All Things 2025 College Football D2 and D3 Thread

[Word]

St Olaf Men's Hockey Roster is 28 players. Tuition and housing is a $77,000 tab.

28 X 77,000 = $2,156,000.00

St olaf wouldn't be able to find 28 other students to fill those spots that aren't hockey players? Are they that desperate for students?

 

[Ope3]

St olaf wouldn't be able to find 28 other students to fill those spots that aren't hockey players? Are they that desperate for students?

In general there are several institutions of higher learning that indeed are desperate to keep the enrollment numbers up through bolstering their athletic teams rosters.

 

[Bayfield Gopher]

Yep, they just moved up from the NAIA. This is their first season at D2.

Will they win one conference game? Probably not.

 

[Some guy]

St olaf wouldn't be able to find 28 other students to fill those spots that aren't hockey players? Are they that desperate for students?

Everyone is, the fertility rate is 1.7 or something
Same reason schools are farming international students

Closed Colleges: List of Closures, Mergers, and Trendline | BestColleges

Close to 80 private nonprofit colleges closed or merged between 2020 and 2024. Find historical data about college closures and a list of closed colleges and mergers.

www.bestcolleges.com

 

[IceBoxGopher]

Will they win one conference game? Probably not.

Probably not, but they have a chance against Southwest Minnesota State and/or U Mary.

 

[disco]

Everyone is, the fertility rate is 1.7 or something
Same reason schools are farming international students

Closed Colleges: List of Closures, Mergers, and Trendline | BestColleges

Close to 80 private nonprofit colleges closed or merged between 2020 and 2024. Find historical data about college closures and a list of closed colleges and mergers.

www.bestcolleges.com

Northland College in Ashland, WI, about 20 miles from where I'm sitting right now, had their final graduation this year as well but isn't on the map.

 

[WoodburyTim]

I don't really buy that the athletic programs in many D2 and D3 drive enrollment for the general student body. But even if they did that would only be a side effect of the athletic programs.

There are many things that happen on a college campus that are not there to turn a profit. They exist to round out a college experience, drive school pride, bring students together(whether to play or spectate) give alumni a focal point in their post graduate lives and provide recreation and escape for students in what should be rigorous academic atmosphere.

And that is the way it should be.

 

[swede2]

I don't really buy that the athletic programs in many D2 and D3 drive enrollment for the general student body. But even if they did that would only be a side effect of the athletic programs.

There are many things that happen on a college campus that are not there to turn a profit. They exist to round out a college experience, drive school pride, bring students together(whether to play or spectate) give alumni a focal point in their post graduate lives and provide recreation and escape for students in what should be rigorous academic atmosphere.

And that is the way it should be.

One anecdote only, but one I see in my community repeated over and over - my former neighbor girl, recently graduated, is playing basketball for something called "Central College" in Iowa. She's a 5'7" forward who, while she started for her high school team, was perhaps the 4th or 5th best player of the starting five. She has explicitly stated she's going to Central because she can play basketball there.

I have a friend in administration for a UMAC school and that school has added athletic programs specifically as a recruitment tool. The school opted to forego football due to cost but added men's soccer. The school instituted hiring and wage freezes this academic year after previously dropping academic programs due to declining enrollment and uncertainty about international student visas. Notably absent from the chopping block: athletic programs.

For most schools and athletic programs, I believe that your first statement in your first paragraph may have been true once upon a time but in today's very competitive and challenging environment, athletic programs are absolutely part of enrollment.

 

[disco]

One anecdote only, but one I see in my community repeated over and over - my former neighbor girl, recently graduated, is playing basketball for something called "Central College" in Iowa. She's a 5'7" forward who, while she started for her high school team, was perhaps the 4th or 5th best player of the starting five. She has explicitly stated she's going to Central because she can play basketball there.

I have a friend in administration for a UMAC school and that school has added athletic programs specifically as a recruitment tool. The school opted to forego football due to cost but added men's soccer. The school instituted hiring and wage freezes this academic year after previously dropping academic programs due to declining enrollment and uncertainty about international student visas. Notably absent from the chopping block: athletic programs.

