watching the game film, recognizing patterns, and making suggestions to the coaches.
 



swede2 said:
Nobody said that, but the original premise was in defense of the coaching staff, as if they had no hand in the shit product on the field.
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I don't think anyone that truly understands football would ever try to float the idea it is all on the players or all on the coaches.

But it does seem in general that posters are far quicker to blame the coaches after a loss even though it is the players that ultimately have to make the plays.
 

MNVCGUY said:
But it does seem in general that posters are far quicker to blame the coaches after a loss even though it is the players that ultimately have to make the plays.
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There are two reasons for that:

1) It's easier to replace a coach than an entire roster; and

2) Although sports fans don't have much problem saying professional players are "bums" or "losers," talking that way about college players will earn you swift condemnation for talking about "kids" that way.
 


TwistingMyMelon said:
There are two reasons for that:

1) It's easier to replace a coach than an entire roster; and

2) Although sports fans don't have much problem saying professional players are "bums" or "losers," talking that way about college players will earn you swift condemnation for talking about "kids" that way.
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I think #2 is going to be changing quite a bit in the coming years as players get paid more and more. When they were amateur athletes I can see protecting them some but they are starting to become more and more like pro athletes with each passing law suit.
 

MNVCGUY said:
I think #2 is going to be changing quite a bit in the coming years as players get paid more and more. When they were amateur athletes I can see protecting them some but they are starting to become more and more like pro athletes with each passing law suit.
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You're probably right!
 

FanSinceTheFifties said:
Yes, recruiting is the cure. Why don't enough 4 and 5 star players want to come to Minneapolis? That's the question few here want to consider. Why not? Do we ask recruits who pick other schools why? Kinda like businesses do with exit interviews. I think you are right about being a 7 win program -- a little better on good years. A little worse on bad. And that limit comes from the inability to recruit well.
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Totally agree and have said this for a long time. The teams are not that talented. When you rank between 35-50 in recruiting year after year you’re not going to be a consistent top 20 team.
 

Here's why it's so hard to beat Iowa even though they seem to have roughly similar resources. I asked an AI to rank the top 20 Power 4 teams on overperformance to recruiting rankings over the past decade. Teams like Iowa simply do a lot more with what they have (coaching, administration, etc.).

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TwistingMyMelon said:
There are two reasons for that:

1) It's easier to replace a coach than an entire roster; and

2) Although sports fans don't have much problem saying professional players are "bums" or "losers," talking that way about college players will earn you swift condemnation for talking about "kids" that way.
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3) The players were recruited by and coached by said coaches.
 

Gopher Mac said:
That is funny!!! The last time the Gophers won the national championship had a black quarterback and one of the greatest college player of all time named Bobby Bell. Only reason we were able to recuit these players were because white colleges down south would not recuit them because of the color of their skin. Then those southern schools decided if they want to compete with us they better get as you say woke and recuit black athletes.
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I get it and think it's great this happened back in the day. Just saying it was a one-off and the reason 100% the Gophers were able to win titles years ago.
 

Gopher Mac said:
I have been a fan for 60 years. Is it time to move on? I have moved on from the Vikings. I remember the Chuck Forman days and I don't waste my Sunday's anymore. Is it time to also start enjoy my Saturdays?
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Don’t let the door hit ya where the lord split ya. I’m a gopher for life. Go gophers!
 

MNVCGUY said:
Nobody associated with the program (players, coaches, fans, administration)....is ok with what happened on Saturday against Iowa.....nobody. Fleck said it was unacceptable at half time and he led off with that again at the start of his press conference today.

But that doesn't mean you blow everything up after an abysmal effort. Part of the reason that Saturday was so shocking is because we rarely get blown out like that these days.

It annoys the crap out of me when fans act like it means more to them then the people in the complex. Fleck isn't looking for a free ride, he wants to win every game the same way all the players and coaches want to win every game.
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Guarantee he cares more and has more invested than everyone on this board put together.
 

Panthadad2 said:
Here's why it's so hard to beat Iowa even though they seem to have roughly similar resources. I asked an AI to rank the top 20 Power 4 teams on overperformance to recruiting rankings over the past decade. Teams like Iowa simply do a lot more with what they have (coaching, administration, etc.).

View attachment 39797
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There are arguments to be made that Iowa underachieves when you compare draft picks to wins
 


maroonfive said:
Lol. I know what you mean. Another week another game. If you are really moving on you are not posting it on here.

Go Gophers !!!!!!
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If your personal happiness is really contingent on the results of gopher football you needed to find a new team in about 1975
 

Gopher Mac said:
I have been a fan for 60 years. Is it time to move on? I have moved on from the Vikings. I remember the Chuck Forman days and I don't waste my Sunday's anymore. Is it time to also start enjoy my Saturdays?
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Sounds like you are ready to go. There are a lot of other options on Saturday. I’ve moved on from the Vikes (after being a season ticket holder for many years), but I am still willing to spend time on Saturdays with the Gophs.

I keep my expectations reasonable. Only bitter disappointment this season was Iowa game. I thought we would lose, but not get thoroughly humiliated and curb stomped. I believe we have the talent to have put up a real fight against the Hawkeyes-it should have been a contest, perhaps down to the wire. Our typical slow and seemingly befuddled and timid start, however, really went sideways when Kirk’s squad of confident bullies came out prepared and swinging.

Our players are just young soldiers doing their level best with the coaching, preparation, schemes, tactics and battle field mindset that their generals give them. Go Gophers. Beat MSU. Our road record is perfect (0-3); keep the home record perfect!
 

Panthadad2 said:
Here's why it's so hard to beat Iowa even though they seem to have roughly similar resources. I asked an AI to rank the top 20 Power 4 teams on overperformance to recruiting rankings over the past decade. Teams like Iowa simply do a lot more with what they have (coaching, administration, etc.).

View attachment 39797
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Northwestern is pretty interesting, too.
 

GopherTheJugular said:
Wasn't Spencer Alvarez (offensive line from Columbia Heights) a 2* in 2020?
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Looks like Spencer was an 85 rated 3 star from the class of 2022. 247 composite had him as an 82 rated player but that's still a 3 star, lower end, but still a 3 star.

suppose I didn't jump into the weeds with on3 and ESPN recruiting rankings, normally I just treat 247 like the word of god lol.
 

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