All Things 2025 Minnesota Twins In-Season Thread

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TNGophfan said:
Try hitting a home run with people on base. Just kidding.
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Valid cometary; but guys also have to get on base in front of of him 🤷‍♂️
TNGophfan said:
Good data,
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Thanks
TNGophfan said:
he just frustrates the heck out of me. I hate waiting around for the big blast, going base to base.
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Rocco gave the team collectively the Green Light for the last couple months of the season and from thst point forward the Twins lead MLB in thefts, per the Twins MLB best writer.

I hope they remain aggressive next year, putting pressure on the defensive and pitchers and implementing a no head first slide rule.
 


GopherWeatherGuy said:
There has been murmurs of culture issues for several years now, long before the bullpen was traded away.
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I get that, but I think the culture issues were above Rocco's level.
 

tikited said:
Thought people would like to know this.
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Celebrating this is akin to getting a gal’s number back in the day, but when you fish out that bar napkin and call it, you reach a fax machine🤦‍♂️. I was told this story by my compadres and never experienced it myself 🤣

They’re just a 21st century version of the Braves😉
 


GophersInIowa said:
WOW. Did not think they'd do it.
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Rocco doesn't determine who is on his team, but he controlled a number of things that were downright awful.
Base running, bullpen management, in game management were atrocious.
The Pohlads are still terrible, but this is one move that makes sense. Buh bye Rocco
 


TRF Guy said:
Rocco doesn't determine who is on his team, but he controlled a number of things that were downright awful.
Base running, bullpen management, in game management were atrocious.
The Pohlads are still terrible, but this is one move that makes sense. Buh bye Rocco
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I'm quite skeptical that Rocco controlled bullpen management. Those decisions I truly believe were made by whatever spreadsheet he was handed during a pre-game meeting with the analytics department.

If they hire someone without any previous MLB Managerial experience, I expect zero change in that aspect. None.
 




Oldtimers will tell you that one of the best ways to judge a coach is how well his team runs the bases. What I saw was brutal.

That being said - I have some friends in the org and it’s widely known that Rocco doesn’t set the line up, the computers do.

Seems like a good dude and I’m sure he’ll have another job in baseball shortly.
 

Gopher_In_NYC said:
Celebrating this is akin to getting a gal’s number back in the day, but when you fish out that bar napkin and call it, you reach a fax machine🤦‍♂️. I was told this story by my compadres and never experienced it myself 🤣

They’re just a 21st century version of the Braves😉
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Sorry, I can't hear you over all the champagne clinking.
 

tikited said:
Sorry, I can't hear you over all the champagne clinking.
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Remember this festive feast once they get bounced from the playoffs😎

At least you’ll have that 2025 NL West Division Shirt to cry into, after another Davy Roberts choke job🥴
 

Ope3 said:
I get that, but I think the culture issues were above Rocco's level.
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That's just an excuse. A good coach can still have a great team culture regardless of how much support they get from above. This team was undisciplined and did not look like they cared half of the time over the last two years.
 



GopherWeatherGuy said:
That's just an excuse. A good coach can still have a great team culture regardless of how much support they get from above. This team was undisciplined and did not look like they cared half of the time over the last two years.
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I think that's an oversimplification. If the Front Office drafts duds, have duds developing them in the minors, influenced the hiring of duds on the coaching staff, trainers & medical at the MLB level then you get duds on the playing field too.

Perhaps Rocco fit right in with all the dud hires himself, but maybe not.
 

Ope3 said:
I think that's an oversimplification. If the Front Office drafts duds, have duds developing them in the minors, influenced the hiring of duds on the coaching staff, trainers & medical at the MLB level then you get duds on the playing field too.

Perhaps Rocco fit right in with all the dud hires himself, but maybe not.
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I don't think so. You can typically see it immediately with coaching changes.

The Twins have had a lot of talented players do well in the minors, only to become duds in the majors. They also had the highest payroll in the AL Central. I think that's only helping my point.

The Gophers are a good example of this. They have bottom 1/3 resources in the B1G, yet PJ has success due to his culture, organization, and being able to identify and develop under the radar talent. I think Niko will be very similar for basketball and how he runs a program will be an immediate upgrade over BJ.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
I don't think so. You can typically see it immediately with coaching changes.

The Twins have had a lot of talented players do well in the minors, only to become duds in the majors. They also had the highest payroll in the AL Central. I think that's only helping my point.

The Gophers are a good example of this. They have bottom 1/3 resources in the B1G, yet PJ has success due to his culture, organization, and being able to identify and develop under the radar talent. I think Niko will be very similar for basketball and how he runs a program will be an immediate upgrade over BJ.
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I don't think even Terry Francona could help this sorry lot much. Sure he could squeeze a couple extra wins but that's it.

Talented minor league players who can't do it at the majors to me signals they weren't prepared well enough at the lower levels or were the wrong choices to begin with.

The payroll comment means the front office spent it rather unwisely. Correa was banged up and unproductive. Dumped for zilch. $33 million. Vasquez another 8 figure contract. No manager is going to overcome that. Take those out alone and where do they stack up against the AL Central?

I don't think there's anything analogous between MLB and NCAA football/basketball where everyone is a Free Agent, every year. Zip.
 

Ope3 said:
I don't think even Terry Francona could help this sorry lot much. Sure he could squeeze a couple extra wins but that's it.