For most schools and athletic programs, I believe that your first statement in your first paragraph may have been true once upon a time but in today's very competitive and challenging environment, athletic programs are absolutely part of enrollment.

Central is a JUCO, isn't it? I know someone who went there to play baseball and received an offer from a major D1 school after playing there for two years.

 

[WoodburyTim]

One anecdote only, but one I see in my community repeated over and over - my former neighbor girl, recently graduated, is playing basketball for something called "Central College" in Iowa. She's a 5'7" forward who, while she started for her high school team, was perhaps the 4th or 5th best player of the starting five. She has explicitly stated she's going to Central because she can play basketball there.

I have a friend in administration for a UMAC school and that school has added athletic programs specifically as a recruitment tool. The school opted to forego football due to cost but added men's soccer. The school instituted hiring and wage freezes this academic year after previously dropping academic programs due to declining enrollment and uncertainty about international student visas. Notably absent from the chopping block: athletic programs.

For most schools and athletic programs, I believe that your first statement in your first paragraph may have been true once upon a time but in today's very competitive and challenging environment, athletic programs are absolutely part of enrollment.

I think your first paragraph is what I am saying. She went there because she wanted to play basketball and be part of a team. A selling point for that school. All part of the college experience.

My disagreement is that there are significant amount of kids choosing certain D2 and D3 schools because they have athletic teams(that they aren't playing on). I would never choose a school based on that or want my kids to do that, but I would think if someone is that sports crazy they would choose a D1 school?

 

[disco]

I think your first paragraph is what I am saying. She went there because she wanted to play basketball and be part of a team. A selling point for that school. All part of the college experience.

My disagreement is that there are significant amount of kids choosing certain D2 and D3 schools because they have athletic teams(that they aren't playing on). I would never choose a school based on that or want my kids to do that, but I would think if someone is that sports crazy they would choose a D1 school?

I'd agree with that. I don't think many would choose a D3 as a sports fan unless they were playing, or involved with a team (like a student trainer) somehow. But there are totally kids that would go to Bama or tOSU or Notre Dame for those reasons.

 

[Word]

One anecdote only, but one I see in my community repeated over and over - my former neighbor girl, recently graduated, is playing basketball for something called "Central College" in Iowa. She's a 5'7" forward who, while she started for her high school team, was perhaps the 4th or 5th best player of the starting five. She has explicitly stated she's going to Central because she can play basketball there.

I have a friend in administration for a UMAC school and that school has added athletic programs specifically as a recruitment tool. The school opted to forego football due to cost but added men's soccer. The school instituted hiring and wage freezes this academic year after previously dropping academic programs due to declining enrollment and uncertainty about international student visas. Notably absent from the chopping block: athletic programs.

For most schools and athletic programs, I believe that your first statement in your first paragraph may have been true once upon a time but in today's very competitive and challenging environment, athletic programs are absolutely part of enrollment.

I know of a local small, private college that plays soccer at the lowest D3 level and takes a ton of players on its team. A huge chunk of those kids will never play varsity (and even varsity is a pretty low level of college soccer). So they probably are making a decent amount of money off those kids. My question was always if the cost of football and hockey make those teams as profitable.

 

[Word]

I'd agree with that. I don't think many would choose a D3 as a sports fan unless they were playing, or involved with a team (like a student trainer) somehow. But there are totally kids that would go to Bama or tOSU or Notre Dame for those reasons.

Agree 100%. Duke didn't become as elite of an academic school until their basketball team became elite. I don't think it was coincidence. More applications means you can be pickier. I know 2 Duke grads from 30-ish years ago and they both say they wouldn't get into Duke now as the standards have gone up considerably.

 

[Ski-U-Ham]

One anecdote only, but one I see in my community repeated over and over - my former neighbor girl, recently graduated, is playing basketball for something called "Central College" in Iowa. She's a 5'7" forward who, while she started for her high school team, was perhaps the 4th or 5th best player of the starting five. She has explicitly stated she's going to Central because she can play basketball there.

Central College is a DIII school in Pella. Average women's basketball program. They got a new coach a couple years ago, his second season was better than his first so maybe he's turning it around there.

 

[IceBoxGopher]

No 2025 outlook yet for the MIAC or UMAC, but D3 Football did release its preseason Top 25 with records from last year. Two Minnesota teams ranked, along with four over in Wisconsin and one in Iowa:

1. North Central (IL) 15-0
2. Mount Union (OH) 14-1
3. Johns Hopkins (MD) 12-2
4. Susquehanna (PA) 12-2
5. St. John's (MN) 11-1
6. Hardin-Simmons (TX) 10-1
7. Salisbury (MD) 12-1
8. Mary Hardin-Baylor (TX) 8-4
9. Wartburg (IA) 10-2
10. Cortland (NY) 11-1
11. Wisconsin La Crosse 8-4
12. Bethel (MN) 11-3
13. Springfield (MA) 12-1
14. DePauw (IN) 11-1
15. Wisconsin Platteville 9-2
16. Linfield (OR) 10-2
17. Wheaton (IL) 9-2
18. Carnegie Mellon (PA) 10-2
19. Wisconsin River Falls 7-3
20. Hope (MI) 11-1
21. Randolph-Macon (VA) 10-2
22. Aurora (IL) 9-2
23. Grove City (PA) 9-2
24. Wisconsin Whitewater 6-4
25. John Carroll (OH) 9-3

 

[swede2]

Central is a JUCO, isn't it? I know someone who went there to play baseball and received an offer from a major D1 school after playing there for two years.

It may have been at one time but it is a four year institution now. There was a rash of private JUCOs that became four year schools in the last couple of decades. Bethany in Mankato, for one.

 

[swede2]

My disagreement is that there are significant amount of kids choosing certain D2 and D3 schools because they have athletic teams(that they aren't playing on). I would never choose a school based on that or want my kids to do that, but I would think if someone is that sports crazy they would choose a D1 school?

I guess I understood the assertion to mean that schools are using the opportunity to be on an athletic team (and thus get a whole bunch of tuition paying student athletes) as recruiting tool, not the mere existence of athletic teams as a significant recruiting tool to non-athletes. I agree that athletics might be part of an overall collegiate experience appeal but not a primary recruiting tool to non-athletes.

I do think athletic success does raise a school's profile and assists in recruiting non-athletes, but I think that the lower the level, the less effect it has.

 

[swede2]

I know of a local small, private college that plays soccer at the lowest D3 level and takes a ton of players on its team. A huge chunk of those kids will never play varsity (and even varsity is a pretty low level of college soccer). So they probably are making a decent amount of money off those kids. My question was always if the cost of football and hockey make those teams as profitable.

St John's FB fits this bill. A friend's kid went to St John's a year or two removed from undergrad and was "on the football team." He was at about #28 on the depth chart for tight ends.

 

[Kitzmann57]

Central is a JUCO, isn't it? I know someone who went there to play baseball and received an offer from a major D1 school after playing there for two years.

Central is in the American Rivers Conference in Iowa. It the same leval / Div as the MIAC in MN. All private schools with high tuition.

 

[Panthadad2]

I think athletics matter for the D2/D3 general student population. If nothing else, for name recognition. For example, there's a perception difference between attending Mankato/St. Cloud versus Metro State. I have no doubt that schools like St. Cloud or Crookston would eliminate all athletics if they thought it wouldn't impact non-athlete enrollment.

 

[Word]

I think athletics matter for the D2/D3 general student population. If nothing else, for name recognition. For example, there's a perception difference between attending Mankato/St. Cloud versus Metro State. I have no doubt that schools like St. Cloud or Crookston would eliminate all athletics if they thought it wouldn't impact non-athlete enrollment.

Metro is kind of a different animal. It's geared toward non-traditional students.

 

[Bayfield Gopher]

Northland College in Ashland, WI, about 20 miles from where I'm sitting right now, had their final graduation this year as well but isn't on the map.