Talented minor league players who can't do it at the majors to me signals they weren't prepared well enough at the lower levels or were the wrong choices to begin with.

The payroll comment means the front office spent it rather unwisely. Correa was banged up and unproductive. Dumped for zilch. $33 million. Vasquez another 8 figure contract. No manager is going to overcome that. Take those out alone and where do they stack up against the AL Central?

I don't think there's anything analogous between MLB and NCAA football/basketball where everyone is a Free Agent, every year. Zip.
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Do you think Detroit and Cleveland were significantly more talented than the Twins the last two seasons, prior to this years trade deadline? I don't. Especially after having a mostly healthy Buxton putting up career numbers this year.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Do you think Detroit and Cleveland were significantly more talented than the Twins the last two seasons, prior to this years trade deadline? I don't. Especially after having a mostly healthy Buxton putting up career numbers this year.
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Cleveland has traded away Josh Naylor and Andres Gimenez last winter, dealt Bieber at the deadline and lost arguably the best relief pitcher in the game due to a gambling investigation. And they still ran down, and passed the Tigers.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Do you think Detroit and Cleveland were significantly more talented than the Twins the last two seasons, prior to this years trade deadline? I don't. Especially after having a mostly healthy Buxton putting up career numbers this year.
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I do think Detroit &; Cleveland were more significantly talented after the 2024 All Star Break when Correa went down then was followed by Lewis, Buxton & Ryan.

The 2025 Twins with Lopez, Ober as well as Lewis & Correa again injured/unproductive pre-All Star Break were not as good either compared to those teams.

Nor Kansas City for that matter.
 

Lou Brown said:
Oldtimers will tell you that one of the best ways to judge a coach is how well his team runs the bases. What I saw was brutal.
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Winner winner 🐔dinner
Lou Brown said:
That being said - I have some friends in the org and it’s widely known that Rocco doesn’t set the line up, the computers do.
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If that’s accurate, it’s horrible, as it takes away the power of a manager to sit players at their discretion; they effectively makes him or any other skipper a eunuch.

Lou Brown said:
Seems like a good dude and I’m sure he’ll have another job in baseball shortly.
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Ope3 said:
I do think Detroit &; Cleveland were more significantly talented after the 2024 All Star Break when Correa went down then was followed by Lewis, Buxton & Ryan.

The 2025 Twins with Lopez, Ober as well as Lewis & Correa again injured/unproductive pre-All Star Break were not as good either compared to those teams.

Nor Kansas City for that matter.
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I disagree and @Breakin' The Plane outlined Cleveland specifically. They had no business winning the AL Central, yet they did, again. Going from Fancona to Voght is a big reason why Cleveland has had the success they had.

Detroit was awful for years including their minor leagues. They brought in Hinch and then became better. Yeah I know he cheated in Houston but he is obviously still a good manager. Leaders and culture matter a lot.

I do think you can apply the Gophers example or any business organization that brings in better leaders. It can change things quickly, even if ownership isn't the most supportive.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
I disagree and @Breakin' The Plane outlined Cleveland specifically. They had no business winning the AL Central, yet they did, again. Going from Fancona to Voght is a big reason why Cleveland has had the success they had.
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Agree to disagree on the talent level of the Twins compared to those that finished well above them in the standings.

GopherWeatherGuy said:
I do think you can apply the Gophers example or any business organization that brings in better leaders. It can change things quickly, even if ownership isn't the most supportive.
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It's not valid because for Gopher football Fleck controls everything from roster construction, development, in game management to even who they play 25% of their schedule amongst many other factors.

Baldelli only controlled one of those things I listed, and even that was under the thumb of the analytics department.

I would argue Fleck's role is much more similar to Falvey's than any manager of a MLB team in terms of equating to success.
 

GopherWeatherGuy said:
Detroit was awful for years including their minor leagues. They brought in Hinch and then became better. Yeah I know he cheated in Houston but he is obviously still a good manager. Leaders and culture matter a lot.
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Look at the record Hinch produced his first 2 seasons in Detroit.

Ick:

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2023 they got better. They also let go of their GM Al Avila after 2022. Scott Harris the Baseball VP had been hired the year before that and took a year to make that move.

Current GM Jeff Greenberg was hired in 2023.

It's not a 1 man Hinch show setting the "culture" for the Tigers. Additionally, it did not happen immediately.
 
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Ope3 said:
Look at the record Hinch produced his first 2 seasons in Detroit.

Ick:

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2023 they got better. They also let go of their GM Al Avila after 2022. Scott Harris the Baseball VP had been hired the year before that and took a year to make that move.

Current GM Jeff Greenberg was hired in 2023.

It's not a 1 man Hinch show setting the "culture" for the Tigers.
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To their credit, they somehow overcame the atrocious Javy Baiz signing as well, which took a disproportionate amount of their payroll.
 


Gopher_In_NYC said:
To their credit, they somehow overcame the atrocious Javy Baiz signing as well, which took a disproportionate amount of their payroll.
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I just noticed that the Tigers technically had a higher opening day payroll than the Twins this year (barely). Are the Little Cesar's heirs still in charge?
 


howeda7 said:
I just noticed that the Tigers technically had a higher opening day payroll than the Twins this year (barely). Are the Little Cesar's heirs still in charge?
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Yup Chris Ilitch, Mike’s son, has been the controlling party since 2017; aside from Javy, hes been about as non-Joe Pohlad as it gets.
 



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