Yep. They have closed after 133 years of operation due to financial issues and declining enrollment.

What is your zip code disco?

 

[State of Football]

I think athletics matter for the D2/D3 general student population. If nothing else, for name recognition. For example, there's a perception difference between attending Mankato/St. Cloud versus Metro State. I have no doubt that schools like St. Cloud or Crookston would eliminate all athletics if they thought it wouldn't impact non-athlete enrollment.

See St. Cloud State as an example of cutting football. What was once a proud school, they have lost almost 40% of its enrollment from its peak. It’s not due to football but losing it doesn’t help the school’s identity. The city is also struggling. The old Red Caroet glory days are long gone. It’s like a ghost town.

 

[denguegopher]

Central is in the American Rivers Conference in Iowa. It the same leval / Div as the MIAC in MN. All private schools with high tuition.

Central was very good in football in the 1970's. One of their alum, Vern DenHerder, played for the Miami Dolphins during at least some of their glory years. I believe that all colleges are battling the "demographic cliff" to maintain enrollments, especially small ones. I read somewhere that enrollments will likely pick up again in 15 years or something like that. Alot of schools, IMHO, will not be able to weather the storm. I went to Luther College (Iowa) and they have shrunk from usual annual enrollments of about 2100ish students to less than 1500 now. They are not in danger of closing and have upped their student recruiting efforts and have become more efficient at securing alumni donations in recent years to make up a part of the difference. The world changes...

 

[Panthadad2]

Central was very good in football in the 1970's. One of their alum, Vern DenHerder, played for the Miami Dolphins during at least some of their glory years. I believe that all colleges are battling the "demographic cliff" to maintain enrollments, especially small ones. I read somewhere that enrollments will likely pick up again in 15 years or something like that. Alot of schools, IMHO, will not be able to weather the storm. I went to Luther College (Iowa) and they have shrunk from usual annual enrollments of about 2100ish students to less than 1500 now. They are not in danger of closing and have upped their student recruiting efforts and have become more efficient at securing alumni donations in recent years to make up a part of the difference. The world changes...

The North Star Promise Scholarship (NSP) program for MNSCU schools doesn't exactly help Minnesota private schools either. Colleges are fighting over every last dollar right now.

 

[IceBoxGopher]

Here are the players listed on D2Football.com’s Elite 100 Watch list from Minnesota in DII:

• QB Jack Strand, Minnesota State-Moorhead
• QB Kyle Walljasper, Minnesota Duluth
• WR Brady Perryman, Minnesota State-Moorhead
• WR Tre Watson, Minnesota State-Mankato
• WR DeShaun Ames, Minnesota Duluth
• DL Marcus Hansen, Minnesota State-Mankato

Other NSIC selections:

• DL Carter Sitzman, Wayne State
• LB Mason Phillips, U Mary
• LB Jake Adams, Northern State
• LB Andy Henson, Sioux Falls
• DB Kevin Speed, Minot State

 

[disco]

Yep. They have closed after 133 years of operation due to financial issues and declining enrollment.

What is your zip code disco?

I live in the Twin Cities, but my cabin zip code is 54847.

 

[disco]

Central is in the American Rivers Conference in Iowa. It the same leval / Div as the MIAC in MN. All private schools with high tuition.

I was thinking it was Iowa Central CC, which is a JUCO. Never mind...

 

[disco]

See St. Cloud State as an example of cutting football. What was once a proud school, they have lost almost 40% of its enrollment from its peak. It’s not due to football but losing it doesn’t help the school’s identity. The city is also struggling. The old Red Caroet glory days are long gone. It’s like a ghost town.

Yep. It used to be the flagship of the MnSCU system, but has been long passed by Mankato.
My alma mater, MSU Moorhead has lost about 50% from it's peak, but they've been steadily improving the campus. I was there last month and it's looking really nice now, and they're making improvements to the city as well. I think a big problem there is there are just so many 4 year schools within about an hour radius.

 

[swede2]

For those of you eagerly checking in, the UMAC historically does not release its preseason poll until the end of August. By historically, I mean 2024.